Dreger: Buchnevich is likely to be traded

[Robtom18]

First my post are asking to much then i am asking for to little. Anytime any of you would like to grab a cold beer watch a game and talk hockey face to face let me know. I live in stpeters. Would love to chat go over opinions

 

[Robtom18]

At 30, for what the Blues need and are giving up? And for how Ceci has done this season? [Someone here has stats on Edmonton's play with, I think it was, the Nurse-Ceci pairing on the ice and with it off, and then Nurse's play with and without Ceci. Take a free guess which one of the two looks terrible.]

He's a 3rd pairing guy, who'd play a year in Scandella's spot, have about the same impact, and be gone at the end of the season. So yeah, he's a cap dump.


1st round picks who get a shot at the NHL at 20, 21 don't need 4 years to break out into a top-6 role. They start showing signs of production even in a limited role. Holloway ... to be kind, isn't.


Kyrou spent parts of 2 seasons in the AHL before sticking with the big club, and even in those partial seasons he still put up the same numbers Holloway has but in half the games.

Maybe more importantly, you could watch Kyrou and say "OK, I see flashes, let's see if he can get his shit together" even if at times you thought maybe he wasn't going to. Holloway shows nothing remotely close to that.


Maybe from Edmonton. Not from the entire league. "Well shit, this is the best this team is offering, ... f***, I guess we gotta accept it instead of seeing what else is out there" is how franchises get stuck in the bottom half of the league for years on end.


Buchnevich was playing in Russia in 2015-16. His first season in the NHL, when he was 21, he was 8-12-20 in 41 games. His second season, when he was 22, he was 14-29-43. Both of those are far ahead of what Holloway has done.

Holloway is, and always has been, playing his pro games in North America. [Much more than a] Slight difference between the two.


I agree, you should use some common sense here. Start with understanding the difference between Buchnevich's development, Kyrou's development and Holloway's development, and what to expect from highly drafted players who spend a couple years in the NHL and barely produce at all. They don't break out to be consistent 50-point, 60-point guys.

Look sorry for being an ass. Long day.

Instead of me and you arguing value. What would be your ask from the following teams. This would help me further understand your thoughts on this. I think thats all the teams showing interest per analyst

Edm
Car
Van
Det
Buf
Nyr
Veg

Once again sorry for being an ass.

 

[Coach Z]

First my post are asking to much then i am asking for to little. Anytime any of you would like to grab a cold beer watch a game and talk hockey face to face let me know. I live in stpeters. Would love to chat go over opinions

Man come on. No one wants to drive to St. Peters.

 

[Robtom18]

Man come on. No one wants to drive to St. Peters.

Stl fans lol

 

[RedHawkDown]

Dont forget suzzuki or Bradly Nadeau need a third piece for the extra year thanks.

You are weirdly high on Holloway and broberg if you think these deals are both acceptable

 

[ChaoticOrange]

You are weirdly high on Holloway and broberg if you think these deals are both acceptable

I think people are sleeping on Broberg. And that's coming from someone that's pissed that our management botched that pick as badly as they did.

I'll eat a shoe if he's ever a top pairing defenceman, but he's NHL ready right now and probably wouldn't look out of place as a team's #4 right now with a decent partner. The only reason he's not up here right now is we have one of the deepest left sides in the NHL with Ekholm/Nurse/Kulak.

Holloway needs to be in the AHL or on someone's top 9. He's totally wasted as a fourth liner which is what we seem to think he is.

 

[Ted Hoffman]

Instead of me and you arguing value. What would be your ask from the following teams. This would help me further understand your thoughts on this. I think thats all the teams showing interest per analyst

Edm
Car
Van
Det
Buf
Nyr
Veg

Obviously this depends on who we're trading, but just spitballing knowing who's probably going to be on the "we're not giving him up" list given who we'd possibly be moving to them and each team's current needs and playoff goals near-term:

EDM - I would ask for Lavoie (has size, has had to grow into his frame but is making real progress) and Wanner (has size, has snarl, Blues could use that on the blueline). If that meant I didn't get a 1st in the deal, OK; that's 2 pieces that could be in the lineup for us for a while.

CAR - Nikishin if he's going to make the jump soon; Morrow otherwise. If I can get a 2nd prospect, I look at Jackson Blake. Carolina is kind of in a "win now" situation, it has to decide if it wants to go all in or play it safe and possibly fall short and wonder what if again.

VAN - Brzustewicz would be my 1st choice. Not Kudryavtsev. I think Willander is off limits. I would be OK with Pettersson (the defenseman) but I wouldn't be thrilled about it. As for a forward, ... kind of whoever, if they've got solid bottom-6 potential that would be nice.

DET - Johansson or Wallinder. We're not getting anyone on defense above that. I like Mazur, think he's probably a legit 3rd liner for years and looking forward at Blues' needs I can see him fill that. But, one of Johansson or Wallinder + Mazur + a 1st is a really steep price for a team still building for a sustained future, who'd get ~6 or so years out of whoever we're sending as our main piece.

BUF - yes. I would tell Buffalo "tell me the 3-4 guys who are purely untouchable" and then pick the best from there. I just don't know why Buffalo would be trading for someone off our roster - and that's not saying "we don't have anything they want" or vice versa, I don't see where there's a fit for a trade given who we want to move.

NYR - the Rangers are probably offering forwards. Maybe Garand in net. But I'm not sure we need a goalie and I'm not sure the Rangers are trading him, and anyone else at forward is either "yeah, we've got that in our system" or it's a roll of the dice on the guy.

VEG - they don't have much. But, they have a Cup so it's worth having little in the system.

 

[BlueDream]

You are weirdly high on Holloway and broberg if you think these deals are both acceptable

Agreed. But that poster just yesterday said the Oilers don’t have what the Blues need and now he’s proposing that trade, so he doesn’t know what he’s talking about. He’s mainly just a troll.

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

Obviously this depends on who we're trading, but just spitballing knowing who's probably going to be on the "we're not giving him up" list given who we'd possibly be moving to them and each team's current needs and playoff goals near-term:

EDM - I would ask for Lavoie (has size, has had to grow into his frame but is making real progress) and Wanner (has size, has snarl, Blues could use that on the blueline). If that meant I didn't get a 1st in the deal, OK; that's 2 pieces that could be in the lineup for us for a while.

CAR - Nikishin if he's going to make the jump soon; Morrow otherwise. If I can get a 2nd prospect, I look at Jackson Blake. Carolina is kind of in a "win now" situation, it has to decide if it wants to go all in or play it safe and possibly fall short and wonder what if again.

VAN - Brzustewicz would be my 1st choice. Not Kudryavtsev. I think Willander is off limits. I would be OK with Pettersson (the defenseman) but I wouldn't be thrilled about it. As for a forward, ... kind of whoever, if they've got solid bottom-6 potential that would be nice.

DET - Johansson or Wallinder. We're not getting anyone on defense above that. I like Mazur, think he's probably a legit 3rd liner for years and looking forward at Blues' needs I can see him fill that. But, one of Johansson or Wallinder + Mazur + a 1st is a really steep price for a team still building for a sustained future, who'd get ~6 or so years out of whoever we're sending as our main piece.

BUF - yes. I would tell Buffalo "tell me the 3-4 guys who are purely untouchable" and then pick the best from there. I just don't know why Buffalo would be trading for someone off our roster - and that's not saying "we don't have anything they want" or vice versa, I don't see where there's a fit for a trade given who we want to move.

NYR - the Rangers are probably offering forwards. Maybe Garand in net. But I'm not sure we need a goalie and I'm not sure the Rangers are trading him, and anyone else at forward is either "yeah, we've got that in our system" or it's a roll of the dice on the guy.

VEG - they don't have much. But, they have a Cup so it's worth having little in the system.

those edmonton guys look quite mid. broberg or holloway would be far preferable i'd think.

van traded brzusteyechart to calgary in lindholm deal.

i'd want gibson from detroit, personally. i'm not as high on wallinder as many here.

edstrom from vegas would interest me. cataford too, as a 3rd piece.

 

[Ted Hoffman]

those edmonton guys look quite mid. broberg or holloway would be far preferable i'd think.

They are mid, but they're what I'd consider "safe" mid with potential upside yet. Holloway is signaling where his ceiling is, and it's not real high unless he suddenly gets a swift kick in the ass with his game. Broberg maybe has room to reach high, but at some point he's got to step out and start getting there and I think is bust potential is high.

We've got a bunch of top-tier forwards in the pipeline and then we've got a bunch of 4th/AHL guys. We don't have someone who's got pretty decent 3rd line potential. That's where Lavoie is penciled in.

van traded brzusteyechart to calgary in lindholm deal.

Damn it, forgot about that.

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

They are mid, but they're what I'd consider "safe" mid with potential upside yet. Holloway is signaling where his ceiling is, and it's not real high unless he suddenly gets a swift kick in the ass with his game. Broberg maybe has room to reach high, but at some point he's got to step out and start getting there and I think is bust potential is high.

We've got a bunch of top-tier forwards in the pipeline and then we've got a bunch of 4th/AHL guys. We don't have someone who's got pretty decent 3rd line potential. That's where Lavoie is penciled in.


Damn it, forgot about that.

i don't know how much upside holloway has as he doesn't seem to have great offensive iq, but he looks like at least a physical 3rd liner who skates fairly well and can chip in 15-20/year. seems like we could always use another one of those.

broberg i'd love to play 18 minutes every night for 50+ games and see if he can settle in. he has the size and skating you want. again, i don't think he has hockey sense to be top guy, but if he can be a 4/5 guy in next couple years that would be real value. kinda our reverse walman.

 

[PerryTurnbullfan]

those edmonton guys look quite mid. broberg or holloway would be far preferable i'd think.

van traded brzusteyechart to calgary in lindholm deal.

i'd want gibson from detroit, personally. i'm not as high on wallinder as many here.

edstrom from vegas would interest me. cataford too, as a 3rd piece.

Agree on Gibson

 

[Donuts]

Mikheyev

 

[Em etah Eh]

It's colt55 and nublues at the asylum. I don't post there but nublues is colt and nublues was at the asylum recently describing these discussions he was having here with other team's fans and they were the exact ones robtom18 was making. everybody knows it's colt55, it just takes a memory

Yeah, as soon as I saw shite in one of his posts along with the over the top flammage I knew it was him.

 

[StlBill]

ok blues fans can you let armstrong know that you’re happy with a deal involving Morrow and Carolina’s first and we’ll let Waddell know that we’re happy with it as canes fans

we can let the two of them bang out the exact minute details if they want any small tweaks either side

How can CAR fit Buch cap wise? If we retain that’s got to require another significant piece.

 

[AirGut]

are the Rangers actually on his NTC?

 

[Frenzy31]

are the Rangers actually on his NTC?

I don’t know that he has ions.

 

[CycloneSweep]

i don't know how much upside holloway has as he doesn't seem to have great offensive iq, but he looks like at least a physical 3rd liner who skates fairly well and can chip in 15-20/year. seems like we could always use another one of those.

broberg i'd love to play 18 minutes every night for 50+ games and see if he can settle in. he has the size and skating you want. again, i don't think he has hockey sense to be top guy, but if he can be a 4/5 guy in next couple years that would be real value. kinda our reverse walman.

Broberg is “big” but like doesn’t use his size in the slightest. Weak as hell in front of the net, not physical. Might as well be 5’9”

 

[tlk]

are the Rangers actually on his NTC?

apparently.

 

[robbieberns]

How can CAR fit Buch cap wise? If we retain that’s got to require another significant piece.

If nothing changes between now and the deadline, Canes will have 5.877 in cap space on deadline day, literally just enough to bring him in with no retention and no salary going the other way.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Kinda hoping he goes to Carolina, even tho they are a bunch of jerks, their fanbase has been very pleasant and I would not mind seeing them won a cup this season.

 

[Whoshattenkirkshoes]

There has not been enough Oilers talk on these main boards. (not Buch specifically)

They should be one off the more active teams

 

[stats1]

Sorry I’m not really following this thread but what is the base of a trade for him?

 

[tfriede2]

Sorry I’m not really following this thread but what is the base of a trade for him?

1st plus top prospect…not a prospect ranked after 3 on a team, but a top 3 prospect of said team.

 

[Vitto79]

He’s gonna get a nice haul if moved

Sorry I’m not really following this thread but what is the base of a trade for him?

Probably just selling high in a weak market for UFAs

Blues should retool imo