Does dubas remain GM if the leafs get bounced by Florida?

[rocketman588]

I think it depends on how we lose if we do

Part of me thinks doing it now so our new GM can make deals at the draft wouldn't be a bad thing. Dubas means we're locked into all 4 for a long time

If we come back and lose in 7 or something I'm probably ok with keeping Dubas if we can keefe

If you want to be offensive you can even Burnett. Obviously same level of playoff success (none) but I think he's offensive while being more north south in the neutral zone and emphasizing the forecheck

 

[ToneDog]

I think it depends on how we lose if we do

Part of me thinks doing it now so our new GM can make deals at the draft wouldn't be a bad thing. Dubas means we're locked into all 4 for a long time

If we come back and lose in 7 or something I'm probably ok with keeping Dubas if we can keefe

If you want to be offensive you can even Burnett. Obviously same level of playoff success (none) but I think he's offensive while being more north south in the neutral zone and emphasizing the forecheck

I'm interviewing Treliving and Gallant ASAP. Dubas and Keefe can find new homes.

 

[rocketman588]

I'm interviewing Treliving and Gallant ASAP. Dubas and Keefe can find new homes.

Gallant seems like he's secretly pretty ass

Let's wait until we actually lose to pitchfork dubas (as much as I agree with you)

I think the fight with the Tampa fans and leaking the job shit on the eve of the playoffs were bush league

 

[PromisedLand]

Gallant seems like he's secretly pretty ass

Let's wait until we actually lose to pitchfork dubas (as much as I agree with you)

I think the fight with the Tampa fans and leaking the job shit on the eve of the playoffs were bush league

what was that? I think i missed that news.

 

[rocketman588]

what was that? I think i missed that news.

The day before the playoffs is when all the Dubas contract/feud with management and "management has kneecapped Dubas on trades" stuff came out. Then mlse responded on game day basically

Was Bush league much like the destruction of Babs to justify the firing

 

[PromisedLand]

The day before the playoffs is when all the Dubas contract/feud with management and "management has kneecapped Dubas on trades" stuff came out. Then mlse responded on game day basically

Was Bush league much like the destruction of Babs to justify the firing

wohhh i missed this. what did mlse say? is there an article I can read?

btw dubas is known to use media to air dirty laundry. he did it to babcock absolutely sabotaged him. the character assassination of Babcock in the media was disgusting IMHO.

Its almost like Shanahan/Tanenbaum don't know how to "evaluate" exec positions i.e. they didn't do a proper background check up on Babs before hiring him which is complete BS IMO because Shanny played for Babs.

whats hilarious of that is that marlies hired dusty under dubas' watch and then fired him right away lol.

Anyway, if there is an article I could read about it that would be great especially mlse response.

 

[leafan11]

wohhh i missed this. what did mlse say? is there an article I can read?

btw dubas is known to use media to air dirty laundry. he did it to babcock absolutely sabotaged him. the character assassination of Babcock in the media was disgusting IMHO.

Its almost like Shanahan/Tanenbaum don't know how to "evaluate" exec positions i.e. they didn't do a proper background check up on Babs before hiring him which is complete BS IMO because Shanny played for Babs.

whats hilarious of that is that marlies hired dusty under dubas' watch and then fired him right away lol.

Anyway, if there is an article I could read about it that would be great especially mlse response.

It was reported in 32 thoughts . Leafs have 3 owners and before the season ended Shanny went to get Dubas an extension and only 1 owner approved. My guess is Bell and Rogers said no. Also CJ has briefly reported of tension between Dubas and Shanny and that winning would fix everything. I think the Matt Murray trade was a fireable offense.

 

[rocketman588]

wohhh i missed this. what did mlse say? is there an article I can read?

btw dubas is known to use media to air dirty laundry. he did it to babcock absolutely sabotaged him. the character assassination of Babcock in the media was disgusting IMHO.

Its almost like Shanahan/Tanenbaum don't know how to "evaluate" exec positions i.e. they didn't do a proper background check up on Babs before hiring him which is complete BS IMO because Shanny played for Babs.

whats hilarious of that is that marlies hired dusty under dubas' watch and then fired him right away lol.

Anyway, if there is an article I could read about it that would be great especially mlse response.

MLSE's response was the 25 mil spent on babs to fire him as their reason why they were waiting. I think 32 thoughts had the team response leak while it was someone from the start who did the initial leak.

Insider Reveals the real reason why the Toronto Maple Leafs are Reluctant to Re-sign Kyle Dubas

Elliotte Friedman talks about one of the reasons the Leafs seem reluctant to offer GM Kyle Dubas a new contract at this time.

www.bladeofsteel.com

Summary of the MLSE response

 

[PromisedLand]

It was reported in 32 thoughts . Leafs have 3 owners and before the season ended Shanny went to get Dubas an extension and only 1 owner approved. My guess is Bell and Rogers said no. Also CJ has briefly reported of tension between Dubas and Shanny and that winning would fix everything. I think the Matt Murray trade was a fireable offense.

Interesting.

Purely from business PoV I see Rogers/Bell point. Give a little now to gain more later is good business strategy. With the open wallet that was afforded to dubas he has ruined any money making prowess the organization could have had IMO.

Its a double whammy. Not only have the Leafs not succeeded in the playoffs for majority of core's years (no hockey success) that was front loaded btw... taking on more money and emptying the cupboards is not a good strategy (no financial success either)

Rogers/Shaw merger may change Roger's tune may be... Bell is going to be a defiant no I believe. Heck if i was an investor on MLSE stock I'd want dubas gone yesterday lol

 

[PromisedLand]

MLSE's response was the 25 mil spent on babs to fire him as their reason why they were waiting. I think 32 thoughts had the team response leak while it was someone from the start who did the initial leak.

Insider Reveals the real reason why the Toronto Maple Leafs are Reluctant to Re-sign Kyle Dubas

Elliotte Friedman talks about one of the reasons the Leafs seem reluctant to offer GM Kyle Dubas a new contract at this time.

www.bladeofsteel.com

Summary of the MLSE response

Thanks! I think MLSE is being more than fair; I'd have been more cutthroat from business pov really.

with all the resources that were afforded to this gm, i wonder if other teams afford the same amount of resources. I was LMAO when I heard pens were interested in dubas; I was like yes let him go there. Pens fired their entire senior exec team after 2 years. Dubas is gonna meet the same route especially with an aging core and not the same kind of "financial" leeway that was afforded to him at MLSE. Pens are now owned by even a more cutthroat organization, they are not going to let stupidity fly like MLSE has for a while. Good to see MLSE reply publicly to set the record straight. Beautifully done!

 

[sxvnert]

MLSE's response was the 25 mil spent on babs to fire him as their reason why they were waiting. I think 32 thoughts had the team response leak while it was someone from the start who did the initial leak.

Insider Reveals the real reason why the Toronto Maple Leafs are Reluctant to Re-sign Kyle Dubas

Elliotte Friedman talks about one of the reasons the Leafs seem reluctant to offer GM Kyle Dubas a new contract at this time.

www.bladeofsteel.com

Summary of the MLSE response

Dubas identified coaching as the problem, promoted his guy, and barely accomplished more than the previous coach. The negatives outweigh the positives with Dubas.

 

[ToneDog]

Dubas identified coaching as the problem, promoted his guy, and barely accomplished more than the previous coach. The negatives outweigh the positives with Dubas.

Said it a long time ago. How many owners allow a rookie GM for fire a coach that forces them to eat $25m ? The responses were the Leafs print money but obviously somebody noticed.

 

[Stephen]

Gallant seems like he's secretly pretty ass

Let's wait until we actually lose to pitchfork dubas (as much as I agree with you)

I think the fight with the Tampa fans and leaking the job shit on the eve of the playoffs were bush league

Gallant seems like a short term adrenaline shot for any program but not a sustainable option.

 

[Stephen]

MLSE's response was the 25 mil spent on babs to fire him as their reason why they were waiting. I think 32 thoughts had the team response leak while it was someone from the start who did the initial leak.

Insider Reveals the real reason why the Toronto Maple Leafs are Reluctant to Re-sign Kyle Dubas

Elliotte Friedman talks about one of the reasons the Leafs seem reluctant to offer GM Kyle Dubas a new contract at this time.

www.bladeofsteel.com

Summary of the MLSE response

It would also be interesting to take a look at the amount of money paid out in salary for the various Nathan Horton, Matt Murray, Petr Mrazek, Joffrey Lupul, Stephane Rodbias, Milan Mihalek, Robin Lehner type projects that might not have been covered by insurance in terms of dollars out for various team building projects during the Shanaplan. MLSE has been generous to say the least while not taking away money from the roster to fund all this stuff.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

Gallant seems like a short term adrenaline shot for any program but not a sustainable option.

Why does he burn his bridges so fast? Too much of a meanie that expects honest effort 100% of the time?

 

[ponder]

I’d say if we fall to Florida (big if, I believe this team has it in them to come back), Dubas stays, but Keefe gets the boot.

Dubas took over as GM in May 2018, and in his first ~16 months made some large mistakes, namely:

- Gave JT a massive contract with an NMC, when he really didn’t fill a team need. This more than anything else has hampered our ability to build around our young core. JT is great on the PP, but just OK at even strength, 7 years at $11 mil AAV, with a full NMC, that was a huge mistake by Kyle

- Dealt Kadri (on a gorgeous contract, 3 years left at $4.5 mil AAV) for Barrie (useless) and Kerfoot (OK but no Kadri). Should’ve just kept Kadri and never signed JT

- Got worked on the Matthews and Marner deals. Caved on both AAV and term, needed to win on at least one of those, not lose on both. With a superstar RFA, you REALLY want 8 years - 4 RFA years, 4 UFA years. He got only 5 years with Matthews (4 RFA, 1 UFA), and 6 years with Marner (4 RFA, 2 UFA), terrible term for the team (especially on Matthews), yet still made Matthews the 2nd highest AAV centre in the league (after McDavid), and Marner the 2nd highest AAV winger (after Panarin). At those AAVs we should have got 8 years from both. And if they couldn’t agree on 8 year deals, he could’ve done 2 year bridge deals at low AAV (allowing a window where we’re stacked), or in the worst case of ~5-6 year deals, the AAV should have been much lower

However, all of that happened when he was a rookie GM, in his first ~16 months. In the ~3.5 years since, he’s been a very good GM for us, pulling off a tonne of great moves, and making only minor mistakes. It does seem he’s learned from his early mistakes, and is now one of the better GMs in the league, I don’t think it’d make sense to give him the boot now.

 

[Menzinger]

Why does he burn his bridges so fast? Too much of a meanie that expects honest effort 100% of the time?

Or he clashes with the GM and is difficult to work with behind the scenes

 

[usernamezrhardtodo]

Gallant seems like a short term adrenaline shot for any program but not a sustainable option.

I think he is a players coach that loses the room after a couple of years. From what I read...he is not and X's and O's type coach...more emotional and it seems to wane in efficacy after a bit.

 

[Smif]

If you voted no, who do you replace him with?

Is this a vote if we think he's going to be here or if we want him to be here??

 

[Stephen]

I think he is a players coach that loses the room after a couple of years. From what I read...he is not and X's and O's type coach...more emotional and it seems to wane in efficacy after a bit.

I think one day we'll need to circle back to a Jon Cooper in the medium future. If Tampa goes down the toilet and he finds himself in a post championship Nick Nurse type situation, I could see it. He was loving the spotlight in Toronto a little too much for that not to be a possibility.

 

[centipede2233]

Rumours are there is a power struggle between the two. My theory is he is distancing himself from Dubas so Dubas takes the fall if they lose to Florida. My guess is Shanny stays because he has years remaining on his contract. Dubas will take the fall.

I agree with you, but are you assuming shanahan and dubas are not seeing eye to eye? I thought they were besties

 

[34]

Full tear down and rebuild after this ousting.

Dubas and Keefe out.

 

[ToneDog]

I agree with you, but are you assuming shanahan and dubas are not seeing eye to eye? I thought they were besties

Apparently no longer. Can't blame Shanny. Perhaps he came out of the trance Dubas had him under.

 

[geo25]

Matthews. Marner. Tavares. Nylander.

None of these guys are a Tkachuk.

This team has been missing a couple Tkachuks for years now. That's been the problem all along. Heart, grit and soul.

Watch the interviews with our top 4. Aside from one of them, the rest have a "I don't care if we win or lose" demeanour about them. Ho-Hum personalities. If we win good, and if we lose it's good too, because the cottage starts tomorrow and I don't have to go through any more pain for a trophy I'm really not all that concerned about.

Move on down a bit to O'Reilly, and you can see the difference. The positivity and personality shine through in his interviews. He's there to win and wants to win.

But what can we do when we only have one of him, while the majority of the rest of the guys are impartial. Ryan is in a losing position if he's ready to win and most of the rest aren't and he knows it. Is he still as positive as the day he arrived?

Very well articulated!

 

[34]

Apparently no longer. Can't blame Shanny. Perhaps he came out of the trance Dubas had him under.

it does not matter if Dubas and Shanahan see Eye 2 Eye. If the leafs end up getting swept here (I think they might) you have to think that MLSE is going to clear house. with the sweep , you can pretty much guarantee that Matthews and Nylander are out of here.