Devils 2019 offseason team discussion (news and notes) XI

[REM17]

i definitely don’t want marner at that price, but if we do get him, hall needs to be traded

I wonder if Hall extends for 8m when we add Marner since he is all about winning...

 

[Incharge1976]

Imagine the 4th year, watching Toronto with your first pick while Marner signed somewhere else after his 3 year deal ended...

It's an offer sheet, not a Marner picks what he wants sheet. The Devils wouldn't put an offer sheet in front of him for 3 years. It would be 6+ years.

 

[Nemec]

Ppl gonna complain about 4 picks, then when marner scores over 100 pts in Toronto next season , they're gonna complain some more.

 

[MartyOwns]

I wonder if Hall extends for 8m when we add Marner since he is all about winning...

he won’t pass up more than $10M because we add marner

 

[Brooklyndevil]

I don’t believe it and don’t like it. Our defense is at best fair. And that’s including Smith. Our goaltending is questionable. The kid is said to want only a 3 year contract. And I don’t believe we’d be able to sign Hall. All these rumors are ridiculous.

 

[JrFischer54]

offer sheet marner give up the 4 picks. like i said before if a signed marner was on the trade block (11 million hit) the asking price would be hughes or nico and first rounders so why wouldn't you want to keep the known players and give up 4 late round draft picks? its a no brainer. a 90pt kid in not even in his prime paired with jack hughes? you realize that is worth more then the value of those 4 draft picks combined. just look at zacha 6th and mikey 11th as proof that they don't always turn into anything spectacular. (not saying they are a bust) just saying that any production from those 4 draft picks won't really raelly really really contribute to this team until probably 5 years from now! you realize how long that is in hockey time?

how does this effect hall? we have no idea. there aren't many teams out there that can take a 12 million dollar contract obviously let alone a team that is hopefully contending (with marner) so does he go "merc" as people claim on here and seek out the most money? or does he take a shorter term deal put up insane point totals and really cash in when the next cba comes out?


saying that we have holes elsewhere is obvious but that doesn't mean we have x amount of money now lets go and solve that problem. 1 a player has to be available how often is that even an option? most resign before they hit the market even then we will be paying top dollar to come to jersey. 2. a trade? ok well what pieces are we going to offer up to bring in that d man? what type of d man will wood/zacha really bring back? the untouchables on this team are bratt/nico/palm/hall/coleman. and i doubt anyone would want zajac at that contract.

 

[JrFischer54]

just what i was thinking. Get som picks for Hall and then try to get gusev from vegas. We cant give away 4 first rounders but if we get some back for Hall i would be ok with it. We get a younger forward but it feels like a step sideways instead of forward.

yes we can afford to give up first round picks. outside of nico and hughes which were LOTTERY WINS the majority of the better prospects/young talent on this team are outside the first round.

we just traded john q for nothing because he sucked. first round pick doesn't mean anything

 

[PKs Broken Stick]

You only give up 4 1st round picks if you're going through a Penguins with Sid and Malkin-esque run of success. We are not there yet.

Nor will we probably ever tbh

 

[GeNeXt]

Yeah, it would not make sense to OS Marner. Only if you're not confident Hall is willing to stay around would it be wise, then you can possibly organize a Hall sign-and-trade scenario (obviously uncommon in the NHL) to recoup draft capital expended on Marner. Since Marner and Hall could not co-exist in the salary cap world, Hall would have to go regardless if he wants to stay, and I'm not certain that would send the right message to the team, our key players, and big new acquisitions. Admittedly though, Marner would much better fit our contention window than Hall since he is five years younger, but just think I would prefer to sign Hall. Hopefully Hall would stay true to his words and be willing to take a slight discount to help the team contend and pay other guys down the road, but that's doubtful.

As for the RD situation, I think we should keep it as is and see if any trade opportunities are there this season. Having a surplus of RD is a beautiful thing, and could work advantageously for us at some point during the season. You know if one of Subban, Severson or Vatanen are out on the ice every shift, we're in decent shape. We'd just have to find out who the compatibile D pairings would be. My guess would be; Mueller/Smith-Subban, Butcher-Vatanen, and Greene-Severson.

We still have to be careful of acquisitions we make on D, since two offseasons from now, we can only protect three of them. Severson would be a definite, as would PK- unless we somehow run into cap issues or PK's game really has fallen off a cliff and we're desperately trying to castaway the final year of his contract. That would leave just one spot reserved for Butcher, Vatanen (I assume will be traded or walk as a UFA, also Walsh could make him expendable), or another acquisition. I think the Vegas draft shows the consequence of protecting more than three Dmen, as teams who wanted to work around it got hosed for top-six forwards. It will certainly be interesting to see what shape the defense takes these next couple years.

 

[Nico the Draft Riser]

So outside of ridiculous offer sheet talk

If we dont acquire another forward, do you think that mwans Simmonds or Zacha is in the top-6?

Five million is a lot to pay someone you’re planning on pinning to your third line, one year or not

 

[JrFischer54]

So outside of ridiculous offer sheet talk

If we dont acquire another forward, do you think that mwans Simmonds or Zacha is in the top-6?

Five million is a lot to pay someone you’re planning on pinning to your third line, one year or not

you have to give zacha the chance since he has the most potential being younger. if he doesn't run with it then you see if simmonds is up to the task. it is a lot of money but like buffalo we have to overpay ufa to come here. simmonds on the 3rd line at 5 million? no biggie i am fine with it

 

[Emperoreddy]

Do not post random twitter rumors with zero credibility.

 

[Nubmer6]

So outside of ridiculous offer sheet talk

If we dont acquire another forward, do you think that mwans Simmonds or Zacha is in the top-6?

Five million is a lot to pay someone you’re planning on pinning to your third line, one year or not

I think they're trying to set up a competition for 2nd line wing. It will be between Simmonds, Zacha, and maybe even Coleman and Wood. I think they'll also be looking at Boqvist, and even Bastian or Anderson for the slot.

I think it's a fairly good gamble that one of those players proves to be a viable 2nd liner.

 

[Scooooooooooooot]

I would offer sheet Marner, also anyone saying he would leave in 3 years if it’s a 3 year deal... he would still be a RFA

 

[jkrdevil]

I think they're trying to set up a competition for 2nd line wing. It will be between Simmonds, Zacha, and maybe even Coleman and Wood. I think they'll also be looking at Boqvist, and even Bastian or Anderson for the slot.

I think it's a fairly good gamble that one of those players proves to be a viable 2nd liner.

That’s only a good gamble if you think betting the big 6/8 in Craps is a good bet.

 

[Nubmer6]

I would offer sheet Marner, also anyone saying he would leave in 3 years if it’s a 3 year deal... he would still be a RFA

Yep. Like he's an RFA now, but Hughes and Smith will be an RFA at the same time too. Who knows what the cap situation will be.

 

[Nubmer6]

That’s only a good gamble if you think betting the big 6/8 in Craps is a good bet.

Well the preference is to sign another top 6 forward, but the original question is if we didn't sign anyone. Frankly, if we didn't, I'd be fairly comfortable with that bet.

 

[Scooooooooooooot]

Yep. Like he's an RFA now, but Hughes and Smith will be an RFA at the same time too. Who knows what the cap situation will be.

Could be an enormous cap due to the tv deal and Seattle

 

[Devs4L]

I'm not saying they're of no value, but I think it's apparent fans place more value on draft picks than GM's do. You table an offer in the 4 first round range that is matchable for Toronto, they're going to tell you to f*** off with your 1st round picks. Don't want 'em. We'd rather the player. Take a hike. The end.

There's every reason to believe this team would be picking no higher than 20 over the next 4 or 5 years. If you think there wouldn't be a MINIMUM of 1 or 2 busts while picking in that range over that time frame, you're dreaming. In fact it's FAR more likely 3 out of 4 players end up being average or nothing players than landing good players with 3 or 4 of those picks.

Even while picking 12 or higher we're still not certain about players like McLeod or Zacha. This while players like Bratt and Boqvist, picked in later rounds, both are looking to potentially be better players.

Just always seems to me choosing the established star over the roll of the dice is a harder decision than it some times needs to be. Give me a guaranteed $5M over a shot in the dark at $10M, but I don't know, that's me.

 

[Nubmer6]

Could be an enormous cap due to the tv deal and Seattle

That's probably why Marner's looking only for 3 years.

 

[Devs4L]

Could be an enormous cap due to the tv deal and Seattle

There's every reason to believe it will be. Most are predicting it to be, for these very reasons.

 

[JrFischer54]

I think they're trying to set up a competition for 2nd line wing. It will be between Simmonds, Zacha, and maybe even Coleman and Wood. I think they'll also be looking at Boqvist, and even Bastian or Anderson for the slot.

I think it's a fairly good gamble that one of those players proves to be a viable 2nd liner.

the thought of coleman/bastian/anderson/boqvist/simmonds/zacha/wood getting second line mins but people don't want to pull the trigger on marner coming here smh.

 

[Andre Palot]

I'll just lead off with this.

Can we realistically give Marner that 12.5 that he wants, give Hall the contract he wants, extend Nico and Hughes (when Hughes eventually will command a big money deal)

AND have a NHL defense that can be capable of not crumbling during a long playoff run? Can we pull all of this off without meeting the fate of cap hell?

I don't want us to be the f***ing Golden Knights, Oilers or one of these teams that ties up money in a handful of players and it f***s up the entire long term future of the team.

Everyone who complains we are just sitting on cap space to realize what the alternative is.

 

[JrFischer54]

That's probably why Marner's looking only for 3 years.

which is why i wouldn't put it past hall for wanting a smaller deal also.

 

[Nubmer6]

I'm not saying they're of no value, but I think it's apparent fans place more value on draft picks than GM's do. You table an offer in the 4 first round range that is matchable for Toronto, they're going to tell you to **** off with your 1st round picks. Don't want 'em. We'd rather the player. Take a hike. The end.

There's every reason to believe this team would be picking no higher than 20 over the next 4 or 5 years. If you think there wouldn't be at MINIMUM 1 or 2 busts while picking in that range over that time frame, you're dreaming. In fact it's FAR more likely 3 out of 4 players end up being average or nothing players than landing good players with 3 or 4 of those picks.

Even while picking 12 or higher we're still not certain about players like McLeod or Zacha. This while players like Bratt and Boqvist, picked in later rounds, both are looking to potentially be better players.

Just always seems to me choosing the established star over the roll of the dice is a harder decision than it some times needs to be. Give me a guaranteed $5M over a shot in the dark at $10M, but I don't know, that's me.

Would you take the guaranteed 5M over four shots at 10M at 50/50? Some would say yes, others no.