Balsillie puts in $212.5 mil offer for the Coyotes

[Alberta Yote]

How can you post credentials on HF?

The truth is 99% of lawyers have no idea which way this will go, because it has never happened before (though there have been somewhat similar cases in other sports, but still not identical).

The big ? is if the NHL can secure another buyer who will keep the Coyotes in Phoenix. This may force the NHL to waive the 35ish million owed to them.

I'll agree with you that nobody can have any more than just an opinion on how this will go.

As for your second point, they already have the buyer ready to go. All of the secured creditors get paid and the City of Glendale is appeased. The only losers are the unsecured creditors, which is mostly Moyes himself.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

I'll agree with you that nobody can have any more than just an opinion on how this will go.

As for your second point, they already have the buyer ready to go. All of the secured creditors get paid and the City of Glendale is appeased. The only losers are the unsecured creditors, which is mostly Moyes himself.

Where, in writing, is this other buyer willing to buy the team with no financing for 217.5M dollars?

I haven't heard anything about THAT yet. A bunch of rumors and thoughts.

 

[jessebelanger]

Where, in writing, is this other buyer willing to buy the team with no financing for 217.5M dollars?

I haven't heard anything about THAT yet. A bunch of rumors and thoughts.

Well, if JB finds that he can not force a movement of the franchise, he likely withdraws his offer, and the value of the franchise falls considerably lower then 217.5 million.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Well, if JB finds that he can not force a movement of the franchise, he likely withdraws his offer, and the value of the franchise falls considerably lower then 217.5 million.

He will take the NHL to higher courts if they try to block the move. You can guarantee that.

This won't be done with if that ever happened.

 

[Alberta Yote]

Where, in writing, is this other buyer willing to buy the team with no financing for 217.5M dollars?

I haven't heard anything about THAT yet. A bunch of rumors and thoughts.

It certainly won't be for $217.5 million. It is an offer that will only go forward if the league wins their little battle against Balsillie's end-around play.

If Balsillie wins, and barring all kinds of drawn out litigation to overturn that decision, the team will move.

He will take the NHL to higher courts if they try to block the move. You can guarantee that.

This won't be done with if that ever happened.

This too. The chances of ongoing lawsuits regardless of the decision of the bankruptcy judge is very high.

If that happens chances of a conclusion to this before next season becomes smaller and smaller.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

It certainly won't be for $217.5 million. It is an offer that will only go forward if the league wins their little battle against Balsillie's end-around play.

Since the court is almost guaranteed to find on behalf of Jim, that seems just like "rumors and talk", then. I don't see a scenario that they don't find in favor of him.

The only thing remaining to be seen is whether or not the NHL tries to block a move, as far as I'm concerned.

Of course, I could be completely wrong here, but I highly doubt that Jim isn't awarded the team. It doesn't screw any of the creditors at all and the bankruptcy court is going to be supremely swayed by that.

 

[kdb209]

http://andrewsstarspage.com/NHL-Business/ticket-prices.htm

Actually, the Atlanta Thrashers had a higher cost per ticket than Ottawa their first 3 seasons in the NHL. It was over $20/ticket higher in their first year(and the Thrashers set the attendance record for an NHL inaugural season at the time as well that year)

Warning - take those numbers with a very big grain of salt.

Those are from the largely debunked Team Marketing Report numbers - which have been shown to have significant methodological flaws and to be wildly inaccurate for many teams.

 

[Rob]

ESPN reports:

"A successful bankruptcy filing could allow the Coyotes to avoid the $750 million penalty for breaking its 30-year lease with Glendale. But Beasley said that when the lease was forged with Moyes and Ellman it was worded with just such a possibility in mind.

"We're comfortable that we have put in the safeguards to get a very strong position out there to keep the team in the city of Glendale," Beasley said."

If that's the case, Moyes is playing a very dangerous game here. Haven't seen the contractual language at issue that Beasley relies, but if there is some type of personal guarantee, Moyes could get hit with the penalty. He hasn't filed for personal bankruptcy.

Frankly, I don't know how the city could have not have forseen the possibility of the bankruptcy by the Coyotes LLC and and taken precautions. Build a $200M arena for an undercapitalized company that has never made a dime operating in Canada or the US, and not get some type of backup protection???

That is a good point. I was wondering if it was really that easy to break the less just by declaring bankruptcy. Maybe we will find out for sure tomorrow?

 

[Artyukhin*]

http://www.azcentral.com/sports/coyotes/articles/2009/05/06/20090506spt-bickleycoyotes.html

"The reports of the franchise's demise are just ridiculous," he said. "Jerry Moyes has been committed to Glendale and committed to the Coyotes. All of this blanket characterization of 'hockey doesn't work in the Sun Belt' is just hogwash. I think the Coyotes have a bright future on the ice."


http://www.azcentral.com/members/Blog/PaolaBoivin/52618

 

[BigMac1212]

What, the one that ceased operations?

There was the IHL franchise & the WHA franchise. Boy people are so ignorant about Phoenix hockey.

 

[Alberta Yote]

Since the court is almost guaranteed to find on behalf of Jim, that seems just like "rumors and talk", then. I don't see a scenario that they don't find in favor of him.

The only thing remaining to be seen is whether or not the NHL tries to block a move, as far as I'm concerned.

Of course, I could be completely wrong here, but I highly doubt that Jim isn't awarded the team. It doesn't screw any of the creditors at all and the bankruptcy court is going to be supremely swayed by that.

But it does screw the City of Glendale and it's taxpayers.

A sale to another party (Reinsdorf) would still see the secured creditors paid in full and would only see the unsecured creditors (Moyes) hurt.

 

[Brodie]

What time is the court appearance tomorrow? Am wondering when we will hear anything about the outcome.

4:30 pm EST.

 

[BigMac1212]

4:30 pm EST.

1:30PM in Phoenix (the state doesn't follow Daylight Savings.)

 

[LadyStanley]

We've had hockey teams long before the Coyotes. Remember the roadrunners.

You are still wrong about Phoenix, and that's the truth, and I'm sorry if that offends you.

What, the one that ceased operations?

There was the IHL franchise & the WHA franchise. Boy people are so ignorant about Phoenix hockey.

And the latest incarnation of the (ECHL) Phoenix Roadrunners which ceased operations about a month ago.

 

[Brodie]

http://www.thespec.com/News/BreakingNews/article/561228

mod edit:

Hockey representatives for prospective NHL franchise owner Jim Balsillie are scheduled to meet with Hamilton Mayor Fred Eisenberger Thursday.

And at least one Hamilton hockey official is hopeful the Balsillie group will once again seek control of Copps Coliseum for the specific purpose of relocating the Phoenix Coyotes there for next season. It’s not known whether Balsillie will be at the meeting.

 

[BigMac1212]

And the latest incarnation of the (ECHL) Phoenix Roadrunners which ceased operations about a month ago.

Still, saying Phoenix isn't a hockey town is pure bull****!

 

[Valic]

Still, saying Phoenix isn't a hockey town is pure bull****!

Having 14,000 people show up up paying 30 dollars a ticket obviously isn't enough to be a big enough hockey town to support an NHL franchise.

Why don't they charge 50 dollar on average a ticket, mark up beer to be 8 bucks a cup, charge 4 bucks a hotdog, 25 dollars for parking, sell a few million dollars in merchandise a year and have a local TV contract that pays them many many millions, and increase the overall attendance to close to 100% so they can survive? It is because they can't

That is what many teams achieve to survive.

Noone is denying the fact that there are a ton of very supportive fans in the Phoenix area, however, what I mentioned above is what it takes to be a profitable organization if you want to spend to the cap, have the travel costs of a western team in the current time of no great national tv deal in the states.

It's crappy, and harsh, but it is the truth.

 

[BigMac1212]

Sorry for going off topic, but there was hockey in Phoenix before the Coyotes came. I came to the Valley of the sun in the summer of 1992, and the Arizona Veterans Memorail Coliseum was packed during Roadrunners game. If it wasn't for the Roadrunners, there's no way in **** that the Jets move to Phoenix.

That's just the truth.

 

[guinness]

Still, saying Phoenix isn't a hockey town is pure bull****!

Doesn't matter though, if the team is in the red, and has been in the red, and then goes **** up. It's not a charity.

The NHL allowed Winnipeg to lose their team, just so they could move to the desert, loose millions, and file bankruptcy. Yeah. And the 'Yotes have a newer building to boot, so it's not even like they have a "give us a new arena, or else" excuse.

It sucks that the 'Yotes aren't working out for whatever reason, but if it's a money pit, it's probably time to cut bait, like possibly getting a new owner, or moving the team.

 

[Realm]

Doesn't matter though, if the team is in the red, and has been in the red, and then goes **** up. It's not a charity.

The NHL allowed Winnipeg to lose their team, just so they could move to the desert, loose millions, and file bankruptcy. Yeah. And the 'Yotes have a newer building to boot, so it's not even like they have a "give us a new arena, or else" excuse.

It sucks that the 'Yotes aren't working out for whatever reason, but if it's a money pit, it's probably time to cut bait, like possibly getting a new owner, or moving the team.

Agree with what you say, but I can't stand how many people spell the word "lose" as "loose".

 

[Brodie]

I ask again: Does anyone think the result of this, no matter what happens, will be an NHL team in Hamilton? I have a feeling that it's inevitable, be it the Coyotes or an expensive expansion team. Especially since there is a non-Balsillie group looking to buy one.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Because your comments about Phoenix not being a hockey town is both ignorant and wrong.

So, why did the Jets move to Phoenix if the Valley of the Sun isn't a hockey town? The logic on this board is scary.

Uh, because the NHL was trying to grow the game in untapped areas. Pretty obvious.

Phoenix is not some crazy hockey hot bed. Don't kid yourself.

 

[BigMac1212]

Uh, because the NHL was trying to grow the game in untapped areas. Pretty obvious.

Phoenix is not some crazy hockey hot bed. Don't kid yourself.

You didn't go to a roadrunners game before the Coyotes came, have you?

See my point? Phoenix is a hockey town no matter what lieks Jonathan puts up.

 

[BigMac1212]

Uh, because the NHL was trying to grow the game in untapped areas. Pretty obvious.

Phoenix is not some crazy hockey hot bed. Don't kid yourself.

Phoenix had hockey before the Coyotes came. Pretty obivous you know little about the Valley of the Sun.

 

[bhawk24bob]

You didn't go to a roadrunners game before the Coyotes came, have you?

See my point? Phoenix is a hockey town no matter what lieks Jonathan puts up.

Look, I'd be pretty pissed if I was on the verge of losing my team too, but let's not get delusional here.

I think NHL hockey can still succeed in Phoenix, but it's not going to happen unless bankruptcy voids the lease in Glendale and allows the Coyotes to move back downtown.