Player Discussion Alex DeBrincat

[Masked]

What other possible scenario can you see happening. If you're him it's a no Brainer.

Sens take him to arbitration instead of a QO. He ends up with a deal of about $8M, either long term or from an arbitration ruling.

Assen na yo!

 

[BondraTime]

Sens take him to arbitration instead of a QO. He ends up with a deal of about $8M, either long term or from an arbitration ruling.

Assen na yo!

Sens need to make the QO first to retain his rights I thought.

QO’s would be useless if teams could just go to arbitration rather than offer the QO.

If DBC turns down the 9 million QO, then they can go to arbitration.

 

[GCK]

8 million for DBC is not smart for the Sens, whatsoever.

Not sure any team will give him 8 million. He’s not an 8 million dollar player.

After watching him for a full season I’d be hard pressed to go over 7.5M and that includes the Ottawa tax.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Depth is lacking cause norris can't stay healthy and Formenton is part of an investigation. We lost both Pinto and Formenton on the 3rd line cause of that. We also got rid of Brown and Paul. Depth is not a DBC issue. Its a GM issue

Oh I though Roster construction was DBC's responsibility.. my bad

 

[Masked]

Sens need to make the QO first to retain his rights I thought.

QO’s would be useless if teams could just go to arbitration rather than offer the QO.

If DBC turns down the 9 million QO, then they can go to arbitration.

They don't need to make the QO first.

2. Team Elected Arbitration​

If the team initiates salary arbitration, known as a “club election” under the CBA, the process is a little different. The team has two different scenarios to which it can elect to take a player to salary arbitration.

a. No Qualifying Offer​

The first scenario is when a team doesn’t tender a Qualifying Offer to a Group 2 RFA. A Group 2 RFA is a RFA coming off an entry level deal that did not “defect” and go play out his RFA years in another league. In addition, the RFA must have received a base salary, including bonuses, in excess of $1,750,000 (or the applicable minimum salary requirements as provided in the CBA) during the last year of his most recent contract.
The team makes this arbitration election instead of making a Qualifying Offer to that player. However, the player may still sign an Offer Sheet prior to 5:00 p.m. EST on July 5th (or the modified date under the MOU). Signing an Offer Sheet at that time voids the salary arbitration process. The parties must then follow the CBA’s procedures regarding Offer Sheets. The team must make this election by the later of June 15th or 48 hours after the Stanley Cup final ends. The arbitrator cannot award less than 85% of the player’s aggregate salary including bonuses he received in his final year.

9c93ab72-b0cb-4706-96bf-9f5be09e507a

beyondtheglasshockey.com

I believe this was done with Matthew Tkachuk last year.

Assen na yo!

 

[Icelevel]

I'm not paying DeBrincat based on what he did several seasons ago. I'm looking at what he did this season, to a lesser extent what he did last year, and to an even lesser extent what he did two seasons ago.

Fiala has been a similar quality player for at least 2 seasons before this one, but his numbers didn't necessarily reflect how good he is because he played on Minnesota's 2nd line beside worse players as the line driver, while DeBrincat is the opposite since has played shotgun beside a 1st ballot HOFer.

Right. Are we paying him to play for Chicago or for Ottawa?
You pay the player based on what he does and expect him to do for you.
If that doesn’t work for the player then it’s not a good fit and you say gbye

 

[BondraTime]

They don't need to make the QO first.

2. Team Elected Arbitration​

If the team initiates salary arbitration, known as a “club election” under the CBA, the process is a little different. The team has two different scenarios to which it can elect to take a player to salary arbitration.

a. No Qualifying Offer​

The first scenario is when a team doesn’t tender a Qualifying Offer to a Group 2 RFA. A Group 2 RFA is a RFA coming off an entry level deal that did not “defect” and go play out his RFA years in another league. In addition, the RFA must have received a base salary, including bonuses, in excess of $1,750,000 (or the applicable minimum salary requirements as provided in the CBA) during the last year of his most recent contract.
The team makes this arbitration election instead of making a Qualifying Offer to that player. However, the player may still sign an Offer Sheet prior to 5:00 p.m. EST on July 5th (or the modified date under the MOU). Signing an Offer Sheet at that time voids the salary arbitration process. The parties must then follow the CBA’s procedures regarding Offer Sheets. The team must make this election by the later of June 15th or 48 hours after the Stanley Cup final ends. The arbitrator cannot award less than 85% of the player’s aggregate salary including bonuses he received in his final year.

9c93ab72-b0cb-4706-96bf-9f5be09e507a

beyondtheglasshockey.com

I believe this was done with Matthew Tkachuk last year.

Assen na yo!

DBC isn't a group 2 RFA coming off an ELC

Tkachuk was given a QO, he just never signed it. Filed for Arbitration a few weeks after they sent the QO.

If we don't send him the 9 million QO, he becomes a UFA July 1st-ish

 

[Masked]

DBC isn't a group 2 RFA coming off an ELC

Tkachuk was given a QO, he just never signed it. Filed for Arbitration a few weeks after they sent the QO.

If we don't send him the 9 million QO, he becomes a UFA July 1st-ish

You're right about Tkachuk. But a QO isn't required. The CBA is not exactly easy reading but a relevant section:

In the event a Prior Club fails to make a Qualifying Offer as set forth in this Section 10.2 and fails to elect salary arbitration pursuant to Section 12.3(a), the Player shall immediately become an Unrestricted Free Agent and shall be completely free to negotiate and sign an SPC with any Club, and any Club shall be completely free to negotiate and sign an SPC with any such Player, without penalty or restriction or being subject to any Right of First Refusal, Draft Choice Compensation, or any other compensation or equalization obligation of any kind.

Note the two conditions must be met for a group 2 to become a UFA.

Assen na yo!

 

[BondraTime]

You're right about Tkachuk. But a QO isn't required. The CBA is not exactly easy reading but a relevant section:

In the event a Prior Club fails to make a Qualifying Offer as set forth in this Section 10.2 and fails to elect salary arbitration pursuant to Section 12.3(a), the Player shall immediately become an Unrestricted Free Agent and shall be completely free to negotiate and sign an SPC with any Club, and any Club shall be completely free to negotiate and sign an SPC with any such Player, without penalty or restriction or being subject to any Right of First Refusal, Draft Choice Compensation, or any other compensation or equalization obligation of any kind.

Note the two conditions must be met for a group 2 to become a UFA.

Assen na yo!

If we don't offer DBC a QO, he absolutely becomes able to speak with other teams immediately. We can still bring him to arbitration, but he's allowed to seek contracts with other teams.

We'd have a full month+ where DBC can talk with, and sign for 8.5 million with whomever for a late 1st, late 2nd and late 3rd, or the Sens are stuck with him at 8.5 x 7, which would not be good

Same as with Stone, he will very likely be sent his QO, obviously his Arbitration case was much more difficult.

 

[Alex1234]

What? Who thinks that?

Some people here thinks are window is the next 8 years
It’s not
Playoffs with and without Giroux would 2 very very different PO runs for these kids

But we are not there yet

 

[Masked]

If we don't offer DBC a QO, he absolutely becomes able to speak with other teams immediately. We can still bring him to arbitration, but he's allowed to seek contracts with other teams.

We'd have a full month+ where DBC can talk with, and sign for 8.5 million with whomever for a late 1st, late 2nd and late 3rd, or the Sens are stuck with him at 8.5 x 7, which would not be good

He can speak with other teams if we do offer him a QO. We cannot stop him from speaking with other teams if we don't have him under contract.

If a team wants to pay him $8.5M long term I don't like their chances of giving us a late 1st.

Assen na yo!

 

[Alex1234]

8 million for DBC is not smart for the Sens, whatsoever.

Not sure any team will give him 8 million. He’s not an 8 million dollar player.

Fiala, Robertson and Connor all make less than 8MM$ and are better

 

[BondraTime]

He can speak with other teams if we do offer him a QO. We cannot stop him from speaking with other teams if we don't have him under contract.

If a team wants to pay him $8.5M long term I don't like their chances of giving us a late 1st.

Assen na yo!

I don't think he's worth 8 million, but a team like Carolina, with a gigantic amount of cap space and no big players to sign, a need for a scoring winger that they have been actively looking for, a history of offer sheets, and all necessary picks, would be more than fine giving up what would very likely be late picks for DBC.

 

[HSF]

Fiala, Robertson and Connor all make less than 8MM$ and are better

two of those are rfa contracts so they can't be compared


Fiala makes close to 8.

 

[Masked]

I don't think he's worth 8 million, but a team like Carolina, with a gigantic amount of cap space and no big players to sign, a need for a scoring winger that they have been actively looking for, a history of offer sheets, and all necessary picks, would be more than fine giving up what would very likely be late picks for DBC.

You're right about Carolina in the short term. Long term they have guys they need to lock up.

But if a team wants to overpay for an RFA and the player is willing to sign the offer sheet, there's not much any team can do. Carolina doesn't really strike me as a team that's willing to overpay for a player. That's why they have so much cap space.

Assen na yo!

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

That 2nd line's play has been bad.. I'd like to say inconsistent but its been bad.
DCat is a part of that. He isn't giving it anywhere near what he did earlier in the year.

 

[Big Muddy]

I never liked the short term nature of the Debrincat trade. It was a one year deal with a potential 2nd year with complications in that 2nd year. Being impatient can often have drawbacks & negative consequences.

After reading through the recent posts, I guess we are hoping for a team like Carolina to come knocking with an offer sheet.

And as an aside (mostly), Debrincat has been pretty invisible lately.

 

[HSF]

8 million for DBC is not smart for the Sens, whatsoever.

Not sure any team will give him 8 million. He’s not an 8 million dollar player.

I think ottawa will have to pay a tad bit more than 'market value' due to the market we are in

price of doing business in ottawa imo

 

[sennysensen]

I predict that The Cat is paid $9 mil for next year. It's not the end of the world to overpay a guy $2 million for 1 year.

Then traded at the deadline for a 1st and 3rd round pick, as I expect his production to be higher next season being a pre-UFA year and all.

 

[BondraTime]

I think ottawa will have to pay a tad bit more than 'market value' due to the market we are in

price of doing business in ottawa imo

Should absolutely move him if that's the case

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

I predict that The Cat is paid $9 mil for next year. It's not the end of the world to overpay a guy $2 million for 1 year.

Then traded at the deadline for a 1st and 3rd round pick, as I expect his production to be higher next season being a pre-UFA year and all.

I would say if its Dorion calling it, that's what they do. It would be a bad decision with not 0 risk.

 

[Alex1234]

two of those are rfa contracts so they can't be compared


Fiala makes close to 8.

I dont dispute that
My point stands though
He is absolutly not worth more than 7.5MM$

 

[Sens9292]

I never liked the short term nature of the Debrincat trade. It was a one year deal with a potential 2nd year with complications in that 2nd year. Being impatient can often have drawbacks & negative consequences.

After reading through the recent posts, I guess we are hoping for a team like Carolina to come knocking with an offer sheet.

And as an aside (mostly), Debrincat has been pretty invisible lately.

Invisible for majority of the season, a few games he went on a little hot streak

 

[GCK]

Out of our top 6 forwards and top 4 D, Debrincat and Chabot stand out as softer players. I wouldn’t be opposed to moving them and replacing with grittier cheaper players. Obviously finding another top 4 RD is tough, but we just need steady not flashy. Replacing Debrincat could be as easy as signing Formenton.

 

[Big Muddy]

Invisible for majority of the season, a few games he went on a little hot streak

His 5 on 5/even strength play has not been stellar, that's for sure.