Best player in the world: 2016

[bobholly39]

This is quite ridiculous. No, goalies didn't have better seasons than Price who had arguably the best season ever in 2015, for a goaltender. It's a ridiculous premise that Price won "because" it was one of the worst offensive seasons. Price was the best player in the world for a 24-36 months period, thats it.

He gets the Hart for sure, as we can see how his team reacted to him missing 40ish games in 2015 2016, they went from the 9th best team in the league from the start of 2014-2015 to his injury in 2016 in winning % with .658 (2nd best in NHL over 187 games), while having the worst GF/GP of all teams in the top 9 and the 3rd worst PP% of all teams in the top 9 to a .400 winning percentage, right after his injury.

You really should put some respect on the talent you've witnessed, such fake news should just not be allowed. Either you have bad faith or you don't remember well, Ill give you the benefit of the doubt and tell you it's the 2nd part.


For comparisons sake: Kane missed games in both 2014 and 2015 and the blackhawks lost .020 points when he wasn't in the line-up. When from 76-35 to 19-14.


The team was completely transformed by the loss of Price. Not only did he inspire a lot of confidence in the way they played but also he was an integral part of the transition game and acted as the 3rd best transition defenseman for the Habs at that time.

Carey Price did not have the best goaltending season ever lol. Don't make ridiculous exagerations.

Carey Price 100% deserved the Hart in 2014-2015.
Had Carey Price played fully in 2015-2016 with no injury - it's possible he'd have been competing for another hart/possibly winning (voter fatigue/goalie bias would be huge obstacles to overcome for a back to back hart). It's also possible Carey Price has a worst season than year before - can't exactly project a full seaosn with certainty off a 12 game sample, it's just speculation.

If you want to get into "of all time" territory...I don't know that a team in NHL history has ever been as affected by injuries to a key player as much as with Carey Price, on 3x occasions. This is probably some "of all time" territory.

2014 playoffs - with Price, Habs make round 3, looking real likely contend for finals and maybe cup....Price is injured, Habs are eliminated right away.

2016...Price starts season great Habs are #1 in league. Price goes down, misses all year, Habs go from 1st overall in league with Price to last overall in league without Price. From first place to last place, literally....

2022. Price has one of the greatest 4 round playoff run ever as a goalie on an underdog team and helps Habs make finals...can't quite overcome juggernaut Tampa in finals, so lose out...then Price surgery/misses all of next year. Habs go from a team who makes the finals and competes for a cup with Price, to absolute last place team without him.

Can't think of many examples in hockey history where an injury to one player had such a huge impact on team. From first place to last place overall....from Finals to last place overal...it's a hell of an impact.

 

[Albatros]

2016...Price starts season great Habs are #1 in league. Price goes down, misses all year, Habs go from 1st overall in league with Price to last overall in league without Price. From first place to last place, literally....

2022. Price has one of the greatest 4 round playoff run ever as a goalie on an underdog team and helps Habs make finals...can't quite overcome juggernaut Tampa in finals, so lose out...then Price surgery/misses all of next year. Habs go from a team who makes the finals and competes for a cup with Price, to absolute last place team without him.

Can't think of many examples in hockey history where an injury to one player had such a huge impact on team. From first place to last place overall....from Finals to last place overal...it's a hell of an impact.

Their regular season goaltending had no meaningful difference between 2021 and 2022. If one player's fortunes made some difference then it was rather Jeff Petry. Yet mainly the difference was having and not having a Canadian division. Price had good first three rounds in the playoffs, but he didn't do much to get them there.

In November 2015 they were indeed leading the league, but even then Price had only played half of the games so it wasn't quite all him either.

 

[Toby91ca]

Part of your user name checks out but you got the affirmation you wanted right?

Kane is a fine player but at no point in their overlapping careers did anyone seriously say or think that Kane was a better player than Crosby.

I agree, I don’t really remember thinking or hearing anyone else truly suggest Kane was ever the best player in the world, but there has to be “best season” leanings on these votes as suggested several times before….i voted Kane.

For example, TSN had Crosby ranked #1 in their pre-season rankings for several years in a row…7 years starting in 2010…before McDavid took over. I have zero issue with those rankings but for this, there needs to be weight given to what was actually done that year…so heavy leaning to best season.

For what it’s worth, I’ve never seen Price as best player in the world either…but voted for him in the last year as best season….which I also suggested is tough because it’s so hard to say goalie A is a better player than skater A….what are you comparing?

 

[GreatGonzo]

So you want to vote Kane because of his smythe from 3 years ago? Your posts are getting more and more confusing in this thread. You initially suggested "Kane won Smythe in 2015".

Crosby had an unusually slow start for ~18 games, by far the worst stretch of his career and completely out of character for him - this costs him the "best season" acolade. But after he got over whatever caused it - he was just as good/better than Kane the remaining ~60-65 games. He was also clearly better in playoffs, with his smythe. Also, if you expand slightly past this season, Crosby continued to do better with the World Cup MVP a couple of months later. Crosby was also better the year before/after - it shows a trend in surrounding months that Crosby is simply a better player than Kane at this point, even though it's close.

I don't understand why people think these polls are about best season, vs best player. Here are best seasons:

2012 Malkin
2013 Crosby or Ovechkin
2014 Crosby
2015 Price
2016 Kane
2017 Crosby or McDavid

It's so obvious who best season is every year. What's there even to poll people about, outside of a few specific years that are close?

Best player is not best season. You have to actually utilize some brain cells and think a bit harder.

Crosby gets votes for past achievements, why can’t Kane? Kane was coming off of a 23 point cup win, if you’re going to vote a certain way, at least be consistent.

Explain how Crosby was that much better than Kane the following year when they both tied in points with 89. Because of playoffs? As for his 2016 smythe, it’s a weak point to make. Crosbys smythe is by far the weakest for a player of his caliber.

Well no, it isn’t “obvious.” I said it before and I will say it again. After 2014, Crosby was no longer as dominate. But for you, he doesn’t need to be as dominate in order to be the best player, he just has to basically be there. that’s why it’s ridiculous. You give him that title based on ANYTHING he would do.

I get that you like to use that against people, but the facts are that Kane was stepping into that role already and had a break out season. Crosby was on the decline. It was mentioned before, but Kane would go on to outscore Crosby 5 out of the next 7 seasons. What exactly did Crosby do to keep the crown? Win smythes? Why do playoffs suddenly out weigh regular season achievements, especially considering he didn’t lead those teams in scoring in either 2016 or 2017.

 

[GreatGonzo]

I agree, I don’t really remember thinking or hearing anyone else truly suggest Kane was ever the best player in the world, but there has to be “best season” leanings on these votes as suggested several times before….i voted Kane.

For example, TSN had Crosby ranked #1 in their pre-season rankings for several years in a row…7 years starting in 2010…before McDavid took over. I have zero issue with those rankings but for this, there needs to be weight given to what was actually done that year…so heavy leaning to best season.

For what it’s worth, I’ve never seen Price as best player in the world either…but voted for him in the last year as best season….which I also suggested is tough because it’s so hard to say goalie A is a better player than skater A….what are you comparing?

The voting say otherwise. Kane walked away with the Lindsay and Hart. Crosby was out scored significantly. Again, it’s hilarious that Crosby can lose awards and point battles, but still gets to be considered the best because TSN said so in the pre season? The same TSN that had Toews the second best player in the world in 2014 and 2015? Yeah not bias at all.

Price was arguably the best goalie in the world(Olympic goalie MVP) in 2014. He then follows it up with an MVP season in 2015, it isn’t hard to understand.

 

[Voight]

This is quite ridiculous. No, goalies didn't have better seasons than Price who had arguably the best season ever in 2015, for a goaltender. It's a ridiculous premise that Price won "because" it was one of the worst offensive seasons. Price was the best player in the world for a 24-36 months period, thats it.

He gets the Hart for sure, as we can see how his team reacted to him missing 40ish games in 2015 2016, they went from the 9th best team in the league from the start of 2014-2015 to his injury in 2016 in winning % with .658 (2nd best in NHL over 187 games), while having the worst GF/GP of all teams in the top 9 and the 3rd worst PP% of all teams in the top 9 to a .400 winning percentage, right after his injury.

You really should put some respect on the talent you've witnessed, such fake news should just not be allowed. Either you have bad faith or you don't remember well, Ill give you the benefit of the doubt and tell you it's the 2nd part.


For comparisons sake: Kane missed games in both 2014 and 2015 and the blackhawks lost .020 points when he wasn't in the line-up. When from 76-35 to 19-14.


The team was completely transformed by the loss of Price. Not only did he inspire a lot of confidence in the way they played but also he was an integral part of the transition game and acted as the 3rd best transition defenseman for the Habs at that time.

Holy hot take Batman.

In the preceding seasons Rask, Bob, Lundqvist and Thomas all had seasons just as good as him or close to it. Lundqvist in 2012 for example had nearly identical stats. You know why he didn't win the Hart? Because you had two forwards with great offensive seasons. Unlike 2015.

Hasek in 99 was better and thats arguably the best season ever goalie wise. Nice try.

Its not a ridiculous premise that he won because of a weak forward year. The Art Ross winner had 87 points, which was the lowest total (full season obviously) since 1968. Price was not the best player in the world for a 24-36 months period, thats it. I remember his play that year - he was fantastic but again, benefitted from a super low scoring anomaly year which I why he won the Hart & Pearson.

Fake news? What the heck are you talking about.....

 

[Mrb1p]

Holy hot take Batman.

In the preceding seasons Rask, Bob, Lundqvist and Thomas all had seasons just as good as him or close to it. Lundqvist in 2012 for example had nearly identical stats. You know why he didn't win the Hart? Because you had two forwards with great offensive seasons. Unlike 2015.

Hasek in 99 was better and thats arguably the best season ever goalie wise. Nice try.

Its not a ridiculous premise that he won because of a weak forward year. The Art Ross winner had 87 points, which was the lowest total (full season obviously) since 1968. Price was not the best player in the world for a 24-36 months period, thats it. I remember his play that year - he was fantastic but again, benefitted from a super low scoring anomaly year which I why he won the Hart & Pearson.

Fake news? What the heck are you talking about.....

Your understanding of goaltending is limited to looking at hockeyDB, its fine.

 

[GeeoffBrown]

Best player does not always have the best season and in 2016, the best player was still Sidney Crosby.

You could package Kane and Price and it would not get you Crosby in a trade

 

[Voight]

Your understanding of goaltending is limited to looking at hockeyDB, its fine.

Wow 10/10 rebuttal.

 

[GreatGonzo]

Best player does not always have the best season and in 2016, the best player was still Sidney Crosby.

You could package Kane and Price and it would not get you Crosby in a trade

Then at what point does that grace period end? That’s why this doesn’t make any sense. What did Crosby do to maintain his rep as the best player without actually having “best player” accolades? Is a smythe where he scored 19 points in 24 games really the answer? Or are we basing it off of past achievements?

 

[wetcoast]

Then at what point does that grace period end? That’s why this doesn’t make any sense. What did Crosby do to maintain his rep as the best player without actually having “best player” accolades? Is a smythe where he scored 19 points in 24 games really the answer? Or are we basing it off of past achievements?

Well Crosby was either the best or in the mix too 3 best player in the world he doesn't need the absolute best season to keep the title.

Kane wasn't even on the radar for best player in the world the previous season so just having the Art Ross doesn't knock Crosby out of top spot.

 

[GreatGonzo]

Well Crosby was either the best or in the mix too 3 best player in the world he doesn't need the absolute best season to keep the title.

Kane wasn't even on the radar for best player in the world the previous season so just having the Art Ross doesn't knock Crosby out of top spot.

Being in the mix isn’t the same as being THE best. You’re basically saying a 2nd/3rd place finish is just as good as a 1st. It isn’t the same.

the previous season he was injured, but still finished 4th in PPG and had a great playoffs. So if losing awards isn’t enough to knock Crosby off, what is? You notice how convenient that is for your argument? It basically doesn’t have to end, you can consider him the best until you basically feel like it.

 

[wetcoast]

Being in the mix isn’t the same as being THE best. You’re basically saying a 2nd/3rd place finish is just as good as a 1st. It isn’t the same.

the previous season he was injured, but still finished 4th in PPG and had a great playoffs. So if losing awards isn’t enough to knock Crosby off, what is? You notice how convenient that is for your argument? It basically doesn’t have to end, you can consider him the best until you basically feel like it.

It ends when someone is significantly better and the argument for Kane simply isn't there it's actually quite laughable.

My guess is that alot of people are voting for best season and not really answering the question the OP is asking here.

We will have an interesting example of this with Hall and his Hart coming up.

 

[norrisnick]

It ends when someone is significantly better and the argument for Kane simply isn't there it's actually quite laughable.

My guess is that alot of people are voting for best season and not really answering the question the OP is asking here.

We will have an interesting example of this with Hall and his Hart coming up.

Because voting for the best player as opposed to the most popular player is preferable?

 

[GreatGonzo]

It ends when someone is significantly better and the argument for Kane simply isn't there it's actually quite laughable.

My guess is that alot of people are voting for best season and not really answering the question the OP is asking here.

We will have an interesting example of this with Hall and his Hart coming up.

So what are the standards to being “significantly” better? Crosby was out scored by 21 points. This is also the second straight year Crosby was out scored by Jamie Benn. So tell
Me, how does THE best player in the world get a pass for being out produced by “inferior” players, yet still gets to maintain that status? It’s ridiculous.

No. People are voting for the player that was considered the best that year. That’s why this is a year to year poll. You simply love using past achievements to dictate Crosbys place at the thrown. You keep bringing up “best season” as if the voters are simply misinformed. Like I said, this was Kanes break out year and he followed it up with others. Crosby didn’t.

 

[GoldenKnight]

@FrankSidebottom you should include the 2017-18 season, that would result in a list of 20 complete NHL seasons when this series concludes.

As to this poll, for the forwards Kane was the best player, Crosby is up there too though there were some standouts on defence as well (like Karlsson).

 

[Video Nasty]

Ultimately, it’s a failure on Crosby’s part that there’s so much argument about who is the best year to year. I understand the cases that are built on the back of him missing serious time. I can’t pretend I’ve ever understood the desire to apologize for his 2014-2015 and 2015-2016 regular seasons, other than needing them to be better than they really were to beef up his all-time status.

 

[Nadal On Clay]

I’ll take the guy who annihilated Crosby in the scoring race by 25%.

… and again

 

[Nathaniel Skywalker]

Being in the mix isn’t the same as being THE best. You’re basically saying a 2nd/3rd place finish is just as good as a 1st. It isn’t the same.

the previous season he was injured, but still finished 4th in PPG and had a great playoffs. So if losing awards isn’t enough to knock Crosby off, what is? You notice how convenient that is for your argument? It basically doesn’t have to end, you can consider him the best until you basically feel like it.

Crosby was top 3 in scoring for 5 straight seasons. Nobody came close to doing that in that time frame.

 

[Nadal On Clay]

Sidney Crosby was absolutely NOT instrumental in that cup win.

People really just hate winners/greatness and it’s sad to see.

 

[TLEH]

Kane wins the scoring race by 17. Its him.

 

[GreatGonzo]

Crosby was top 3 in scoring for 5 straight seasons. Nobody came close to doing that in that time frame.

That still doesn’t explain why he gets to wear that rep as “best player” when other players out performed him. I give him all the credit for his consistency, but again..being up there with the best shouldn’t automatically give him that title.

People really just hate winners/greatness and it’s sad to see.

Using “hate” to justify someone disagreeing with you is the weakest argument.

 

[Ace Card Bedard]

Well Crosby was either the best or in the mix too 3 best player in the world he doesn't need the absolute best season to keep the title.

Kane wasn't even on the radar for best player in the world the previous season so just having the Art Ross doesn't knock Crosby out of top spot.

The previous season?

Kane was leading the league in points before his injury ended his regular season.
He came back for the playoffs, led the playoffs in scoring, and won the cup.

Then the following year he destroyed the league in points.

"On the radar?" Yea, I think so.

 

[blundluntman]

I'm curious to see if McDavid gets the same "best season vs best player" treatment once his prime begins. I'll go ahead and say it right now, I don't think he has any inarguable seasons until 2020-21. Crosby is likely my pick for 2017 when you factor in the playoffs, Mackinnon isn't too far off from McDavid in 2018 (although I may still lean toward McDavid given how great he was in the 2nd half of the season), Kucherov was better in 2019, and Draisaitl was very good in 2020. Despite that, McDavid was considered the best player in the world by general consensus after 2017. I'd like to think these arguments aren't simply being made in favor of Crosby so it'll be interesting to see how things go.

 

[Nadal On Clay]

That still doesn’t explain why he gets to wear that rep as “best player” when other players out performed him. I give him all the credit for his consistency, but again..being up there with the best shouldn’t automatically give him that title.


Using “hate” to justify someone disagreeing with you is the weakest argument.

Oh would you look at that. A poster telling people to touch grass on a hockey forum when posters disagree with him wants to give away free lessons on what to do when someone disagrees with you !

Not to mention that 2/3 of your posts are concerning Crosby takes that you don’t agree with. So ironic

When someone is as irrational as MJ is with Crosby, there is no room for agreeing or disagreeing.