Value of: Andrei Kuzmenko

[Junohockeyfan]

It’s gonna be really interesting to see what kind of value he has, I honestly think it’s significant still, the guy scored 39 goals last year, especially if you could retain a little bit.

I would not be surprised whatsoever if he breaks out in the second half of the season, or gets traded and pots 30 plus goals next year

I wouldn't be surprised if last season was a flash in the pan and he continues he current lack of production.

 

[Izzy Goodenough]

In my view, Kuzmenko's actual issue is that the vast majority of time this year the Canucks give up the puck to enter the offensive zone and are then forced to forecheck to recover possession.

This style does not favour Kuzmenko and he rarely has puck possession to do his dangles.

To compound this, Kuzmenko's most common line mates are Mikheyev and Pettersson so he has 2 fantastic line mates but they both also "need" the Puck to be effective.

If they want to make it work, they should play Kuzmenko with Pettersson and move a player like Lafferty or Suter on to the line.

Mikheyev can play anywhere up and down the lineup.

Well Mikheyev and Pettersson and Kuzmenko are back together tonight apparently so time will tell if this will now work.

 

[PettersonHughes]

then we send them D-Petey

Petey's for 4 quality assets is a trade I'd do

In my view, Kuzmenko's actual issue is that the vast majority of time this year the Canucks give up the puck to enter the offensive zone and are then forced to forecheck to recover possession.

This style does not favour Kuzmenko and he rarely has puck possession to do his dangles.

To compound this, Kuzmenko's most common line mates are Mikheyev and Pettersson so he has 2 fantastic line mates but they both also "need" the Puck to be effective.

If they want to make it work, they should play Kuzmenko with Pettersson and move a player like Lafferty or Suter on to the line.

Mikheyev can play anywhere up and down the lineup.

Well Mikheyev and Pettersson and Kuzmenko are back together tonight apparently so time will tell if this will now work.

Could see that working; Lafferty's pretty much a north-south skater and he can forecheck for his linemates and let them do their magic.

 

[dustybreaks]

I wouldn't be surprised if last season was a flash in the pan and he continues he current lack of production.

You’d be right. He wasn’t going to ever sustain that shooting percentage.

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

I think your information is out of date. The Capitals are third in the east, and they're doing it with contributions from a bunch of players who are under 27.

Selling Wilson makes no sense for a team with a .633 points percentage.

That doesn’t mean their window isn’t closing. Ovi, Backstrom, Carlson, Wilson etc etc are all starting to get older and there isn’t much coming through high end prospect wise. No way they come out of the East in the next 3 years and by that time your assets are no longer assets, they are Cap problems.

 

[Petes2424]

Lol you should at least watch players if you're going to make such definitive statements about their play. This is a load of nonsense.

This is a guy with 17 points in 29 games played. Everyone likes to talk about his shooting percentages and averages in relation to his counting stats while ignoring that he only plays 15 minutes a game. He playd 16 a game last year.

Some of his best performances both last year and this have been with Kuzmenko on the 3rd or 4th line. The idea that he hasn't been tough enough to play in the tough areas reeks of the old euro/Russian stereotypes.

Kuzmenko's issue hasn't been that he plays too perimeter - its that he doesn't understand his role as an F1 on the forecheck. He peels off too much rather than pressuring to aid the players behind him. His defensive effort is better than his defensive understanding but he does not manage the game - he'll make the same creative cross-ice pass to the opposite wing to try and maintain possession even when his team is changing behind him and needs him to just dump it.

The necessity of playing an intelligent team based 200ft defensive game is why he's sitting. The projection of a soft offensive game is entirely your fabrication.

Let’s not try to overcomplicate things. His issues offensively this year COMPARED to last, is very basic stuff. What you’re talking about is nothing new.

Last year, while in the offensive zone, he proved he can score and create from the outside. Teams have now adjusted by pressuring him in the zone. Now it’s up to him to respond.

Like I said, it really is basic stuff. He needs time/space to do his damage. Take that space away, he’s going to have to find a new level in his game, or he’ll be back in Russia, because he doesn’t offer anything else.

This issue isn’t unique to Kuzmenko either. Just look at the point leaders in the KHL. Most had the same exact problem in the NHL. Some even had initial success too. The problem is NHL dmen can play a high pressure game, unlike in the KHL. Once NHL dmen took that space away, they became very one dimensional. He’s suffering from that right now. The scouting report is out on him.

You could deal with the big drop in production, if he played a well rounded game. He just doesn’t.

 

[ohnoeszz]

Let’s not try to overcomplicate things. His issues offensively this year COMPARED to last, is very basic stuff. What you’re talking about is nothing new.

Last year, while in the offensive zone, he proved he can score and create from the outside. Teams have now adjusted by pressuring him in the zone. Now it’s up to him to respond.

Like I said, it really is basic stuff. He needs time/space to do his damage. Take that space away, he’s going to have to find a new level in his game, or he’ll be back in Russia, because he doesn’t offer anything else.

This issue isn’t unique to Kuzmenko either. Just look at the point leaders in the KHL. Most had the same exact problem in the NHL. Some even had initial success too. The problem is NHL dmen can play a high pressure game, unlike in the KHL. Once NHL dmen took that space away, they became very one dimensional. He’s suffering from that right now. The scouting report is out on him.

You could deal with the big drop in production, if he played a well rounded game. He just doesn’t.

The bolded is all made up. You are talking about a player that did most of his damage around the net.

 

[ViD]

Are the Canucks stupid ? Why do they keep benching him ?

 

[Canucks LB]

Are the Canucks stupid ? Why do they keep benching him ?

It’s not all about goals

He has been much better today, he is battling this year, especially defensively he has been questionable

 

[Kshahdoo]

It’s not all about goals

He has been much better today, his battling this year, especially defensively has been questionable

Like he's the only defensively questionable player on the team. They played for 2 min vs empty nets, good chance to score a hatty and boost confidence for Kuzmenko, but it looks like Tocchet didn't want to boost his confidence. I think they will trade him in the end, or he should ask for a trade because he has no future with this coach...

 

[Huhu]

Like he's the only defensively questionable player on the team. They played for 2 min vs empty nets, good chance to score a hatty and boost confidence for Kuzmenko, but it looks like Tocchet didn't want to boost his confidence. I think they will trade him in the end, or he should ask for a trade because he has no future with this coach...

The Pettersson line was bleeding goals all night for whatever reason. Both Pettersson and Kuzmenko were -2 despite getting 2 pts each; Tocchet had enough of allowing the Sharks to come back into the game (which they did multiple times) and wanted to lock it down.

Kuzmenko was in the middle of the pack in terms of ice-time; if he was trying to screw him over he'd be off the PP.

 

[jackjohnson]

Are the Canucks stupid ? Why do they keep benching him ?

He has been lazy forechecking and backchecking so I kind of understand why he was scratched. Even this game his line was -2 despite scoring. Although I don't want to blame him as petersson was terrible this game and made lazy passes in defensive zone

Let’s not try to overcomplicate things. His issues offensively this year COMPARED to last, is very basic stuff. What you’re talking about is nothing new.

Last year, while in the offensive zone, he proved he can score and create from the outside. Teams have now adjusted by pressuring him in the zone. Now it’s up to him to respond.

Like I said, it really is basic stuff. He needs time/space to do his damage. Take that space away, he’s going to have to find a new level in his game, or he’ll be back in Russia, because he doesn’t offer anything else.

This issue isn’t unique to Kuzmenko either. Just look at the point leaders in the KHL. Most had the same exact problem in the NHL. Some even had initial success too. The problem is NHL dmen can play a high pressure game, unlike in the KHL. Once NHL dmen took that space away, they became very one dimensional. He’s suffering from that right now. The scouting report is out on him.

You could deal with the big drop in production, if he played a well rounded game. He just doesn’t.

You are wrong. His issue is not about offense but more about his play away from the puck. Lack of forecheck and backcheck. He can easily score as you saw tonight and he has 8 goals with so many healthy scratches and limited ice time this season.

 

[Nona Di Giuseppe]

4 players ranked in the top 20 statistically in points (Miller at 3rd, Quinn and Petey tied at 6th, Boeser at 13th), including a puck-moving stalwart on the back end to run things still isn't enough skill?

Also my emphasis was on acquiring more abrasiveness, since we have enough skilled speed to sneak into defensive openings with Garland, Hoglander and Mikheyev but none of them are strong enough on the forecheck to generate turnovers against big defenses consistently. Case in point, I was at the game against VGK where they ran a tight system and their big defenders kept things to the outside, while Hill shut off any dump and chase attempts by cleanly and quickly getting the puck to his D-men. Now if Pietrangelo/ Theodore and co. had to deal with a power forward barreling in on them who can dislodge the puck, they won't be able to make such clean passes in their system that so effectively shut down our offense. The West will probably have to go through Vegas and they have multiple big wings who can create havoc (they screen and tipped down low pretty often, en route to pouring on 44 shots on Demko compared to the 22 we had, and they had more hits than we had shots) so we're going to need to fight fire with fire, since I also don't believe that we've bulked up enough on the forward lines to contend (we're good on the blue line).

Forget points. That's one type of skill. I'm talking about defensively capable forwards.

Defensively skilled forwards >>> Tough guys.

Mgmt is aware of this too. Look at every guy they targeted this off season. It's why Hoglander didn't start with the team, or Podz. Every team needs to ability to ice five guys that can stop the best scorers in the league. Canucks haven't had that since, Kesler, Burrows, Hansen left.

 

[Nona Di Giuseppe]

Let’s not try to overcomplicate things. His issues offensively this year COMPARED to last, is very basic stuff. What you’re talking about is nothing new.

Last year, while in the offensive zone, he proved he can score and create from the outside. Teams have now adjusted by pressuring him in the zone. Now it’s up to him to respond.

Like I said, it really is basic stuff. He needs time/space to do his damage. Take that space away, he’s going to have to find a new level in his game, or he’ll be back in Russia, because he doesn’t offer anything else.

This issue isn’t unique to Kuzmenko either. Just look at the point leaders in the KHL. Most had the same exact problem in the NHL. Some even had initial success too. The problem is NHL dmen can play a high pressure game, unlike in the KHL. Once NHL dmen took that space away, they became very one dimensional. He’s suffering from that right now. The scouting report is out on him.

You could deal with the big drop in production, if he played a well rounded game. He just doesn’t.

this does not check out.

 

[Toby Flenderson]

Guentzel @50% retention for Kuz + 1st

If the rumors are true JG won’t re-sign with us

 

[elitepete]

edit: double post

 

[elitepete]

Like he's the only defensively questionable player on the team. They played for 2 min vs empty nets, good chance to score a hatty and boost confidence for Kuzmenko, but it looks like Tocchet didn't want to boost his confidence. I think they will trade him in the end, or he should ask for a trade because he has no future with this coach...

He is literally the only bad defensive player on the roster. Why does he get a pass to be a bad defender and not forecheck when Elias f***ing Pettersson, a far better and more skilled player, does it? Zero excuses for laziness.

 

[elitepete]

Guentzel @50% retention for Kuz + 1st

If the rumors are true JG won’t re-sign with us

No thanks. Guentzal would be strictly a rental and if we trade a first, it should be for a rhd. We are good at forward.

 

[Kshahdoo]

He is literally the only bad defensive player on the roster. Why does he get a pass to be a bad defender and not forecheck when Elias f***ing Pettersson, a far better and more skilled player, does it? Zero excuses for laziness.

Lol, have you watched all those goals Vancouver let in in the last game? You can blame Kuzmenko in one of them at the very most.

 

[samsagat]

The description made about Kuzmenko is more or less one of an unidimensional offensive winger...


Well, historically NHL GMs are not fond on them.
Particularly when it get close to the playoffs, as players who don't contribute when they're not scoring, and are not elite contributor offensively, aren't sought after commodities for the type of hockey that is played in this period.


Furthermore, he's been scratched multiple times this season.


Kovacevic + Colorado 2024 2nd + Harris


Vancouver gets two youngish NHL blueliners, they save about 3,4 mil on the cap and get a 2nd.

Kovacevic is solid defensively. A classic big steady RHD payed 0.767 mil for 1 more year.
Harris is a young, mobile, versatile (play LD/RD) and smart defensemen.
Both of them will be able to play for cheap next year, as Myers, Zadorov and Cole are all UFAs for Van.

MTL adds offensive talent MSL can work with, as Mtl isn't in a situation to think short term. If Kuzmenko isn't playing a style of hockey suited for the playoffs... who cares. Kuzmenko is a project for MTL.

 

[Cogburn]

Guentzel @50% retention for Kuz + 1st

If the rumors are true JG won’t re-sign with us

That's just not a good deal for Vancouver. You must realize that, right?

 

[WetcoastOrca]

Guentzel @50% retention for Kuz + 1st

If the rumors are true JG won’t re-sign with us

Yikes! No way we pay that for a rental winger.
The top scoring team in the league needs to improve the D way more than adding a winger. And that’s a huge overpay for a rental.

 

[Qwijibo]

The description made about Kuzmenko is more or less one of an unidimensional offensive winger...


Well, historically NHL GMs are not fond on them.
Particularly when it get close to the playoffs, as players who don't contribute when they're not scoring, and are not elite contributor offensively, aren't sought after commodities for the type of hockey that is played in this period.


Furthermore, he's been scratched multiple times this season.


Kovacevic + Colorado 2024 2nd + Harris


Vancouver gets two youngish NHL blueliners, they save about 3,4 mil on the cap and get a 2nd.

Kovacevic is solid defensively. A classic big steady RHD payed 0.767 mil for 1 more year.
Harris is a young, mobile, versatile (play LD/RD) and smart defensemen.
Both of them will be able to play for cheap next year, as Myers, Zadorov and Cole are all UFAs for Van.

MTL adds offensive talent MSL can work with, as Mtl isn't in a situation to think short term. If Kuzmenko isn't playing a style of hockey suited for the playoffs... who cares. Kuzmenko is a project for MTL.

That's way too much to give up for a one dimensional player who had an outlier shooting percentage last year.

 

[Peter Griffin]

The bolded is all made up. You are talking about a player that did most of his damage around the net.

This poster has said the same thing about Kuzmenko several times now, it’s clear he hasn’t watched him play often. Kuzmenko’s bread and butter last year was that he didn’t need a lot of time and space to make things happen, just opportunity. He’s not getting those opportunities this year because he’s not playing the full 200ft game Tocchet demands of all of his players. In limited prime minutes compared to last year he’s on pace for 20+ goals and 50+ points. A couple bounces go his way that haven’t and those projections are easily 30/60.

 

[samsagat]

That's way too much to give up for a one dimensional player who had an outlier shooting percentage last year.

So what?

He's still on pace for a 20 goals/50 pts season.

I mean, Habs have an abundance of defensemen and they'll have to trade some one day, preferably for offensively talented forwards because it's something they lack.

Kovacevic and Harris aren't the ones Habs will build their future with... still they're good but not as good as the defensemen that will be arriving soon from the system.

For me it's the perfect match in terms of respective teams needs and abundance..

Plus the 2nd will be a late one.