Speculation: Claude Giroux and the Colorado Avalanche

[Captain97]

I could see the Habs offering the double rendition spot for either a late pick or swapping one of theirs with the other team.

Like Avs get the Habs 3rd Habs get the Avs 2nd. (Basically trade down ~5-10 spots in the draft.

 

[Peter Peckerwood]

I think a first will suffice. Maybe add an older prospect with limited upside like Sampo Ranta or late round pick (5th or 6th). I don't think it will take much more than that. I think it is really just a first and then something thrown in to make Fletcher not look as bad.

I don't anticipate Fletcher doing this though. I think he'll trade Giroux for something like future consideration, which will be if Giroux resigns with Colorado, Chuck gets a signed game-worn jersey.

I honestly think the Hockey World will be shocked at how little return Chuck will get.

Not a Byram or Newhook jersey, though, right?

 

[Hasbro]

If thats the case, there aren't many better in the business there, either. It sounds like G checks all the boxes.

I'm at the point that I don't even care about the return. I just want him to win. Such an underrated player.

His Scientology attitude made me consider Kessel just for the sake of getting JTC off PP1. His and MacKinnon injuries earlier in the season made them change up the power play which has made it so potent as of late.

 

[JoemAvs]

The dirty lirtle secret that Avs fans don't want to admit to themselves is that we really can not afford big trades at the moment. At all.
Neither assetwise nor capwise.
Sakic would be smart to not give up the little he has left to chase unicorns at the deadline.
The only way Giroux makes sense is via UFA IMO once both Bura and Kadri walk (+ maybe Nichushkin).
It will take a herculean effort by Sakic in the offseason to fix the second line. He really can not afford to trade away the few assets he has now. He very likely is desperately going to need them in the summer. Especially considering that he has to really overpay for people to retain (probably even double retention so two teams) to make it work with the cap.
I really hope he doesn't even try something stupid like that.
I also don't see why Giroux would force his way to the Avs via NMC and thats realistically the only way the Avs could maybe somewhat afford him and why he would then stay at a discount (which the Avs would need from him) to stay in Denver.

 

[TheKingPin]

Giroux is actually an excellent PKer on top of being elite at faceoffs. Two birds, one stone.

PP, PK, 5v5, C, W.

 

[TheKingPin]

The dirty lirtle secret that Avs fans don't want to admit to themselves is that we really can not afford big trades at the moment. At all.
Neither assetwise nor capwise.
Sakic would be smart to not give up the little he has left to chase unicorns at the deadline.
The only way Giroux makes sense is via UFA IMO once both Bura and Kadri walk (+ maybe Nichushkin).
It will take a herculean effort by Sakic in the offseason to fix the second line. He really can not afford to trade away the few assets he has now. He very likely is desperately going to need them in the summer. Especially considering that he has to really overpay for people to retain (probably even double retention so two teams) to make it work with the cap.
I really hope he doesn't even try something stupid like that.
I also don't see why Giroux would force his way to the Avs via NMC and thats realistically the only way the Avs could maybe somewhat afford him and why he would then stay at a discount (which the Avs would need from him) to stay in Denver.

Aren’t those some reasons to make a big move? The team is set to down grade next year. Mackinnon s deal is up soon. I know he said he will take a discount, but who knows with another early exit. I am with you on not “going for it” but the Avs seem to have a little more motivation than the typical contender.

 

[Richard88]

Do the Avs need depth at RHD as well?

Wonder if Giroux + Braun could go together with the Flyers retaining 50% on both

2023 1st
2022 2nd
Barron
Compher for salary purposes

Wait nevermind, Sakic is just going to bend Chuck over like everyone else does.

Yes, a bottom 4 RD who can PK well would definitely be nice to add, especially if Byram is out for the season, so Braun would likely very much be of interest.

That said, if Helleson does well at the Olympics there's a chance Sakic tries to sign him asap and give him some games prior to the deadline to see if he can fill that role. He plays exactly the role the Avs need right now, the only question is if he would be able to handle the responsibility of playing in the NHL so soon, particularly if he's expected to PK.

Yes they can use another RHD. They are pretty much playing 5 d last couple games, with McDermid only playing 5-6 mins a game. And EJ was benched yesterday, so EJ and McDermid were both below 10 mins, while Makar and Toews had to play 30+ mins.

Counter with

Kaut
2022 3rd
Olausson
Compher for salary purposes

For Giroux at 50% and Braun full cap.

Hall with a NMC only fetched a 2nd and Björk, which is more or less equivalent to 2nd + Jost. So if Giroux flexes that NMC it might be possible to get him without giving up a 1st.

As for Braun, with so few 2022 1sts available (ie. Florida, Carolina, Vegas, and Carolina already traded their 1st's), and with a saturated market both for Dmen and forwards, realistically he'll probably only fetch a 3rd or 3rd+ at the deadline.


Combine the two and you get a 2nd + Jost + 3rd. That's probably a bit low, so alternatively with Braun included you can bump the 2nd up to a 1st and go with a 1st + Jost and maybe a lesser prospect (eg. Bowers). That way Philadelphia ensure themselves of one of the few 1st rounders on the market despite having little leverage due to Giroux's NMC.

 

[Rebels57]

Yes, a bottom 4 RD who can PK well would definitely be nice to add, especially if Byram is out for the season, so Braun would likely very much be of interest.

That said, if Helleson does well at the Olympics there's a chance Sakic tries to sign him asap and give him some games prior to the deadline to see if he can fill that role. He plays exactly the role the Avs need right now, the only question is if he would be able to handle the responsibility of playing in the NHL so soon, particularly if he's expected to PK.


Hall with a NMC only fetched a 2nd and Björk, which is more or less equivalent to 2nd + Jost. So if Giroux flexes that NMC it might be possible to get him without giving up a 1st.

As for Braun, with so few 2022 1sts available (ie. Florida, Carolina, Vegas, and Carolina already traded their 1st's), and with a saturated market both for Dmen and forwards, realistically he'll probably only fetch a 3rd or 3rd+ at the deadline.


Combine the two and you get a 2nd + Jost + 3rd. That's probably a bit low, so alternatively with Braun included you can bump the 2nd up to a 1st and go with a 1st + Jost and maybe a lesser prospect (eg. Bowers). That way Philadelphia ensure themselves of one of the few 1st rounders on the market despite having little leverage due to Giroux's NMC.

Jost has no value to the Flyers at all. He's just more of the same mediocre players they already have and a pointless addition. If Colorado wont do a 1st they'll move on to St. Louis, Minnesota, etc.

 

[Richard88]

I know this is a Giroux to Colorado thread, but I was just looking at some stats and noticed the Avs have the worst PK% of the current playoff teams. Has there been any discussions in and around the Avs about adding a PK specialist by the deadline?

The need for help on the PK has certainly been discussed plenty on the Avs board.

One issue is the low faceoff win % for Jost and Compher who are both regular PK'ers. Maltsev is great at face-offs and has been earning more trust from Bednar lately so he could be an in-house solution to that issue if he can improve his PK game.

The system has been tweaked lately with some improvement, but obviously adding a bottom 6 PK specialist would also help. Lehkonen's name has come up frequently for example.

Avs have a lot of numbers in the bottom 6 forward positions though (i.e. Newook, LOC, NAK, Jost, Compher, Helm, Maltsev, and MacDermid), so if a forward is added it may require someone to be moved out to make room.

A RHD who can clear the net-front and partner Girard would be useful too. Particularly as Byram is out, and JJ and Murray haven't been great on the PK.

 

[Richard88]

Giroux is one of the better PK players in the league when he's actually used there., for what it's worth. And since the Avs likely sont break up Pp1. You could slot G on second line and PK1 and PP2 duty and call it a day.

If Giroux was acquired he'd almost certainly get put in the bumper spot on PP1. Bednar likes to have a RHS in that position as it has statistically created more opportunities than with a LHS there (particularly due to Rantanen's passing off the right). Donskoi and Compher have been used there the last couple of seasons but neither has been an ideal fit.

Giroux being good at face-offs and a RHS would allow Bednar to move Kadri to PP2 without losing his faceoff ability on PP1 as well.

----------------- Landeskog -------------
MacKinnon - Giroux - Rantanen
-------------------- Makar -----------------

Could also see Giroux on the PK, along with being used on the 3rd line to have 3 really good scoring lines.

Landeskog - MacKinnon - Rantanen
Nichuskin ---- Kadri --- Burakovsky
Giroux ------- Newhook -- O'Connor
Compher - Jost - Helm/NAK/Maltsev/Macdermid

 

[Richard88]

Jost has no value to the Flyers at all. He's just more of the same mediocre players they already have and a pointless addition. If Colorado wont do a 1st they'll move on to St. Louis, Minnesota, etc.

How will Philadelphia move on to Minnesota, Blues, etc if Giroux chooses only Colorado as a destination? That is the premise of what I posted.

As for Jost, I would have thought a team with terrible defense might have some interest in a reasonably young player with excellent defensive metrics (albeit very meh metrics offensively). Anyways the add could easily be another prospect like Ranta, Kaut, Bowers, whatever.

 

[Rebels57]

How will Philadelphia move on to Minnesota, Blues, etc if Giroux chooses only Colorado as a destination? That is the premise of what I posted.

As for Jost, I would have thought a team with terrible defense might have some interest in a reasonably young player with excellent defensive metrics (albeit very meh metrics offensively). Anyways the add could easily be another prospect like Ranta, Kaut, Bowers, whatever.

Giroux isn't going to put the Flyers in that situation. There's already rumors that he has multiple teams in mind.

But yes, based on your premise, it would make the return less.

 

[ponder719]

How will Philadelphia move on to Minnesota, Blues, etc if Giroux chooses only Colorado as a destination? That is the premise of what I posted.

There's no point in discussion if that's the premise; clearly the Flyers will get what they will get in that circumstance, because they'd have no leverage. Might as well say "Giroux will demand to be traded to Colorado with Couturier for JT Compher and permission to kick Dave Scott in the balls once weekly, and the Flyers will have to do it." At that point, we're not discussing anything, we're reading fanfic.

Any discussion of what trades are possible have to be predicated on the idea of Giroux allowing for at least a couple possibilities, which opens up room for negotiation of value.

 

[Richard88]

There's no point in discussion if that's the premise; clearly the Flyers will get what they will get in that circumstance, because they'd have no leverage. Might as well say "Giroux will demand to be traded to Colorado with Couturier for JT Compher and permission to kick Dave Scott in the balls once weekly, and the Flyers will have to do it." At that point, we're not discussing anything, we're reading fanfic.

Any discussion of what trades are possible have to be predicated on the idea of Giroux allowing for at least a couple possibilities, which opens up room for negotiation of value.

Why does "any" discussion have to be predicated on him allowing for multiple teams? It's not unrealistic at all for him to choose one particular team, so discussing that possibility seems like a valid conversation to have.

 

[McJedi]

Jost has no value to the Flyers at all. He's just more of the same mediocre players they already have and a pointless addition. If Colorado wont do a 1st they'll move on to St. Louis, Minnesota, etc.

Philly doesn’t get to move on and shop this player league wide. It’s Giroux that decides where he’ll play.

 

[ponder719]

Why does "any" discussion have to be predicated on him allowing for multiple teams? It's not unrealistic at all for him to choose one particular team, so discussing that possibility seems like a valid conversation to have.

Because it's not a discussion at that point; you're simply dictating terms. "Take it or leave it" offers no room to converse.

 

[Richard88]

Because it's not a discussion at that point; you're simply dictating terms. "Take it or leave it" offers no room to converse.

Of course there's still room to converse. Lots of prospects or players could be involved. Could expand it to include Braun for example.

 

[Patagonia]

There's no point in discussion if that's the premise; clearly the Flyers will get what they will get in that circumstance, because they'd have no leverage. Might as well say "Giroux will demand to be traded to Colorado with Couturier for JT Compher and permission to kick Dave Scott in the balls once weekly, and the Flyers will have to do it." At that point, we're not discussing anything, we're reading fanfic.

Any discussion of what trades are possible have to be predicated on the idea of Giroux allowing for at least a couple possibilities, which opens up room for negotiation of value.

Giroux is more likely to stay close to home. Being a UFA, increase his marketability playing 2C on a Cup contender. AVs would definitely be a scary team, cap hit would be difficult to navigate unless a dump ie. Compher is included in the deal.

I suspect the team would be BOS or NYR as the likely destinations.

 

[Dooble08]

Philly doesn’t get to move on and shop this player league wide. It’s Giroux that decides where he’ll play.

Well they actually do get to. It's not like Giroux will say "I'm only playing in Colorado." So it's just a farce that the Flyers will get a poor or weaker return. He'll give the Flyers a list of where he would like to go. Then it's a bidding war between those teams where the Flyers will trade him to the team that gives up the best return.

 

[Shane Diesel]

The dirty lirtle secret that Avs fans don't want to admit to themselves is that we really can not afford big trades at the moment. At all.
Neither assetwise nor capwise.
Sakic would be smart to not give up the little he has left to chase unicorns at the deadline.
The only way Giroux makes sense is via UFA IMO once both Bura and Kadri walk (+ maybe Nichushkin).
It will take a herculean effort by Sakic in the offseason to fix the second line. He really can not afford to trade away the few assets he has now. He very likely is desperately going to need them in the summer. Especially considering that he has to really overpay for people to retain (probably even double retention so two teams) to make it work with the cap.
I really hope he doesn't even try something stupid like that.
I also don't see why Giroux would force his way to the Avs via NMC and thats realistically the only way the Avs could maybe somewhat afford him and why he would then stay at a discount (which the Avs would need from him) to stay in Denver.

The Avs have little need for Giroux as the highest scoring team in the league. I think it makes no sense whatsoever, especially so for the reasons you note above.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Jost + 1st for Giroux @50%

And a 4th round pick somewhere else for Giroux @ another 50% off.


Just do it now and we have our 1/2C replacement while Mackinnon is out.

 

[Peter Peckerwood]

Well they actually do get to. It's not like Giroux will say "I'm only playing in Colorado." So it's just a farce that the Flyers will get a poor or weaker return. He'll give the Flyers a list of where he would like to go. Then it's a bidding war between those teams where the Flyers will trade him to the team that gives up the best return.

Or he will say ""I'm only play in Colorado", "I will only play for NYR...Boston", etc.
The only thing that is a farce is assuming to know what he'll do. Staying close to home, as stated above may make sense. Hell, he could mull it over until this summer and possibly re-sign and stay home for that matter.
We still have basically 2 months of this in all likelihood.

 

[SnS]

I dont see Giroux backing us into an “only this team” scenario.


I think he’ll cup chase and then come back to Philly as a FA.

 

[TheKingPin]

Jost + 1st for Giroux @50%

And a 4th round pick somewhere else for Giroux @ another 50% off.


Just do it now and we have our 1/2C replacement while Mackinnon is out.

That’s likely the lowest return. I would think it would be higher for the flyers to move him now. I think he hits 1000 games predeadline too.

 

[Dooble08]

Or he will say ""I'm only play in Colorado", "I will only play for NYR...Boston", etc.
The only thing that is a farce is assuming to know what he'll do. Staying close to home, as stated above may make sense. Hell, he could mull it over until this summer and possibly re-sign and stay home for that matter.
We still have basically 2 months of this in all likelihood.

It's already been speculated that there are multiple teams interested and that Giroux has multiple teams that he'd accept a trade to. Like you mentioned, it's only a few months. So staying close to home probably isn't as important.

I mean the reports are that G has already been meeting with his agent and will continue to during the All-Star break.