Confirmed with Link: [ARI/TOR] Conor Timmins to Toronto for Curtis Douglas

[Coaches Coroner]

This is the home of Wendel, Roberts and Tucker. You can't deprive the fanbase like this.

None of them won anything with this team. Wendel had is dining out on a few great Leaf seasons, and then cost us very good picks to get back in run down form. Roberts was fine but one in a long line of acquiring over the hill vets.

 

[TMLAM34]

I don't think the odds are high, But given his pedigree and the fact he's developed into a viable NHL option despite the injuries to this point.... if he stays healthy you can't write it off.

As good or better odds than of Douglas being an everyday NHLer

I agree. Douglas will probably see some NHL games this year only because Arizona is trying to suck and what better way to suck than icing bad players. But on a contending team, I don’t see Douglas playing. People see the height and get worked up but it’s not like Dubas traded him for another midget… Timmins is 6’2 and plays a sound two-way game.

 

[Fogelhund]

So was Mason Marchment in Toronto. He was actually given a real opportunity somewhere else and he flourished. For some reason physical players are buried here. I actually don't think it's because they're not good enough, because everytime they go to a new team they literally take off.

Douglas scored at a 42 point pace over 82 games as a rookie with the majority of his time on the 4th line. Marchment scored at a 48 and 46 point pace playing middle-six with the Marlies his first two seasons. You know what would have been nice for Curtis Douglas after a successful first season, almost too much so given his positioning in the lineup. Maybe, trying out the 3rd line or heaven forbid the 2nd line with actual linemates who could score with regularity. Maybe, some time in front of the net on the PP? Doesn't seem like a reach to use him that way. SDA was pacing for 51 points last year in the middle-six and he has been given every opportunity to succeed. What use do the Leafs have for SDA? I would think it would have been a lot more important for Douglas to be soaking up those minutes.

We don't need another Malgin, Engvall or Kerfoot we need a Marchment, Ritchie or Kadri. They keep gifting this player type away for soft as shit depth pieces. We need tough as shit depth pieces. I think Dubas is smart, but he has some serious holes in his team building philosphies. I think it's part of the reason he's successful (6 years in the playoffs), but part of the reason he fails (6 1st round exits). He's gone all in on his preferences and our team is probably the softest team in the league.

This is the home of Wendel, Roberts and Tucker. You can't deprive the fanbase like this.

Do you really believe, that if his play AND skating hadn't regressed, he wouldn't have EARNED more opportunity? Marchment had wheels at least, the basic skills that maybe he could put things together. Douglas's skating wasn't good enough last year in the AHL to make the step, after extensive time spent with skating coaches. So you'd think in the offseason, you'd continue to do things to improve your skating, your explosiveness in the gym... and yet, he came to camp worse than he was last year. He was projecting to make the Jason Allison Speed Skating team.

I was one of the first guys on the Curtis Douglas bandwagon last year, maybe even the first. The games I watched this year... he just wasn't the same guy. I get the give him better line mates story, but even on the fourth line, he was dragging his line mates down. He wasn't standing up for his team mates this year.

Go ahead, search through my posts with Curtis Douglas, you'll see my posting that he's been terrible this year. Even as one of his bigger fans, I cautioned other Leafs posters that he was at least a year away, if he did the right things, showed progress in his game, and most importantly his skating... and yet, the opposite happened... he got worse. I'm disappointed, that the player just face planted...

 

[Maplebeasts]

Dubas has to go. I’ve lost faith in him.

This is a pretty minor trade but the overarching theme to all his moves is just infuriating.

His aversion to anyone who plays a physical game is ridiculous. He’s learned nothing. And his love for former Soo Greyhounds is just comical at this point.

I don’t know how good Douglas will be but he’ll play in the NHL. This is basically the Mason Marchment trade 2.0.

Right the guy who traded for Muzzin, Lyubushkin, Clifford, signed Bogosian and Simmonds who was nothing more than a washed up face puncher, etc has an aversion to physical players.

 

[Fogelhund]

Right the guy who traded for Muzzin, Lyubushkin, Clifford, signed Bogosian and Simmonds who was nothing more than a washed up face puncher, etc has an aversion to physical players.

Probably posted by a guy, who doesn't even watch the Marlies.

 

[Isaac Nootin]

We don't need another Malgin, Engvall or Kerfoot we need a Marchment, Ritchie or Kadri.

But Douglas wasn't dealt for a Malgin, Kerfoot, Engvall type.

You want depth toughness, they can be found on the waiver wire or for 5th round picks........Or still within the organization.

 

[MAB1]

So was Mason Marchment in Toronto. He was actually given a real opportunity somewhere else and he flourished. For some reason physical players are buried here. I actually don't think it's because they're not good enough, because everytime they go to a new team they literally take off.

Douglas scored at a 42 point pace over 82 games as a rookie with the majority of his time on the 4th line. Marchment scored at a 48 and 46 point pace playing middle-six with the Marlies his first two seasons. You know what would have been nice for Curtis Douglas after a successful first season, almost too much so given his positioning in the lineup. Maybe, trying out the 3rd line or heaven forbid the 2nd line with actual linemates who could score with regularity. Maybe, some time in front of the net on the PP? Doesn't seem like a reach to use him that way. SDA was pacing for 51 points last year in the middle-six and he has been given every opportunity to succeed. What use do the Leafs have for SDA? I would think it would have been a lot more important for Douglas to be soaking up those minutes.

We don't need another Malgin, Engvall or Kerfoot we need a Marchment, Ritchie or Kadri. They keep gifting this player type away for soft as shit depth pieces. We need tough as shit depth pieces. I think Dubas is smart, but he has some serious holes in his team building philosphies. I think it's part of the reason he's successful (6 years in the playoffs), but part of the reason he fails (6 1st round exits). He's gone all in on his preferences and our team is probably the softest team in the league.

This is the home of Wendel, Roberts and Tucker. You can't deprive the fanbase like this.

Never seen a fanbase glorify a group of players that led to no cups only to hate another group of players for accomplishing the same result. Only difference is they played the way you liked while still losing and amounting to no team success.

 

[ACC1224]

Anyone would thinks Timmins is a p***y doesn't know the player.

 

[ToDavid]

No it’s not overblown when Colorado got to watch Nazem Kadri skate around the ice with the Stanley Cup over his head while we’ve had to watch Kerfoot coast around for four years.

Or when Florida benefited from a nearly point per game season from Marchment while Malgin played in Europe.

Or when Edmonton has a point per game Zach
Hyman for the price we’re paying Kerfoot and Engvall to score a combined 3 goals in 39 games this season

Or when he treats Matt Martin like absolute garbage and trades him for Eamon McAdam. Martin then plays 49 playoff games in the three following seasons as an integral part of an effective fourth line.

He has routinely favoured soft players over physical ones. And it hasn’t payed off. And he keeps doing it.

Points about Kadri and Marchment I'll accept. Although it's not like plenty of fans weren't chasing Kadri out of town as well. Marchment was a long shot and I hate using hindsight to evaluate trades, but I'll admit I didn't like it at the time because while it was nothing for nothing, our nothing had an off chance of being something unique.

Dubas is literally the guy who found Hyman and he loved him. He got priced out of the team. Bunting has also been a pretty damn fine replacement for $950k.

Lou was GM when Babcock started scratching Martin and based on rumors it was more personal than professional. Not surprising for Babcock. Dubas did the guy a solid by sending him back to the Isles when it was clear his coach was done with him.

 

[ACC1224]

Points about Kadri and Marchment I'll accept. Although it's not like plenty of fans weren't chasing Kadri out of town as well. Marchment was a long shot and I hate using hindsight to evaluate trades, but I'll admit I didn't like it at the time because while it was nothing for nothing, our nothing had an off chance of being something unique.

Dubas is literally the guy who found Hyman and he loved him. He got priced out of the team. Bunting has also been a pretty damn fine replacement for $950k.

Lou was GM when Babcock started scratching Martin and based on rumors it was more personal than professional. Not surprising for Babcock. Dubas did the guy a solid by sending him back to the Isles when it was clear his coach was done with him.

Story was Martin stood up to Babcock for treating Marner poorly and the Coach held it against him.

 

[Magic Man]

None of them won anything with this team. Wendel had is dining out on a few great Leaf seasons, and then cost us very good picks to get back in run down form. Roberts was fine but one in a long line of acquiring over the hill vets.

They were each part of conference final runs with Toronto. A couple for Wendel. They had 4 big runs in 10 years with a lot of legendary Leaf warriors I could list.

But Douglas wasn't dealt for a Malgin, Kerfoot, Engvall type.

You want depth toughness, they can be found on the waiver wire or for 5th round picks........Or still within the organization.

The numbers tell me Timmins isn't a physical player much like those listed above. He's a soft depth player just like them that Dubas has fallen in love with.

Reaves has been traded before once for a 3rd and once in a deal where a 1st rd. pick was exchanged. Reaves at 35 years old is worth a 5th.

You can't find prime Brian Boyle or Adam Lowry on the waiver wire.

 

[TMLAM34]

Man, 14 pages of people being upset about Douglas getting traded… Douglas stood and watched his goaltender get run over. Just because he’s big doesn’t mean he’s a beast. Look at Gauthier, Engvall, etc. Douglas for Timmins, I do this deal and second of the day on any day.

 

[CabanaBoy5]

People who think that Douglas will become a Marchment didn't watch Marchment play with the Marlies. I used to have LeafsTV and watched all their games, and he showed alot of promise as he developed. He scored 70 pts in 124 games with the Marlies showing a combination of grit and some skill. Even scored 16pts in 33 playoff games. I never understood why he wasn't given a better opportunity with the Leafs. That's on Dubas.

But Douglas, other than size, offers very little. He has 1 point in 13 games and is a -2. Yes, he had a decent season last year, but this season he has regressed dramatically. Marchment progressed each season. Dubas haters have to at least be objective when commenting on trades. This a potential something for nothing trade imo based on the players involved and their potential.

 

[Judas Tavares]

I bet Douglas does get NHL games sooner than later and may even show well in them because..... It's Arizona. Just like Ritchie and Boyd are showing well there because it's.... Arizona.

 

[Thornbury]

Man, 14 pages of people being upset about Douglas getting traded… Douglas stood and watched his goaltender get run over. Just because he’s big doesn’t mean he’s a beast. Look at Gauthier, Engvall, etc. Douglas for Timmins, I do this deal and second of the day on any day.

Agreed. When I first saw the title of this thread yesterday, I thought bit was one of those "here's a trade idea from a fan" proposals, rather than an actual transaction. Certainly no guarantee Timmins figures it out, stays healthy and flourishes, but the potential is definitely there.

 

[Magic Man]

Probably posted by a guy, who doesn't even watch the Marlies.

I'm sure I've watched more of the Marlies over the years then most of the people posting in this thread.

 

[Isaac Nootin]

The numbers tell me Timmins isn't a physical player much like those listed above. He's a soft depth player just like them that Dubas has fallen in love with.

The numbers, lol

Say no more.

 

[Skullz]

Any scouting reports on Timmins for those who have watched him closely? All I know he is a big RHD with draft pedigree and injury issues?

Would have preferred to trade Gogolev over Douglas though if we're just freeing a contract slot.

 

[Magic Man]

The numbers, lol

Say no more.

Timmins has 42 hits in 51 NHL games, playoffs included where the intensity is ramped up. He is not even a hit per game, this is what it looks like when measured up with current Leafs defenseman.

This season alone...

Sandin has 50 hits in 21 games.
Holl has 39 hits in 21 games.
Rielly has 22 hits in 20 games.
Giordano has 20 hits in 21 games.
Benn has 18 hits in 6 games.
Liljegren has 17 hits in 10 games.
Muzzin has 11 hits in 4 games.
Brodie has 17 hits in 15 games. (He is usually pretty low, so it's probably the sample size.)
Mete has 1 hit in 5 games.

 

[Isaac Nootin]

Timmins has 42 hits in 51 NHL games, playoffs included where the intensity is ramped up. He is not even a hit per game, this is what it looks like when measured up with current Leafs defenseman.

This season alone...

Sandin has 50 hits in 21 games.
Holl has 39 hits in 21 games.
Rielly has 22 hits in 20 games.
Giordano has 20 hits in 21 games.
Benn has 18 hits in 6 games.
Liljegren has 17 hits in 10 games.
Muzzin has 11 hits in 4 games.
Brodie has 17 hits in 15 games. (He is usually pretty low, so it's probably the sample size.)
Mete has 1 hit in 5 games.

#1 - I would seriously suggest actually watching him play.

#2 - If you can't wait that long, I'd suggest reading ANY available scouting report on Timmins.

 

[TMLAM34]

Timmins isn’t a physical force, never has been. He brings a very sound two-way game though. If he can stay healthy, definitely a great add on the third pair.

 

[acrobaticgoalie]

I was on board signing Timmins as a low risk high reward RHD. Very scary injury history, but I remember how well regarded he was during his respective Draft. If he could stay healthy he could have some significant upside for us. Sadly, someone his age with such significant past injuries, the chances of putting them behind him and having a meaningful career are not promising. Definitely hoping for the best there.

Not peeved by the Soo connection as I usually am because of the high upside for Timmins if he can get healthy and fulfill his potential, but could we not offer the only 6'9 tough potential 4C player in our pipeline to get him? I understand Douglas has badly underperformed and had a top ceiling of 4C that was no guarantee to even get there, but we have no one remotely close to him in our pipeline. If he does become that tough, can play 4C guy who will stand up for team-mates, well, that's going to suck.

Hoping Timmins stay's healthy and becomes the defender that he was projected to become for us. Could be that we paid peanuts for him if that's the case.....

Awesome potential for us but even if he ends up just being a depth defender when healthy, it's still a good get and for pretty much nothing.

For the most part, I haven't really cared about the Soo connection as most of them have worked out pretty well for us but it is kind of getting kinda weird.

 

[Isaac Nootin]

Timmins isn’t a physical force, never has been.

Incorrect.

 

[TMLAM34]

Incorrect.

When has he been a physical force?

 

[ACC1224]

When has he been a physical force?

That's a pretty vague term.
I'd say he's about as physical as Brodie, Rielly, players like that.
He'll take the body, rub guys out but he's not running around looking for it.