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Around the League--Dog Days of Summer

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Ron said:
Harken back to your Kobe 101… If she refuses to testify…
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Wasn't there a credibility issue there, though?

And if she refuses to testify, can they hold her in contempt? I don't recall who was pressing charges, but I thought it was the DA...
 
Brad Doty said:
Wasn't there a credibility issue there, though?

And if she refuses to testify, can they hold her in contempt? I don't recall who was pressing charges, but I thought it was the DA...
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Depends on the state. In California they can say DV is a crime against the state. I'm not sure they can in whatever state Kane did his business in, nor are they in an actual relationship so it isn't DV either.
 
Brad Doty said:
Wasn't there a credibility issue there, though?

And if she refuses to testify, can they hold her in contempt? I don't recall who was pressing charges, but I thought it was the DA...
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Yes but there are rape shield laws. And most of the time even if there isn't a specific law on the books DA's and judges don't like trying to bring contempt charges against victims. It's a PR nightmare.
 
tsanuri said:
Yes but there are rape shield laws. And most of the time even if there isn't a specific law on the books DA's and judges don't like trying to bring contempt charges against victims. It's a PR nightmare.
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Does anyone know what would happen if they don't really need the victims testimony to pursue charges?

I'm unclear on what can happen in this case because one of the people slated to testify was a friend who was with the victim. Even if Kane settles with the victim, what's to keep the DA from getting an indictment with the witnesses testimony?

Is the DA involved in any settlement talks that may take place?

I know a little contract law from things I've done, but I have no clue about criminal law.
 
Fishhead said:
Does anyone know what would happen if they don't really need the victims testimony to pursue charges?

I'm unclear on what can happen in this case because one of the people slated to testify was a friend who was with the victim. Even if Kane settles with the victim, what's to keep the DA from getting an indictment with the witnesses testimony?

Is the DA involved in any settlement talks that may take place?

I know a little contract law from things I've done, but I have no clue about criminal law.
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It's is almost impossible to prove without the victims testimony.
Rape is a matter of consent. So they could have DNA that he had intercourse with her. But if she won't say that is wasn't consensual you don't really have a case.
The DA might be involved. Many victims don't want to go through all that is required in order to try to obtain a conviction. If you have ever been around someone that has gone through it you know that all too well.
 
It could also end up that any part of a settlement could involve the D.A.'s office that would see Kane plea down to a lesser charge as part of the settlement. If not there isn't any reason for the victim in this case to settle prior to the trial. Regardless of how the criminal trial turns out she can still file and win a civil suit as the burden of proof is less.
 
Delayed 2 weeks? Looks like the NHL is gonna be forced into a position of action after all, rather than hoping it all went away over the summer.
 
417th said:
It could also end up that any part of a settlement could involve the D.A.'s office that would see Kane plea down to a lesser charge as part of the settlement. If not there isn't any reason for the victim in this case to settle prior to the trial. Regardless of how the criminal trial turns out she can still file and win a civil suit as the burden of proof is less.
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There are plenty of reasons for a person being willing to a settlement.
First is just the stress of having to go through everything.
Your life being torn apart and twisted upside down.
And then with rape cases being hard to prove and get convictions. The implications if he is found not guilty towards you.
Not to mention there is still a percentage of the population that things a woman must have done something and therefore deserves it. Which just makes me sick but they are there.
 
tsanuri said:
There are plenty of reasons for a person being willing to a settlement.
First is just the stress of having to go through everything.
Your life being torn apart and twisted upside down.
And then with rape cases being hard to prove and get convictions. The implications if he is found not guilty towards you.
Not to mention there is still a percentage of the population that things a woman must have done something and therefore deserves it. Which just makes me sick but they are there.
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I agree with each of the points you have made. I guess I meant more that since she has brought the case this far that she should take it all the way to trial. But I do agree that there are legitimate reasons for a victim to settle out of court. I only hope that in this case that it goes forward.

I think that people who bring forward rape charges against another person who has raped them are showing exceptional courage.
 
417th said:
I agree with each of the points you have made. I guess I meant more that since she has brought the case this far that she should take it all the way to trial. But I do agree that there are legitimate reasons for a victim to settle out of court. I only hope that in this case that it goes forward.

I think that people who bring forward rape charges against another person who has raped them are showing exceptional courage.
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She really hasn't done much so far in the scheme of things. She has made a statement to the police and likely undergone a full physical to obtain any DNA that could be there.
Nothing in front of others like the grand jury or at trial where she would have to undergo cross.
And even with rape shield laws and not being able to bring somethings up at trial. It's amazing how it leaks and every guy she's ever had sex with is known. And how long ago it was. And how long she'd know him before it. All of which are not easy for her or her family. It's sad but the victim ends up many times being put on trial if not in court, but sometimes even there, but in the court of public opinion. And it is all magnified if the person being accused is a public figure.
 
417th said:
I agree with each of the points you have made. I guess I meant more that since she has brought the case this far that she should take it all the way to trial. But I do agree that there are legitimate reasons for a victim to settle out of court. I only hope that in this case that it goes forward.

I think that people who bring forward rape charges against another person who has raped them are showing exceptional courage.
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There are, but that doesn't appear to be the reason for the delay.

Also, as Graham points out, any kind settlement, even if it's to plea for a lesser charge would be a disaster for Kane.

Tim Graham ‏@ByTimGraham · 18m18 minutes ago
With grand jury set, investigation essentially done. All bad press, lost endorsements and hassle out there. If innocent, go forth/clear name

He's right. The lawyer has claimed all along Kane is innocent and anything less will keep a dark cloud over him.
 
deeshamrock said:
There are, but that doesn't appear to be the reason for the delay.

Also, as Graham points out, any kind settlement, even if it's to plea for a lesser charge would be a disaster for Kane.

Tim Graham ‏@ByTimGraham · 18m18 minutes ago
With grand jury set, investigation essentially done. All bad press, lost endorsements and hassle out there. If innocent, go forth/clear name

He's right. The lawyer has claimed all along Kane is innocent and anything less will keep a dark cloud over him.
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Of course, that was understood as it was previously reported. My response was to what Tsunari was saying in his response to my previous post. The delay as has been stated has nothing to do with settlement discussions. I do agree that if Kane settles out of court that he will be doing serious harm to his already tarnished reputation and as I have said in another thread, he has also given the NHL and his team a black eye and according to the NHL etc that is an entirely unacceptable situation. To my way of seeing things the dye is cast for Kane regardless of what happens next in some ways. That said I think that if he ends up avoiding a jail sentence that he may still end up in trouble with the NHL and that could be significant too.

The NHL has to respond to RoR and Kane in the same manner that they did with Voynov or they are going to end up with more trouble than they want or at least I think so. I agree with Graham that Kane should go out and clear his name if it is at all possible.
 
417th said:
Of course, that was understood as it was previously reported. My response was to what Tsunari was saying in his response to my previous post. The delay as has been stated has nothing to do with settlement discussions. I do agree that if Kane settles out of court that he will be doing serious harm to his already tarnished reputation and as I have said in another thread, he has also given the NHL and his team a black eye and according to the NHL etc that is an entirely unacceptable situation. To my way of seeing things the dye is cast for Kane regardless of what happens next in some ways. That said I think that if he ends up avoiding a jail sentence that he may still end up in trouble with the NHL and that could be significant too.

The NHL has to respond to RoR and Kane in the same manner that they did with Voynov or they are going to end up with more trouble than they want or at least I think so. I agree with Graham that Kane should go out and clear his name if it is at all possible.
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RoR will fall under the substance abuse program. We can all agree or not but that seems to be a fact.
 
I know this has become the de-facto "Kane thread", but am I the only one that doesn't like this tournament that will be starting next year? Just seems like another opportunity for guys to get hurt. These idiots already have to play in the ****ing olympics, now they have to play in something every 2 years?
 
KopitarFAN said:
I know this has become the de-facto "Kane thread", but am I the only one that doesn't like this tournament that will be starting next year? Just seems like another opportunity for guys to get hurt. These idiots already have to play in the ****ing olympics, now they have to play in something every 2 years?
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I don't like it since it's a freaking joke. Team U-23? Team Rest of Europe? How stupid can you get.

International play is awesome though. I wish Worlds were later so more NHLers could play. Also that Olympic qualification was at a point were guys like Kopitar could help their countries qualify like how the World Cup is.
 
Holden Caulfield said:
I don't like it since it's a freaking joke. Team U-23? Team Rest of Europe? How stupid can you get.

International play is awesome though. I wish Worlds were later so more NHLers could play. Also that Olympic qualification was at a point were guys like Kopitar could help their countries qualify like how the World Cup is.
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Until fairly recently, I thought that's what the whole tournament was (U-23 Teams), so I was like "awesome, no one who matters as far as the teams I like will be able to play."

I just don't see how you can have these kinds of things with a season that runs over 8 months for the teams that go to the finals.
 
The team Europe and U-23 North American team is just stupid. I don't mind the tournament itself though.
 
KopitarFAN said:
I know this has become the de-facto "Kane thread", but am I the only one that doesn't like this tournament that will be starting next year? Just seems like another opportunity for guys to get hurt. These idiots already have to play in the ****ing olympics, now they have to play in something every 2 years?
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Country > NHL, obviously. I was told on this site that all these players are on loan from their countries so we should feel privileged...
 
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