Rumor: All Purpose Trade Proposals, Speculation and Rumours - 2023/24

[Atoyot]

Its interesting how other GM’s assess value. Figured Teams would be lined up for C who scored 40+ goals last year. I didn’t realize that Schiefele played some W last year. He’s always seemed like a better player than PLD to me but I don’t watch him as much as you guys obviously.

He played wing for 10 games at most. And even then that feels high.

 

[FlameChampion]

He played wing for 10 games at most. And even then that feels high.

Yeah I thought he played predominantly center but the one poster he played some wing. Figured he would be traded by now but the flat cap had caused some havoc.

 

[Atoyot]

Scheifele is not a winger. He maybe played a game there when Bones was trying to shake up the team. He is a true #1 center though he is offence first type of player. He is still the Jets best overall offensive player at age 30. He is a point per game guy but he is on the wrong side of 30.

Scheifele is a very effective offensive center. He is putrid defensively. If properly used he could feast on other teams' defensively deficient lines, but using him as a #1 center that can match against other teams' top lines is a recipe for disaster. It's what those teams beg for.

 

[KingBogo]

Yeah I thought he played predominantly center but the one poster he played some wing. Figured he would be traded by now but the flat cap had caused some havoc.

It is a bit of a dance because I think the organization is also balancing keeping him if he will re-sign. We have no one close to him replacing #1 Center at this point.

 

[Atoyot]

Yeah I thought he played predominantly center but the one poster he played some wing. Figured he would be traded by now but the flat cap had caused some havoc.

He did, but as a Jets' fan I think he's better suited on the wing. Ideally we can trade him at his value as a center.

 

[KingBogo]

Scheifele is a very effective offensive center. He is putrid defensively. If properly used he could feast on other teams' defensively deficient lines, but using him as a #1 center that can match against other teams' top lines is a recipe for disaster. It's what those teams beg for.

Except the actual impact charts that @Whileee keeps posting shows that Scheifele is our most impactful forward balancing offense and defense. He isn’t actually near as bad as the narrative that has taken hold.

He did, but as a Jets' fan I think he's better suited on the wing. Ideally we can trade him at his value as a center.

He isn’t better on the wing. Now that PLD is gone no one else is even close to being a #1 center.

 

[ps241]

Can I ask a question Jets fans. I don’t follow your media and I haven’t heard much about Schiefele. I assume hes on the trade block? If so, does he have more trade value than PLD did? I would assume he does but surprised I haven’t heard much about rumours?

If Mark just turned 25 Like PLD he would probably have more trade value than Dubois but there is almost 6 years difference in age which is why there was market for Dubois. LA is getting PLD’s prime years and his deal ends at the same age as Mark’s next contract kicks in age wise (give or take one season). It’s kind of comparing apples and oranges now.

 

[Atoyot]

Except the actual impact charts that @Whileee keeps posting shows that Scheifele is our most impactful forward balancing offense and defense. He isn’t actually near as bad as the narrative that has taken hold.


He isn’t better on the wing. Now that PLD is gone no one else is even close to being a #1 center.

Shows that he's more effective in his 700+ games as a center than he is as a winger, which we have less than a 20 game sample size? Yeah, that's not very convincing. He's not the center he was 4 years ago.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Marino really does seem like a great player to target. No NTC yet, young but proven... seems like another DeMelo basically.

But we have Pionk and Schmidt we are most likely stuck with, and DeMelo that is ahead of both.

If we could deal any of our RD that would immediately make so much more sense.

And if I'm NJ... if you have a guy like this to insulate Nemec and possibly even partner with Hughes as he gains experience? That's not a guy I'd be looking to give up. I can see Vanecek + Marino and something smaller but not Holtz being doable.

If we clear our log jam first. And that log jam has been here for more than a calendar year now

Don't have to clear the log jam first. Just clear it.

I don't see Holtz as being a deal breaker. He is developing a little slowly. I've seen some posts by NJD fans wanting to move him. Not that I agree with that but he is not living up to his draft position.

 

[Buffdog]

I can see why everyone wants to dump Scheifele for his defensive limitations. Here's his adjusted 5v5 shot metrics and player card... (Oh, wait, that's budding superstar Tage Thompson)...

Subtext... Jets aren't going to easily replace Scheifele's consistent, top-end scoring and overall contribution.

View attachment 727312View attachment 727313

Scheifele's career, based on xGAR...

View attachment 727314

I think that the pain of the last couple of years of the contract we'd give him to extend is less than the pain of losing him for the next couple of seasons

 

[WpgSteve]

Waiting for someone to jump in and say - "Naah, we don`t need to actually see them in action on the big club. We believe that players develop fully in the AHL and we`re good enough to judge whether they will make it or not just by watching them while they play there".

Why not give me a stretch of games in the NHL? By your logic, there is no other way to tell if I am good enough or not.

 

[Flair Hay]

I

Don't have to clear the log jam first. Just clear it.

I don't see Holtz as being a deal breaker. He is developing a little slowly. I've seen some posts by NJD fans wanting to move him. Not that I agree with that but he is not living up to his draft position.

Don't think Holtz is a deal breaker either. I think you probably getto choose between one of him and Marino, not both.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I

Don't think Holtz is a deal breaker either. I think you probably getto choose between one of him and Marino, not both.

OK, but I think Marino IS a deal breaker. He is something we need. Holtz is not. But I don't see the value without both.

Vanacek is part replacement goalie for us and part cap relief for them so doesn't add up to a big part of the return. Marino is a good 2nd pair RHD on a good contract. He is a significant part of the return but not enough by himself. Holtz is a good, not great, prospect. I think the value is right but I could accept something else instead if NJD wants to hold on to Holtz.

 

[Flair Hay]

OK, but I think Marino IS a deal breaker. He is something we need. Holtz is not. But I don't see the value without both.

Vanacek is part replacement goalie for us and part cap relief for them so doesn't add up to a big part of the return. Marino is a good 2nd pair RHD on a good contract. He is a significant part of the return but not enough by himself. Holtz is a good, not great, prospect. I think the value is right but I could accept something else instead if NJD wants to hold on to Holtz.

Agree on everything there. There may even be a bit of a debate about what has more value

1 year of elite goalie vs 4 years of good 2nd pair D on a good contract

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Agree on everything there. There may even be a bit of a debate about what has more value

1 year of elite goalie vs 4 years of good 2nd pair D on a good contract

If we are looking at Helle as a rental for 1 year, we aren't going to like the return. He has to go somewhere he will sign. NJD are a good candidate for that.

 

[BobTheSolarsystem]

I think the teams with the most to benefit from a Helle trade are Buffalo and Toronto... then NJD

Assuming its a sign and trade if Im Chevy Im asking for
Mittelstadt plus from Sabres
Knies and Liljegren from TO
Nemec from NJD

 

[BobTheSolarsystem]

WHy is everyone trading helle for another goalie All the time. I'll say right now, I don't think he's dealt for another goalie in the package unless u do Edmonton for Holloway or Bourgoult or a RHD prospect and 1stt plus Campbell and run Campbell bro

Campbell has a NTC - and 4 years of Campbell is probably four high draft picks... only way I see an Edmonton trade working is Skinner coming back as part of the package and Campbell going somewhere else - maybe Arizona

I would see another goalie coming back in a Helle trade only as a cap dump to make it work... like Vanecek

Why not give me a stretch of games in the NHL? By your logic, there is no other way to tell if I am good enough or not.

Coyotes are currently searching for your number - but dial up is taking a while...

 

[ecolad]

Why not give me a stretch of games in the NHL? By your logic, there is no other way to tell if I am good enough or not.

I `m sure you missed the sacasm emoji - we agree. I just don`t think the Jets do a particularly good job with evaluating what they really have with young players BEFORE they are forced to make difficult, irrevocable decisions due to waiver requirements. (Especially with D - think Kovacevic and currently Heinola/ Chisholm).

 

[Weezeric]

I `m sure you missed the sacasm emoji - we agree. I just don`t think the Jets do a particularly good job with evaluating what they really have with young players BEFORE they are forced to make difficult, irrevocable decisions due to waiver requirements. (Especially with D - think Kovacevic and currently Heinola/ Chisholm).

Is this why there are all those draft picks the Jets gave up on thriving on other teams???

 

[Been around]

Except the actual impact charts that @Whileee keeps posting shows that Scheifele is our most impactful forward balancing offense and defense. He isn’t actually near as bad as the narrative that has taken hold.


He isn’t better on the wing. Now that PLD is gone no one else is even close to being a #1 center.

Yeah but the stupidity will persist

 

[BobTheSolarsystem]

Jets got a bit trapped in a 'win now' window after the playoff run... my hunch is that TNSE was pushing Chevy to trade for vet D for Pomo/core and lost sight of the draft develop plan...

We really didn't 'develop' anyone from 2018-Pomo's departure except Poolman I guess and that was mostly desperation - Stan and Ves never seized their moments

 

[DRW204]

Really not clear on how Capo outplayed anyone with 14 games at 12 mins TOI - that's not enough sample size for any fancy stats analysis


This is laughable. Kova playing 20-25 mins against top teams - basically thrown to the wolves... but yeah Capo getting sheltered third line minutes is better.

Jets screwed up plain and simple.

Capo given his minutes was better than heinola. Not sure how exactly that's unclear?

Weird how you single that out when ppl want to move Schmidt and Pionk and put heinola in. What makes heinola better

 

[DRW204]

If Cappo was a Jets draft pick this place would be losing their shit over the lack of opportunity he has been given. He is the same age as Kovy with better draft pedigree. He is also a better skater and puck distributor.

Really Not sure why ppl hate on Capo last year. Agree with your jets draft pick premise. Ppl overhype the crap out of prospects.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I think the teams with the most to benefit from a Helle trade are Buffalo and Toronto... then NJD

Assuming its a sign and trade if Im Chevy Im asking for
Mittelstadt plus from Sabres
Knies and Liljegren from TO
Nemec from NJD

I don't think Mittelstadt is a C. He's not on my list at all.

TML don't have ANY cap space. Even after they LTIR Muzzin they are 3.2 over the cap with 22 on the roster and Samsonov to sign. If they wanted to do anything about their goaltending they should have bought out Murray. They should have bought him out anyway.

I'd like Nemec from NJD but I think that is a non-starter. I think we could get Marino and Nemec slides into his spot with NJ.

 

[Flair Hay]

If we are looking at Helle as a rental for 1 year, we aren't going to like the return. He has to go somewhere he will sign. NJD are a good candidate for that.

It sounds like it is the extension that is scaring teams off so far. If he is willing to sign a team friendly extension, that would be huge for us. Something like a $8x5. That adds value to his rental price.

Any longer term for that price and his value is straight up worth more as a rental. I like to try to be open minded about these things... but to me his rental value = his extension value unless he really does us a solid