OT: COVID-19- March 17 2020 - No politics! Read post #1

[nsleaf]

 

[JT AM da real deal]

It would be good news if the anti-malarial drug was effective....BUT if it lead to complacency regarding the measures that have been put in place, it could tragically backfire.

It is not a cure. It is not a vaccine. At best, it will be an effective treatment that will improve symptoms and lessen severity for MOST, but not all. People would still die and the health care system would still be overwhelmed even with this treatment.

Still, it is potentially great news if the public can keep it in perspective. A vaccine though...the developer of that will be a hero of the magnitude of Banting and Salk.

Let's hope it is another U of T guy again

 

[Jojalu]

Ya but this was in the early 1900s so they'd have to mass produce it again

Ya just wondering about the timeline

There is so little info being released about the timeline.

I don't think anyone wants to even say. If they predict 3 months people will freak out.

The US has an announcement today at 11:45 so hopefully they will mention something about a timeline

 

[yubbers]

So you like to watch an old dog suffer badly on a ventilator and die without doing anything ... common man be real.

I'd shoot the dog if it required a ventilator. Bad comparison :p

 

[DenisSamson3]

Is there a possibility that more people will die indirectly from the upcoming recession and social isolation than the virus itself?

People who are depressed, have low savings, have food allergies and are forced to eat what is at the supermarket in stock, people who lose their retirement, people affected by perscription drug shortages, etc.

 

[PromisedLand]

It would be good news if the anti-malarial drug was effective....BUT if it lead to complacency regarding the measures that have been put in place, it could tragically backfire.

It is not a cure. It is not a vaccine. At best, it will be an effective treatment that will improve symptoms and lessen severity for MOST, but not all. People would still die and the health care system would still be overwhelmed even with this treatment.

Still, it is potentially great news if the public can keep it in perspective. A vaccine though...the developer of that will be a hero of the magnitude of Banting and Salk.

That is precisely what the FDA said as to why they are not "approving" the drug as the treatment for COVID-19. They do not want research to stop in developing a guaranteed and clinically tested drug and vaccine even if this does provide some effectiveness. There is not enough evidence to suggest that it works with certainty!

 

[deltamachine]

My issue with the environmental movement is that they are waging war on trees and us! Carbon Dioxide is what the trees breathe! The more Carbon Dioxide and Sun + Water the more vegetation grows. There are so many scientists that are out there who say and put their reputation on the line to say... A single underwater volcano can outproduce all of humanity in a year, which produces less than 1% or thereabouts of the total.

I do have a problem with these things that they don't talk about...

Industrial chemicals dumped in the ocean, lakes, rivers and down mine shafts
Fukushima still cranking out radioactive waste daily
Child labor being used to make our things

Our problem is density, we pack too many humans too close together and then give them all cars and pack industries tightly which creates smog. They should make many small self sufficient communities tied together by high speed rail systems, that's the common sense solution.

Not following the reasoning. 7b people dispersed in small communities is still 7b. I’d think that denser communities might have societal impacts but they would generate less waste and pollution. Economies of scale, transit, lower distribution costs.

 

[Jojalu]

Is there a possibility that more people will die indirectly from the upcoming recession and social isolation than the virus itself?

People who are depressed, have low savings, have food allergies and are forced to eat what is at the supermarket in stock, people who lose their retirement, people affected by perscription drug shortages, etc.

Dystopic thoughts. Let's hope it doesn't come to that

 

[kb]

Costco Pharmacy - Medications - Plaquenil - hydroxychloroquine
What side effects are possible with this medication?

Many medications can cause side effects. A side effect is an unwanted response to a medication when it is taken in normal doses. Side effects can be mild or severe, temporary or permanent.
The side effects listed below are not experienced by everyone who takes this medication. If you are concerned about side effects, discuss the risks and benefits of this medication with your doctor.
The following side effects have been reported by at least 1% of people taking this medication. Many of these side effects can be managed, and some may go away on their own over time.
Contact your doctor if you experience these side effects and they are severe or bothersome. Your pharmacist may be able to advise you on managing side effects.

• diarrhea
• dizziness
• hair loss
• headache
• increased skin sensitivity to sunlight
• loss of appetite
• nausea
• skin rash
• stomach cramps or pain
• vomiting

Although most of the side effects listed below don't happen very often, they could lead to serious problems if you do not check with your doctor or seek medical attention.
Check with your doctor as soon as possible if any of the following side effects occur:

• blurred vision or any change in vision – this effect may also occur or worsen after stopping the medication
• change in colour of hair or skin pigment
• flu-like symptoms (sudden lack of energy, fever, cough, sore throat)
• hallucinations (seeing or hearing things that are not there)
• mood or other mental changes
• muscle weakness
• ringing or buzzing in ears or any loss of hearing
• signs of anemia (low red blood cells; e.g., dizziness, pale skin, unusual tiredness or weakness, shortness of breath)
• signs of bleeding (e.g., unusual nosebleeds, bruising, blood in urine, coughing blood, bleeding gums, cuts that don't stop bleeding)
• signs of heart problems (e.g., fast, irregular heartbeat or pulse, chest pain, sudden weight gain, difficulty breathing, leg swelling)
• signs of infection (symptoms may include fever or chills, severe diarrhea, shortness of breath, prolonged dizziness, headache, stiff neck, weight loss, or listlessness)
• signs of liver problems (e.g., nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, loss of appetite, weight loss, yellowing of the skin or whites of the eyes, dark urine, pale stools)
• signs of low blood sugar (hypoglycemia) (e.g., blurred vision, dizziness, fatigue, headache, numbness or tingling of the mouth, rapid heartbeat, shakiness, sweating or confusion)
• tingling, numbness or burning pain
• unusual tiredness or weakness

Stop taking the medication and seek immediate medical attention if any of the following occur:

• convulsions (seizures)
• extrapyramidal symptoms (abnormal body movements, restlessness, shaking, or stiffness)
• signs of a severe skin reaction such as blistering, peeling, a rash covering a large area of the body, a rash that spreads quickly, or a rash combined with fever or discomfort
• signs of a serious allergic reaction (e.g., abdominal cramps, difficulty breathing, nausea and vomiting, or swelling of the face and throat)
• thoughts of suicide or self-harm

Some people may experience side effects other than those listed. Check with your doctor if you notice any symptom that worries you while you are taking this medication.
Are there any other precautions or warnings for this medication?

Before you begin using a medication, be sure to inform your doctor of any medical conditions or allergies you may have, any medications you are taking, whether you are pregnant or breast-feeding, and any other significant facts about your health. These factors may affect how you should use this medication.
Blood tests: If you take this medication for a long period of time, your doctor will likely want you to have blood tests to monitor your levels of red and white blood cells.
Blood sugar levels: Hydroxychloroquine may cause hypoglycemia (low blood sugar levels). People with diabetes may find it necessary to monitor their blood sugar more frequently while using this medication. People without diabetes have also been known to experience low blood sugars while taking hydroxychloroquine. If you experience signs of low blood sugar (cold sweat, cool pale skin, headache, or weakness), contact your doctor immediately.
Blurred vision: While taking this medication, use caution when driving or operating machinery, since hydroxychloroquine can cause blurring of vision. If your vision blurs, call your doctor.
Eye damage: Irreversible damage to the retina of the eye has occurred for some people who take long-term or high-dosage treatment with hydroxychloroquine. Eye damage is more likely to occur if recommended doses are exceeded. Your doctor will want you to have regular eye exams if you take this medication for a period of time. If you notice any new problems with sight or symptoms such as light flashes and streaks, stop the medication at once and call your doctor.
Heart disease: Rarely, weakening of the heart muscle has been reported with the use of hydroxychloroquine. If you have heart disease, discuss with your doctor how this medication may affect your medical condition, how your medical condition may affect the dosing and effectiveness of this medication, and whether any special monitoring is needed.
Kidney disease: If you have kidney disease, you may need a lower dose of this medication. Talk to your doctor about how this medication may affect your medical condition, how the medical condition may affect the dosing and effectiveness of this medication, and whether any special monitoring is needed.
Liver disease: If you have liver disease, you may need a lower dose of this medication. Talk to your doctor about how this medication may affect your medical condition, how the medical condition may affect the dosing and effectiveness of this medication, and whether any special monitoring is needed.
Muscle weakness: Call your doctor if you notice any signs of unusual or unexpected muscular weakness.
Other medical conditions: If you have stomach, nerve, blood, or skin disorders, talk to your doctor about how this medication may affect your medical condition, how your medical condition may affect the dosing and effectiveness of this medication, and whether any special monitoring is needed.
Suicidal behaviour: Rarely, people taking this medication may feel agitated (restless, anxious, aggressive, emotional, and feeling not like themselves), or they may want to hurt themselves or others. These symptoms may occur within several weeks after starting this medication. If you experience these side effects or notice them in a family member who is taking this medication, contact your doctor immediately. You should be closely monitored by your doctor for emotional and behaviour changes while taking this medication.
Pregnancy: Hydroxychloroquine crosses the placenta during pregnancy and may cause harm to the developing baby if it is taken by the mother during pregnancy. This medication should not be used during pregnancy unless the benefits outweigh the risks. If you become pregnant while taking this medication, contact your doctor immediately.
Breast-feeding: This medication passes in small amounts into breast milk. Infants are extremely sensitive to its side effects. If you are a breast-feeding mother and are taking hydroxychloroquine, it may affect your baby. Talk to your doctor about whether you should continue breast-feeding.
Children: The safety and effectiveness of using this medication have not been established for children when used for the treatment of rheumatoid arthritis or systemic lupus erythematosus. Children are especially sensitive to the side effects of hydroxychloroquine.
What other drugs could interact with this medication?

There may be an interaction between hydroxychloroquine and any of the following:

• albendazole
• amiodarone
• beta-adrenergic blockers (e.g., atenolol, propranolol, sotalol)
• chlorpromazine
• cyclosporine
• dapsone
• diabetes medications (e.g., glyburide, chlorpropamide, insulin, rosiglitazone)
• digoxin
• leflunomide
• live vaccines (e.g., BCG, yellow fever, measles, mumps, rubella)
• mebendazole
• mefloquine
• methotrimeprazine
• perphenazine
• praziquantel
• prochlorperazine
• pyrantel pamoate
• thioridazine
• trifluoperazine

If you are taking any of these medications, speak with your doctor or pharmacist. Depending on your specific circumstances, your doctor may want you to:

• stop taking one of the medications,
• change one of the medications to another,
• change how you are taking one or both of the medications, or
• leave everything as is.

An interaction between two medications does not always mean that you must stop taking one of them. Speak to your doctor about how any drug interactions are being managed or should be managed.

Check out any common ones like cholesterol or anti-depressants. It looks the same.

 

[ImpartialNHLfan]

holy crap didn’t know bill gates said that.

I read the dan brown novel “Inferno” it’s all about the elitist cults and their plan to lower global population. True or not novel was pretty epic

This is it here. Speaking on lowering population, in 2 days it just so happens to be the 40th anniversary of the Georgia Guidestones lol.

 

[PromisedLand]

Is there a possibility that more people will die indirectly from the upcoming recession and social isolation than the virus itself?

People who are depressed, have low savings, have food allergies and are forced to eat what is at the supermarket in stock, people who lose their retirement, people affected by perscription drug shortages, etc.

There is always a possibility of any event happening (well any plausible event happening); but the probability of what you are suggesting although there is very small, especially in a country like Canada.

The alternative is to disregard the warnings and continue with business as usual and then...

• People get sick
• Hospitals cannot handle the massive cases
• People call in sick
• People are not as productive
• People lose jobs
• Business don't make money
• Economy crashes anyway and overall health of the country is also garbage
• Governments offer bail outs; EI escalates, etc.... anyway....

I'd rather rebuild with a healthy country than a country in severe health crisis.

People have to understand that every country is going through it and it is not just Canada. Eventually when the smoke clears (hopefully soon enough ); no other country is going to have any significant comparative advantage over another country because of exchange rates, debt etc....

Even if one argues China, okay.... But China still needs international demand to support their growth via Chinese exports; if international demand drops China's growth and economy tanks too.

The way I am seeing it is that every country that is laying out massive stimulus packages is just "printing money"; devaluing their exchange rates against each other; but every major economy is doing it.

China has pegged their currency to US dollar anyway; so in the end it won't be a massive failure. Financial sector might suffer a little but it will rebound nonetheless once everybody gets back to work and there is borrowing and lending again. Only thing we gotta do in Canada is to make sure we enforce some policies to make sure house prices DO NOT significantly escalate after we have printed money and interest rates are down.

For example; stress tests have to be even more strict and foreign ownership has to be taxed very heavily (i.e. discourage foreign buyers for Canadian real estate) for a couple years or so.

Things are going to work out just fine. Don't let the fear mongering about economy bother you; it is people with significant lack of knowledge about long term economic trends who are making comments.

May be people don't buy any stupidly expensive cell phones or cell phone plans; or that expensive car; or that armani jacket etc...; those firms are rich enough to handle a minor blip; if not they can fail, crash and burn, new competitive firms will come in and take their place.

 

[deltamachine]

some of my family in BC was saying that they are seeing weird price action. Price of gas has gone down at the pumps but eggs/milk/bread of jumped quite a lot.

Reasonable price increases based on supply might actually help curtail hoarding. People actually needing supplies will be able to get their supplies instead of doing without. Price gouging is a different animal altogether

 

[PromisedLand]

This is it here. Speaking on lowering population, in 2 days it just so happens to be the 40th anniversary of the Georgia Guidestones lol.

View attachment 337741

Unless he misspoke; that is freakin' outrageous.

Why can't we just plant more trees ffs; and stop the forest fires; trees help cut down CO2;

also more and more people are waiting to have kids later in life anyway; and mother nature doesn't give a flying F; if you wait later (especially women) to have kids - good luck first of all having kids and even more good luck having healthy kids. Also, another trend is more of the people are deciding not to have kids too.

Bilderberg group is EVIL, there is no arguing that.

 

[PromisedLand]

Reasonable price increases based on supply might actually help curtail hoarding. People actually needing supplies will be able to get their supplies instead of doing without. Price gouging is a different animal altogether

True;

but the stimulus given by the government will not suffice. If one now has to pay a larger share towards needs like food and meds; then they will run short on paying rent/mortgages or other expenses.

They need to fix the price for transportation industries for the time being to get stuff to the stores.

 

[ULF_55]

Check out any common ones like cholesterol or anti-depressants. It looks the same.

Yep, and of course some drugs side effects include death.

My concern is people are going to get their hands on it and self medicate.

Really, doctors can prescribe it for a multitude of symptoms, and already do. Have for years, so to stretch it to use for COVID-19 isn't really going crazy.

 

[lottster14]

i thought hoarding TP was silly but it seems 2 or 3 posters here have the entire world supply of tin foil!

they must have a tinfoil hat for every occasion

Distrusting government (worldwide) with reasonable concern = Tinfoil nut job conspiracy theorist! Obey our fear programming peeps!

 

[JT AM da real deal]

There is so little info being released about the timeline.

I don't think anyone wants to even say. If they predict 3 months people will freak out.

The US has an announcement today at 11:45 so hopefully they will mention something about a timeline

Even scarier dude is no one even knows ... all you can really go on is China which lasted about 2 months but with way more stringent rules than we are following ... when we get to point where you need GOV approval to drive your car out of your driveway or face a $500 fine then you will know it is a total lockdown

 

[thewave]

Not following the reasoning. 7b people dispersed in small communities is still 7b. I’d think that denser communities might have societal impacts but they would generate less waste and pollution. Economies of scale, transit, lower distribution costs.

My point is air quality outside of the city is superior to inside the city. There is no smog in a place like, Barrie, On. The mainstream sells that to the people and say look, look see we have pollution problems we must stop! The idea simple, the solution to pollution is dilution and so if humans are the pollution, dilute the population which is actually a strategy in books as old as even the bible. What happens if Toronto has a fire in a chemical plant in the city? Millions are affected. Disease? Same thing. Packing people tightly is a dirty practice, risky practice and if anything unforeseen like power outage, supply chain issue, electricity fails... It's instantly within days a humanitarian crisis. Massive liability.

 

[yubbers]

Distrusting government (worldwide) with reasonable concern = Tinfoil nut job conspiracy theorist! Obey our fear programming peeps!

And most are coming off 4 straight years of parroting actual conspiracies. It's richer than a cheesecake that's King.

Reading an article headline in your social media feed does not make you informed. It takes actual work.

 

[Jojalu]

Even scarier dude is no one even knows ... all you can really go on is China which lasted about 2 months but with way more stringent rules than we are following ... when we get to point where you need GOV approval to drive your car out of your driveway or face a $500 fine then you will know it is a total lockdown

They are not even out of lockdown in places in China. Not to mention they are having a very difficult time rebooting where they are trying.

I try to remain optimistic, but with each passing hour the stark reality of how grave this situation is becomes a little clearer.

Hope still springs eternal, but being an ostrich with his head in the sand is no good

 

[Walshy7]

Distrusting government (worldwide) with reasonable concern = Tinfoil nut job conspiracy theorist! Obey our fear programming peeps!

I’m sorry have you read some of the theories going around in this thread? This is nothing to do with trusting the government’s of the world or not. Some of it is just beyond ludicrous

 

[ImpartialNHLfan]

Distrusting government (worldwide) with reasonable concern = Tinfoil nut job conspiracy theorist! Obey our fear programming peeps!

It's a natural response, they've gone through a lifetime of programming and it's tough for most to break out of it.

 

[PromisedLand]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-covid19-coronavirus-medical-equipment-1.5504149

 

[PromisedLand]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/banks-rbc-bmo-td-mortgage-credit-coronavirus-covid19-1.5503478

 

[PromisedLand]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/covid19-military-vance-1.5504247