Confirmed Signing with Link: [DET] Danny DeKeyser (6 years, $5M AAV)

[member 202355]

Great for DeKeyser. Bad for Detroit.

 

[Bender]

Good deal for both.

For both who? DDK and his agent?

 

[Reddwit]

I disagree there, I'd take Ekholm in almost every situation over him...

Please. Dekeyser wouldn't even know what to do with himself in Ekholm's position behind PK/Weber and Josi. Dekyser has been Detroit's #2 defenseman basically since he joined the league with no one to hold his hand and Wings fans love the guy.

This is one of the most misinformed threads I've ever posted in. Dekeyser is a solid #3 and people are calling him a "mediocre second-paring defenseman." Good lord.

 

[Reddwit]

For both who? DDK and his agent?

Yup. Terrible idea to lock up the guy who has been your #2 defenseman for the past 3 years to a 6 year deal, eating up 5 UFA years. Terrible for Detroit.

 

[member 202355]

He also gets great zone starts, Dekeyser does not. Despite what some people think, usage has a massive impact on "possession".

Prove it. Oh wait, you can't.

 

[triggrman]

Please. Dekeyser wouldn't even know what to do with himself in Ekholm's position behind PK/Weber and Josi. Dekyser has been Detroit's #2 defenseman basically since he joined the league with no one to hold his hand and Wings fans love the guy.

This is one of the most misinformed threads I've ever posted in. Dekeyser is a solid #3 and people are calling him a "mediocre second-paring defenseman." Good lord.

and if he played here he'd be behind PK/Weber - Josi as well.

That doesn't change my opinion of Ekholm being a better player right now.

 

[member 202355]

Ekholm is so much better than DeKeyser as a player and it's not even close.

 

[izlez]

So confused by this thread.

Are all defenseman judged by point production or something?

 

[bleedblue1223]

Prove it. Oh wait, you can't.

One of the better ways to prove it is look at a year by year comparative of Hedman and Pietrangelo. It's shows the affect in opposite directions. Hedman went from playing heavy defensive minutes to heavy offensive minutes, and Pietrangelo went from offensive minutes to heavy defensive minutes. Their CF% followed along with that change.

This is where the mic drops.

Also it works the same way with forwards, Backes and Steen are prime examples. Time in a certain zone has a massive impact on Corsi.

 

[TLEH]

Don't get all the hate
dekeyser has looked like a #1 in a few games when Kronwall wasn't playing and is atleast a solid 2 or 3. I've watched plenty of Detroit and always seems super steady and I think he has a little offensive upside to his game.

 

[Reddwit]

Ekholm is so much better than DeKeyser as a player and it's not even close.

This is embarrassing, as is this whole thread. Ekholm is great, as is Dekeyser.

Really, what do you guys think? The Wings fanbase has been ready to lambast Holland at any point over the past few years, have been more than willing to attack his contracts, but now the fanbase as a whole is completely fine with this deal, and yet its the fans of all other teams that know better? Ok.

Face it. Dekeyser isn't hyped. You may catch some Wings games, but you aren't keying in on Dekeyser.

 

[Cellee]

Yikes.

Enjoy that.

 

[WesMcCauley]

"This is what shutdown defensemen cost". Where have i heard that before?



Danny G

This is almost as bad as Dan Girardi`s contract...

 

[izlez]

Everyone just looking at straight stats and not realizing he's a defensive defenseman?

or maybe people using that one advanced stat that one guy on the wings board kept using to try to convince everyone Brendan Smith is our best defenseman?

 

[member 202355]

One of the better ways to prove it is look at a year by year comparative of Hedman and Pietrangelo. It's shows the affect in opposite directions. Hedman went from playing heavy defensive minutes to heavy offensive minutes, and Pietrangelo went from offensive minutes to heavy defensive minutes. Their CF% followed along with that change.

That's two players over what - three or four seasons? Is that proof?

Also, I'm not sure what you mean by "heavy offensive minutes" and "heavy defensive minutes". Are you referring to zone starts?

 

[member 202355]

This is embarrassing, as is this whole thread. Ekholm is great, as is Dekeyser.

Really, what do you guys think? The Wings fanbase has been ready to lambast Holland at any point over the past few years, have been more than willing to attack his contracts, but now the fanbase as a whole is completely fine with this deal, and yet its the fans of all other teams that know better? Ok.

Face it. Dekeyser isn't hyped. You may catch some Wings games, but you aren't keying in on Dekeyser.

It's not embarrasing. Ekholm is one of the best defensive defensemen in the NHL.

 

[WesMcCauley]

Please. Dekeyser wouldn't even know what to do with himself in Ekholm's position behind PK/Weber and Josi. Dekyser has been Detroit's #2 defenseman basically since he joined the league with no one to hold his hand and Wings fans love the guy.

This is one of the most misinformed threads I've ever posted in. Dekeyser is a solid #3 and people are calling him a "mediocre second-paring defenseman." Good lord.

No offense defensemen with horrible shot suppression, possesion etc are usually never a good idea to lock up longterm on big $ contracts. Girardi etc etc..... NYR fans loved him before they actually understood he was a big part of the problem.

 

[SpezDispenser]

The way things are going Karlsson's gonna ask for 1 billion dollars (pinkie finger to mouth).

 

[Group Chat Legend*]

yikes - Detroit's GM is showing his age with every move he makes. They are desperate to make the playoffs again

 

[bleedblue1223]

That's two players over what - three or four seasons? Is that proof?

Also, I'm not sure what you mean by "heavy offensive minutes" and "heavy defensive minutes". Are you referring to zone starts?

That's 2 players with 6 and 7 years of data that show the clear trend. There are many more and I've posted it before. I can try and find it, but I don't have time right now.

Show me proof that it doesn't and don't use the idea of on the fly changes. On the fly changes does not eliminate the known usage that we can determine with zone starts.

Yes, offensive minutes and defensive minutes can be determined by zone starts and quality of competition. Quality of competition varies in how it is evaluated and some of it is complete crap. Possession based quality of competition would make Berglund one of the toughest forwards to matchup against from the Blues, but we all know that is not true.

 

[izlez]

No offense defensemen with horrible shot suppression, possesion etc are usually never a good idea to lock up longterm on big $ contracts. Girardi etc etc..... NYR fans loved him before they actually understood he was a big part of the problem.

are you saying that this description fits Dekeyser?

Edit: Nevermind, I misudnderstood. You wrote "no-offense defenseman" rather than "no, offensive defenceman"

Still think he's being incredibly underrated in here. He's a young player who is by far the best defender we have who has put up 30 points offensively with no PP time, and in my mind still has plenty of potential to grow on the offensive end

 

[Uber Coca]

This is one of the most misinformed threads I've ever posted in. Dekeyser is a solid #3 and people are calling him a "mediocre second-paring defenseman." Good lord.

Are you really surprised? A deal is either superb or trash in here. Obviously a lot of hockey fans on HFBoards don't watch anything outside their team but still feel the need to share their ''input''.

 

[MikeK]

This deal is neither good nor bad. It's just a fair deal and one that is to be expected for this time of year. I can't say I like it, but can't say I'm surprised either.

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

Who?

The Baker....

Danny Dekeyser Bun

 

[member 202355]

Show me proof that it doesn't and don't use the idea of on the fly changes. On the fly changes does not eliminate the known usage that we can determine with zone starts.

The onus is on you to prove that it does, not for me to prove that it doesn't. You're the one who threw out the claim that usage has a massive impact on possession, and so far you have shown nothing to prove that.

Yes, offensive minutes and defensive minutes can be determined by zone starts and quality of competition. Quality of competition varies in how it is evaluated and some of it is complete crap. Possession based quality of competition would make Berglund one of the toughest forwards to matchup against from the Blues, but we all know that is not true.

Zone starts have no affect on possession numbers, and that's a fact. There is no correlation between fraction of offensive versus defensive zone starts and the corsi of a player. If we're talking explicitly about a player's possession numbers, only the possession numbers of the player's opponents are taken into consideration when talking about quality of competition. And over the course of an entire season, every player faces almost the same competition in terms of possession.