Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - offseason edition

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Triumph

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Oct 2, 2007
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What can be "throw back in my face" facts?

Who is the starting goalie in our system today? Who is top 4 defender not named Luke...I suppose any piece of garbage can be top 4 defender...we used John Moore as one for 3 years...

Beyond that everything else was just facts ...Bratt is the highest scoring single season drafted player since Elias 2012....we haven't had a single pick crack 26 goals or 60 points ...that includes 8 seasons from 2 #1OA"s.

Just facts. Maybe after 10 seasons from #1OA's and nearly 16 million in salary someone will crack 26 goals or 60 points..... freaking joke.

All of your dumbass points about 1st overalls and points. Two of the seasons that those guys have played weren't full seasons, two of them have also been cut short by injury.

Jack Hughes is on the verge of superstardom. He is ready to be the first 100 point scorer in Devils history. Most everyone else can see that.
 

JimEIV

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Feb 19, 2003
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All of your dumbass points about 1st overalls and points. Two of the seasons that those guys have played weren't full seasons, two of them have also been cut short by injury.

Jack Hughes is on the verge of superstardom. He is ready to be the first 100 point scorer in Devils history. Most everyone else can see that.
I think the bolder prediction in this is not the points... it's that you got him staying healthy for that long.
 
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SteveCangialosi123

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Feb 17, 2012
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I think the bolder prediction in this is not the points... it's that you got him staying healthy for that long.
38-B8977-A-9460-41-F2-A984-7-DD78-F0-E8-E8-E.jpg
 

AfroThunder396

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Jan 8, 2006
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I love how Dallas's 2017 draft gets 5 years of patient development before we can gush over how amazing and fantastic all of their players are after a good season, whereas the Devils 2017 draft was trash two years out and the Devils 2018, 2019, and 2020 drafts are already considered irredeemable dog shit.

When it was just Heiskanen no one seemed to brag about their draft, he was just one guy. It's almost like players take a while to develop?
 

Guttersniped

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Just found out there are some players that may be better than Nico Hischier
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I love how Dallas's 2017 draft gets 5 years of patient development before we can gush over how amazing and fantastic all of their players are after a good season, whereas the Devils 2017 draft was trash two years out and the Devils 2018, 2019, and 2020 drafts are already considered irredeemable dog shit.

When it was just Heiskanen no one seemed to brag about their draft, he was just one guy. It's almost like players take a while to develop?

In one debate Mercer didn’t count because we didn’t draft him with our own 1st.
 

Oneiro

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Mar 28, 2013
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The thing not to like about the first round drafting is reaching on Stillman and Mukhamadullin and using trade/draft capital on players with skating issues, like Foote and potentially Holtz, in a league that's getting ever faster. McLeod was a bad pick and Smith is trending poorly.

Good teams miss in the first round too, but I think it's fair to be annoyed about those things, albeit a bit early to write off some of those guys. Maybe even early on all of them.

If you believe our players haven't done much, then the rot goes deeper than talent and more to the development and philosophical approach. And let's face it: that's really what's being argued here. Pining for Daddy McMullen and Buddy Lou and the days of The Wonderful Chocolate Factory [100% Salary Cap Free, Guaranteed].
 
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Csonked Out

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This simply comes down to a failing organization that can’t develop players. We could have drafted Makar over Hughes and we would still be complaining. Until we find a coach who can put a successful structure in place we will be regurgitating this conversation every year.
 

Triumph

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I think the bolder prediction in this is not the points... it's that you got him staying healthy for that long.

Hughes missed 7 games to injury in his first two seasons. The notion that he is injury-prone is not supported by very much, but I'm glad you have another hobbyhorse to get on after 'Jack Hughes can't score' got destroyed last season.
 

JrFischer54

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Apr 4, 2017
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Like I said the other day, how much different would the Devils right now be if they had Makar over Hischier? They likely don't make the playoffs in 2018 without Nico

I don't get the point in doing this type of exercise. Its only going to make you mad....especially given that it was always going to be Nico or Nolan and they made the right choice.
That’s what is like constantly lost with this conversation. No one ever said the devils shouldn’t have picked nico. No one has ever said they should’ve taken makar. Simply (me) saying the devils not leaving that draft without the best player hurt this team. You get gifted the 1 pick and don’t land the best player it stings esp a team that is still stuck at the bottom of the nhl. I don’t know how much better the devils would be with him but certainly they would be better. I rather have a legit top Norris d man over 2nd 3rd line nico. But again that’s just me.
 

Guttersniped

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The thing not to like about the first round drafting is reaching on Stillman and Mukhamadullin and using trade/draft capital on players with skating issues, like Foote and potentially Holtz, in a league that's getting ever faster. McLeod was a bad pick and Smith is trending poorly.

Good teams miss in the first round too, but I think it's fair to be annoyed about those things, albeit a bit early to write off some of those guys. Maybe even early on all of them.

If you believe our players haven't done much, then the rot goes deeper than talent and more to the development and philosophical approach. And let's face it: that's really what's being argued here. Pining for Daddy McMullen and Buddy Lou and the days of The Wonderful Chocolate Factory [100% Salary Cap Free, Guaranteed].
You know who had foot speed problems?
Jason Robertson.

He was a fantastic prospect in so many ways, a top half of the draft candidate, with only one flaw, but it was seen as a huge one. His skating was real slow so he fell to 39th.

Who knows how far he would have fallen if Dallas’ approach even then was “get the guy who projects for a lot of offense & we’ll worry about the other stuff later”.

There’s a myth that you can’t improve skating but it depends on what’s wrong and often if the player is bigger like Robertson added strength will help quite a bit. And the need for speed depends on the position, with wingers needing it the least.

Holtz had flaws coming in. He was a shooter/playmaker, not a play driver, so he’s center dependent and he tries to slow plays down to create (which is extremely hard to pull off at the highest levels) instead of playing with higher pace.

He’s skating needs to get better and he needs to get stronger but not every successful player is a burner in this league. There’s also different issues with skating (younger players who are slow vs flaws in skating technique,posture,etc).
 
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Csonked Out

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That’s what is like constantly lost with this conversation. No one ever said the devils shouldn’t have picked nico. No one has ever said they should’ve taken makar. Simply (me) saying the devils not leaving that draft without the best player hurt this team. You get gifted the 1 pick and don’t land the best player it stings esp a team that is still stuck at the bottom of the nhl. I don’t know how much better the devils would be with him but certainly they would be better. I rather have a legit top Norris d man over 2nd 3rd line nico. But again that’s just me.
The thought that makar would have developed the same with us as he did in Colorado is hilarious. That isn’t how it works at all
 

JrFischer54

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Apr 4, 2017
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the Devils aren't bad right now because of drafting the previous 4-5 years.

they are bad right now because of drafting from the prior 10-15 years.
Yeah I mean blackwood Zacha McLeod just to name a few beg to differ that’s not even getting into the other 2-3 bleh . Believe you me I love to hate on Lou but that time is coming to an end the further we get away from him.
 

JimEIV

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Feb 19, 2003
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Hughes missed 7 games to injury in his first two seasons. The notion that he is injury-prone is not supported by very much, but I'm glad you have another hobbyhorse to get on after 'Jack Hughes can't score' got destroyed last season.
He's missed 20% of the games he could've played in so far in his career. He could have played in 207 games he's played in 166. As a percentage he's missed almost exactly the same amount of time as Nico. And Nico has been a bit glassy..
 
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JrFischer54

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The thought that makar would have developed the same with us as he did in Colorado is hilarious. That isn’t how it works at all
So basically the Avs made makar? Or your saying the devils are that dysfunctional he wouldn’t have reached similar peak here? I mean he has the makings of being a generational talent so I think he would’ve been just as good in a lot of places
 
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NJDevs26

Once upon a time...
Mar 21, 2007
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Oh, good the weekly "Shero sucks!" argument...again. Some of you really need to find a new hobby.
The drafting questions go beyond Shero at this point considering Fitz has had four first-rounders (aside from #4OA) the last two years and only one looks like a sure bet at this point. Plus our 'second first-rounder' - Foote - in the Coleman trade hasn't exactly been all that either. But the fact Shero ignored young D other than his Mirco Mueller dumpster diving didn't help obviously. Goalies are still a question mark. Definitely have some forwards but as last year should have proven, forwards don't automatically = success
 

Guttersniped

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The thought that makar would have developed the same with us as he did in Colorado is hilarious. That isn’t how it works at all
I think he would still have been utterly fantastic but a guy who wasn’t on his National team and was still in the AJHL at 18 because he was started college at 19 wasn’t going 1OA.

Just doesn’t happen. That’s life, that’s what all the people say etc. If some posters can’t get over these basic facts even though we got a really great center, I can’t help them.

…wait, I’ve been informed that they like bitching about said player. Welp, that’s on them too.
 
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JrFischer54

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Apr 4, 2017
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It's not really about relitigating the 2017 draft...It's more about how shitty the quality we've gotten from the draft....

Which one of plethora of our picks is better than Jason Roberson? Jack? I'd except that but still hasn't score 40 goals or 79 points...Same for Bratt...Then what? Who is the starting goalie we've drafter? Who is the top pair D we've drafted? Dallas did that in 3 picks in 2017...We've been doing this since 2015 with nothing close to the results of Robertson.
My man isn’t lying here.
 

JimEIV

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Feb 19, 2003
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You know who had foot speed problems?
Jason Robertson.

He was a fantastic prospect in so many ways, a top half of the draft candidate, with only one flaw, but it was seen as a huge one. His skating was real slow so he fell to 39th.

Who knows how far he would have fallen if Dallas’ approach even then was “get the guy who projects for a lot of offense & we’ll worry about the other stuff later”.

There’s a myth that you can’t improve skating but it depends on what’s wrong and often if the player is bigger like Robertson added strength will help quite a bit. And the need for speed depends on the position, with wingers needing it the least.

Holtz had flaws coming in. He was a shooter/playmaker, not a play driver, so he’s center dependent and he tries to slow plays down to create (which is extremely hard to pull off at the highest levels) instead of playing with higher pace.

He’s skating needs to get better and he needs to get stronger but not every successful player is a burner in this league. There’s also different issues with skating (younger players who are slow vs flaws in skating technique,posture,etc).
You accept that risk when picking #39....not so much at #7. This is an utterly ridiculous comparison.
 
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