Confirmed with Link: Flyers trade Cutter Gauthier to Anaheim for Jamie Drysdale and 2025 2nd round pick

[GKJ]

(EDIT)

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[wankstifier]

Has Mintyukov passed Gauthier?

 

[BritainStix]

I apologize for conflating your use of “actual” Flyers fans and your posts complaining about people being negative.

Apology accepted.

It was a direct reference to the response that there are no flyers fans here, that everyone is checked out and simply come to shoot the shit unrelated to the flyers. I clearly stated there are threads for that, ironically I believe it's against forum rules to go off topic, but that's another argument.

This board is for discussing the flyers, positive and negative. The overwhelming tirade of negative comments about literally anything this organisation does, has done, or will do regardless on the outcome is pretty tiresome at best. Subtle statements of discontent at people that have a little hope in this franchise turning a corner and finally understanding the cap based NHL is pretty common here.

 

[Random Forest]

I dont project to understand what players could or couldnt have been available, so im not going to engage in specifics.

I think my ideal would have been to focus those efforts on a high first round pick and dedicate it to a replacement center prospect (since we have exactly one good C below the age of 30 on a rebuilding team, and nothing left in the pipeline that projects to be one, aside from the one we've been dicking around the lineup for a few years) or a roughly equivalent C prospect that a team cant get under contract for whatever reason, but feels they can replace with a lesser player, etc).

I think that’s fair in concept, but you have to put the rubber on the road if you’re going to squawk about the return. How high of a draft pick would you have taken for Gauthier? 10th overall? 15th? Keep in mind that Montreal chose to take Reinbacher instead of swapping for Gauthier. Is that pick really more valuable than Drysdale? Would we really think it would have been received well to trade Gauthier for, say, the 10th overall pick?

I’m not answering those questions, but let’s just say I am skeptical that the return would have been considered better than the one we got today.

 

[mja]

Honestly, the Hindenburg wasn’t really that bad. It looked pretty damn spectacular:View attachment 799537

Some of you really need to get your own shticks!

 

[renberg]

Imagine thinking you can confidently say you get the best deal available on a player that you had * checks notes* 2.5 additional years to either convince to sign, or alternatively, continue to shop around in the event that something else in the landscape changes.

Is it really 2.5 years? This year is almost gone. If he doesn’t sign at the end of this season, he’s coming back for the third year at school. At that point he’s almost home for the fourth year and UFA status. I believe that that is what he wants now. Good luck Aname I’m with this guy.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

Has Mintyukov passed Gauthier?

I would think so.

 

[Beef Invictus]

What's the highest pick you realistically think Gauthier could have garnered?
Magua would probably say in the teens given his pre-trade evaluation of Gauthier.

Looking at equivalent trades, hard to think of anyone giving a top 5 pick, Gauthier had a decent freshman year, good WJC and Int'l comp, but nothing that said "elite center." So it's more like DeBrincat without the years of good NHL performance. Tuck went from #3 to #13 at 21 after struggling in the NHL. They tried to get #5 from Montreal who wouldn't bite.

So would you rather have #8-10 or Drysdale and a high 2nd in 2025?

8-10.

 

[thedjpd]

Do you understand the difference between signing him before and after the season ends?

Do you understand how it effects his ELC? Genuinely asking because it seems like you don't know the contract rules.

Yes, I know the difference. He wants his contract to start earlier to burn years.

Do you know how that happens? He has to play in the NHL. They go hand in hand in this case. He didn’t just want the contract as a matter of fact - he demanded a guarantee to burn the year.

Last year, everybody was flipping out about how he has a lot of work to do on his game. Now folks want to suddenly claim he should have been in the NHL all along?

 

[Starat327]

I think that’s fair in concept, but you have to put the rubber on the road if you’re going to squawk about the return. How high of a draft pick would you have taken for Gauthier? 10th overall? 15th? Keep in mind that Montreal chose to take Reinbacher instead of swapping for Gauthier. Is that pick really more valuable than Drysdale? Would we really think it would have been received well to trade Gauthier for, say, the 10th overall pick?

I’m not answering those questions, but let’s just say I am skeptical that the return would have been considered better than the one we got today.

I haven't once squawked about the return. Just the management of the process and how poor it was.

I don't have strong feelings about Drysdale -- i think he can still be a decent player, but im not confident in it. I also think the organizational weakness is greater at young centers than young D, so my own evaluations are certainly coming in to play here, which i dont expect everyone to agree with.
Im not sure how far back i'd go. If someone gives me a #10, I probably take it, yeah.

 

[BritainStix]

Hold on. Let me pull out my crystal ball and see who has needs in what area after this season, who decides to rebuild, and who doesnt kill their cap space with *checks notes* potential bonus overages.

Unlike some people around here, I don't conject about things i don't actually know. There are rumors - who knows how serious - Zegras may be available out of Anaheim. There's an option if you want for a specific. Which, i'm sure will be met with "lol no way hes not available, or "rofl, ducks dont trade Zegras for a college rookie who doesnt want to sign".

Ironic, you literally did conject when you stated the flyers definitely didn't get the best value out of Cutter in this trade did you not? But you can't possibly know what offers were on the table, or what offers could be made.

Edit: I don't think this actually was you, I can't find it in your post history. Mistaken identity, my bad.

Its not an unreasonable request to ask what you believe would be a better offer. If you had said Zegras, that would have been a valid offer. I think it likely that we would have had to add to Cutter, but at least it's a genuine attempt.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

Has Mintyukov passed Gauthier?

For all of these Tier 3 and below prospects, high end NHL success changes the calculus. Completely different class of asset right now.

That's your 1OA in a re-draft. Or at least it should be.

 

[Starat327]

What's the highest pick you realistically think Gauthier could have garnered?
Magua would probably say in the teens given his pre-trade evaluation of Gauthier.

Looking at equivalent trades, hard to think of anyone giving a top 5 pick, Gauthier had a decent freshman year, good WJC and Int'l comp, but nothing that said "elite center." So it's more like DeBrincat without the years of good NHL performance. Tuck went from #3 to #13 at 21 after struggling in the NHL. They tried to get #5 from Montreal who wouldn't bite.

So would you rather have #8-10 or Drysdale and a high 2nd in 2025?

8-10, easily. I probably go back closer to 15 before I consider Drysdale the better alternative.

 

[scumpup]

I said that the last 30 years. Gave them the benefit of the doubt for literal decades. They routinely disappoint. Feel free to hold out hope but nothing in this organization's history should lead you to believe that anything will be different.

skill issue im afraid.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

The trade is whatever; they had to move him and hopefully Drysdale can stay healthy and be a good player.

The issue is that they let it get to a point where a top college prospect refused to sign with the big money, big market, Philadelphia Flyers. And not even the top college prospect from his draft year. That was Cooley, who was happy to sign with the Coyotes and play in front of 5,000 fans.

Cooley knew he would get top 6 minutes right away so he had nothing to worry about, his spot was secure. He claimed it wasn’t about Torts. Did he want assurances he would be gifted a spot? I don’t think the Flyers operate that way. It’s been that way for decades hasn’t it?
Did Calgary wait long to trade Adam Fox after he said he didn’t want to play there? Then he told Carolina he only wanted to play for one team so Carolina made the move before they got nothing for him.
I would be curious to see what other offers were out there.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

I don’t think anyone here has been happy about the Flyers the last decade and they deserve criticism. That criticism gets stale when it’s the only thing mentioned in every thread. There is no benefit I can see from beating the same drum over and over but maybe it’s therapeutic, idk.



A large percentage of posts here are nothing but bitching about Torts, management, and ownership, perhaps not unjustly at all, but how many reiterations of the same comment do we need? It’s masochistic with some posters and any Flyers related discussion is boring and repetitive



Fans have a right to complain about the team but it makes the place unusable if that’s all it is. No one is going to change the team by posting on a prospects board airing their grievances. Want to make a difference? Don’t watch games, don’t give clicks, don’t give money. Ignoring them will make a bigger difference



I know this comment won’t be popular and I’ll probably be called a bootlicker or something but that’s not the case. It’s also not directed to anyone in particular. I just remember when this place was better and not just a place to shout into the void

 

[JojoTheWhale]

It's not the pick that matters in a return. It's the prospect you take with it. How much you like that guy is the discussion.

The name is going to be different for everyone. You can't have the Gauthier pick discussion without talking about what you think about Oliver Moore or Axel Sandin Pellikka. Every pick from 5-13 in 2023 is worth Zach Benson when it's on the clock.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

I’d be pretty surprised if Gauthier passed up two more years of potential NHL pay.

Even at the latest the Flyers were probably gonna have to move him at this upcoming draft. Any time past that you’re probably seriously risking taking a big or bigger hit in lost value.

So that was the leverage he had with his willingness to push the issue. I doubt you can pull this card again & Gauthier is now on the clock with what he’s willing to risk losing pocket wise.

 

[Curufinwe]

Gauthier didn't need to be gifted a spot. Look at the lineup and how much trouble they have scoring goals.

Briere then went out in the summer and signed a premium 4th liner who's been useless alongside the even more useless Deslauriers. Forward roster spots clearly aren't all that valuable in Philly.

And Gauthier is also a LW on a team forcing multiple RWs to play the left side.

 

[Captain Dave Poulin]

For all of these Tier 3 and below prospects, high end NHL success changes the calculus. Completely different class of asset right now.

That's your 1OA in a re-draft. Or at least it should be.

Not because of Mintyukov - our guys knew he would be good, but not this good - but it was such a clear case of TRADE DOWN and collect assets instead of picking Qatar. The top of that draft was piss poor.

 

[Starat327]

Ironic, you literally did conject when you stated the flyers definitely didn't get the best value out of Cutter in this trade did you not? But you can't possibly know what offers were on the table, or what offers could be made.

Edit: I don't think this actually was you, I can't find it in your post history. Mistaken identity, my bad.

Its not an unreasonable request to ask what you believe would be a better offer. If you had said Zegras, that would have been a valid offer. I think it likely that we would have had to add to Cutter, but at least it's a genuine attempt.

I dont believe i conjected that, but if youve got the quote handy, i'm certainly happy to eat the crow.

Asking for a specific proposal is silly. I dont know how much the Kraken soured on Shane wright. Can i have him? The oilers fail to make the playoffs this season and want to blow it up. Can i trade Risto and Couturier at 50% and our first for McDavid?

Its silly talk. I dont know how teams value their players.

 

[Random Forest]

The thing about waiting until draft day is that the team on the clock *almost always* values their pick higher than its generic value. It’s hard to transact in the 5-15 range because that’s where the draft opens up and teams have guys at the top of their list that they probably have ranked unusually high. And if you blow it at the draft, well, what do you do then?

Likely the only alternative that might have made sense to me would have been making a trade the week leading up to the draft. But again, there’s no guarantee that you’ll be able to get great value then either. And at that point, Gauthier’s intentions would have been obvious. Waiting would not have been without risk.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Gauthier didn't need to be gifted a spot. Look at the lineup and how much trouble they have scoring goals.

They could just stop gifting spots to several shit players and let youth try.


But no, we cannot have that for some reason.

 

[Starat327]

I’d be pretty surprised if Gauthier passed up two more years of potential NHL pay.

Even at the latest the Flyers were probably gonna have to move him at this upcoming draft. Any time past that you’re probably seriously risking taking a big or bigger hit in lost value.

So that was the leverage he had with his willingness to push the issue. I doubt you can pull this card again & Gauthier is now on the clock with what he’s willing to risk losing pocket wise.

Exactly this. If he pushes this further, and goes back to junior, hes at the age where hes becoming too far gone. He wants to sabotage his career? Have a blast. Maybe he gets a different advisor that tells him that signing and playing with the expectation of a trade is the better option, since the Flyers called his bluff.

 

[Pet Charles]

last time they spoke was on a zoom call after the world championships according to EF.

On the zoom call Conversation about turning pro, the flyers said they couldn't do it at the time because his bonus would have put them over the cap and they didnt want an overage this year according to EF.

Wait - Friedman wasn't crystal clear but I think you're conflating two different conversations: one in March and one in May. The reason I write that is because by the time the WCs were played in May it wasn't possible to have a contract CG signed count as Year 1 in 2022-23. He'd have to have been signed and on the roster for the March 28th game against Montreal and have played the rest of the games to reach 10 and have it count. So whether he signed in May or September, it would have been all the same to him as it pertains to service time. They also had plenty of cap space at the start of the new cap year in the summer.

If service time was indeed the issue, then it makes the most sense that the time that the CG camp was reportedly informed the Flyers wouldn't sign him was March. BC's season ended on March 11 and Fletcher was fired a day earlier on March 10. It's possible that with all the craziness going on, the importance to the CG camp at signing him at that moment was lost in the shuffle. It's hard to say.

But I still have a hard time with the idea that the Flyers or any club owes a player on an ELC what amounts to a "free" year of service by playing 10 meaningless games at the end of a meaningless season. It's too bad for ELC players that the NHLPA didn't negotiate ELC players better terms, but the NHLPA is an organization that puts more weight into protecting their long-standing members.

 

[BritainStix]

They could just stop gifting spots to several shit players and let youth try.


But no, we cannot have that for some reason.

Who do we have in the Phantoms that should realistically be playing over the current squad?

We only really have roles on the bottom line and they are getting less than 10 minutes a game.

Zamula and Risto have actually formed a bottom pairing partnership that isn't the worst in the NHL.