That's not by design. They're currently under a ransomware attack. It's also not looking good. Seems like the hackers got personal information of their customers and probably credit card info too.
News Article: Colorado Avalanche Media Coverage Part VI
- Thread starter forsbergavs32
- Start date
-
Work is still on-going to rebuild the site styling and features. Please report any issues you may experience so we can look into it. Click Here for Updates
Yep exactly. If the service I eventually have to pay for to watch the Avs and Nuggs just pipes in the stadium sound and PA announcer i could live with that. I really don't care or hate for any of the on air people, just used to it. But i could get used to just the basics too as long as I get to watch the action. Maybe the newer fans need announcers and analysts but i don't
Well, neither have them and Comcast. Nothing was resolved except for the lawsuit, but that had to end before anything else could move forward.
AvBuff
Registered User
- May 1, 2019
- 808
- 2,175
Altitude wasted years and God knows how much in attorneys fees for zilch. If you wanna sue Comcast for anti trust to get leverage in a business dispute...you better be right and you better win. Altitude caved and probably destroyed any remaining ability to cut a deal with Comcast.
Litigation was a supremely dumb move.
Litigation was a supremely dumb move.
It's kinda weird that they settled away from court and that altitude actually posted that on their Twitter account. Plus Moser and the other altitude guys didn't say a peep about it. Normally they're extremely vocal about that stuff. I don't want to get my hopes up, but maybe there's a slight chance that a deal might happen? Or at least heading in the right direction? I can only hope I guess.
That's where my flimsy string of hope is coming from. Maybe they were told to cool it while something is maybe worked out.
AvBuff
Registered User
- May 1, 2019
- 808
- 2,175
Altitude was getting ass kicked in federal court and decided to cut its losses. The case was always weak. But they didn't just take Comcast to court - they sued it for anti trust. Which is an enormous allegation...that they could never prove. They saw the writing on the wall and dumped the case. By suing, Altitude did immeasurable damage to whatever goodwill remained with Comcast.
Altitude knows the landscape is about to change and they couldn't have that overhang it appears. I'm guessing a second round of something like Evoca comes out if the leagues themselves don't make some major changes and go the no blackouts route. With the Rockies looking likely to have to go that way KSE just has to get on board and salvage what they can.
There was no goodwill to be had, and no deal that would not signal the beginning of the end for Altitude. I’m not here to defend their actions but I can see why they decided to go down swinging as hard as they could.
That said, KSE should accept that the landscape is changing and just do what’s necessary to get their station back on the air everywhere it can be. It’s gonna be a painful transition no matter what. May as well get it started and go from there.
I don't blame Altitude, they knew regional sports networks were a dying business five years ago, so they stood strong in their stance to keep themselves sort of alive. Now I am not sure if they "won" anything as I did not see any sort of deal, but considering a major player has filed chapter 11 and AT&T now wants to get the hell out of it, shows what's going on in the industry. I also don't blame Comcast for not wanting to overpay a very small network for their demands (though considering their profit margin, they should've been more to wiggle). In reality, both come across as evil and guilt-tripping each other where the fans lose in the end, especially during Avs Cup run.
The saddest part of this sordid affair is that the Avalanche, Nuggets, and Mammoth have never been in better shape, and there’s a huge potential audience just…unable to watch them.
Bill Peckerskull
Fargin' Icehole
It's not sad, it's asinine. Total, "FU we don't care" to the fans. Dude worth billions bickering over a few mill. It's been said before, but why not take that money and start a streaming service with your own app that costs like $5 a month or $50 a year?
I can't imagine what he spent on lawyer fees. Probably more than the difference between what he and Comcast where squabbling over.
The whole thing is beyond stupid.
Don’t just blame KSE. They chose bad tactics, but the major cable carriers colluded with one another to run Altitude out of business. And now we’re seeing a total collapse of RSOs, so the initial strategy for Altitude to sell to a larger network chain (preferably the one the cable carriers owned) is now for naught.
KSE wound up for too big a punch, but it was the cable carriers who started this shit.
SirLoinOfCloth
Registered User
I agree with this. However, I believe on Altitude FM once they spoke about how KSE aren't actually allowed to do their own streaming service due to rules enforced by the NHL. They didn't mention what they were, and for all I know it was bullshit propaganda from KSE to make the listeners feel like they were the victims, but thats what they said (paraphrasing) "We cannot switch to offering a streaming service due to NHL regulations".
RockLobster
King in the North
I think it was @henchman24 that went a little more in depth, but I actually do not believe KSE is able to do their own streaming service (right now) due to some likely antiquated rules/bylaws w/ the NHL and their viewing rights.
Could be wrong, but I believe that MIGHT be a legitimate thing Altitude was saying.
All along, I've been relatively anti-Altitude because their talking points are just so f***ing stupid, they could have had a deal in the beginning but f*cked around and they ended up finding out.
Could be wrong, but I believe that MIGHT be a legitimate thing Altitude was saying.
All along, I've been relatively anti-Altitude because their talking points are just so f***ing stupid, they could have had a deal in the beginning but f*cked around and they ended up finding out.
The short story is out of market local broadcast rights are owned by ESPN. So Altitude outside the blackout region cannot offer streaming services directly to consumers as it isn't their product to offer. Within the blackout region, they can offer streaming services. Now Altitude being basically a one city operation, that is a rather expensive endeavor and one that risks deteriorating the relationships they have even further. Can be done though, Bally did it (and it has failed).
Really the issue here is that Comcast and others are simply not wrong. RSOs have been a huge cash cow for years that simply get pushed through to consumers. I don't know the actual number for altitude, but many of these channels have gotten between $3-6 per month, per subscriber for years. As pricing pressure has hit cable and satellite, plus the desire to cord cut and ala carte programming, those companies are looking at the data to find where they can be cost competitive. Simply put, RSOs are nearly as expensive as ESPN and TNT, but don't get near the usage. They are the easiest to cut without a huge hit to most consumers. We are the hardcore here who follow teams, but the vast majority of people just watch a few games or bigger games each year (if they even do that). So for cable to stay competitive price wise, it makes sense to cut RSOs. But RSOs have built their model around these huge fees. They'll go bankrupt in a future with $1-1.50 per month.. just a matter of how long they can hold out. We are seeing it in real time.
Once that happens, the NHL teams getting ~20-30m per year off these (most are in that range, some more, some less) are going to have a very rough time getting even half that for local rights.... which the NHL will probably just band those teams together and package the local rights to ESPN (and ESPN would jump on this opportunity). ESPN would likely just have their own crews run things, but because of that excess cost, they'll ask for a discount. Probably in the realm of ~3-400m for the whole NHL (unconfirmed, but NHL is rumored to net around 900m-1b for local rights)
Really the issue here is that Comcast and others are simply not wrong. RSOs have been a huge cash cow for years that simply get pushed through to consumers. I don't know the actual number for altitude, but many of these channels have gotten between $3-6 per month, per subscriber for years. As pricing pressure has hit cable and satellite, plus the desire to cord cut and ala carte programming, those companies are looking at the data to find where they can be cost competitive. Simply put, RSOs are nearly as expensive as ESPN and TNT, but don't get near the usage. They are the easiest to cut without a huge hit to most consumers. We are the hardcore here who follow teams, but the vast majority of people just watch a few games or bigger games each year (if they even do that). So for cable to stay competitive price wise, it makes sense to cut RSOs. But RSOs have built their model around these huge fees. They'll go bankrupt in a future with $1-1.50 per month.. just a matter of how long they can hold out. We are seeing it in real time.
Once that happens, the NHL teams getting ~20-30m per year off these (most are in that range, some more, some less) are going to have a very rough time getting even half that for local rights.... which the NHL will probably just band those teams together and package the local rights to ESPN (and ESPN would jump on this opportunity). ESPN would likely just have their own crews run things, but because of that excess cost, they'll ask for a discount. Probably in the realm of ~3-400m for the whole NHL (unconfirmed, but NHL is rumored to net around 900m-1b for local rights)
Last edited:
I bet KSE realized how small the audience was for specifically paying for their service and the potential payoff if every subscriber paid for it on a standard tier was just so much greater that they felt like they had to go this route. Going forward, I think the NHL with nearly half its teams in broadcasting limbo will have to make drastic changes over the summer. It appears most of their teams have gotten some commitments from RSNs to show games until the end of the regular season. The big issue will be the handful of teams which have very lucrative deals because viewership is so high, how will they compromise on this idea of mostly digital streaming for many teams? The idea that access to sports team broadcasts drives cable subscriptions does still hold water in some limited markets with certain teams.
AvBuff
Registered User
- May 1, 2019
- 808
- 2,175
To me, there's a pox on both Comcast and Altitude. Comcast is playing hardball with KSE and Kroenke is too damn stubborn to admit that its business model simply doesn't work anymore.
I'm just sick and tired of the Altitude crew acting like this is some kind of "David v Goliath" saga and that poor Stan Kroenke is getting pushed around by a monopoly. Kroenke is one of the richest people on the planet - he could give away the Avs and Nuggets broadcast rights and the shortfall would be a rounding error on the bottom line of his empire.
I'm just sick and tired of the Altitude crew acting like this is some kind of "David v Goliath" saga and that poor Stan Kroenke is getting pushed around by a monopoly. Kroenke is one of the richest people on the planet - he could give away the Avs and Nuggets broadcast rights and the shortfall would be a rounding error on the bottom line of his empire.
Well, I don't think you have to worry about that anymore, I can't imagine the settlement would not cover that aspect.
Unfortunately at this point there's more uncertainty than ever because Plan B was to sell and roll Altitude into another RSO, and that's not really a viable plan anymore.
I'd venture to guess that you could buy Altitude for the amount of cash they have on their balance sheet. At worst, 2x cash. The unfunded liabilities have to be huge without a ton of cash coming in. Clear to see they have operated with a major gap and there isn't going to be an easy way to fill that gap. They could file bankruptcy and get protection, but that only hurts the Nuggets and Avs as related parties. I do wonder when the contracts end with the teams. If the end during the same year (I'd say odds are high), that is naturally the time to unwind the channel.
That’ll be one hell of a sea change given that it’s a television and radio network tied together. A LOT of people are gonna lose their jobs.
everything just goes back to the root problem - not enough viewers. People don’t watch as much sports (and TV) as they did 5-10 years ago. In the meantime costs rise and people expect their salaries to grow every year. The math just doesn’t add up. It’s not sustainable. Comcast used to allow the money spigot to flow and then pass on the increases to their customers. Then Netflix came along and Comcast had to stop/slow down the spigot. Now there’s no money out there. And judging by how icy the reception is when Netflix doesn’t allow password sharing or rate increases - that buck doesn’t seem like it’s going to get passed on to the streamers either.
Yeah it is inevitable though… the industry is dying.
I’d guess though they spin off radio when this all happens. There is still a workable business model in radio. Not a hugely profitable one (unless you are on the tower side), but one that can work.
AvBuff
Registered User
- May 1, 2019
- 808
- 2,175
I'm conflicted a bit because I really like Altitude sports radio - it's infinitely better than KKFN when it comes to hockey coverage - or any other kind of non-Bronco coverage. I also like the on-air Avalanche talent. It's just too bad they're all Kroenke employees.
I'm afraid they've staked their career to a dying horse.
I'm afraid they've staked their career to a dying horse.
Latest posts
-
-
OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: Kansas City Swifts vs Philly Eagles- Latest: bigdaddyk88
