Derek Dorsett

[arttk]

Kuzma said Anaheims
Trade deadline Offer for Kesler was two 2nds and Etem

And we've heard it was two 1st and Etem from ANA and 1st + Sutter + prospect from Pitts. Of all the sources you trust, naturally you trust the one that is the least credible and has the lowest value.

I guess anything to prop up the current management group.

 

[Jimson Hogarth*]

And we've heard it was two 1st and Etem from ANA and 1st + Sutter + prospect from Pitts. Of all the sources you trust, naturally you trust the one that is the least credible and has the lowest value.

I guess anything to prop up the current management group.

Could you cite that please?

 

[arttk]

Could you cite that please?

No, just dig through the site yourself. Everybody has seen those rumors passed around a thousand times. At least that reporter from Montreal/Pittsburg have credibility when they post their rumor out considering the Pitts one was the one who leaked the deal and then leaked the fact Aquaman killed it before anyone did.

You are treating like Kuzma's rumor is the golden one that has to be right. How about this, you want to find the last time Kuzma broke a news story before everyone and was actually right? Good luck with that.

 

[Jyrki21]

It's clear that people's problem with Dorsett is not the player himself but the price the team paid for him.

If Dorsett made under $1 million, most of the complaining would go away.

Even though his contract is a ridiculous example of Benning acting as a parody of himself, my issue was more with Dorsett's usage than anything. Because he scowls a lot, Desjardins gave him offensive minutes (PP and extra attacker, as well as moving up the lineup) that should have gone to guys like Kassian.

 

[Jimson Hogarth*]

No, just dig through the site yourself. Everybody has seen those rumors passed around a thousand times. At least that reporter from Montreal/Pittsburg have credibility when they post their rumor out considering the Pitts one was the one who leaked the deal and then leaked the fact Aquaman killed it before anyone did.

You are treating like Kuzma's rumor is the golden one that has to be right. How about this, you want to find the last time Kuzma broke a news story before everyone and was actually right? Good luck with that.

Yea, that's what I thought. Attack the source (Kuzma) when you have none yourself. I thought it was against board rules to post trade rumours without a source?

 

[arttk]

Yea, that's what I thought. Attack the source (Kuzma) when you have none yourself. I thought it was against board rules to post trade rumours without a source?

Because your source is crap, need to say more?

Even a simple google search I can find a rumor that is better than the 2 2nds and Etem.

#pens did pitch #Canucks on Kessler before Olympics. Hearing Sutter, Pouliot part of those talks. That was before Letang situation.
— Rob Rossi (@RobRossi_Trib) February 28, 2014

 

[Jimson Hogarth*]

Because your source is crap, need to say more?

Even a simple google search I can find a rumor that is better than the 2 2nds and Etem.

#pens did pitch #Canucks on Kessler before Olympics. Hearing Sutter, Pouliot part of those talks. That was before Letang situation.
— Rob Rossi (@RobRossi_Trib) February 28, 2014

Trade deadline not before the Olympics.

 

[arttk]

Trade deadline not before the Olympics.

Right so a rumor is invalid because it is not on trade deadline? So if MG refused a better deal earlier, why would he accept a crappier deal when trade deadline is the day prices go up and not down.

Shows you how crap the Kuzma rumor is, especially considering there were rumors that Ana had both 1st rounder in play and MG is known to not trade his players unless he gets what he wants.

Like I said you chose to believe what you want to believe, even if it doesn't make sense at all.

 

[Lonny Bohonos]

Right so a rumor is invalid because it is not on trade deadline? So if MG refused a better deal earlier, why would he accept a crappier deal when trade deadline is the day prices go up and not down.

Shows you how crap the Kuzma rumor is, especially considering there were rumors that Ana had both 1st rounder in play and MG is known to not trade his players unless he gets what he wants.

Like I said you chose to believe what you want to believe, even if it doesn't make sense at all.

Nevermind the Kuzma "rumour" refers to an Anaheim offer not a trade about to happen.

 

[Scurr]

We lead the league in fighting majors with these two on the roster. Dale Weise just bested Dorsett's best season this year and is younger and a fraction of the cost.

Laugh all you want scurr, both these guys are better hitters too. Even under Torts who hate Weise he produced at the same rate as Dorsett in nearly 5 minutes less icetime per game.

I don't really care anyways, bottom of the roster players fighting other teams bottom of the roster players isn't "toughness" to me, it's done to make sure these guys maintain jobs.

The difference between what these guys bring and what Dorsett brings isn't vast, only their pay grades are.

Then you don't believe in the role. That's fine... but those guys aren't comparable imo. Not even close.

---

IMO it means something to have a guy that will legit 'do anything' for their team. It means something to the guys in the dressing room. Lapierre had to be convinced to stick up for himself... never mind his teammates. Weise wasn't that kind of player here, either. When it quits being important to the players, I'll agree that these guys have less shine.

 

[arsmaster*]

Then you don't believe in the role. That's fine... but those guys aren't comparable imo. Not even close.

Why? Could you please elaborate? Not even close?

IMO it means something to have a guy that will legit 'do anything' for their team. It means something to the guys in the dressing room. Lapierre had to be convinced to stick up for himself... never mind his teammates. Weise wasn't that kind of player here, either. When it quits being important to the players, I'll agree that these guys have less shine.

Is this some sort of appeal to the "unsung hero award"?

 

[Scurr]

Why? Could you please elaborate? Not even close?

Lapierre is a pest. Closer to Matt Cooke than DD. If he wasn't going to start defending himself -they would have kicked him to the curb like Cooke.

Weise is a pretty good player and a decent hitter but I found him to be reluctant to accept a role like this. He didn't seem to think it was his job to do the dirty work. I think he'd rather be Jannik Hansen.

Is this some sort of appeal to the "unsung hero award"?

No, I've said the same thing before about similar players. There is game within the game that goes on in hockey and imo players still want a guy to help on that end. It's certainly better for them if the guy can play... so I'm not surprised they're DD fans.

 

[arsmaster*]

So we're paying 11m for a guy because he fights. That sucks.

 

[Scurr]

So we're paying 11m for a guy because he fights. That sucks.

It's not just the fighting. There is a lot that goes on that people don't see. Trash talk and stuff behind the play. Dorsett polices it all for everyone. He settles every score. IMO he's one of the best in the game at it.

We're paying more for a guy that can fill the role and play. I don't mind that in theory... though I don't like how far they went.

 

[arttk]

It's not just the fighting. There is a lot that goes on that people don't see. Trash talk and stuff behind the play. Dorsett polices it all for everyone. He settles every score. IMO he's one of the best in the game at it.

We're paying more for a guy that can fill the role and play. I don't mind that in theory... though I don't like how far they went.

So Dorsett is going to stop the other team's top 9 from trash talking and guys like Lucic from doing their dirty thing by fighting other 4th line scrubs.

Do you see how that logic falls apart really really quickly.

"if you talk trash again, I am going to fight the other scrub on your team"

That is some real deterrent.

 

[arsmaster*]

It's not just the fighting. There is a lot that goes on that people don't see. Trash talk and stuff behind the play. Dorsett polices it all for everyone. He settles every score. IMO he's one of the best in the game at it.

We're paying more for a guy that can fill the role and play. I don't mind that in theory... though I don't like how far they went.

Dorsett doesn't clear scrums. He doesn't police anything other than some token fights with guys trying to make it.

Dorsett fighting John Scott may get stick taps from his teammates, but it doesn't change anything. John Scott isn't "policed" by Dorsett.

Zack Kassian was more of a deterrent....you could see it every time he was out with the Twins.

This idea that 5'10" 180lbs Dorsett "settles every score" is not backed up by anything, we even have video footage of Hamhuis and Kassian coming to his rescue.

 

[Jyrki21]

It's not just the fighting. There is a lot that goes on that people don't see. Trash talk and stuff behind the play. Dorsett polices it all for everyone. He settles every score. IMO he's one of the best in the game at it.

Catch "Double D: Supercop" at 9 p.m. in NBC's new fall lineup!

Things like "settling scores" and "message sending" and "standing up in scrums" are examples of those unlimited arms races that have basically never, ever contributed to winning, just escalating violence.

Have players ever hesitated to crash the crease because a scrum ensues literally every single time? Has "having to answer the bell" ever eliminated cheapness or (especially) accidents from the game? Derek Dorsett is really going to put an end to stupid behavior that has plagued hockey since time immemorial? It's largely because of guys like him that it happens in the first place.

 

[MS]

Dorsett doesn't clear scrums. He doesn't police anything other than some token fights with guys trying to make it.

Dorsett fighting John Scott may get stick taps from his teammates, but it doesn't change anything. John Scott isn't "policed" by Dorsett.

Zack Kassian was more of a deterrent....you could see it every time he was out with the Twins.

This idea that 5'10" 180lbs Dorsett "settles every score" is not backed up by anything, we even have video footage of Hamhuis and Kassian coming to his rescue.

Yeah, the funniest thing about this whole 'scrums' thing from Benning is that he promptly went and traded the only two guys (Kassian and Bieksa) on the team who were actually good in scrums.

 

[arttk]

Dorsett doesn't clear scrums. He doesn't police anything other than some token fights with guys trying to make it.

Dorsett fighting John Scott may get stick taps from his teammates, but it doesn't change anything. John Scott isn't "policed" by Dorsett.

Zack Kassian was more of a deterrent....you could see it every time he was out with the Twins.

This idea that 5'10" 180lbs Dorsett "settles every score" is not backed up by anything, we even have video footage of Hamhuis and Kassian coming to his rescue.

Not to mention he asked our GM for more "help". I mean comeon, this is like his ONLY job.
If we are overpaying by like 1-1.5M for him and he still needs help on this already irrelevant job that doesn't contribute to us winning, then what the hell are we overpaying him for?

 

[arsmaster*]

The positive is we're going to get 30+ staged fights this year. Yay.

 

[MS]

The positive is we're going to get 30+ staged fights this year. Yay.

Is there a more boring fighter in the league than Dorsett?

I think the only fight of his 19 last year that I actually remember is him getting rag-dolled by John Scott. And the Chris Neil fight a bit.

 

[MS]

Catch "Double D: Supercop" at 9 p.m. in NBC's new fall lineup!

Things like "settling scores" and "message sending" and "standing up in scrums" are examples of those unlimited arms races that have basically never, ever contributed to winning, just escalating violence.

Have players ever hesitated to crash the crease because a scrum ensues literally every single time? Has "having to answer the bell" ever eliminated cheapness or (especially) accidents from the game? Derek Dorsett is really going to put an end to stupid behavior that has plagued hockey since time immemorial? It's largely because of guys like him that it happens in the first place.

Statistics show that there is actually a small NEGATIVE correlation between fights and injuries. And fights and winning.

The whole notion that a 'policeman' prevents 'cheapshots on star players' is total, unmitigated rubbish.

Not to mention he asked our GM for more "help". I mean comeon, this is like his ONLY job.
If we are overpaying by like 1-1.5M for him and he still needs help on this already irrelevant job that doesn't contribute to us winning, then what the hell are we overpaying him for?

I don't know what's more amazing - that Dorsett had the balls to ask for that along with his huge new contract, or that Benning rushed to give it to him.

 

[DL44]

So we're paying 11m for a guy because he fights. That sucks.

i thought we were paying because he's a fighter capable of playing 13+ mins/night of Plus hockey regularly.

Does it matter what his possession numbers were last season, when it didn't end up hurting us?

If he can duplicate another 25 pt season, of being a plus player again... would it matter what the possession numbers say?

 

[Scurr]

Dorsett doesn't clear scrums. He doesn't police anything other than some token fights with guys trying to make it.

Dorsett fighting John Scott may get stick taps from his teammates, but it doesn't change anything. John Scott isn't "policed" by Dorsett.

Zack Kassian was more of a deterrent....you could see it every time he was out with the Twins.

This idea that 5'10" 180lbs Dorsett "settles every score" is not backed up by anything, we even have video footage of Hamhuis and Kassian coming to his rescue.

That's what you think of it. Like I said, I think the players want it. As long as that's the case, there is a place for players like this.

It's not about deterring, it's about having an answer. If you guys don't think anything goes on behind the play... I really question how much experience you have in the game.

 

[opendoor]

Is there a more boring fighter in the league than Dorsett?

I think the only fight of his 19 last year that I actually remember is him getting rag-dolled by John Scott. And the Chris Neil fight a bit.

I don't know if that's giving him enough credit. I also distinctly remember the one vs. Tropp where he fought when the Canucks were up 2-0 vs. CBJ and then by the end of that period they were down 3-2 enroute to losing 6-2.

I do agree that the Neil one was memorable too. Up 2-0 vs. OTT and they end up losing 4-3. Or the one against Cody McLeod where the team blew another lead after a Dorsett fight and ended up losing 7-3 to COL.

For some reason though I can't remember any of his fights where the Canucks were losing but ended up coming back to win afterwards. It's almost like it didn't happen once all season.