Hawkaholic
Registered User
I'd rather have
McDavid (12.5mil) and a 4.5mil player = 17mil
than
Eichel (10mil) and Nylander (7mil) = 17mil
2023 NHL Draft situation
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McDavid (12.5mil) and a 4.5mil player = 17mil
than
Eichel (10mil) and Nylander (7mil) = 17mil
Kevin Musto
Hard for Bedard
- Feb 16, 2018
- 23,045
- 29,736
Yeah Yager is around that spot on my list as of now. He's got the upside to be a top 6 forward. Might be better as a winger at the NHL level.
Haven't gotten around to Smith yet.
Kaners Bald Spot
Registered User
I honestly think that part of the reason the Hawks were so dominant is that they were able to build depth because they Didn't have Crosby or Ovechkin. Notice that Crosby didn't win his 2nd and 3rd Cups and Ovi didn't win until their cap hits became more reasonable.
The cap is actually making an argument that you don't want the top players in the league because it's impossible to put a good team around them.
Look at Edmonton and Toronto for examples.
DisgruntledHawkFan
Blackhawk Down
You don't want McDavid is an argument I don't have any time for.
Hawkaholic
Registered User
Name a team that has won the Cup without top players in the league.
Kaners Bald Spot
Registered User
St. Louis in 2019.
You want tier 2 stars vs tier 1 stars IMO. 19 and 88 were tier 2 stars during most of the Hawks window.
Edmonton has the two best forwards in the world and can barely sniff the playoffs most years.
I don't even think it's 100% incompetence. I just think that you can't win with 21M tied up in 2 forwards with an 82M salary cap.
It's not a coincidence that the Hawks took a shit when 19/88 got paid and it would have happened to a lesser degree if 19 didn't get worse as a player.
Watch what happens to Colorado with MacKinnon, Landeskog and Rantanen making as much as they do.
DisgruntledHawkFan
Blackhawk Down
Taking the field over Colorado is a safe bet. Edmonton is a mediocre team with poor management. I can't believe you can look at that team and think McDrai is the problem.
Hawkaholic
Registered User
So 1 team since the Cap was implemented. Toews and Kane weren't tier 2 stars. The Hawks took a shit in 2016 and on because Hossa wasn't the player he was, Toews declined, Seabs declined, Keith declined, and they traded all their good young talent.
Kaners Bald Spot
Registered User
I don't necessarily think that they're THE problem, but I think they're A problem.
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Styles
No Light, No Signal
- Apr 6, 2017
- 8,452
- 13,704
Kaners Bald Spot
Registered User
Yeah, there's a lot of evidence with Pittsburgh, Washington and Edmonton that having too good of players taking up to big of a percentage of cap space is actually detrimental to winning. You could possibly add Toronto to that list. How many years did Pittsburgh and Washington fail in the playoffs? What happened that made it not a big deal anymore? Oh yeah, the cap grew, and Crosby/Ovechkin's long-term deals were suddenly no longer a hindrance to building depth. Talent matters to a certain point, but having 4-5 Tier 2-3 stars is better than having 2 of the best players in the world taking up too much of your salary cap so that you can't afford depth around them.
I think there's going to be a pattern in the NHL, we're seeing it with McDrai and Matthews, and it existed with Ovi as well that tier 1 stars aren't going to win cups until late in their careers when their cap hit is no longer a hindrance on the rest of the rosters.
If anything, McDavid is underpaid but where the salary cap is, I'm not sure anyone is worth 10M, or 12% of the cap.
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DisgruntledHawkFan
Blackhawk Down
Connor McDavid on your team is a problem in your eyes. Alright bud. I disagree and think this is one of your worst takes yet.
Kaners Bald Spot
Registered User
Connor McDavid isn't a problem but Connor McDavid with a 12.5M cap hit is.
Colorado is in some shit with MacKinnon and Makar making what they are too, as good as both players are.
DisgruntledHawkFan
Blackhawk Down
Kaners Bald Spot
Registered User
Maybe it's only a problem because the cap has barely gone up in 6-7 years. If cap growth was as it was pre-2016 maybe it wouldn't be as big of a deal. IIRC the cap has only grown ~3M since then because of the oil price crash affecting the Canadian dollar and COVID-19.
DisgruntledHawkFan
Blackhawk Down
The dude who scored more than two points a game in last year's playoffs wasn't what did Edmonton in. It's a terrible argument.
Kaners Bald Spot
Registered User
It's not the direct effect, but rather the indirect effect that McDavid's cap hit has on the rest of the roster. There's a domino effect.
You guys can think it's ridiculous all you want, but you're completely misunderstanding the argument.
My argument isn't that McDavid is bad undesirable or anything like that. It's just that it's not the ideal way to construct a roster and as good as he is, he alone (or with Drai) can't make up for the deficiencies of having worse teammates.
DisgruntledHawkFan
Blackhawk Down
I understand your argument. I'm not simple and it's not overly complex. I just think it's a terrible argument.
Kaners Bald Spot
Registered User
Ya, and it makes me sad to have to make this argument based on my opinion that the best players should get paid more than they already do, especially in the NHL. I never get mad when a guy gets paid.
DisgruntledHawkFan
Blackhawk Down
Kaners Bald Spot
Registered User
I'm a fan of a system closer to MLB than anything else. Also Don't allow owners in that aren't willing to do whatever it takes to win during a competitive window.
I think the NHL's hard cap sucks because it leads to bullshit like what is happening to McDrai.
DisgruntledHawkFan
Blackhawk Down
CallMeShaft
Elmo is a Nazi
- Apr 14, 2014
- 16,638
- 23,627
McDavid is worth $20m and only being paid 12.5m. The rest of the team is worthy of blame, but certainly not him.
His contract is a steal.
His contract is a steal.
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