Rumor: AVS Proposals/Rumors/Free Agents & Roster Moves (related topics)

[KingSizeKirby]

Not that I believe Lindholm is available, but I can't really think of the last time a name that big has been traded. Maybe EJ?

Subban? Weber?

 

[hockeyfish]

Subban? Weber?

Well, I guess I kind of forgot about those two.

 

[CobraAcesS]

Not that I believe Lindholm is available, but I can't really think of the last time a name that big has been traded. Maybe EJ?

Subban? Weber?

If you are going back that far,

Subban, Webber, EJ, Burns (He was with Minny before, thank god for that trade), Jones as a younger guy more recently. Larrson depending on how you view him. A lot of people are considering him underrated on the shutdown side because of advanced stats.

I feel like I'm forgetting one more if you are going back as far as EJ/Burns. I'm probably thinking of Sutter, but that was obviously as a UFA.

 

[KingSizeKirby]

Well, I guess I kind of forgot about those two.

Haha don't worry about, it happens.

 

[AslanRH]

I don't think Risto and Trouba belong in the same conversation as Lindholm. IMO, he's in a different tier.

Agreed, I missed the Lindholm or Risto being choosing between the two and thought it was choosing either or.

If one had to choose, even at a painful price, Lindholm is the guy by leaps and bounds

 

[hockeyfish]

If you are going back that far,

Subban, Webber, EJ, Burns (He was with Minny before, thank god for that trade), Jones as a younger guy more recently. Larrson depending on how you view him. A lot of people are considering him underrated on the shutdown side because of advanced stats.

I feel like I'm forgetting one more if you are going back as far as EJ/Burns. I'm probably thinking of Sutter, but that was obviously as a UFA.

Crap, I forget about Jones too. Although I don't put Laarson in with this group.

 

[CobraAcesS]

Agreed, I missed the Lindholm or Risto being choosing between the two and thought it was choosing either or.

If one had to choose, even at a painful price, Lindholm is the guy by leaps and bounds

Here is a question...

How long before Lindholm is at Hedman's level, or is he already there?

I think Lindholm is closer to Hedman than he is to Risto or Trouba at this point though.

Crap, I forget about Jones too. Although I don't put Laarson in with this group.

Well, hes still kind of a big name because of his draft position and East coast coverage. He has improved over the last year or so too, so he had been getting more recognition as well.

And remember Burns was at the same All-Star games as Weber back in the day competing for the hardest shot. He was definitely an established All-Star when Minny traded him.

 

[Pokecheque]

Well, I guess I kind of forgot about those two.

Seriously?

 

[AslanRH]

Here is a question...

How long before Lindholm is at Hedman's level, or is he already there?

I think Lindholm is closer to Hedman than he is to Risto or Trouba at this point though.
.

It depends on how much more improving Hedman continues to do. IMO he even improved just over the course of last season.

I do think Lindholm is strides ahead of Risto or Trouba and probably is closer to Hedman, but I can't yet bring myself to discuss him at a Hedman level until I see at least another consistent season out of him.

 

[CobraAcesS]

It depends on how much more improving Hedman continues to do. IMO he even improved just over the course of last season.

I do think Lindholm is strides ahead of Risto or Trouba and probably is closer to Hedman, but I can't yet bring myself to discuss him at a Hedman level until I see at least another consistent season out of him.

Definitely, but as Headman's offense came along slowly, I'm seeing the same thing with Lindholm.

Here is another one.. Who do you take between Lindholm and OEL? (Damn Sweden has good defense lol)

 

[The Abusement Park]

Definitely, but as Headman's offense came along slowly, I'm seeing the same thing with Lindholm.

Here is another one.. Who do you take between Lindholm and OEL? (Damn Sweden has good defense lol)

I'd take OEL. I think he's one of the most underrated d-men in the league, he really carries that Arizona team. I'd like too see what all he can do when that supporting class Arizona has coming up really blossoms. Also I don't think Lindholm is on Hedman's level yet. I think in the next 1-3 years he could be on that level or in that 5-10 range of D-man if not higher.

 

[Pokecheque]

Definitely, but as Headman's offense came along slowly, I'm seeing the same thing with Lindholm.

Here is another one.. Who do you take between Lindholm and OEL? (Damn Sweden has good defense lol)

I'd definitely take OEL there, though I may change my mind in the coming seasons.

If Anaheim doesn't do everything they can to keep Lindholm (save for some amazing trade package that's too good to be true) then Bob Murray really is the worst GM in the league not named Jim Benning. Beyond him that D has Cam Fowler, Sami Vatanen, and the wildly overrated and on-the-decline Kevin Bieksa. That's not an awful D by any means but it's nowhere near good enough to contend without him.

 

[CobraAcesS]

I'd take OEL. I think he's one of the most underrated d-men in the league, he really carries that Arizona team. I'd like too see what all he can do when that supporting class Arizona has coming up really blossoms. Also I don't think Lindholm is on Hedman's level yet. I think in the next 1-3 years he could be on that level or in that 5-10 range of D-man if not higher.

That's where I am at as well. I still think OEL would be the best partner for EJ if he was ever available.

I think he'd definitely have even better offensive numbers in the last years on a different team.

 

[Ivan13]

OEL is an interesting case, his last to seasons weren't on par with what is expected from him, yet his occasional struggles fly under the radar. But don't get me wrong, even on that level he's better than Lindholm, who at times looked overwhelmed playing against top lines.

As for the previous debate about Risto, Lindholm and Trouba, Lindholm is clearly at the top, with Risto being a clear step above Trouba.

 

[The Abusement Park]

That's where I am at as well. I still think OEL would be the best partner for EJ if he was ever available.

I think he'd definitely have even better offensive numbers in the last years on a different team.

I think that OEL is a top 5 Dman, the only dmen I'd clearly take over him are Keith, Doughty, Karlsson, and PK. However I may be missing a couple players. He really is an incredible defenseman.

 

[CobraAcesS]

I think that OEL is a top 5 Dman, the only dmen I'd clearly take over him are Keith, Doughty, Karlsson, and PK. However I may be missing a couple players. He really is an incredible defenseman.

The waters get really murky when you try to narrow down a top five IMO. I wouldn't put Subban in the top five personally. His defensive game is too weak IMO, and he does not provide the level of offensive ability someone like EK does either.

I'd put Subban in the top ten barely IMO. That's a whole huge argument though. I don't think EK is the best defender in the NHL either, so that should say where I sit with valuing offensive D.

I think OEL has been a top five in some seasons, but not others IMO.

 

[The Abusement Park]

The waters get really murky when you try to narrow down a top five IMO. I wouldn't put Subban in the top five personally. His defensive game is too weak IMO, and he does not provide the level of offensive ability someone like EK does either.

I'd put Subban in the top ten barely IMO. That's a whole huge argument though. I don't think EK is the best defender in the NHL either, so that should say where I sit with valuing offensive D.

I think OEL has been a top five in some seasons, but not others IMO.

I can agree the top 10 is murky, I think it comes down to personal preference. I mean Suter, Gio, Brodie, Faulk, Burn. Vlasic, Weber, Josi, Lindholm, Pietro, and Hedman all have shout to be in the top 10, some more than others.

 

[Pokecheque]

The waters get really murky when you try to narrow down a top five IMO. I wouldn't put Subban in the top five personally. His defensive game is too weak IMO, and he does not provide the level of offensive ability someone like EK does either.

I'd put Subban in the top ten barely IMO. That's a whole huge argument though. I don't think EK is the best defender in the NHL either, so that should say where I sit with valuing offensive D.

I think OEL has been a top five in some seasons, but not others IMO.

Could not disagree more. P.K. is definitely top ten. That's not even a question. I'm reluctant to pin him in top five just because there are a lot of very talented defenders out there. He is a legit franchise defenseman, better defensively than Karlsson, better offensively than most any other franchise defenseman save for maybe a guy like Drew Doughty. And even then I think I give Subban the edge in that aspect.

I think people are going to see Weber just a bit exposed this season when he's not alongside Roman Josi. Perhaps I'll be wrong though and PK struggles to start out in Nashville...it's why they play the games, after all.

 

[henchman21]

People said Weber would be exposed without Suter... Maybe Weber is just great?

 

[Avs_19]

People said Weber would be exposed without Suter... Maybe Weber is just great?

*Was great. Still pretty good though.

It's funny, people said the same thing about Suter and Hamhuis without Weber. Those two have done okay for themselves without him too.

 

[Gigantor The Goalie]

People said Weber would be exposed without Suter... Maybe Weber is just great?

Pssh he can hit and shoot, overrated.

 

[CobraAcesS]

Could not disagree more. P.K. is definitely top ten. That's not even a question. I'm reluctant to pin him in top five just because there are a lot of very talented defenders out there. He is a legit franchise defenseman, better defensively than Karlsson, better offensively than most any other franchise defenseman save for maybe a guy like Drew Doughty. And even then I think I give Subban the edge in that aspect.

I think people are going to see Weber just a bit exposed this season when he's not alongside Roman Josi. Perhaps I'll be wrong though and PK struggles to start out in Nashville...it's why they play the games, after all.

I'd take,

DD, EK, Hedman, OEL, Keith, Josi, and Burns over him.

I think Burns is more dangerous offensively with the accuracy of his slap shot, and they are similar in how they may burn you with their decision making at times as well. I just like Burns a touch better personally. So that is what I mean by barely in the top 10.

I've watched a lot of Montreal against Detroit/Tampa recently in the last few years since the wife is a Deadthing fan, and Tampa is my Eastern team, a lot of that being live as well. Subban almost always leaves me wanting more. He just picks the wrong parts/times during games to take risks sometimes. He does not seem to have that ability to tighten it up within the game situation IMO, and he also disappears for long stretches during games as well. This has been the case every single time I've seen him live, and that's been about 10 times over the last two years. I value the live games when looking at defense way more than TV, because you can see so much more when you are not at the mercy of the camera man, at least with defense.

I'm obviously not alone in my evaluation of him either looking at team Canada's roster. I understand the value in what he brings, but he isn't consistent enough for me to pick him that high. He's the EJ of top tier defenders IMO lol.

 

[Ivan13]

PK is much, much better than EJ.

 

[CobraAcesS]

PK is much, much better than EJ.

You do realize the context in which I made that statement right? I'm not sure, seeing as you felt the need to post this comment.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

Weber still is great. As good as he was? No. Still great? Yep.