Value of: Devon Toews

[John Mandalorian]

That's an interesting one
Colorado need to think about it because after next season Toews will get a 8M per year contract and Colorado can't afford it.
Colorado objective are simple: Get Byram ready to replace Toews when Toews contract ended.
If Byram can stay Healthy yes he can take his place.
And Get Behrens ready to nhl at the same time.
Not sure Colorado will trade Toews but his value can be very high if Colorado win the Cup this year.
@ the draft if a team call and offer a top 15 pick, Colorado maybe need to change their plan and move Toews.
If they move Toews Colorado Defense can be next year :
Makar Byram
Manson GIrard
Hunt and Johnson (1 year contract around 2 M)
They can use Macdermid Middleton or J.Johnson

The primary thing moving the needle with Toews will be his ask. And if it's too much, it makes more sense that the Avs would look for NHL ready players more than the 15th pick of the draft.

 

[BKarchitect]

Still don’t see the Avs trading a top pairing stud making $4 million when by all accounts 23-24 is still a “go for it” season, as it should be.

They’ll keep him as an in-house rental and let him walk if his demands are astronomical.

They will never find an in-his-prime star defender at that price point who already has amazing chemistry with Makar. You don’t waste any of MacK or Makar’s prime years.

That defense without him just won’t cut it. Even if you get something decent back as a lower pair replacement. We can’t trust Byram or frankly Manson at this point to stay healthy. Hunt, a Johnson and MacD as regular players is awful.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Still don’t see the Avs trading a top pairing stud making $4 million when by all accounts 23-24 is still a “go for it” season, as it should be.

Normally I would agree... But given what they did this year(Or didn't do more accurately), I think its certainly possible they're on asset management mode already and not in the go for it mode anymore, unfortunately.


They're almost certainly going to have to move a LD this summer. It'll be interesting to see who it ends up being.

 

[bossram]

Still don’t see the Avs trading a top pairing stud making $4 million when by all accounts 23-24 is still a “go for it” season, as it should be.

They’ll keep him as an in-house rental and let him walk if his demands are astronomical.

They will never find an in-his-prime star defender at that price point who already has amazing chemistry with Makar. You don’t waste any of MacK or Makar’s prime years.

That defense without him just won’t cut it. Even if you get something decent back as a lower pair replacement. We can’t trust Byram or frankly Manson at this point to stay healthy. Hunt, a Johnson and MacD as regular players is awful.

Yep. My view as well.

The Avs are clearly in an "all-in to win the Cup every year" window. Toews at $4M provides so much value toward that goal, that there is really zero chance they would trade him.

They'll use him for the duration of his contract, try to win another Cup, and move on when he's a UFA and can no longer afford him.

 

[PensandCaps]

Avs would be way better off keeping Toews and trading Girard for a futures based package around a young C prospect.

You don’t trade a top end D for cap reasons.

The suggestion of Jenner for him was laughably bad and that poster should feel ashamed for even defending it let alone suggesting it in the first place.

Jenner might be the one who has more value around the league if anything considering his cap hit to his production, he's a steal. Columbus could get a Hagel like deal for him.

 

[Alienblood]

That’s fair but projecting him forward, I’d have him more in 30-40 range than even top 10.

If the Avalanche are trading him, they clearly don’t value him as even a top10D despite what their fans say

They have Byram

I love Avs fans. Makar is the best d-man in the world. Byram is a #1. Toews is a #1. Girard a top pairing d-man.

You guys are hilarious.

That's the truth though and why the Avs are ready to repeat.

 

[GirardSpinorama]

Avs should probably trade Manson and a winger and try to keep their top 4 dmen around. Probably still not possible though

Doubt Manson's deal can cover for toews. We will have to trade away Manson or let him expire to cover for Byram's 3rd contract.

 

[Alienblood]

Girard is not really playing at a top pairing level right now but he certainly has in the past.
Anything else is just your bias showing.

Makar just won a Norris and a Conn Smythe and I doubt anyone would really argue with him being the best d in the world (or atleast in the mix). Toews has been rated a top10 D in the league last season by quite a few different people and outlets. He IMO is not as good this year but still comfortably one of the better Ds in the league and could easily be the #1 on quite a few teams.

Byram might not be a #1 D yet but thats mostly due to usage and injuries. He was arguably the best defensive D during a cup run where the Avs went 14-4 and certainly projects as a #1 D (if he can stay healthy) going forward.

We basically shredded the league last year and our biggest strength by far was our defense. So why do you think its so outlandish that the Avs have a crazy amount of talent on D right now?

I even disagree with the post you quoted. Toews has serious value but with 1 year left on his deal, the return will not be enormous unless we find a sucker like Bowman back during the Seth Jones saga but thats unlikely.

Great post as always ......16-4 even better with 2 blown losses by Kuemper

 

[Ararana]

The Avs were smart and didn't give Kadri that horrendous contract (though it sure would have been nice if they'd made any sort of an attempt to replace him).

They should be smart here and trade Toews this summer while his value is still quite high. His next contract is going to be ugly and they already have his replacement in Bowen Byram.

Byram - Makar
Girard - Manson

Use Toews to finally get that 2C.

 

[Tufted Titmouse]

I love Avs fans. Makar is the best d-man in the world. Byram is a #1. Toews is a #1. Girard a top pairing d-man.

You guys are hilarious.

The Makar statement is truth, though. I don't think he's very far off from McDavid.

 

[BKarchitect]

The Avs were smart and didn't give Kadri that horrendous contract (though it sure would have been nice if they'd made any sort of an attempt to replace him).

They should be smart here and trade Toews this summer while his value is still quite high. His next contract is going to be ugly and they already have his replacement in Bowen Byram.

Byram - Makar
Girard - Manson

Use Toews to finally get that 2C.

I just don’t see it man. I know this is a great debate so I get the concept but Toews for the 23-24 season is still almost an unimaginable cost/effectiveness value to this team.

That top 4 is still fine in theory but with Manson another year older, Girard erratic in his play and injury concerns with Byram (and frankly Manson with his age and play style) - you’re a small injury crisis from being sunk.

I think Toews at $4.2 million for another year is too valuable for a team gunning for Cups to trade. This team lives off the incredible movement and fluidity of its defense…it’s the lifeblood. I think it’s far easier to patch a solution together up front than it is to replace Toews.

 

[saintunspecified]

I just don’t see it man. I know this is a great debate so I get the concept but Toews for the 23-24 season is still almost an unimaginable cost/effectiveness value to this team.

I would be shocked if there is an NHL GM, particularly of a contending club, who would disagree with you.

 

[CanadienShark]

The Makar statement is truth, though. I don't think he's very far off from McDavid.

He's a stud. I do think he's probably the best overall d-man right now. It's the other parts that I find funny.

 

[Ararana]

Makar is the best d-man in the world. Byram has the potential to be a #1. Toews never was a #1. Girard is a top pairing d-man to about 2 Avs fans who also thought Tyson Barrie was a god.

IFIFY

 

[AslanRH]

I just don’t see it man. I know this is a great debate so I get the concept but Toews for the 23-24 season is still almost an unimaginable cost/effectiveness value to this team.

Agree here, worst case Toews is their "own rental" next season.

Toews allowed Makar's 2way game to develop without him having to reduce his offensive focus.
That being said, if a team comes in and want Toews to serve a similar role with their younger dman and is willing to overpay I could see the Avs bite, but the overpay would need to be convincing.

 

[Ararana]

I just don’t see it man. I know this is a great debate so I get the concept but Toews for the 23-24 season is still almost an unimaginable cost/effectiveness value to this team.

That top 4 is still fine in theory but with Manson another year older, Girard erratic in his play and injury concerns with Byram (and frankly Manson with his age and play style) - you’re a small injury crisis from being sunk.

I think Toews at $4.2 million for another year is too valuable for a team gunning for Cups to trade. This team lives off the incredible movement and fluidity of its defense…it’s the lifeblood. I think it’s far easier to patch a solution together up front than it is to replace Toews.

Trading Toews this summer is the smart move. Unfortunately, I don't believe for a second Avs management is smart enough to do it. I think we've seen all the smoke we need to that Toews will be extended and Girard will be traded this summer.

My confidence in Avs management has taken a huge blow this season with them refusing to replace Kadri and wasting a contention year.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

I just don’t see it man. I know this is a great debate so I get the concept but Toews for the 23-24 season is still almost an unimaginable cost/effectiveness value to this team.

That top 4 is still fine in theory but with Manson another year older, Girard erratic in his play and injury concerns with Byram (and frankly Manson with his age and play style) - you’re a small injury crisis from being sunk.

I think Toews at $4.2 million for another year is too valuable for a team gunning for Cups to trade. This team lives off the incredible movement and fluidity of its defense…it’s the lifeblood. I think it’s far easier to patch a solution together up front than it is to replace Toews.

The flip side of this is that watching someone as valuable as Toews walk in UFA, and having nothing to replace him, because there's not much left in the system. For a team gunning for Cups, that's going to be a massive hit to their chances going forward.

If the goal is multiple Cups, then there's a certain amount of logic in trading the extremely valuable Toews to make sure you retain some of that value longer term. Ideally, it would be for an affordable 2C with term, plus picks and prospects to balance the value difference. That would both fix a hole in the Avs roster for a few years, and replenish the prospect pool, while Byram would hopefully stay healthy and take over Toews role on the ice. Obviously, there's risk, but on the other hand, which NHL team isn't a small injury crisis away from being sunk?

 

[Grinner]

The flip side of this is that watching someone as valuable as Toews walk in UFA, and having nothing to replace him, because there's not much left in the system. For a team gunning for Cups, that's going to be a massive hit to their chances going forward.

If the goal is multiple Cups, then there's a certain amount of logic in trading the extremely valuable Toews to make sure you retain some of that value longer term. Ideally, it would be for an affordable 2C with term, plus picks and prospects to balance the value difference. That would both fix a hole in the Avs roster for a few years, and replenish the prospect pool, while Byram would hopefully stay healthy and take over Toews role on the ice. Obviously, there's risk, but on the other hand, which NHL team isn't a small injury crisis away from being sunk?

a 2C+. May I ask who did you have in mind?

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

a 2C+. May I ask who did you have in mind?

Just because I think that would be the ideal return doesn't mean that I have any of the specifics worked out. Looking around the league, I'm not seeing a lot of good options that are likely available, but then again, I don't have the benefit of the Avs pro scouts feeding me information, so maybe I'm missing someone.

Regardless, even if the ideal return isn't there, there's still going to be some really good offers on the table, and the Avs could retain a large portion of Toews value for more than just one year, even if he'd easily be the best piece in the trade.

 

[Dr Amazing]

Avs resign Toews trades Girard.

 

[Linds]

Avs resign Toews trades Girard.

No cap space to do that and DT is older

 

[McJedi]

Avs resign Toews trades Girard.

If Nurse and Seth Jones make $9mm+ per year. And we all likely agree Toews is a better player than either of those two… what does Toews make in his next contract?

He could sign something like $8.25mm x 8. And the Avs can’t afford that. Unless Landy is LTIR and basically retired. In which case, we give Toews Landys contract plus a few bucks per.

And who knows what Byram will cost. He’s scoring on a 23 goal pace over 82 games as a 21 year old with hardly any PP time. That’s insane. Suffice to say, Byram will need a raise.

 

[HockeyVirus]

If Avs fans are saying the truth, losing Toews is the start of the decline of that roster. Arguably started already losing Kadri, but losing Toews is what will move them into bubble team territory.

 

[Ararana]

If Avs fans are saying the truth, losing Toews is the start of the decline of that roster. Arguably started already losing Kadri, but losing Toews is what will move them into bubble team territory.

Bubble team, not really. Not with the core they have. But as the for decline from a team who went 16-4 in the postseason, that's coming one way or another. Either they're smart and trade Toews while he has value, or they extend him, trade Girard, and watch Toews turn into an old man over the next handful of years while Byram continues to cost more and more.

It is what it is. Every team hits the cap crunch sooner or later. Girard is younger and locked down to a much better term for another 4 years. It's such an easy decision I don't see how anyone can argue giving a 30 year old Toews a massive contract when you already have Byram and Girard on the left side.

Not to mention an extended Toews would probably land a 2C from a defense needy team.

 

[BKarchitect]

If Avs fans are saying the truth, losing Toews is the start of the decline of that roster. Arguably started already losing Kadri, but losing Toews is what will move them into bubble team territory.

It's gonna hurt. Less so if Byram stays healthy though. You can still win with Makar and a healthy Byram...that's still a potentially monster 1-2 punch. But it would be disingenuous to say that's guaranteed.

In the meantime, two more great shots at a Cup with him (Toews) on the roster.

This is also where you (we) hope the FO braintrust can continue to do good work....like the move to acquire Toews in the first place.