Player Discussion Fire Dustin Schwartz

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

I mean....if you ran this team like a business your scouts would get turned over and Schwartz would be gone. You can't have terrible results for this long.
Part of the problem though is this is not a franchise that puts an organizational emphasis on the position.

 

[Zerotonine]

lol this one again.

The reason that Dustin Schwartz is still employed by the oilers is that he is extremely well respected and liked by the team and the brass alike.

Respected by who and for what? Sure as hell isn't respected for his results

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

lol this one again.

The reason that Dustin Schwartz is still employed by the oilers is that he is extremely well respected and liked by the team and the brass alike.

You don't keep a job because you're respected or well-liked.

You keep a job because you're good at it.

 

[Soundwave]

You don't keep a job because you're respected or well-liked.

You keep a job because you're good at it.

Not in Oilerville, lol.

 

[Laodongxi]

How has this guy survived since 2014? He must be very charismatic or have the goods on upper management? It defies belief.

 

[Laodongxi]

Big Oops! Did not see the current thread just below. Duh! Could Mods please delete?

 

[Tarus]

You don't keep a job because you're respected or well-liked.

You keep a job because you're good at it.

In closed business communities run on cronyism/nepotistic policies(hollywood, sports, theater etc), you absolutely get and keep jobs because you're well liked or respected within that community.

The entire league endlessly recycles inept coaches and GMs, every GM search and coach search is the same 5 - 10 guys over and over again. Even people who flame out to the point that no franchise could ever possibly justify their hiring due to how bad they've been, they'll still get a job with a background executive title or punted over to the TV commentary space until the memory of their ineptitude has faded enough that they can be hired again.

Merit is for 20 year old hockey players, not for 50 year old former players who paid their dues and now get cushy executive retirement jobs.

 

[BlackDogg]

The Oilers must be schwartz-staffed to keep him on.

 

[McDrai]

lol this one again.

The reason that Dustin Schwartz is still employed by the oilers is that he is extremely well respected and liked by the team and the brass alike.

Doesn’t dismiss the fact that he’s terrible at his job. You can be a likeable person but if you can’t perform the duties of your job effectively then you should be held accountable. I’m tired of this country club bullshit.

 

[Stoneman89]

I mean....if you ran this team like a business your scouts would get turned over and Schwartz would be gone. You can't have terrible results for this long.

Part of the problem though is this is not a franchise that puts an organizational emphasis on the position. Look back at how many drafts since Dubnyk and look how many 1st and 2nd round goalies we had access to and didn't draft. At this point I definitely blame Schwartz but this team needs be run with a constant plan and part of that is using a 1st or second every 3-5 years on a goalie and being aware of when to use them. If I was Edmonton I'd be book marking the 2025 draft for D'Aigle and saying our top pick is going to him similar to how Gibson, Askarov and Wallstedt just off the top of my head should've been pencilled in as our first pick of either of those drafts. Look ahead, identify a target, commit to drafting that player regardless of situation

While I can agree they have sluffed off the position for years, it's not all drafting that has hurt them. Below are a few goalies that were drafted by a team, but are now playing well for another team. So, we are also weak at identifying existing quality already in the league. And looking at the list, perhaps we should sit in the weeds and wait for Washington to draft goalies and then go out and trade for them!

Ullmark - drafted by Buffalo, but playing for Boston
Vanacek- drafted by Washington, but playing for New Jersey
Samsonov- drafted by Washington, but playing for Toronto
Varlamov- drafted by Washington, but playing for the Islanders
Montembault- drafted by Florida, but playing for Montreal

 

[Ritchie Valens]

Posted this in the Campbell thread but I'll put it here as well. It's probably been posted before but anyways...

Dustin Schwartz Hockey Stats and Profile at hockeydb.com

Statistics and Records of Dustin Schwartz, a hockey player and coach from Stettler, ALTA born Mar 30 1979 who was active from 1996 to 2005.

www.hockeydb.com

...our NHL goalie coach. The guy who had a sub .900 and inflated GAA of 3.30 or more in the WHL. Then we wonder why this place is where goalies come to die a slow and agonizing death.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

In closed business communities run on cronyism/nepotistic policies(hollywood, sports, theater etc), you absolutely get and keep jobs because you're well liked or respected within that community.

The entire league endlessly recycles inept coaches and GMs, every GM search and coach search is the same 5 - 10 guys over and over again. Even people who flame out to the point that no franchise could ever possibly justify their hiring due to how bad they've been, they'll still get a job with a background executive title or punted over to the TV commentary space until the memory of their ineptitude has faded enough that they can be hired again.

Merit is for 20 year old hockey players, not for 50 year old former players who paid their dues and now get cushy executive retirement jobs.

Great, maybe we can stop running the org based on nepotism and cronyism then? Because it sure as hell hasn't worked out for us during the past few decades. The entire reason Schwartz was hired was that he was the goalie coach for the Oil Kings. Year after year the Oilers have had substandard goaltending save for Talbot in 2016-17 and even then he fell off next year. Yet this guy still remains for reasons I don't understand.

If the only reason he's still with the org is because the brass likes him then kick the brass out and let the new blood decide.

 

[joestevens29]

With Skinner's emergence early on this year as well as Carter Hart's play, I just don't see the Oilers moving on from Schwartz. Skinner also gives him high praise from time to time when really he wouldn't have to, so that's probably saving the guys job too.

I've wanted the guy fired for awhile, but I just don't see him getting fired if he didn't get fired anytime soon in the off-season.

 

[joestevens29]

Great, maybe we can stop running the org based on nepotism and cronyism then? Because it sure as hell hasn't worked out for us during the past few decades. The entire reason Schwartz was hired was that he was the goalie coach for the Oil Kings. Year after year the Oilers have had substandard goaltending save for Talbot in 2016-17 and even then he fell off next year. Yet this guy still remains for reasons I don't understand.

If the only reason he's still with the org is because the brass likes him then kick the brass out and let the new blood decide.

In all fairness he deserved the hire. He was doing well with goalies down there.

Now he didn't deserve to stick around as long as he did though.

I don't know that we should just not hire guys because they worked with the Oil Kings. A guy like Laxdal put in his time and is now in his 9th year with the Dallas organization. Lauer put his time in and now is in Winnipeg. I would've had time for them to move into a role with the pro organization somewhere.

Not opposed to hire guys in our backyard, but keeping them when results are poor I am opposed too.

 

[JustNapalmIt]

Posted this in the Campbell thread but I'll put it here as well. It's probably been posted before but anyways...

Dustin Schwartz Hockey Stats and Profile at hockeydb.com

Statistics and Records of Dustin Schwartz, a hockey player and coach from Stettler, ALTA born Mar 30 1979 who was active from 1996 to 2005.

www.hockeydb.com

...our NHL goalie coach. The guy who had a sub .900 and inflated GAA of 3.30 or more in the WHL. Then we wonder why this place is where goalies come to die a slow and agonizing death.

I guess anyone who wasn’t a good nhll’r should not be an NHL coach by this logic.

 

[joestevens29]

I guess anyone who wasn’t a good nhll’r should not be an NHL coach by this logic.

Jon Cooper (ice hockey) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Fire this guy immediately

 

[Tarus]

Great, maybe we can stop running the org based on nepotism and cronyism then? Because it sure as hell hasn't worked out for us during the past few decades. The entire reason Schwartz was hired was that he was the goalie coach for the Oil Kings. Year after year the Oilers have had substandard goaltending save for Talbot in 2016-17 and even then he fell off next year. Yet this guy still remains for reasons I don't understand.

If the only reason he's still with the org is because the brass likes him then kick the brass out and let the new blood decide.

You'll have to go buy a franchise and prove that they're running their teams wrong, because every organization runs on those principles. Even the successful guys all got their jobs because of who they were or who they knew.

It's simply the way the league runs.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

You'll have to go buy a franchise and prove that they're running their teams wrong, because every organization runs on those principles. Even the successful guys all got their jobs because of who they were or who they knew.

It's simply the way the league runs.

I don’t think I’d have to spend billions of dollars to prove the way the Oilers do things is wrong seeing as there’s an entire decade of evidence that only ended when we lucked into McDavid.

 

[ZJuice]

I guess anyone who wasn’t a good nhll’r should not be an NHL coach by this logic.

Does Scrivens count as a good NHL’r? He has a 59* save shut out record for us. His nickname was also “the Professor”.
He is also from Spruce Grove completing the nepotism/close to home link

 

[Jumptheshark]

You don't keep a job because you're respected or well-liked.

You keep a job because you're good at it.

yep--I have had a lot of jobs were I was liked and respected but when it came to my training of some staff it failed to meet expectations and I was shown the door

Oilers need to look beyond like and respect and look at results

Curious to know why Ranford's teaching in LA has gone sideways

 

[Tarus]

I don’t think I’d have to spend billions of dollars to prove the way the Oilers do things is wrong seeing as there’s an entire decade of evidence that only ended when we lucked into McDavid.

The Oilers do things like every other NHL franchise.

You can't cite even the well-regarded and successful GMs of the NHL without noting that their hiring is due to networking/old boys club stuff(Yzerman/Sakic). It's worse in the coaching ranks, and scouting ranks are straight up retirement jobs for former players and entry level jobs for non-playing friends/family.

 

[McSuper]

Yes another Fire ___ thread. But I think all Oilers fans can agree that no matter what our Stanley Cup winning management/coaching/roster combo is, Dustin Schwartz will not be part of the solution. This guy has made goalies worse here without fail many of whom like Dubnyk/Cam/Brossoit go on to bounce back with other orgs. Even Koskinen was a solid serviceable albeit overpaid goaltender his first 2 years before becoming inevitably afflicted by Dustin Schwartz disease and falling apart the last 2 years. Heck he's not even limited to damage within the Oilers org, he caused Carter Hart's implosion the past 2 years too. The only goalie who has show any signs of improved gameplay during his Oilers tenure was 2020-21 Mike Smith and that's the guy we know does his own maverick thing and probably lets Schwartz's words go in one ear and out the other.

Dustin Schwartz is a problem folks. Has been for a decade. Get rid of patient zero before he infects Skinner or whoever we bring in to replace Smithkonen too.

Firing him is long over due.

 

[McSuper]

Posted this in the Campbell thread but I'll put it here as well. It's probably been posted before but anyways...

Dustin Schwartz Hockey Stats and Profile at hockeydb.com

Statistics and Records of Dustin Schwartz, a hockey player and coach from Stettler, ALTA born Mar 30 1979 who was active from 1996 to 2005.

www.hockeydb.com

...our NHL goalie coach. The guy who had a sub .900 and inflated GAA of 3.30 or more in the WHL. Then we wonder why this place is where goalies come to die a slow and agonizing death.

Playing ability has nothing to do with coaching ability. See Gretzky coaching career vs his playing career. I do agree this guy need to go base on his body of work in Edmonton.

 

[Oil Gauge]

yep--I have had a lot of jobs were I was liked and respected but when it came to my training of some staff it failed to meet expectations and I was shown the door

Oilers need to look beyond like and respect and look at results

Curious to know why Ranford's teaching in LA has gone sideways

Curious as to why people link a goalies performance so strongly to their goalie coach. All goalies have a ceiling, they are all limited by their physical and mental limitations. Any goalie coach is only going to get so much out of Koskinen. Any goalie can only perform so well behind a poor defensive team.

The same people that want Schwartz fired should be furious that David Pelletier hasn't turned every Oiler player into the skater that McDavid is.

 

[Ritchie Valens]

Playing ability has nothing to do with coaching ability. See Gretzky coaching career vs his playing career. I do agree this guy need to go base on his body of work in Edmonton.

Having at least a bit of experience at any kind of pro level does though. I don't know about you, but I'd have pretty tough time having a guy with no experience higher than Junior/University telling me how to stop NHL stars, but that's just me.