GDT: 2024 Draft Discussion

[SantosHalper]

I would imagine that every team has scout's watching USDP but what about the local hockey programs? Belle Tire(Connor, Werenski, Larkin, Krug, Coleman), Little Ceasars(Robertson, Trocheck, Oleksiak, L.Hughes, Kaliyev), Compuware(Trouba, Copp, Gauthier, Noesen, Cotter, Zucker), Victory Honda(DeBrincat, Roy, Cole), Honeybaked(Kane, Rust, Motte, Fowler, Joshua, McCarron), Oakland Grizzlies(Norris).

Lot of local kids and kids across the USA comes through those programs, if there was a scout who simple just writes names up and passes them forward to the scouts where ever these kids go to play next. Not every gets in the USDP, maybe Wings could have better view of the kids who got rejected by the USDP.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

I would imagine that every team has scout's watching USDP but what about the local hockey programs? Belle Tire(Connor, Werenski, Larkin, Krug, Coleman), Little Ceasars(Robertson, Trocheck, Oleksiak, L.Hughes, Kaliyev), Compuware(Trouba, Copp, Gauthier, Noesen, Cotter, Zucker), Victory Honda(DeBrincat, Roy, Cole), Honeybaked(Kane, Rust, Motte, Fowler, Joshua, McCarron), Oakland Grizzlies(Norris).

Lot of local kids and kids across the USA comes through those programs, if there was a scout who simple just writes names up and passes them forward to the scouts where ever these kids go to play next. Not every gets in the USDP, maybe Wings could have better view of the kids who got rejected by the USDP.

The kids that get rejected by the NDTP will land in the USHL and the CHL. They don't exactly fall off of the face of the earth.

 

[Holden Caufield]

. I do think, however, our geographic proximity to the program may actually be hurting us because it results in a certain amount of overexposure to the NDTP kids over two years. If you watch a kid a ton, you run the risk of fault finding after a certain point and you find yourself looking for something new and better.

Exactly, Hakan swears by this theory.
He only scouts a prospect a handful of times and says anything more is suboptimal… for the reasons you stated.

Also CSB mid term ranking should be released very soon, maybe Friday ?
I think they were made available Jan 13th last year.

 

[SantosHalper]

The kids that get rejected by the NDTP will land in the USHL and the CHL. They don't exactly fall off of the face of the earth.

No they don't but they may not instantly thrive where ever they land. Some of them might be so raw that they slip through the cracks but if our scout has seen them play since they were 13/14 years old, then we should have the edge.

I believe that's how Mazur got drafted, Draper's neighbours kid who Draper coached when he was 12. Seems like a good pick now, everyone was cursing Draper to hell when Wings drafted him.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

No they don't but they may not instantly thrive where ever they land. Some of them might be so raw that they slip through the cracks but if our scout has seen them play since they were 13/14 years old, then we should have the edge.

I believe that's how Mazur got drafted, Draper's neighbours kid who Draper coached when he was 12. Seems like a good pick now, everyone was cursing Draper to hell when Wings drafted him.

That is probably more of a coincidence than anything. Mazur was playing on the top line of Tri City next to Matthew Knies during the year he was drafted. He was out in the open for everyone to see. What you do at 18 is far more relevant than what you did at 14 in terms of NHL drafting. That said, the hockey world is small and kids develop reputations for the wrong reasons pretty quickly. If anything, that is why you would want to know what is going on in youth hockey.

 

[WF19]

just draft for high end skill for once

Agreed and Goalies. Never have enough goalie prospects. Look at all the teams scrambling for a tendy. Go full monopoly on the goalie front.

 

[Henkka]

NTDP is also problematic, because those guys will benefit on great chemistries on superior team, and at some point that could be misleading.

They look better than they really are.

 

[SantosHalper]

That is probably more of a coincidence than anything. Mazur was playing on the top line of Tri City next to Matthew Knies during the year he was drafted. He was out in the open for everyone to see.

Mazur was overaged when he was drafted. Players picked in 2020 from the 4th round to 7th were Sam Stange, Jan Bednar, Alex Cotton, Kyle Aucoin, Kienan Draper and Chase Bradley and right now Mazur is looking better than anyone of them. He is also looking better than the 3rd round picks Donovan Sebrango and Eemil Viro, and 2nd round picks Niederbach and Hanas.

Wings could have used the information what they had, a one year prior and pick Mazur instead of Cotton/Aucoin for example. Then could have picked someone else with the 3rd round pick in 2021.

What you do at 18 is far more relevant than what you did at 14 in terms of NHL drafting.

Writing down a name on a piece of paper doesn't cost money. Some kids just might not succee when is their draft year, but they been highly succesful before. Scouts watch hundreds of games and if the name pops up 4 years later, then why not use the earlier information. Especially in the later rounds.

Mazur scored 78 points in 67 games, 43 of them were goals when he was 15. Then when was 16 he scored 65 points in 60 games, 35 goals. At that point scout should have written down Mazur, Carter, to his notebook. Checks up him, "he goes to USHL, next year" and passes the name to the USHL scout.

Draft year comes Mazur doesn't click instantly, a bit of a down year. 47 games and 13 points, -19. Draft day comes and Wings waste a pick on his teammate Kyle Aucoin, a small and not very offensive defenseman. By then Wings scout should have said "hey this kid Mazur was scoring goals left and right when he played in Little Ceasars, why not him instead?"

That said, the hockey world is small and kids develop reputations for the wrong reasons pretty quickly. If anything, that is why you would want to know what is going on in youth hockey.

Hockey world is indeed small and i think that's why you should dig deeper. And if you are scouting local U15-U16 hockey programs, i think you are going to be well aware what is going on in youth hockey.

 

[Frk It]

Mazur was overaged when he was drafted. Players picked in 2020 from the 4th round to 7th were Sam Stange, Jan Bednar, Alex Cotton, Kyle Aucoin, Kienan Draper and Chase Bradley and right now Mazur is looking better than anyone of them. He is also looking better than the 3rd round picks Donovan Sebrango and Eemil Viro, and 2nd round picks Niederbach and Hanas.

Wings could have used the information what they had, a one year prior and pick Mazur instead of Cotton/Aucoin for example. Then could have picked someone else with the 3rd round pick in 2021.

Writing down a name on a piece of paper doesn't cost money. Some kids just might not succee when is their draft year, but they been highly succesful before. Scouts watch hundreds of games and if the name pops up 4 years later, then why not use the earlier information. Especially in the later rounds.

Mazur scored 78 points in 67 games, 43 of them were goals when he was 15. Then when was 16 he scored 65 points in 60 games, 35 goals. At that point scout should have written down Mazur, Carter, to his notebook. Checks up him, "he goes to USHL, next year" and passes the name to the USHL scout.

Draft year comes Mazur doesn't click instantly, a bit of a down year. 47 games and 13 points, -19. Draft day comes and Wings waste a pick on his teammate Kyle Aucoin, a small and not very offensive defenseman. By then Wings scout should have said "hey this kid Mazur was scoring goals left and right when he played in Little Ceasars, why not him instead?"

Hockey world is indeed small and i think that's why you should dig deeper. And if you are scouting local U15-U16 hockey programs, i think you are going to be well aware what is going on in youth hockey.

You don’t think we are already doing a lot of this?

Draper said Jesse Wallin has seen Danielson play since he was 14 and knows his family. That wasn’t just a one off thing with Mazur.

But this is kind of a double edge sword, to Rzombos point. A lot of kids that are dominant at 13/14 will fall by the wayside by the time they are 17/18.

 

[Frk It]

As much as I am trying to sell myself on the forwards, realistically I think if we are picking in the 10-20 there are probably going to be better quality players available at defense than at forward.

A guy like Parekh would usually be a top 3 defenseman in their draft class IMO, but might be sitting there in the 10-20 range. Similar story with Buium. Potentially similar story with Yakemchuk or Jiricek.

 

[SantosHalper]

You don’t think we are already doing a lot of this?

Draper said Jesse Wallin has seen Danielson play since he was 14 and knows his family. That wasn’t just a one off thing with Mazur.

I didn't know this. Good that they digging deep.

But this is kind of a double edge sword, to Rzombos point. A lot of kids that are dominant at 13/14 will fall by the wayside by the time they are 17/18.

Not in my opinion, they could have a bad year when it's their draft year, too much pressure or small role etc. I think it would be short sized to write someone off because of it, if he has thrived for 3 years before. If they have followed someone for 4 years, they have all the necessary info on him.

 

[newfy]

Yzerman and Draper were in Sarnia last night watching the Sting play the Knights. Dickinson in London is the only really high projected pick out there. For the people who hated the Mazur and Bertuzzi picks though, Jiri Ficshers kid plays in Sarnia and was projected to be a fairly high pick this year but the sting are ass and its probably not helping him.

I had an invite to watch in a box last night too that I passed up, could've met them, oh well

 

[Frk It]

Yzerman and Draper were in Sarnia last night watching the Sting play the Knights. Dickinson in London is the only really high projected pick out there. For the people who hated the Mazur and Bertuzzi picks though, Jiri Ficshers kid plays in Sarnia and was projected to be a fairly high pick this year but the sting are ass and its probably not helping him.

I had an invite to watch in a box last night too that I passed up, could've met them, oh well

Fischer in round 2 would be a nice pick, IMO.

 

[newfy]

Fischer in round 2 would be a nice pick, IMO.

I was just looking at elite prospects top 96 for this year and was surprised he isnt on it. Going into the year some people had him projected top 15.

I've only made it to one game of theirs this year but hes got his Dads height, just needs to fill out more. Really good skater and smooth looking out there

 

[Frk It]

I was just looking at elite prospects top 96 for this year and was surprised he isnt on it. Going into the year some people had him projected top 15.

I've only made it to one game of theirs this year but hes got his Dads height, just needs to fill out more. Really good skater and smooth looking out there

Maybe this year we get the familiar name draft:

Rd1: Howe
Rd2: Fischer
Rd3: Zetterberg

 

[norrisnick]

Maybe this year we get the familiar name draft:

Rd1: Howe
Rd2: Fischer
Rd3: Zetterberg

How badly do things need to go sideways for an Eiserman to get added?

 

[Frk It]

How badly do things need to go sideways for an Eiserman to get added?

My initial thought is really bad or we need some big time lottery luck. But it's also kind of hard to say how you should rank the players in that 2-6 range in this draft. Some people feel Eiserman is kind of a one trick pony as far as just being a scorer. Not sure I agree with that. But I also am very high on Demidov, Levshunov, Dickinson, etc. And then some people really like this giant Russian defenseman, but I really don't know a damn thing about him.

 

[Barry Amsterdam]

if we draft 10-20 any buium is there and we don’t pick him in punching a baby

 

[Frk It]

if we draft 10-20 any buium is there and we don’t pick him in punching a baby

If I could put my Henkka tinfoil hat on for a second, I'd tell you the only reason we ever drafted Shai Buium and LDN was really so could we acquire valuable information on their brothers.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Maybe this year we get the familiar name draft:

Rd1: Howe
Rd2: Fischer
Rd3: Zetterberg

This is what happens when you reach the end of franchise mode in EA Sports NHL 2004. Random generated prospects with old hockey player names.

That said, I wouldn't be mad at this draft.

 

[Frk It]

This is what happens when you reach the end of franchise mode in EA Sports NHL 2004. Random generated prospects with old hockey player names.

That said, I wouldn't be mad at this draft.

I don't know much about Howe, but collectively I like that group of forwards from the WHL this year.

Ideally I'd love to get Catton or Iginla.

 

[Murmansk16A]

If I could put my Henkka tinfoil hat on for a second, I'd tell you the only reason we ever drafted Shai Buium and LDN was really so could we acquire valuable information on their brothers.

And Evgeny Svechnikov . . .

 

[Holden Caufield]

Might be checking out Sam O’Reilly aswell at the LON/SAR game. He is a big riser right now.

He has been on fire and scored again last night. Good skater and 200 foot player. A lot to like there.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

I don't know much about Howe, but collectively I like that group of forwards from the WHL this year.

Ideally I'd love to get Catton or Iginla.

I'd venture as many as 6 defensemen go in the top 10 this year. With the success of guys like Makar, Hughes, Heiskanen and others in the modern mobile defender mould I would imagine several teams looking to draft guys that can run their transition game and powerplays.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Here's an under the radar kid that might be worth a look.

Noel Fransen - D - Farjestad
Scored his first SHL goal recently.



Here's a better look.



This kid has a shot from the blueline.

Here's a bit more about Noel Fransen.

https://thehockeynews.com/news/2024...n-celebrini-noel-fransen-and-nikita-artamonov

Noel Fransen, LHD, Farjestad Jr. (J20 Nationell), 6-foot, 179 pounds​

Oct. 15, 2023, vs. Oskarsthamn Jr. - Playing against one of the lesser teams in the J20, Fransen put his full skill set on display and absolutely stood out in this game.

Defensively, the young Swede was instinctual in reading his opponent’s rush and cutting off the play or keeping an attacker to the outside. His stick was precise when poking the puck away, using his feet to keep up with the attacker to ensure he wouldn’t get his stick tangled up in their feet.

When defending in the zone, his mobility and anticipation were evident almost every time. He cut off lanes to the net, angled players to the outside and consistently closed on puck carriers.

His ability to quickly identify passing options on the breakout while eluding pressure is a major asset in his game, and he showcased it consistently in this game. Fransen was a willing and able puck carrier, using his high-end edge work to weave through traffic in the neutral zone and safely work the puck into the offensive zone. Once there, Fransen was a roving attacker who defaulted to the blueline but rarely stayed stagnant in his positioning. His pulsating action on the far side of the offensive zone constantly presented his teammates with a new passing option, and he got under opposing defenders to gain body position off the puck.

When the puck was on his stick, he was constantly in motion to open up passing lanes for himself. If presented with a skating lane toward the slot, Fransen attacked the space and got himself into a high-to-medium danger shooting position rather than settling for low-danger shots from high in the zone.

He scored a goal on the power play in which he crept into space on the lower half of the left faceoff circle and received a pass. He moved laterally up to the inside hashmark to present as a shooting threat while moving and then sniped the puck as soon as an opening presented itself in the goalie's movement.

Both of his assists in this game were secondary assists from his activity in transition, acting as a bumper and outlet option before finding a streaking teammate with a crisp pass.

Fransen’s ability to affect the game positively in all three zones, incorporating intelligent defending with creative passing and playmaking, could make him one of the most exciting players to watch throughout this draft season. At this point, he is a clear first-round talent through multiple viewings.