Player Discussion Artem Zub (D) Part 2 [Extended 4 years @ $4.6M]

[Dan Patrick]

Blaming the Sens for not signing Zub to a longer contract is such a speculative and bad take. If that was an option dont you think the team would have given him a 3 or 4 year deal. Zub had all the leverage of just going back to the KHL if he wanted. And for all we know the 2 year deal was pre-agreed on in order to get him to come over and sign with the Sens in the first place.

All we can do is speculate but I have to think following last years play if 3 or 4 year deals were ever an option then the team would have jumped on it.

He's a great defencemen and I hope we can compete next year and convince him to re-sign.

 

[OD99]

Blaming the Sens for not signing Zub to a longer contract is such a speculative and bad take. If that was an option dont you think the team would have given him a 3 or 4 year deal. Zub had all the leverage of just going back to the KHL if he wanted. And for all we know the 2 year deal was pre-agreed on in order to get him to come over and sign with the Sens in the first place.

All we can do is speculate but I have to think following last years play if 3 or 4 year deals were ever an option then the team would have jumped on it.

He's a great defencemen and I hope we can compete next year and convince him to re-sign.

That's fine but quite frankly your speculation is no different so it's great you have a different opinion but to suggest that the team would have obviously done it has no evidence behind it either.

So call the contrasting opinion a bad take doesn't make sense.

I fully agree on the bolded s0 we are united there.

 

[Dan Patrick]

That's fine but quite frankly your speculation is no different so it's great you have a different opinion but to suggest that the team would have obviously done it has no evidence behind it either.

So call the contrasting opinion a bad take doesn't make sense.

I fully agree on the bolded s0 we are united there.

Maybe I should have made myself more clear, I just don't think speculation should be used as valid criticism. Without any evidence It is just as likely a 2 year max contract extension was pre-agreed before Zub came to Ottawa as it is that the team didn't want to sign him to longer. But only one group speculating is using that to criticize management.

It's fair to not like the contract, to wish he would have signed longer term, to wish or wonder if a longer term deal for more money could have been made. But the only fact we have is that we don't know anything really about the negotiations, and using the negotiations we know nothing about to criticize someone we don't like seems petty.

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

Blaming the Sens for not signing Zub to a longer contract is such a speculative and bad take. If that was an option dont you think the team would have given him a 3 or 4 year deal. Zub had all the leverage of just going back to the KHL if he wanted. And for all we know the 2 year deal was pre-agreed on in order to get him to come over and sign with the Sens in the first place.

All we can do is speculate buhave to think following last years play if 3 or 4 year deals were ever an option then the team would have jumped on it.

He's a great defencemen and I hope we can compete next year and convince him to re-sign.

I would like to think this is the case so that if he leaves at least it is easier to swallow but if we examine it more deeply it doesn't really make a lot of sense.

Imagine you're Zub and you're given an option of a 2 year 2.5 mill contract or a 4 year 4.5 mill contract. Which one are you taking? The contract that gives you a guaranteed 18 mill or the 2 year contract that could leave you 13 mill short in the case of a career altering injury? And 4 years isn't long so even if Zub wants to leave he will still be in his prime and have the opportunity to sign another big contract. It's basically a win-win for Zub. He could live a a life of luxury just off the 18 mill. 5 mill in earnings would be a lot tougher. And if not 4 years a least 3 should have been doable.

This combined with Dorions comments about how JBD and Thomson will fill the role leaves me to believe that this is yet another case of Dorions inability to evaluate talent. Even though it's smacking him in the face.

Micehal Del Zotto 2 year 4 mill contract
Artem Zub 2 year 4.5 mill contract

Can you make any sense in that? seems like gross managerial incompetence, its not like Dorion doesn't have history of it.

 

[Wondercarrot]

Blaming the Sens for not signing Zub to a longer contract is such a speculative and bad take. If that was an option dont you think the team would have given him a 3 or 4 year deal. Zub had all the leverage of just going back to the KHL if he wanted. And for all we know the 2 year deal was pre-agreed on in order to get him to come over and sign with the Sens in the first place.

All we can do is speculate but I have to think following last years play if 3 or 4 year deals were ever an option then the team would have jumped on it.

He's a great defencemen and I hope we can compete next year and convince him to re-sign.

The Sens kneecapped themselves as far as using that (entirely legit) excuse when Dorion himself suggested a short term deal was preferable because they had Thomson and JBD coming.
Why does that matter?!?
So the choice is either:
a) Dorion choose to cover for Zub and his agent who wouldn’t budge, and thereby make the Sens look dumb.
OR
b) he really thought that was a good reason.

Both are foolish, but the 2nd is also real incompetence.

 

[Dan Patrick]

I would like to think this is the case so that if he leaves at least it is easier to swallow but if we examine it more deeply it doesn't really make a lot of sense.

Imagine you're Zub and you're given an option of a 2 year 2.5 mill contract or a 4 year 4.5 mill contract. Which one are you taking? The contract that gives you a guaranteed 18 mill or the 2 year contract that could leave you 13 mill short in the case of a career altering injury? And 4 years isn't long so even if Zub wants to leave he will still be in his prime and have the opportunity to sign another big contract. It's basically a win-win for Zub. He could live a a life of luxury just off the 18 mill. 5 mill in earnings would be a lot tougher. And if not 4 years a least 3 should have been doable.

This combined with Dorions comments about how JBD and Thomson will fill the role leaves me to believe that this is yet another case of Dorions inability to evaluate talent. Even though it's smacking him in the face.

Micehal Del Zotto 2 year 4 mill contract
Artem Zub 2 year 4.5 mill contract

Can you make any sense in that? seems like gross managerial incompetence, its not like Dorion doesn't have history of it.

Speculating on what Zub would have done if offered 4x4.5 is silly and just feels like you're trying to make up something to suit your argument. We have no idea what was offered, and no idea what was agreed on in order to get Zub to come over or to stay in Ottawa.

Dorion has a long and sordid history with putting his foot in his mouth and I don't take anything he says much farther than I could throw him. It's one of the many fair criticisms I think you can make about management, but wild speculation about failing to sign Zub long term shouldn't be part of that criticism because we simply don't know. Making up a narrative about Zub's contract only works to detract from other fair arguments against Dorion.

As per your last line, Dorion overpaid MDZ for sure, it's another in an increasingly long line of weird FA acquisitions that I think you can fairly criticize Dorion for but again that should be left to the MDZ or Dorion threads.

 

[Emerica]

Zub

 

[YouGotAStuGoing]

Zub

Great take.

 

[Deku]

Zub

I agree.

 

[Hale The Villain]

Financial security is a lot more valuable to Zub than it is for someone like Brady, given that he's already 26 and hasn't made much in his career thus far.

Would be shocked if he opted for a 5M/2YR deal over a 20-25M/5-6YR deal, but I don't think the latter was ever offered.

Dorion came right out and said that he thinks Thomson and JBD will be ready after next season and are top 4 D in the making. With Zaitsev signed beyond next season, don't have to be a genius to put it together.

Really should have gotten him locked up for 4-5M on a longer deal deal. Big missed opportunity.

 

[coladin]

It was obvious he was really good it was a massive blunder to not sign him long term. No idea how anyone compares this situation to Zaitsev. Because they are Russian and defense I guess. Eye test showed how good he was last year. He made Mike Reilly look good. An impossible feat.


Oh yeah he is going to get 6 +

It takes both sides, but honestly in his scenario, dude is right off the boat and maybe isn't, or wasn't sure, how long may actually stay in North America. I am pretty confident he cam be re-signed. He is playing a lot of minutes, which he likes, whereas on another team, he may end up being buried down the lineup. Couple of Russians are here, I think this bodes well for him staying

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

How many times have we been burned for locking up too early. Too many.

How many games has he played in NA. Not many

Zub likes Ottawa because it reminds him of mother russia. Let's relax and see if he wants part of this dynasty

 

[Bileur]

How many times have we been burned for locking up too early. Too many.

How many games has he played in NA. Not many

Zub likes Ottawa because it reminds him of mother russia. Let's relax and see if he wants part of this dynasty

 

[Butchy Dakkar]

The fans are gonna make him so loved he won’t want to leave. It’s already happening, this guy belongs in Ottawa.

 

[CornerStone61]

 

[Gil Gunderson]

Signing him for 2 years because Dorion believes Thomson/JBD will be able to replace him is going to bite us in the ass.

 

[Cosmix]

Financial security is a lot more valuable to Zub than it is for someone like Brady, given that he's already 26 and hasn't made much in his career thus far.

Would be shocked if he opted for a 5M/2YR deal over a 20-25M/5-6YR deal, but I don't think the latter was ever offered.

Dorion came right out and said that he thinks Thomson and JBD will be ready after next season and are top 4 D in the making. With Zaitsev signed beyond next season, don't have to be a genius to put it together.

Really should have gotten him locked up for 4-5M on a longer deal deal. Big missed opportunity.

Yes a missed opportunity; however, the Senators could sign Zub to another contract when the current contract ends. They would just have to pay the going rate at that time. But they might want to go the cheaper route with JBT and LT due to EM's famous budget!

 

[Cosmix]

How many times have we been burned for locking up too early. Too many.

How many games has he played in NA. Not many

Zub likes Ottawa because it reminds him of mother russia. Let's relax and see if he wants part of this dynasty

Your first two questions are intriguing. I wonder what the answers are.

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

Your first two questions are intriguing. I wonder what the answers are.

 

[PoutineSp00nZ]

Financial security is a lot more valuable to Zub than it is for someone like Brady, given that he's already 26 and hasn't made much in his career thus far.

Would be shocked if he opted for a 5M/2YR deal over a 20-25M/5-6YR deal, but I don't think the latter was ever offered.

Dorion came right out and said that he thinks Thomson and JBD will be ready after next season and are top 4 D in the making. With Zaitsev signed beyond next season, don't have to be a genius to put it together.

Really should have gotten him locked up for 4-5M on a longer deal deal. Big missed opportunity.

A good Russian in his prime can always make bank in the KHL. ANd he gets to play in his home country. We have no idea if Zub even wants to stay in the NHL for his entire career.

I would have loved to see him locked up long term, but its entirely possible he wasn't willing to sign beyond two years. We just don't know.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Signing him for 2 years because Dorion believes Thomson/JBD will be able to replace him is going to bite us in the ass.

Zub signed for two years because he wants to make money ASAP. You can't make a player sign a long term deal if he doesn't want to.

 

[Wondercarrot]

How many times have we been burned for locking up too early. Too many.

How many games has he played in NA. Not many

Zub likes Ottawa because it reminds him of mother russia. Let's relax and see if he wants part of this dynasty

I get that and it’s fair, I just think it’s a missed opportunity for a home run deal for the Sens which obviously contributes to keeping other players.

you need to hit on a couple of those I think to offset some of the deals where you might need to overpay etc.

 

[Gil Gunderson]

Zub signed for two years because he wants to make money ASAP. You can't make a player sign a long term deal if he doesn't want to.

Well I hope they push hard to get an extension this summer. Right handed D who can support a top LD on a top pairing don’t grow on trees. We’ll be looking for one for years. He’s Chabot’s Methot.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Well I hope they push hard to get an extension this summer. Right handed D who can support a top LD on a top pairing don’t grow on trees. We’ll be looking for one for years. He’s Chabot’s Methot.

He's going to chase the money and we don't have a ton of it and lots of good prospects who will want lots of cash.

Re-signing him will be risky. I'm all in favour but he's going to want 7 per: he's good and there aren't a lot of good RD available. He's going to to UFA ASAP for the $$$.

 

[aragorn]

Zub had another strong night & had a solid game on both sides of centre including being the QB on a second PP unit a few of times. He needs to shoot more when he has a clear shot. I wouldn't worry about re-signing Zub it's clear he's one of their best D right now & a fan favourite, he'll get re-signed.

We should have Sanderson on his ELC for at least two yrs & there will be a boat load of guys coming off the books by yr's end. They will need to re-sign Paul as well this summer & C. Brown next yr too hopefully at team friendly numbers.