Confirmed with Link: Flyers trade Cutter Gauthier to Anaheim for Jamie Drysdale and 2025 2nd round pick

[GKJ]

(EDIT)

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[FlyerNutter]

Smartest move is to deal him while he’s half ass healthy.

That would require the admittance of a mistake however.

Briere needs to be rightfully torched for that trade. Nobody in their right mind thinks that Jamie Drysdale + a 2nd was the best that could be found for a 5OA - coming off a strong WJC.

Even if Cutter limited the options.

 

[deadhead]

Charlie was saying even before the season started internally they had no meaningful expectations again for Drysdale this year. If you go to keep writing off seasons that’s probably a tell but I don’t think they see it that way.

That's more an admission he was horribly handled in Anaheim and it's going to take a whole season to fix him. Which is what it took to fix Risto.

They're very different players, with Drysdale, it's learning defensive fundamentals, but more important, when to take risks on offense. Risto had to learn positioning and to stop chasing hits.

Smartest move is to deal him while he’s half ass healthy.

That would require the admittance of a mistake however.

Briere needs to be rightfully torched for that trade. Nobody in their right mind thinks that Jamie Drysdale + a 2nd was the best that could be found for a 5OA - coming off a strong WJC.

Even if Cutter limited the options.

Cutter really limited the options, no different than Carolina accepting a 2nd 7 3rd for Fox, even when they knew he was going to be a top D-man after a great college season.

Flyers got a 2nd and Drysdale for Gauthier. And no one thinks he'll turn out as good as Fox.

 

[FlyerNutter]

That's more an admission he was horribly handled in Anaheim and it's going to take a whole season to fix him. Which is what it took to fix Risto.

They're very different players, with Drysdale, it's learning defensive fundamentals, but more important, when to take risks on offense. Risto had to learn positioning and to stop chasing hits.


Cutter really limited the options, no different than Carolina accepting a 2nd 7 3rd for Fox, even when they knew he was going to be a top D-man after a great college season.

Flyers got a 2nd and Drysdale for Gauthier. And no one thinks he'll turn out as good as Fox.

The Flyers targeted Drysdale. Murray was highlighted as part of that decision.

They were broken up with, and gave the ring to the first crackhead with tits they saw at a bar.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

I don’t think anybody is going to be celebrating if they turn Drysdale into a decent third pair defender like Ristolainen. Like yeah you got something out of nothing & that’s admirable but ultimately still investment outweighs that even if that’s not necessarily the coaching staff’s fault.

 

[Magua]

Cutter really limited the options, no different than Carolina accepting a 2nd 7 3rd for Fox, even when they knew he was going to be a top D-man after a great college season.

Copy and pasted from the last 18-20 times you've brought this up:

Fox and Gauthier have nothing in common. Fox, as a 3rd rounder, was entering his senior year, had the academic card to play, and only wanted to go to one team. Gauthier was a top 5 pick, was early in his sophomore year, and was suffering a case of ELC blue balls to the point his trade list was 18-20 teams, according to Seravalli.

 

[Beef Invictus]

That's more an admission he was horribly handled in Anaheim and it's going to take a whole season to fix him. Which is what it took to fix Risto.

They're very different players, with Drysdale, it's learning defensive fundamentals, but more important, when to take risks on offense. Risto had to learn positioning and to stop chasing hits.


Cutter really limited the options, no different than Carolina accepting a 2nd 7 3rd for Fox, even when they knew he was going to be a top D-man after a great college season.

Flyers got a 2nd and Drysdale for Gauthier. And no one thinks he'll turn out as good as Fox.

Cutter gave a list of 18-20 preferred teams. How is that "limited?" That's "anywhere but here," and it included Anaheim, which is evidently seen as a better organization to play for.

They sold as low as they could.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

To me, it seems like people talk about the idea of Jamie Drysdale more than what he actually does on the ice.

He doesn't even generate offense. He's not good at anything at 5v5. He has no positives. Every Defenseman rebuild they've done involved getting improved defensive play at the cost of the other end of the ice. That's not even an option here. There are no knobs to turn. His strengths still don't translate. He can't pass my personal baseline for having any hope in NHL YEAR FIVE.

 

[freakydallas13]

To me, it seems like people talk about the idea of Jamie Drysdale more than what he actually does on the ice.

He doesn't even generate offense. He's not good at anything at 5v5. He has no positives. Every Defenseman rebuild they've done involved getting improved defensive play at the cost of the other end of the ice. That's not even an option here. There are no knobs to turn. His strengths still don't translate. He can't pass my personal baseline for having any hope in NHL YEAR FIVE.

I have only watched a few games this season and last while Drysdale has been in the lineup, but I honestly cannot tell you what are his positives are supposed to be. Maybe I have just missed them in my viewings.

He has bad reads in the d-zone. Fires passes at people like the puck is a grenade. He is awful at keeping the puck in the o-zone, and terrible at getting to the lanes and cycling. He's not physical at all.

Like, I know he's still young(ish), but what is the upside on his play here?

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

I have only watched a few games this season and last while Drysdale has been in the lineup, but I honestly cannot tell you what are his positives are supposed to be. Maybe I have just missed them in my viewings.

He has bad reads in the d-zone. Fires passes at people like the puck is a grenade. He is awful at keeping the puck in the o-zone, and terrible at getting to the lanes and cycling. He's not physical at all.

Like, I know he's still young(ish), but what is the upside on his play here?

The issue is he’s basically entering his physical prime as a 22-23 year old this year & you’re still starting from the ground up. There’s little to nothing in his underlying numbers to hang his hat on to this point that would really make you comfortable to projecting a higher end defensemen. Yeah he was put in an unfortunate situation with Anaheim but he’s not the first player in league history under a bad situation. Talent still usually shows in some ways even under less ideal situations which other players have shown.

If he has another season that’s been in line with his body of work to this point he’d be an extreme outlier to reach the status the Flyers hope for him. At that point you’d have to start moving to the target down to hopefully a useful mid or bottom pair defender.

Even with Ristolainen the Flyers dropped the target range from a top-mid pair two way defender to basically now a third pair defensive role. It’s not really a comparable arch to Drysdale.

 

[Embiid]

The Flyers are a bunch o fish eyed fools!

 

[deadhead]

Copy and pasted from the last 18-20 times you've brought this up:

They all knew the Flyers had no choice.
There are zero rumors of great deals that were turned down.

"The Philadelphia Flyers reportedly offered the Habs a trade that involved Gauthier in exchange for the fifth overall pick at the 2023 NHL Entry ..."

According to the journalist's information, the CH saw Gauthier as a 5th overall pick from a weak draft while MTL held the 5th pick of a draft they considered strong. Thus, the offer was not sufficient in Hughes' eyes.» It was also learned that the Flyers would have also drafted David Reinbacher with this 5th overall pick. [note, Briere knew Arizona would not take Michkov b/c he made it clear he would not sign with them] In short, the general manager of the Montreal Canadiens seems to have made an excellent decision, especially now that we know Gauthier did not want to play for a Canadian team.

[Flyers would have had to sweeten the deal, but the impression was the Habs simply didn't want him so Flyers would have had to overpay to make that deal]

"Scott Hartnell said a lot of the teams that were on Cutter Gauthier’s trade list, declined offers because of the way he went about the whole situation and his attitude towards the Flyers."

"Michael Russo and Joe Smith of The Athletic ($) did their end-of-season Minnesota Wild mailbag, and one reader asked them the chances that Marco Rossi gets traded. As part of their response, Russo and Smith divulged that the Wild were after Gauthier in a prospective Flyers trade before he was shipped to Anaheim."

[two points, timing mattered, b/c if it was Rossi, he had a horrible start as an undersized center, 1 point in 19g in 2022-23. Flyers were offering Gauthier that summer. However, by the Drysdale trade he had 22 points in 35g by Jan 1. So did the Flyers turn Minn down in the summer and/or Minn turn the Flyers down in January? Rossi is listed at 5'9 182]


I don't see any great deal on the table that Briere turned down.
The lack of trade rumors suggests few teams were seriously interested.
Since no one would have made a deal without confirming with Gauthier that he'd come there, he could veto any trade he had second thoughts about, which would have discouraged offers.

If he waits until the 2024 draft, Gauthier is only 2 years from being a UFA, so teams would have been more wary of trading for him. So it's doubtful his value increases by waiting.

Flyers would have received the #37 pick if they let him walk in two years, so Briere probably set that as the floor, in effect Anaheim's 2nd.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

The Flyers are the ones that “really limited their options” here. Not Gauthier. They had an archetype they wanted, just like they always have, and they weren’t going to consider anything different.

*rolls.jpg*

 

[Magua]

I don't see any great deal on the table that Briere turned down.
The lack of trade rumors suggests few teams were seriously interested.

I do remember the Flyers story was they told teams to stay quiet to be fair to Gauthier. It was praised by the local media as a front office masterclass. Now, it means no one was interested (credibly sourced 18-20 teams!!!!) in one of the more valuable ELCs in the league? And your evidence is….? Do you think the Ducks alone couldn’t offer a different package?

Word for the wise: watching CHL games is less of a waste of time than this.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

They all knew the Flyers had no choice.
There are zero rumors of great deals that were turned down.

"The Philadelphia Flyers reportedly offered the Habs a trade that involved Gauthier in exchange for the fifth overall pick at the 2023 NHL Entry ..."

According to the journalist's information, the CH saw Gauthier as a 5th overall pick from a weak draft while MTL held the 5th pick of a draft they considered strong. Thus, the offer was not sufficient in Hughes' eyes.» It was also learned that the Flyers would have also drafted David Reinbacher with this 5th overall pick. [note, Briere knew Arizona would not take Michkov b/c he made it clear he would not sign with them] In short, the general manager of the Montreal Canadiens seems to have made an excellent decision, especially now that we know Gauthier did not want to play for a Canadian team.

[Flyers would have had to sweeten the deal, but the impression was the Habs simply didn't want him so Flyers would have had to overpay to make that deal]

"Scott Hartnell said a lot of the teams that were on Cutter Gauthier’s trade list, declined offers because of the way he went about the whole situation and his attitude towards the Flyers."

"Michael Russo and Joe Smith of The Athletic ($) did their end-of-season Minnesota Wild mailbag, and one reader asked them the chances that Marco Rossi gets traded. As part of their response, Russo and Smith divulged that the Wild were after Gauthier in a prospective Flyers trade before he was shipped to Anaheim."

[two points, timing mattered, b/c if it was Rossi, he had a horrible start as an undersized center, 1 point in 19g in 2022-23. Flyers were offering Gauthier that summer. However, by the Drysdale trade he had 22 points in 35g by Jan 1. So did the Flyers turn Minn down in the summer and/or Minn turn the Flyers down in January? Rossi is listed at 5'9 182]


I don't see any great deal on the table that Briere turned down.
The lack of trade rumors suggests few teams were seriously interested.
Since no one would have made a deal without confirming with Gauthier that he'd come there, he could veto any trade he had second thoughts about, which would have discouraged offers.

If he waits until the 2024 draft, Gauthier is only 2 years from being a UFA, so teams would have been more wary of trading for him. So it's doubtful his value increases by waiting.

Flyers would have received the #37 pick if they let him walk in two years, so Briere probably set that as the floor, in effect Anaheim's 2nd.

That’s what we’re going with here? Really?

 

[freakydallas13]

They all knew the Flyers had no choice.

No choice to what, find somewhere in the next TWO YEARS to trade Gauthier?

There are zero rumors of great deals that were turned down.

There are zero rumours of lots of things. The fact there are zero rumours has no bearing on the reality of the situation, save for the spin you try and give it.

Honestly don't have the energy to fact check the rest of your post, so we'll both have to live with just a fact check of your first 2 sentences.

 

[Magua]

No choice to what, find somewhere in the next TWO YEARS to trade Gauthier?

McGroarty, selected 14th in 2022, was traded for Yager, selected 14th in 2023, the following season. Winnipeg was taken to the cleaners in value! When a team knows a player asks for a trade, and there are almost 20 competitors vying for that player, value goes down. That’s how it works, right?

Gauthier was undeniably more valuable than Yager. Hence the Flyers starting price being 5th overall value. It’s not coincidence Drysdale was a former 6th overall. With the high 2nd rounder added, it stands to reason they valued Drysdale as more valuable than a 10-15th overall pick.

We’ve already addressed these points countless times. It’s bad faith arguing at this point.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

They all knew the Flyers had no choice.
There are zero rumors of great deals that were turned down.

"The Philadelphia Flyers reportedly offered the Habs a trade that involved Gauthier in exchange for the fifth overall pick at the 2023 NHL Entry ..."

According to the journalist's information, the CH saw Gauthier as a 5th overall pick from a weak draft while MTL held the 5th pick of a draft they considered strong. Thus, the offer was not sufficient in Hughes' eyes.» It was also learned that the Flyers would have also drafted David Reinbacher with this 5th overall pick. [note, Briere knew Arizona would not take Michkov b/c he made it clear he would not sign with them] In short, the general manager of the Montreal Canadiens seems to have made an excellent decision, especially now that we know Gauthier did not want to play for a Canadian team.

[Flyers would have had to sweeten the deal, but the impression was the Habs simply didn't want him so Flyers would have had to overpay to make that deal]

"Scott Hartnell said a lot of the teams that were on Cutter Gauthier’s trade list, declined offers because of the way he went about the whole situation and his attitude towards the Flyers."

"Michael Russo and Joe Smith of The Athletic ($) did their end-of-season Minnesota Wild mailbag, and one reader asked them the chances that Marco Rossi gets traded. As part of their response, Russo and Smith divulged that the Wild were after Gauthier in a prospective Flyers trade before he was shipped to Anaheim."

[two points, timing mattered, b/c if it was Rossi, he had a horrible start as an undersized center, 1 point in 19g in 2022-23. Flyers were offering Gauthier that summer. However, by the Drysdale trade he had 22 points in 35g by Jan 1. So did the Flyers turn Minn down in the summer and/or Minn turn the Flyers down in January? Rossi is listed at 5'9 182]


I don't see any great deal on the table that Briere turned down.
The lack of trade rumors suggests few teams were seriously interested.
Since no one would have made a deal without confirming with Gauthier that he'd come there, he could veto any trade he had second thoughts about, which would have discouraged offers.

If he waits until the 2024 draft, Gauthier is only 2 years from being a UFA, so teams would have been more wary of trading for him. So it's doubtful his value increases by waiting.

Flyers would have received the #37 pick if they let him walk in two years, so Briere probably set that as the floor, in effect Anaheim's 2nd.

So to review, the Laughton rumor with specifics mentioned by a credible reporter IS NOT proof.

The absence of rumors about offers IS proof.

I need a drink.

 

[kudymen]

Oh well, what can I say.

If getting top16 and making playoffs in a 32 team league is a significant and difficult feat, then having a list of only 20 teams where you can trade truly is a difficult spot to be put into as well.

Rather hilarious that someone might feel that way, but hey. Probably that darn participation trophy generation, eh?

 

[Beef Invictus]

Please remember that the Flyers always handle every situation as best as it can be handled, and the proof is in the results on ice.

 

[deadhead]

I do remember the Flyers story was they told teams to stay quiet to be fair to Gauthier. It was praised by the local media as a front office masterclass. Now, it means no one was interested (18-20 teams!!!!) in one of the more valuable ELCs in the league? And your evidence is….?

Word for the wise: watching CHL games is less of a waste of time than this.

If there were real offers on the table, odds are they'd eventually leak out.

Every team has reporters with inside sources that eventually break these stories, especially after a high profile trade like this one.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

If there were real offers on the table, odds are they'd eventually leak out.

Every team has reporters with inside sources that eventually break these stories, especially after a high profile trade like this one.

So to review (my apparent new catchphrase):

There was only one real offer on the table for a highly-regarded prospect with an entire ELC still to come.

Rasmus Ristolainen had multiple offers of a 1st round pick+ on the table as a Rental. I think Dreger said 4 of them? Something like that.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Or the Flyers only bothered talking to the one team that had the one player their one advisor was still super thrilled about.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

Or the Flyers only bothered talking to the one team that had the one player their one advisor was still super thrilled about.

I think the simple solution is that they just valued Drysdale that much.

Which is still bad. Very, very bad!

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

I think the simple solution is that they just valued Drysdale that much.

Which is still bad. Very, very bad!

There has been though. Byram (I think one of the national writers brought up) & Rossi from Charlie were two names after the fact mentioned as pieces that discussed.

 

[deadhead]

So to review (my apparent new catchphrase):

There was only one real offer on the table for a highly-regarded prospect with an entire ELC still to come.

Rasmus Ristolainen had multiple offers of a 1st round pick+ on the table as a Rental. I think Dreger said 4 of them? Something like that.

How did we know there were multiple offers for Risto?

If there were attractive offers on the table, you don't think Friedman or someone like him would have written a piece on it?

I think Hartnell had it right, a number of teams probably kicked the tires but were reluctant to make serious offers for a LW with some questions. Figured it wasn't worth the potential risk. Since Gauthier could veto any deal, a team both had to work out a deal with the Flyers, and confirm that Gauthier wanted to go there (in case he had second thoughts).

I'm sure Anaheim talked to his people before making the deal. If the Montreal GM saw it as a weak draft, others may have also valued Gauthier more like a #10 and wanted a discount on top of that.

This obsession with PR is silly, given the public commitment to rebuilding, the FO has created a long run way, so they're not as focused on PR as past FOs. I think Drysdale wasn't the return b/c he was #6, after three years, his value was probably seen more as a high 2nd rd pick. So two high 2nds are equivalent to pick #20-25. Obviously a loss even if Gauthier was seen as more of a #10 in a stronger draft.