ATD 2020 Draft Thread IV

[tinyzombies]

Are you confusing Connell with Clint Benedict? I never heard Connell had a drinking problem too.

Give me a bit for my next pick.

Pretty sure it was Connell. And he had a contract dispute with the owners as well. That's what put a dent in his legacy, but guys who played with him backed him up and said he was one of the best ever at that point. His legacy was tarnished though. And he was knocked because he wasn't ready to play in big games because of his drinking- but actually he performed very well in big games. He was blackballed by the owners is my recollection and considered hard to deal with.

This mentions something about his jitters, but maybe that was just the public story:
Alec Connell – puckstruck

I remember where it was - it was in the King Clancy autobiography. Clancy backs him up though.

What I'm saying is I think he should get a bump in ATD and that it's a great pick.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

I'll pick the "glue guy" of the French Connection line - Rene Robert, RW

Rene was a 2nd Team All Star in 1975

"Robert would hustle into the corners and more often than not come out with the puck. He was skilled enough to be able to do something with that puck too, often setting up his two marksmen linemates. His constant hustle and try not only made Perreault and Martin better players, but also made the Sabres into a true contender." - Greatest Hockey Legends

" As long as Robert laced up the skates, no one on the ice could out hustle him" - Greatest Hockey Legends

_____________________

The best thing about Robert? He's a RH shot who excelled at playing the point on the PP. Roberts was statistically one of the best pointmen in the league over the course of his career:

GM overpass: Rene Robert was a skilled, hard working player who scored almost a point per game in his NHL career. But why pick him for the ATD? What did he do really well?

Play the point on the power play. Robert was one of the top point men of the 1970s.

Top PP points of 1970-71 to 1979-80, playing the point

Player	GP	PPG	PPA	PPP
Denis Potvin	498	61	169	230
Rene Robert	647	66	163	229
Bobby Orr	407	55	174	229
Brad Park	623	51	162	213
Guy Lapointe	691	56	154	210

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Top PP points of 1971-72 to 1980-81, playing the point

Player	GP	PPG	PPA	PPP
Denis Potvin	572	70	201	271
Rene Robert	684	71	174	245
Brad Park	633	58	179	237
Bill Barber	694	83	126	209
Guy Lapointe	646	52	151	203

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Top PP points of 1972-73 to 1981-82, playing the point

Player	GP	PPG	PPA	PPP
Denis Potvin	632	81	219	300
Rene Robert	678	67	181	248
Bill Barber	774	96	152	248
Brad Park	633	58	185	243
Borje Salming	663	33	186	219

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

If you like the adjusted power play points, here are some defencemen and forwards who played the point with a similar career average to Monsieur Rowbear. I'm happy to pick him up a guy who can match Brad Park's PP performance in Round 20.

Name	GP	$PPP/82	PP%	TmPP+
P.K. Subban	500	29	75%	0.91
Gary Suter	1145	28	80%	1.13
Rene Robert	744	28	76%	1.05
Alex Delvecchio	1017	28	75%	1.03
Brad Richards	1126	28	73%	0.96
Daniel Alfredsson	1246	28	70%	1.03
Brad Park	1115	26	81%	1.15
Chris Pronger	1167	26	68%	1.12
Sandis Ozolinsh	875	25	69%	1.04

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Incidentally, if Robert ever played on the second penalty kill unit as LOH suggests, it was a double-secret unit that was never used and never showed up in the statistical record.

 

[tinyzombies]

Pretty sure it was Connell. And he had a contract dispute with the owners as well. That's what put a dent in his legacy, but guys who played with him backed him up and said he was one of the best ever at that point. His legacy was tarnished though. And he was knocked because he wasn't ready to play in big games because of his drinking- but actually he performed very well in big games. He was blackballed by the owners is my recollection and considered hard to deal with.

This mentions something about his jitters, but maybe that was just the public story:
Alec Connell – puckstruck

I remember where it was - it was in the King Clancy autobiography. Clancy backs him up though.

What I'm saying is I think he should get a bump in ATD and that it's a great pick.

Actually maybe you are right: "After the disappointing loss in the playoff series, goaltender Clint Benedict became embroiled in a controversy with the club over late nights and drinking. He was traded away, along with Harry Broadbent, to the new Montreal Maroons before the next season, for cash.[127] "

 

[VanIslander]

Connell had a major issue if I remember - a drinking problem? I almost took him over Price because of his playoff record. I was secretly hoping to get both - which could have been a great duo. Price was ok to backing up Halak back in the day lol, so if I have another goalie who has a playoff resume it can work. If Price isn't playing well come playoff time (unlikely), I can put the playoff goalie in.

OMG.

It is no mark against a goalie to have off-ice issues because goalies are notorious basketcases!!! Seriously. I have heard so many stories over the years. Superstitious, alcoholic, food binging, violent, nervous, throwing up before big games, gawd an epic book could be written on goalie psychology.

Sawchuk was a headcase. Hall threw up before most games. Roy's temper went off the handle countless times. Plante and Hasek had several issues!

There is no correlation between sanity and good goaltending, unless it's an inverse one.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Actually maybe you are right: "After the disappointing loss in the playoff series, goaltender Clint Benedict became embroiled in a controversy with the club over late nights and drinking. He was traded away, along with Harry Broadbent, to the new Montreal Maroons before the next season, for cash.[127] "

Benedict definitely had a drinking problem and was dumped from Ottawa after he supposedly blew a playoff series for them by showing up drunk. He resurrected his career with the Maroons though.

I had never read anything similar about Connell, though that doesn't mean it didn't happen.

 

[tinyzombies]

VI-I was saying the opposite. And I think TDMM is right, it was Benedict. I read about it in the Clancy autobiography and got them mixed up. Clancy said he was unfairly maligned and the owner had an issue with him about salary too that might have clouded the issue.

 

[VanIslander]

Benedict definitely had a drinking problem and was dumped from Ottawa after he supposedly blew a playoff series for them by showing up drunk.

To be clear: showing up drunk was not the issue. Losing the series was, and the reason for it was a future predictable risk.

My dad in 1979 was the mechanic (a trained engineer from Hungary whose qualifications were ignored in Canada - hence his position) for all ground transportation at the airport in a Vancouver Island (I am VanIslander - though some guy on facebook stole my handle) town. Anyways,... one Saturday night in 1979 (i was 10) the airport manager called my dad to fly to work on an off coast tiny isle because the radar repeater station electricity engine wasn't working and the Department of Defense (my dad was also a DoD employee) wanted it repaired asap, and MY DAD WAS THREE SHEETS TO THE WIND on his third bottle of whiskey - 40 pounders - and the gov't offered DOUBLE PAY ... and when my dad told them he was too drunk to do it they offered an escort driver and mechanical helper AND... THE KICKER... some expensive brand of whiskey my child self didn't recognize. He went, did it, got the booze, and the next pay day we walked into Shoppers Drug Mart (the only store in that small town to have toys) and told me to get whatever i wanted!!! It was better than Christmas or my birthday and I walked out with a Luke Skywalker and Stormtrooper figurine, Pink Panther doll, Alfred Hitchcock and Agatha Christie story anthologies and some gum with comics.

Er,... my point: being drunk wasn't identified as "an issue" until the 1980's. I remember when "alcoholism" was seen as a silly new word with few defenders.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

This guy's versatility makes him a useful 4th line player, mainly a wing but won a Cup playing 2nd line C, can play point or trigger man as a wing on the PP, has experience as a PKer (I wouldn't play him on one of the top 2 PK units, but he can be used for a more offensive 3rd unit or as a spare when one of your main PKers is in the box), at ES not great defensively but not a liability.

Chicago selects Patrick Sharp, LW/C


EDIT: Also an AS record of 3, 5, 6 is about as good as it gets right now

 

[BenchBrawl]

Good picks with Robert and Sharp. I considered both at various times in the last round or two.

 

[VanIslander]

Sharp.. a guy i have liked but felt he lacked fire... i honestly feel he could have been a HHOFer if he went balls-to-the-wall strong in key games. Pretty boy, big bucks, celeb.... the King Henrik objection to hockey greatness.

 

[ImporterExporter]

He's versatile. Can play the W and actually drop back to D and not look horrendous. Good two way guy and arguably the toughest guys of his era. Davidson-Madden-this guy is going to be a real pain in the ass to go against.

Great bio's from @Dreakmur and @Leafs Forever

ATD #12 Bio Thread

ATD2011 Bio Thread

Saskatoon is please to welcome:

Ken Randall, RW/D

"The Life and Times of Ken Randall, Hockey's Bad Hombre

I want this book.

 

[VanIslander]

Any hockey book with "bad hombre" in the subtitle, i wanna read!

 

[Habsfan18]

Baltimore will select RW, Tomas Sandstrom

The perfect fit to complete our “a bitch to play against” 3rd line alongside Nick Metz and Steve Kasper, Sandstrom is an ultra pest who will without question get under the opponents skin. He also proved that he can make an impact on the scoreboard as well, 9 times scoring 25 goals or more, including seasons of 45, 40 and 35 goals. Also playing a responsible defensive game, this one was a no-brainer for us.

He was the complete power forward: 6'2", fast, tenacious, and blessed with a surprising shot.

Tomas Sandstrom was one of the most hated players of his day. He had a reputation as a shit disturber at best, and as a dirty player at worst. He was very abrasive, always yapping, giving facials with his gloves and keep his stick high whenever someone came nearby. He infuriated opponents regularly enough that they would often try to retaliate, allowing Sandstrom's team to go to the power play.

Sandstrom had the finesse skills to make that team pay, too. He combined good size, speed, strength and skill. Nine times in his career, including seven seasons in a row, Sandstrom topped 25 goals or more, including a couple of 40 goal campaigns. He surprised goalies with virtually no backswing to his shot, showing velocity and accuracy regardless. He could even release shots while the puck was still in his feet. He was also an underrated passer.

Despite his reputation as a dirty player, the bottom line on Tomas Sandstrom was that he loved to compete and you had to respect that. That being said, he had a general disregard for his opponent's safety, and that does not need to be respected. He was like an Esa Tikkanen or Claude Lemieux - an elite pest with a good all around game to match it.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

Sharp.. a guy i have liked but felt he lacked fire... i honestly feel he could have been a HHOFer if he went balls-to-the-wall strong in key games. Pretty boy, big bucks, celeb.... the King Henrik objection to hockey greatness.

Pretty boy looks-wise, yes, but he played hard. Being a PKer requires some kind of grit. Big games...he led the Hawks in goals in 2 of the 3 Cup winning runs.

EDIT: Also wore an "A" for those Cups

 

[VanIslander]

Sharp like my boy Marleau never was cattle prodded nor was he hype/propelled.

His floor is pretty high, but his ceiling is a question mark.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

I like the Sharp and Morrow picks that Hawkey Town has made. Kind of jack-of-all trades type players that are quite useful on lower lines at even strength.

@Hawkey Town 18 , is C/LW the right listing for Sharp? He's been listed as a "F" in the past, but I know GMs often try to stretch things.

 

[VanIslander]

Recchi has NOTHING on Sharp and Marleau, other than awesome pivot!

 

[ImporterExporter]

@MadArcand has until 2:22 AM EST (1.5 hours)

@tinyzombies would then be up with @The Macho Man auto skipped with 4 to make up (hope you're feeling better bud, miss having your commentary).

I"m off to bed.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

I like the Sharp and Morrow picks that Hawkey Town has made. Kind of jack-of-all trades type players that are quite useful on lower lines at even strength.

@Hawkey Town 18 , is C/LW the right listing for Sharp? He's been listed as a "F" in the past, but I know GMs often try to stretch things.

I’m sure at some point in his career he played RW, but I definitely don’t think it’s enough to be played there in the ATD.

From 09-10 until Sharp was traded after the 2015 Cup the top 2 RW spots were owned by Kane and Hossa (Sharp got relegated to the 3rd line at the end there, but was still on the left side).
In 07-08 and 08-09 it was Kane and Havlat as the top 2 RW’s (Havlat was injured for a good chunk of 07-08, it’s possible Sharp filled in there but I don’t remember and think it’s unlikely).
Also, I remember at least for his first season in Dallas he was on the left side.

That’s basically his entire prime...doesn’t leave a whole lot left for RW.

EDIT: So, I don’t think he should be listed as F, I thought it was a bit of a stretch to put the /C in there, but since he did it for a Cup run I think it’s legit. I would never make C his full time role, it’s more just to show that value where he can step up if one of the C’s gets injured mid-game or needs to be benched.

 

[tinyzombies]

Craig Hartsburg

Biographical Info:

Position: D ▪ Shoots: Left
Height: 6-1 ▪ Weight: 200 lbs.

$PPP/82 = 25
SH% = 30%

Hartsburg's stats:
-Norris finishes: 4, 12
-19th all-time amongst defensemen in both points and assists per games played.
-1st in Power Play Goals On-Ice For (not against) 1986-87
-7th in Total Goals on Ice For (not against) 1986-87
-413 points in 570 career games
-42 points in 61 career playoff games
-3 time all star
-3 50 Assist Seasons
-40 Career Power Play Goals
-Member of Team Canada 1981, 1987 (won Canada Cup).

Joe Pelletier:
Before the injuries riddled him, Hartsburg was a wonderful rushing defenseman. He was an excellent skater, extremely mobile laterally in particular. He would often rush the puck out of the zone, sometimes recklessly and leading to injury susceptibility.

As his career progressed he reigned in his rushing game and proved to be a fantastic passing defenseman, clearing the zone with proficiency but starting the transition offense expertly as well. He also knew how to quarterback a power play. His vision and creativity allowed him to move the puck into the slimmest of passing lanes, and he naturally knew when to pinch to keep the zone.

Hartsburg was very sound defensively, playing his defensive angles well and reading the rush well back into his own zone. His active stick broke up a lot of oncoming breaks.

 

[MadArcand]

Hurricanes select Jaroslav Holík, C

 

[Dreakmur]

He's versatile. Can play the W and actually drop back to D and not look horrendous. Good two way guy and arguably the toughest guys of his era. Davidson-Madden-this guy is going to be a real pain in the ass to go against.

Ken Randall, RW/D

From what I understand, he's more of a defenseman who can move up to forward and not look horrendous. He seems to have been very successful in the season that he was a pure defenseman, but never cracked the top 10 in scoring as a forward

 

[Ben Grimm]

I wondered where Nilsson would go. He's 9th in PPG.

 

[ResilientBeast]

I'll catch up with, Jay Bouwmeester, D

 

[ImporterExporter]

@Selfish Man has until 10:19 AM EST to pick (1 hour).

@tabness (4 hr clock) would then be up.