Devils 2019 offseason team discussion (news and notes) XI

[Dialamo]

Toronto takes those four 1st rounders in a second. No way Shero makes such an offer.

 

[Cheddabombs]

it's July 6th and times are slow lool

just bringing it up, not saying it's legit or not

 

[Blender]

Marner only wants a 3 or 4 year contract from all reports. We'd be insane to offer sheet him and potentially give up 4 1st rounders for that short of a deal.

 

[Triumph]

Fine, I'll start a Twitter that just tweets bogus Devils news and you guys can find it and enjoy it.

 

[MadDevil]

it's July 6th and times are slow lool

just bringing it up, not saying it's legit or not

Wait, so you mean the multiple rolling eyes emojis you posted after the Tweet means you weren't taking the rumor as fact?

 

[Stephen Gionta]

If we are offersheeting Marner for 12.5
million it better be a 6 or 7 year deal

 

[Capt Nico Poo]

I dont mind offersheeting marner for 12.5, sure the term gotta be 5+.

In a couple of years its water under the bridge. Two scenarios come to mind:

A. We screw Toronto if they match it. Ill drink to that.

B. We get Marner to wing Hughes. Also might have positive implications on Hall staying.

Do it Shero.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

I dont mind offersheeting marner for 12.5, sure the term gotta be 5+.

In a couple of years its water under the bridge. Two scenarios come to mind:

A. We screw Toronto if they match it. Ill drink to that.

B. We get Marner to wing Hughes. Also might have positive implications on Hall staying.

Do it Shero.

tying up ~30% of the cap in 2 wingers is not how you build a winning team. Especially when you have holes on D like we do.

Thats not even factoring in the 4 firsts we would have to forfeit.

 

[TheUnseenHand]

Marner only wants a 3 or 4 year contract from all reports. We'd be insane to offer sheet him and potentially give up 4 1st rounders for that short of a deal.

Imagine the 4th year, watching Toronto with your first pick while Marner signed somewhere else after his 3 year deal ended...

 

[Capt Nico Poo]

tying up ~30% of the cap in 2 wingers is not how you build a winning team. Especially when you have holes on D like we do.

Every big move has its down sides. I do acknowledge our need in proper D, but gems like Marner arent up for grabs too often.

Rather have mediocre D, as the latest Pens cup showcased, its doable.

 

[Blender]

Fine, I'll start a Twitter that just tweets bogus Devils news and you guys can find it and enjoy it.

I mean that's how a lot of people who get posted on HF started, so...

 

[Darkauron]

Can we please stop posting tweets from these schmucks with no credibility or sources.

 

[The Devil In I]

Got interested in how the cap management would work should we actually sign Marner, with the idea that it would cause Hall to extend with us as well.

So I looked into our cap space as currently laid out for next off-season. We would have something like 48.5M in space with Hall, Hischier, Bratt, Zacha, Simmonds, Butcher, Vatanen, Greene, and Blackwood contracts up. Say Hall and Marner combine for a 24M cap hit, and include Hughes cap hit at the rookie max of 3.775M. Then we're down to like 20.75M still with Hischier, Bratt, Zacha, Butcher, and Blackwood extensions still to factor in...which in all likelihood those 5 contracts would likely take up more than the remaining space. Leaving us with barely any cap space to fill 2 spots on defense. Walsh could likely take one of those spots.

I think it would force us to have to move someone like Wood, Zacha, or Palmieri to free up space, maybe trade Zacha for a young-ish cheap defenseman. Or if Blackwood continues to show he's got what it takes this season, we would have to look at trading Cory while maybe retaining some of his contract. It would definitely take getting creative with cap management.

 

[zombie abo]

Can we please stop posting tweets from these schmucks with no credibility or sources.

Ayyyyyy I’m chatterin ova heeee

 

[None Shall Pass]

What, you don't believe NHLRumorInsiderSource69420 on Twitter?

 

[Blender]

Got interested in how the cap management would work should we actually sign Marner, with the idea that it would cause Hall to extend with us as well.

So I looked into our cap space as currently laid out for next off-season. We would have something like 48.5M in space with Hall, Hischier, Bratt, Zacha, Simmonds, Butcher, Vatanen, Greene, and Blackwood contracts up. Say Hall and Marner combine for a 24M cap hit, and include Hughes cap hit at the rookie max of 3.775M. Then we're down to like 20.75M still with Hischier, Bratt, Zacha, Butcher, and Blackwood extensions still to factor in...which in all likelihood those 5 contracts would likely take up more than the remaining space. Leaving us with barely any cap space to fill 2 spots on defense. Walsh could likely take one of those spots.

I think it would force us to have to move someone like Wood, Zacha, or Palmieri to free up space, maybe trade Zacha for a young-ish cheap defenseman. Or if Blackwood continues to show he's got what it takes this season, we would have to look at trading Cory while maybe retaining some of his contract. It would definitely take getting creative with cap management.

At some point if we continue to trend in the right direction, we will be in this situation regardless. The idea is that you have a very good core of players and continually draft well so you can inject quality ELCs into the lineup year after year to fill positions. I don't necessarily think blowing $20+ million per season of cap space on two wingers is the way to go though, as it's not been shown to be a path to sustained success.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

Every big move has its down sides. I do acknowledge our need in proper D, but gems like Marner arent up for grabs too often.

Rather have mediocre D, as the latest Pens cup showcased, its doable.

the Penguins had two top 5 centers in the NHL on their team. Those 2 guys made ~24% of the cap in 2017.

Assuming Marner and Hall both gets $12.5 million and the cap stays around the same (lets call it $83), thats over 30% of the cap. Thats a big difference.

 

[Capt Nico Poo]

the Penguins had two top 5 centers in the NHL on their team. Those 2 guys made ~24% of the cap in 2017.

Assuming Marner and Hall both gets $12.5 million and the cap stays around the same (lets call it $83), thats over 30% of the cap. Thats a big difference.

I was more referring to their D (Letang hurt in playoffs etc.)

 

[Nubmer6]

Got interested in how the cap management would work should we actually sign Marner, with the idea that it would cause Hall to extend with us as well.

So I looked into our cap space as currently laid out for next off-season. We would have something like 48.5M in space with Hall, Hischier, Bratt, Zacha, Simmonds, Butcher, Vatanen, Greene, and Blackwood contracts up. Say Hall and Marner combine for a 24M cap hit, and include Hughes cap hit at the rookie max of 3.775M. Then we're down to like 20.75M still with Hischier, Bratt, Zacha, Butcher, and Blackwood extensions still to factor in...which in all likelihood those 5 contracts would likely take up more than the remaining space. Leaving us with barely any cap space to fill 2 spots on defense. Walsh could likely take one of those spots.

I think it would force us to have to move someone like Wood, Zacha, or Palmieri to free up space, maybe trade Zacha for a young-ish cheap defenseman. Or if Blackwood continues to show he's got what it takes this season, we would have to look at trading Cory while maybe retaining some of his contract. It would definitely take getting creative with cap management.

Yeah, I've re-run the numbers using EvolvingWild's projected contracts (which are VERY optimistic) I'm coming up with something like 6-7M next year before signing Marner.

That's presuming 83M cap, and:
Butcher: 2.5M
Zacha: 2M
Mueller: 1.1M
Carrick 1.2M
Hughes: 1M
Smith: 1M

Hall: 10M
Hischier: 6.5M
Bratt: 2.5M
Vatanen: 6M
Blackwood: 2M
Anderson: 1M

Maybe we could do it if we don't re-sign Vats and dump Zajac, but you'd need to get replacements for Vatanen and Greene, and at least to me, those contract estimates look awfully low, especially for Hall,Hischier, and Bratt (plus it doesn't include performance bonuses).

 

[Devs4L]

Honestly, I'm in no way that worried about losing the four 1st round picks. Players like this are normally considered untouchable. Teams won't even consider trading them under most circumstances. He's a 21 year old coming off a near 100 point season, with the kind of game that warrants every reason to believe he'll continue to improve as a player.

We have a good amount of prospects, young players, two 1st overall picks, one of which potentially generational, an absolute stud D prospect about to make the team, then you add a 22 year old superstar in Marner, and Ray would recoup at least one or two firsts over the span of 5 years, guaranteed. Even if by just trading up from the 2nd. JT Miller just fetched a 1st. We would only go at most 2 years at a time without a first anyway.

Our scouting staff has given us plenty of reason to believe they can find talent in the later rounds too.

If we're heading toward win now mode there's every reason to believe we may go 2, 3, or more consecutive years without a 1st like most other teams if Ray starts trading them at the deadline. Give me a 22 year old superstar over whatever overpriced rentals that end up not fitting in and leaving that those 1st rounders would be traded for, every day of the week.

For me, the money element of this is the only debatable part, but a salary cap that could very likely be approaching $90M or more in the next few years needs to be at least kept in mind while having that debate.

 

[MartyOwns]

i definitely don’t want marner at that price, but if we do get him, hall needs to be traded

 

[Alex NJD]

I bet my uncle earlier this offseason that I'd buy him a Marner jersey if he landed in NJ and now he's sharing these dumb rumors on facebook and telling me his jersey size

 

[REM17]

I bet my uncle earlier this offseason that I'd buy him a Marner jersey if he landed in NJ and now he's sharing these dumb rumors on facebook and telling me his jersey size

You can already order it

 

[Khione]

i definitely don’t want marner at that price, but if we do get him, hall needs to be traded

just what i was thinking. Get som picks for Hall and then try to get gusev from vegas. We cant give away 4 first rounders but if we get some back for Hall i would be ok with it. We get a younger forward but it feels like a step sideways instead of forward.

 

[Khione]

I also want some size in our top 6 someway.