Player Discussion Alex DeBrincat

[Micklebot]

If he is qualified he just signs the one year deal and walks to UFA....

We better not qualify him then, sounds like a much better idea to just let him become UFA right away...

They are going to try and sign him, if that fails, they will try to trade him, if they can't get a trade done prior to June 15th, they likely elect for arbitration, or if for some reason think his award will exceed 9 mil, qualify him. Then they'll continue to try and trade him.

This is just like people freaking out that Kleven or any other College kid will walk themselves to UFA, people need to stop getting ahead of themselves.

 

[JD1]

Should be fired for this. Why on earth would he sign a long term extension when the only leverage dorion had is now gone.

I think the leverage ends up being signing players that want to be here

If a player a year out from Ufa doesn't want to be here, you don't have any leverage at all.

If DeBrincat doesn't want to sign here... it's pretty simple, he doesn't sign.

If he does want to sign here, there's a discussion to be had

 

[Micklebot]

I think the leverage ends up being signing players that want to be here

If a player a year out from Ufa doesn't want to be here, you don't have any leverage at all.

If DeBrincat doesn't want to sign here... it's pretty simple, he doesn't sign.

If he does want to sign here, there's a discussion to be had

Pretty much,

QO or arbitration is just a means to maintain his rights, it doesn't put us in any worse a position than we are right now if we trying to trade him because he wants to walk himself to UFA.

 

[JD1]

Pretty much,

QO or arbitration is just a means to maintain his rights, it doesn't put us in any worse a position than we are right now if we trying to trade him because he wants to walk himself to UFA.

We've got an up and coming team and by all accounts a very tight group. If he doesn't want to be here....see ya later. Recoup what you can and keep moving forward

The ptsd in here is over the top some times

 

[OD99]

I am a big believer in Ottawa being attractive to players with young families, and believe they will get a contract done.

Add in the trajectory of the team, relative ages, renewed fan support, new ownership, etc...and things seem primed for a good run.

There is also risk on any 1 year deal in a contact sport, so it isn't as easy as just take max contract now and walk to FA.

I say he stays and we are happy and better off for it.

 

[GCK]

Pretty much,

QO or arbitration is just a means to maintain his rights, it doesn't put us in any worse a position than we are right now if we trying to trade him because he wants to walk himself to UFA.

To be fair if he is offered his QO vs team elected arbitration we are screwed.

 

[Golden_Jet]

To be fair if he is offered his QO vs team elected arbitration we are screwed.

Why would be screwed, you can still move him, just need the right fit, especially with cap going up year after.

If arbitration happens AAV is 85-100% of his QO.

 

[Masked]

Keep in mind that he is American, and the record of Canadian teams in keeping American UFAs is mixed. We kept one Tkachuk, while the other didn't want to extend with a Canadian team.

We've locked up both Tkachuk and Norris long term. Matthew not wanting to stay in Calgary likely has more to do with the lack of direction there long term and the lousy travel schedule.

You'll also note that DeBrincat like Tkachuk, Norris, Sanderson, Chychrun and Kastelic has a Canadian parent.

Assen na yo!

 

[Micklebot]

To be fair if he is offered his QO vs team elected arbitration we are screwed.

Well, that assumes he accepts his QO. There's the possibility that he wants to be here long term, but both sides feel it will take past 1 jul to figure out a fair deal. If we qualify him, and he opts not to sign it becauae he wants a deal with term and wants to stay here, we aren't screwed.

That's the type of thing the team might know better than Joe Schmo fans. DeBrincat might want to be here the next 8 years, and we might want to make that happen. If both sides agree about that, a QO could be nothing more than a formality.

 

[GCK]

Why would be screwed, you can still move him, just need the right fit, especially with cap going up year after.

If arbitration happens AAV is 85-100% of his QO.

Try fitting 9M into our cap next year. Bye bye Brannstrom, can’t bring back Formenton, etc…

 

[Samboni]

My guess is that a deal gets done. IMO, there’s too much upside with this team for DeBrincat to not want to be a part of it.

 

[NyQuil]

Bye bye Brannstrom, can’t bring back Formenton, etc…

Brannstrom is replaceable and Formenton may never be coming back anyway.

Not to say that we should or shouldn't sign ADB, but those aren't potentially massive consequences.

 

[GCK]

Well, that assumes he accepts his QO. There's the possibility that he wants to be here long term, but both sides feel it will take past 1 jul to figure out a fair deal. If we qualify him, and he opts not to sign it becauae he wants a deal with term and wants to stay here, we aren't screwed.

That's the type of thing the team might know better than Joe Schmo fans. DeBrincat might want to be here the next 8 years, and we might want to make that happen. If both sides agree about that, a QO could be nothing more than a formality.

If they were negotiating in good faith then club elected arbitration is the safe method to extend the deadline.

 

[Larionov]

Cap space is going to be an issue for a lot of teams next year. The cap is only rising by $1 million, so basically nothing, whereas a lot of teams had hoped and expected it would rise by $4 million or so. The number of teams tight up against the cap this year was insane - something like 27 of 32 within a couple million of the cap, and teams like the Leafs playing Make-A-Wish with their backup goalie situation just to stay compliant. Teams will perform all kinds of cap gymnastics if they really want a guy, but there are a lot of teams who would be out on DeBrincat right from the start simply because there is no way to make the money work...

 

[GCK]

Brannstrom is replaceable and Formenton may never be coming back anyway.

Not to say that we should or shouldn't sign ADB, but those aren't potentially massive consequences.

Putting Debrincat in at 9M gives us 6.28M in cap space with

Tkachuk Stu Giroux
Debrincat Norris Batherson
Greig Kastelic Joseph
Kelly XXX XXX

Chabot Chychrun
Sanderson Zub
XXX XXX

Forsberg
Sogaard

Now try filling out the roster using that 6.2M, and don’t think that Joseph can magically disappear, it would take BIG sweetener to unload the remaining 9.3M on his deal.

 

[NyQuil]

Putting Debrincat in at 9M gives us 6.28M in cap space with

Tkachuk Stu Giroux
Debrincat Norris Batherson
Greig Kastelic Joseph
Kelly XXX XXX

Chabot Chychrun
Sanderson Zub
XXX XXX

Forsberg
Sogaard

Now try filling out the roster using that 6.2M, and don’t think that Joseph can magically disappear, it would take BIG sweetener to unload the remaining 9.3M on his deal.

Right, ELC ends for Pinto.

I'd turf Hamonic, that's for sure. He'll want more than he can be paid.

Bridge contracts for Pinto and JBD, Brassard for the same amount as this year.

Pick up some bottom pairing guy on the refuse pile.

 

[Loach]

Well, that assumes he accepts his QO. There's the possibility that he wants to be here long term, but both sides feel it will take past 1 jul to figure out a fair deal. If we qualify him, and he opts not to sign it becauae he wants a deal with term and wants to stay here, we aren't screwed.

That's the type of thing the team might know better than Joe Schmo fans. DeBrincat might want to be here the next 8 years, and we might want to make that happen. If both sides agree about that, a QO could be nothing more than a formality.

If he gets his 9m qualifying offer, how long until he can sign a new contract? Could he do the 9m and then sign a 6 year at 7.75m?...That would be like a 7 year at 7.92. Or something along those lines. Is that a thing?

Try fitting 9M into our cap next year. Bye bye Brannstrom, can’t bring back Formenton, etc…

I forgot about this.

 

[ottawah]

either the player wants to stay here and is willing to negotiate a long term deal, or he doesn't, in which case you trade him before the draft and try to get yourself a first and a blue chip prospect.

The problem is Debrincat did not return that value last year, when he definitely had more value. We are likely to get a late first/early second at this point. I'd sooner wait it out and see if we really are in contention, else a trade at the trade deadline can likely return more.

You have to think if the shoe was on the other foot. Would you give up our first and Grieg for Debrincat today (assuming he was not on our team) with that contract situation? No way. I wouldn't give up either by itself.

 

[GCK]

If he gets his 9m qualifying offer, how long until he can sign a new contract? Could he do the 9m and then sign a 6 year at 7.75m?...That would be like a 7 year at 7.92. Or something along those lines. Is that a thing?


I forgot about this.

If Debrincat is signed to a 1 year deal whether through QO, Arbitration or negotiation, he cannot sign his next deal until January. This could work out but it’s extremely unlikely.

Signed Mark Stone

The problem is Debrincat did not return that value last year, when he definitely had more value. We are likely to get a late first/early second at this point. I'd sooner wait it out and see if we really are in contention, else a trade at the trade deadline can likely return more.

You have to think if the shoe was on the other foot. Would you give up our first and Grieg for Debrincat today (assuming he was not on our team) with that contract situation? No way. I wouldn't give up either by itself.

Debrincat’s trade value for us was at its highest at this year’s TDL when we could have retained 50%. I’m on record as saying at the time he should be moved at the TDL if unsigned. Next most value is at the draft followed by next years TDL.

 

[Loach]

If Debrincat is signed to a 1 year deal whether through QO, Arbitration or negotiation, he cannot sign his next deal until January. This could work out but it’s extremely unlikely.

Signed Mark Stone

Thanks. I was just thinking that they could use the 9m qualifying to lower the cap of his next deal. Do teams do this ever? I guess they just sign the player or trade him.

 

[Micklebot]

If he gets his 9m qualifying offer, how long until he can sign a new contract? Could he do the 9m and then sign a 6 year at 7.75m?...That would be like a 7 year at 7.92. Or something along those lines. Is that a thing?

I don't think there's any limit on how long before you can extend him if he signs his QO.

Not seeing why we'd do what you're suggesting, that would make sense in a scenario where we have lots of cap space next year but want to save in future seasons, next year is a crunch for us...

 

[Loach]

I don't think there's any limit on how long before you can extend him if he signs his QO.

Not seeing why we'd do what you're suggesting, that would make sense in a scenario where we have lots of cap space next year but want to save in future seasons, next year is a crunch for us...

I forgot that part. An interesting idea though....at least it is to me.

 

[Micklebot]

The problem is Debrincat did not return that value last year, when he definitely had more value. We are likely to get a late first/early second at this point. I'd sooner wait it out and see if we really are in contention, else a trade at the trade deadline can likely return more.

You have to think if the shoe was on the other foot. Would you give up our first and Grieg for Debrincat today (assuming he was not on our team) with that contract situation? No way. I wouldn't give up either by itself.

Sure he did, he got 7oa, a 39oa and a 3rd,

7oa is very much a bluechip prospect with some wiggle room, 39oa + a 3rd is pretty close to enough to get you a late 1st in the 28-32 range.

All Depends on what you categorize as Blue chip is suppose

 

[Sun God Nika]

Cap space is going to be an issue for a lot of teams next year. The cap is only rising by $1 million, so basically nothing, whereas a lot of teams had hoped and expected it would rise by $4 million or so. The number of teams tight up against the cap this year was insane - something like 27 of 32 within a couple million of the cap, and teams like the Leafs playing Make-A-Wish with their backup goalie situation just to stay compliant. Teams will perform all kinds of cap gymnastics if they really want a guy, but there are a lot of teams who would be out on DeBrincat right from the start simply because there is no way to make the money work...

Thing is for Debrincat he can get a guaranteed 9M this coming season and when teams get a bump in cap flexibility the following year he can be a UFA. The cat has a ton of leverage tbh.

I also rather not have Debrincat at a 9M cap hit next year. but that becomes complicated because if you don't qualify he becomes a free agent if you qualify he signs and pretty much becomes a little harder to move as a 9M rental when everyone is cash strapped.

 

[DrEasy]

Thing is for Debrincat he can get a guaranteed 9M this coming season and when teams get a bump in cap flexibility the following year he can be a UFA. The cat has a ton of leverage tbh.

I also rather not have Debrincat at a 9M cap hit next year. but that becomes complicated because if you don't qualify he becomes a free agent if you qualify he signs and pretty much becomes a little harder to move as a 9M rental when everyone is cash strapped.

Good! Given that at $9M he has negative surplus value, you take the $9M and use them for better things.