OT: Coronavirus (COVID-19) Part IV - II

[NYSPORTS]

I am not sure Ive ever brought up Singapore but if you'd like I guess we can take a look? 433 cases and 1 death per million population. US 1662 and 65. What exactly is your point here?

i’m sure you’re fully aware of Singapore and have been hardly supportive of our head from likely before this virus. The Singapore stats are rising suddenly while many, within and around your posts, have praised what an amazing job Singapore did in handling this crisis. Well, like all the other guesswork that theory went up in smoke too.

by all means, you’re the leader of the free world. Let’s read your solution b/c the last ones have been proven more and more inaccurate by the hour.

 

[Fireonk]

I'm not a Trump guy, didn't vote for Trump, and don't like a lot of things about Trump. But, if Trump weren't "concerned" about it then he wouldn't have banned travel from China as early as he did. Or Europe. Criticize him all you want but AFTER Trump had already shut down travel from Wuhan, Cuomo was saying not to worry, NY is ready, DeBlasio was saying go to Broadway and use mass transit, Pelosi was saying go to Chinatown the food is great and there's nothing to see here, etc... These are all major leaders in their respective positions - a leading governor, the mayor the largest city in the United States, and the 3rd in line to the Presidency. I don't see them getting raked over the coals, I just see articles commending Cuomo on how well he's doing. It's ludicrous.

I don't know if you were addressing me (since you quoted me), but I don't take any of this personally. I just think that EVERYONE is culpable here and this constant finger pointing about who should known what and done what when is all in hindsight and we all know about hindsight given all of the arguments about our drafts. It's comical. Of course things could have been done better. Things we do in the coming weeks and months could've been done better. Everything ever done can probably be done better.

There should be more tolerance for an unprecedented event in human history. There's no playbook for this. Coronavirus costs lives. The wrecked economy will cost lives. It all costs.

A lot of what you are saying is perfectly fair. If you have been following my comments you will see that I have given Trump credit for the travel ban and agreed in criticism for all the democrats who led their constituents astray. You just don't see people trying to twist blame away from De Blasio by turning the conversation into what Trump did wrong so that makes it ok like you do the people defending Trump.

Like you said, a lot of people made mistakes.

The place where I guess we disagree, is that I believe you should absolutely be holding these people accountable and not just giving some free pass because there are aspects of this that are of course unprecedented. Nothing we can change about the past, but by holding people accountable it makes it more likely that future politicians behave a little more in the public interest going forward.

 

[Fireonk]

i’m sure you’re fully aware of Singapore and have been hardly supportive of our head from likely before this virus. The Singapore stats are rising suddenly while many, within and around your posts, have praised what an amazing job Singapore did in handling this crisis. Well, like all the other guesswork that theory went up in smoke too.

by all means, you’re the leader of the free world. Let’s read your solution b/c the last ones have been proven more and more inaccurate by the hour.

And for like the 100th time, no one is expecting perfection anywhere. Singapore's numbers still look way better than what we are going through.

I've already provided multiple points on where I think things were handled improperly, I am not going to rehash them. I am not pretending I have a solution to the re-opening of everything, nor have I said anything about the US's current plans on handling that either way. Right now I think we are in the wait and see phase and we get the benefit of some other countries attempting this first. We certainly aren't re-opening with 30k new cases a day, so we wait a couple weeks, see how these other countries succeed or fail, and then formulate a better plan based on the most up to date information we have.

 

[Hire Sather]

I'm not a Trump guy, didn't vote for Trump, and don't like a lot of things about Trump. But, if Trump weren't "concerned" about it then he wouldn't have banned travel from China as early as he did. Or Europe. Criticize him all you want but AFTER Trump had already shut down travel from Wuhan, Cuomo was saying not to worry, NY is ready, DeBlasio was saying go to Broadway and use mass transit, Pelosi was saying go to Chinatown the food is great and there's nothing to see here, etc... These are all major leaders in their respective positions - a leading governor, the mayor the largest city in the United States, and the 3rd in line to the Presidency. I don't see them getting raked over the coals, I just see articles commending Cuomo on how well he's doing. It's ludicrous.

I don't know if you were addressing me (since you quoted me), but I don't take any of this personally. I just think that EVERYONE is culpable here and this constant finger pointing about who should known what and done what when is all in hindsight and we all know about hindsight given all of the arguments about our drafts. It's comical. Of course things could have been done better. Things we do in the coming weeks and months could've been done better. Everything ever done can probably be done better.

There should be more tolerance for an unprecedented event in human history. There's no playbook for this. Coronavirus costs lives. The wrecked economy will cost lives. It all costs.

It's just so hard to be fair these days.

His side won't give an inch. Won't throw a bone to say he was wrong here or the left was right there. He will lie to cover up his mistakes and never take responsibility for them. His supporters will believe it. He'll take credit for things he shouldn't and distance himself from the idiotic things he's done and said.

The time to be fair has long passed. We can't afford to be.

Listen to his tone at these daily briefing he gives. Attacking reporters and bragging about his ratings. He doesn't give a shit about the crisis. His tone hasn't changed. He hasn't pivoted.

 

[Crease]

- ok, so you’re more upset at the action rather the content. Ok

- as far as transparency. I think it’s you’re right to want it. Respectfully, every message, decision, etc has so overly ridiculed and littered with fake news agendas for years we’re beyond the boy who cried wolf. Any message gets botched to fit a narrative so I don’t even care anymore. So many self anointed experts on how to handle any situation, with the latest being the virus, prove to be more emotional than factual.

Respectfully, it is very difficult having this discussion with you. When I correct your record regarding the CARES Act and explain that the President is committing a constitutional violation, your only response is "Ok." Why I vent about the President's lack of transparency regarding Fine, you start with the incorrect premise that I ask for too much then move the goalpost to any transparency would be pointless because of the media. I feel like we're not having a good faith conversation here. I can criticize politicians on both sides of the aisle. I do not like de Blasio's (D) leadership and will not vote for him if he ever runs again. I do not agree with Pelosi's (D) stance against China travel restrictions. It would go a long way if you showed that readiness as well.

 

[NYSPORTS]

Respectfully, it is very difficult having this discussion with you. When I correct your record regarding the CARES Act and explain that the President is committing a constitutional violation, your only response is "Ok." Why I vent about the President's lack of transparency regarding Fine, you start with the incorrect premise that I ask for too much then move the goalpost to any transparency would be pointless because of the media. I feel like we're not having a good faith discussion here. I readily criticize politicians on both sides of the aisle. I do not like de Blasio (D) and will not be voting for him next mayoral election. I do not agree with Pelosi's (D) stance against China travel restrictions. Please note that you can criticize this President and still vote for him in November.

i get it but this thread and what dominates our world is more about the virus and survival rather than about policy.

The smartest people on the planet are trying to be lucky enough to find a vaccine to stop this virus. Meanwhile, some are still trying to play a blame game while grasping for straws IMO.

 

[Good Intentions]

I am pretty elated to see the chorus of agreement on my post (p.23 of thread)...

“This thread is a sobering reminder of how I wouldn’t survive a single conservation with some, face to face. Our similarities begin and end with Rangers...For any Trump apologist, the history books will not be kind to you.”

On a related note, I truly do believe a great deal of good will come of this cataclysmic tragedy. Overdue injustices are finally being checked. A new decency will replace many shades of ugliness. Overall, I’m very optimistic.

As for our small, but incredibly meaningful Rangers world - having hockey this summer will be the greatest gift towards normalcy. Looking forward to the days in front of us.

 

[Good Intentions]

Delete

 

[Crease]

i get it but this thread and what dominates our world is more about the virus and survival rather than about policy.

The smartest people on the planet are trying to be lucky enough to find a vaccine to stop this virus. Meanwhile, some are still trying to play a blame game while grasping for straws IMO.

Respond individually. Please don't play defense against valid points because others might be grasping at straws

 

[NYSPORTS]

. Singapore's numbers still look way better than what we are going through.

I've already provided multiple points on where I think things were handled improperly, I am not going to rehash them. I am not pretending I have a solution to the re-opening of everything, . .

i won’t be rehashing the posts regarding stats either as this isn’t halftime of the Super Bowl whereas those quoting stats a mere week ago were doing nothing more than reporting the current score as if the game went Final. They still apparently do.

yes, you have pointed out how you feel things were handled improperly and stated your way of how they should have been handled. Well, those ideas didn’t work so now you’re in the wait and see mode which is a far cry from your take a few hundred thousands deaths ago.

Welcome aboard as every expert has been wrong so all we can do is wait and see as we still don’t have a vaccine, are still experimenting with drugs although hydroxychloroquine is being used in hospitals across the globe due to it’s promising mechanism of action. People are exercising better social distancing while millions still go about their business as if they weren’t warned since birth to cover your mouth when they cough or to leave a room somebody is sneezing.

Good news, MIT identified septic in ppm and it appears over 500% of people in the BSX area have Corona yet likely have no symptoms. Tough to make people aware when we’re still in the discovery phase. Who do we blame for that? Did the ouija board test positive for corona and out of commission?

Hoping for a vaccine from the experts or lucky rather than the media swaying this delusion of blame and passing it off as credible journalism.

 

[NYSPORTS]

Respond individually. Please don't play defense against valid points because others might be grasping at straws

respectfully, i get it but i’m not going into politics b/c all we care about is a solution to the virus. If another thread emerges about policy i’ll chime in.

 

[PuckLuck3043]

It's just so hard to be fair these days.

His side won't give an inch. Won't throw a bone to say he was wrong here or the left was right there. He will lie to cover up his mistakes and never take responsibility for them. His supporters will believe it. He'll take credit for things he shouldn't and distance himself from the idiotic things he's done and said.

The time to be fair has long passed. We can't afford to be.

Listen to his tone at these daily briefing he gives. Attacking reporters and bragging about his ratings. He doesn't give a shit about the crisis. His tone hasn't changed. He hasn't pivoted.

Speaking of being fair when was the last time the other side said anything that Trump did was the right thing to do? The same officials who bashed Trump for banning China travel and called him a racist for doing so are bashing him for not doing enough early on. Neither side will give an inch.

 

[Synergy27]

Just for reference, February 17th, from a USA Today Article:

Fauci doesn't want people to worry about coronavirus, the danger of which is "just minuscule." But he does want them to take precautions against the "influenza outbreak, which is having its second wave."
"We have more kids dying of flu this year at this time than in the last decade or more," he said. "At the same time people are worrying about going to a Chinese restaurant. The threat is (we have) a pretty bad influenza season, particularly dangerous for our children."
Fauci offered advice for people who want to protect against the "real and present danger" of seasonal flu, which also would protect against the hypothetical danger of coronavirus.
"Wash your hands as frequently as you can. Stay away from crowded places where people are coughing and sneezing. If in fact you are coughing and sneezing, cover your mouth," he says.
"You know, all the things that we say each year."

Criticize Trump all you want. Just don't forget to criticize everyone else that got this wrong. Which is just about everyone. From the experts, to the Republicans, to the Democrats, to other countries, and on and on and on. Start with China. That's where we should ALL be looking for answers.

This is exactly right. The response was botched from top to bottom. Anyone defending anybody at this point is either purposely ignoring facts or just locked into an inescapable cult of personality.

The constant defeatism I see from the folks who defend the president blows my mind. No one could have seen this coming. No one could have orchestrated a better response. Really?

If you feel this way, what do you do moving forward? We couldn’t have done any better, so there’s no need to reflect and improve. Let’s just sit around and do nothing, don’t attempt to dissect what when wrong and who was responsible, and run headlong into the next disaster that can’t be prevented. Sounds like a great idea to me.

 

[eco's bones]

The Federal govt. hasn't been managing the job from the beginning......the state's have. It's turned into a Governor's problem. The state's have put in requests to the Federal govt. for help but with the exception of Florida have not got nearly the help they asked for or need--part of the issue being the divestment of needed materials and supplies and the elimination of the pandemic task force all of which has happened during this presidency. As well the country on the whole was cued well into March not to take the virus seriously--slow to act on it the virus spread deeper.

So now we have the stimulus package--we don't help out the Post Office who not only do a lot of delivering for Amazon but also deliver lots of the medication people need but we bail out the airline and cruise ship industries which ain't going to be doing shit for a long while. They know for the campaign cash kickbacks come from and it ain't USPS. Most adults though will get $1200--was that Trump's idea? Not really--I think it started up with his arch-republican nemesis in the Senate Mitt Romney. It was either him or Hawley or maybe it was both. But still that had to be worked out between the House and the Senate---that's the real Federal response so far that does any good and even here there are industry bailouts. All Trump had to do was sign or not sign and of course he takes the credit like it was his idea and wants to make sure everyone knows his signature is on the check.

Speaking of which we're giving $500 of that to the food bank. Maybe give something to the SPCA too.

 

[Hire Sather]

Speaking of being fair when was the last time the other side said anything that Trump did was the right thing to do? The same officials who bashed Trump for banning China travel and called him a racist for doing so are bashing him for not doing enough early on. Neither side will give an inch.

I already said why I won't give an inch. We can't afford to. He doesn't. Why should we.

He's made it this way.

 

[Synergy27]

Is Trump treated “unfairly” by the media? Yes. Does he capitalize on that, thrive on it, and do everything he can to drive the partisan wedge in this country deeper and deeper? Yes. Does this create the high ratings cycle that he seems to love so much? Of course.

At the end of the day, does it matter what the media says or thinks? No. Everyone knows that the media is biased, divided, and losing credibility by the second.

Does it matter what the president says? It really, really does. Can you imagine if he just tossed off the “heel” role for a week, embraced the entire country, didn’t attack anyone, shared credit for successes, shouldered some blame for failures, and painted a clear picture for how we’re going to get out of this mess? I can’t, because if he hasn’t done that in the face of this he just doesn’t have it in him.

 

[PuckLuck3043]

I already said why I won't give an inch. We can't afford to. He doesn't. Why should we.

He's made it this way.

You won't give an inch and they won't but only one side is wrong. Got it.

 

[Lindberg Cheese]

COVID-19 beard has come in surprisingly well and the GF likes it.

I'm banking on minor victories nowadays.

It should only take her 5 min to shave it off her face when she tires of it

 

[Machinehead]

People in this thread: "The Democrats also did a bad thing!!"

Me:

 

[Crease]

COVID-19 beard has come in surprisingly well and the GF likes it.

This is the covid news I needed today.

 

[Machinehead]

ok, you’re running the country. Give us your plan.

let’s make sure the facts aren’t dismissed in this plan though. In no particular order:

- the CDC forecasted between 2-20 million people being hospitalized despite less than a million hospital beds nationwide.
- Despite any threat, too many people (likely millions) still can’t grasp the concept of social distancing
- Test or no test, millions are infected with this virus yet show no symptoms
- from the lowest unemployment to the highest, solve the problem. Do you give the people hope or tell them we’re not going back to work for a year?
- you have no vaccine


You are now the President. Please share your plan of action. Anybody chime in. Keep in mind, the “more testing” crew which praised tiny Singapore, etc guess what? Singapore numbers are quickly rising.

Let’s hear the master plans

Let's start with national social distancing standards.

This is something a high school student could put together in 20 minutes.

Every other country has them.

 

[GoAwayGiannone]

Respond individually. Please don't play defense against valid points because others might be grasping at straws

I feel like theres too large a gap of knowledge of politics and law between the two of you for him to give an actual answer and for you to be satisfied with said answer. Unless the whole point was to show case that, then touché.

 

[UnSandvich]

He Could Have Seen What Was Coming: Behind Trump’s Failure on the Virus

 

[Bob Richards]

It should only take her 5 min to shave it off her face when she tires of it

This is the covid news I needed today.

I'm a man of the people. This is my purpose on this forum. Poster extraordinaire.

 

[Ola]

Kremlin warns of huge influx of Moscow patients as coronavirus toll climbs

Russia denied having the corona virus in the society until last March. They would handle it, Putin is good at these things he thinks himself. Meanwhile this is how it looks outside all hospitals in Moscow:

One ambulance had to wait 15 HOURS to in line outside the hospital with a corona patient.

This is what frustrates Putin, Trump and the likes. They are used to getting what they want and making the reality bend around them at the cost of everyone living in the real world. But it can’t be done with a thing like this.