2023-24 Roster Thread 3: We Three Flyers

[snoop88]

“We want to get Bonky up here”


Bonky

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

Can't wait for Seeler, Walker and Staal to take the most minutes.

Me either! Bring on the tank!

 

[tnfrs]

Curious on how we see Farabee approach the season in terms of play style.

I personally kind of saw him as a shittier, and worse skating (shocking) Gagne.

Tel me what his actual playing style is, because it seems they have tried to convert him into some sort of power grinder.

Hes just a slightly upgraded Laughton skill wise. Laughton is 3rd/4th line guy, Farabee is a 2nd/3rd line guy but they both do relatively the same job. Farabee still has a few years to improve though and he could legit become a 30 goal guy but he could be a 20 goal a year energy guy

 

[FlyerNutter]

Hes just a slightly upgraded Laughton skill wise. Laughton is 3rd/4th line guy, Farabee is a 2nd/3rd line guy but they both do relatively the same job. Farabee still has a few years to improve though and he could legit become a 30 goal guy but he could be a 20 goal a year energy guy

I mean if thats what he is fine.

I for some reason remember thinking he had more finesse to his game than say Laughton, but I really dont know who the hell Farabee is as a player anymore.

 

[tnfrs]

I mean if thats what he is fine.

I for some reason remember thinking he had more finesse to his game than say Laughton, but I really dont know who the hell Farabee is as a player anymore.

He had more finesse than Laughton but I dont think he was ever considered a great stick handler or playmaker and his shot isnt amazing compared to other players. Laughton is better defensively but Farabee is definitely a better offensive player and shooter

 

[Beef Invictus]

Curious on how we see Farabee approach the season in terms of play style.

I personally kind of saw him as a shittier, and worse skating (shocking) Gagne.

Tel me what his actual playing style is, because it seems they have tried to convert him into some sort of power grinder.

That's just the normal Flyers development process at work. They're trying to make Allison a boards-oriented power grinder too, and in the process are turning a legit bottom six player into nothing. His playstyle completely changed last year into a dump-and-chase mucker who didn't do anything more than banging pucks deeper. We can watch these things happening in real time, and yet people still doubt.

 

[Magua]

A slightly upgraded Laughton? Besides Laughton's career best 49 game season in 19-20, they are in different universes of scoring talent. Farabee outproduced Tippett at 5v5 last season in a down year off neck surgery. His 2 previous seasons, he was 36th (>1000 min) in 5v5 points/60. He was virtually tied with Forsberg, Landeskog, Ovechkin. Outpaced Meier, Guentzel, Scheifele, Connor, Barzal, Aho, and so on. He was also 16th in 5v5 goals/60.

He's been disappointing as a play-driver. His PP work has been disappointing, but the Flyers PP has been catastrophically bad for years, in scoring and chance generation. Good proven players look not good. Personnel decisions are awful. It's worrisome that, from a skill sense, the Flyers' bad processes might be ruining an entire crop of young players on the PP.

 

[tnfrs]

A slightly upgraded Laughton? Besides Laughton's career best 49 game season in 19-20, they are in different universes of scoring talent. Farabee outproduced Tippett at 5v5 last season in a down year off neck surgery. His 2 previous seasons, he was 36th (>1000 min) in 5v5 points/60. He was virtually tied with Forsberg, Landeskog, Ovechkin. Outpaced Meier, Guentzel, Scheifele, Connor, Barzal, Aho, and so on. He was also 16th in 5v5 goals/60.

He's been disappointing as a play-driver. His PP work has been disappointing, but the Flyers PP has been catastrophically bad for years, in scoring and chance generation. Good proven players look not good. Personnel decisions are awful. It's worrisome that, from a skill sense, the Flyers' bad processes might be ruining an entire crop of young players on the PP.

well it sounds like farabee will have no trouble winning that first line spot on the left if hes putting up Ovechkin numbers lol maybe broaden the categories youre using to compare him but nobodys talking about Farabee in the same conversation as those guys and they never have. His injury maybe held him back in 2023 but he'll need to be a wholly different player to be in the same league as Barzal or any of those guys.

 

[freakydallas13]

A slightly upgraded Laughton? Besides Laughton's career best 49 game season in 19-20, they are in different universes of scoring talent. Farabee outproduced Tippett at 5v5 last season in a down year off neck surgery. His 2 previous seasons, he was 36th (>1000 min) in 5v5 points/60. He was virtually tied with Forsberg, Landeskog, Ovechkin. Outpaced Meier, Guentzel, Scheifele, Connor, Barzal, Aho, and so on. He was also 16th in 5v5 goals/60.

He's been disappointing as a play-driver. His PP work has been disappointing, but the Flyers PP has been catastrophically bad for years, in scoring and chance generation. Good proven players look not good. Personnel decisions are awful. It's worrisome that, from a skill sense, the Flyers' bad processes might be ruining an entire crop of young players on the PP.

Can you say they Flyers are ruining young players on the PP when those players haven't failed on a other team's PP though?

Impossible to prove, everyone knows that is the metric.

 

[wasup]

That's just the normal Flyers development process at work. They're trying to make Allison a boards-oriented power grinder too, and in the process are turning a legit bottom six player into nothing. His playstyle completely changed last year into a dump-and-chase mucker who didn't do anything more than banging pucks deeper. We can watch these things happening in real time, and yet people still doubt.

Hey Buddy , be a Flyer lol

 

[deadhead]

A slightly upgraded Laughton? Besides Laughton's career best 49 game season in 19-20, they are in different universes of scoring talent. Farabee outproduced Tippett at 5v5 last season in a down year off neck surgery. His 2 previous seasons, he was 36th (>1000 min) in 5v5 points/60. He was virtually tied with Forsberg, Landeskog, Ovechkin. Outpaced Meier, Guentzel, Scheifele, Connor, Barzal, Aho, and so on. He was also 16th in 5v5 goals/60.

He's been disappointing as a play-driver. His PP work has been disappointing, but the Flyers PP has been catastrophically bad for years, in scoring and chance generation. Good proven players look not good. Personnel decisions are awful. It's worrisome that, from a skill sense, the Flyers' bad processes might be ruining an entire crop of young players on the PP.

Farabee was 20-21 those two seasons, and with a thin frame that needed to fill out.
Last year was an obvious mulligan, he lost a lot of strength after the surgery and wasn't prepared to start the season.

Farabee also missed Couts, he's not a play driver, he's more a complementary player, who has top notch skill in the dirty areas, expecially his hands and shooting (not so much velocity but accuracy and a six sense where to shoot) but needs to add strength to really be effective there, great hands and anticipation.

I expect this could be his breakout season.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Farabee was 20-21 those two seasons, and with a thin frame that needed to fill out.
Last year was an obvious mulligan, he lost a lot of strength after the surgery and wasn't prepared to start the season.

Farabee also missed Couts, he's not a play driver, he's more a complementary player, who has top notch skill in the dirty areas, expecially his hands and shooting (not so much velocity but accuracy and a six sense where to shoot) but needs to add strength to really be effective there, great hands and anticipation.

I expect this could be his breakout season.

I cannot think of a single player you've said has to fill out their frame that actually needed to, or struggled from it. A shitload of skills combine to create effective NHL play and size is just one of them.

Remind me, what was Laughton's production in the NHL when he was 20?

 

[captainpaxil]

I cannot think of a single player you've said has to fill out their frame that actually needed to, or struggled from it. A shitload of skills combine to create effective NHL play and size is just one of them.

Remind me, what was Laughton's production in the NHL when he was 20?

When Laughton was 20 there was quite a few of us puzzled why they were sending him down to get him more time at center when it was pretty clear he was better at wing. Granted he did come back up as a more complete player I just didn't see much need for it

 

[BernieParent]

Can't wait for Seeler, Walker and Staal to take the most minutes.

I'm sorry, but if Farabee can't beat out Seeler, Walker, or Staal for a roster spot, he doesn't deserve to be there.

 

[Striiker]

I cannot think of a single player you've said has to fill out their frame that actually needed to, or struggled from it. A shitload of skills combine to create effective NHL play and size is just one of them.

Remind me, what was Laughton's production in the NHL when he was 20?

2 points in 31 games lol

 

[deadhead]

Can't wait for Seeler, Walker and Staal to take the most minutes.

Well, hope you have a good book while you wait.
Seeler was 6th in D minutes last year.
Walker was 3rd pair in LA, if he's faster due to a year away from ACL surgery, he might get 1st pair minutes by default, at least until the TDL. But only b/c they don't have another RHD for that role, unless you want to see York - Risto.
Doubt Stall will play more than Braun did last season, Braun was probably a better player.

 

[Rich Nixon]

When Laughton was 20 there was quite a few of us puzzled why they were sending him down to get him more time at center when it was pretty clear he was better at wing. Granted he did come back up as a more complete player I just didn't see much need for it

I'm not necessarily discounting the veracity of it or picking on you in particular, but I feel like a lot of people having been trying to pass off "better at wing" as analysis lately. Here's the key thing: Basically every NHL forward is "better at wing." It's an easier position to play.

"Capable at center" is magnitudes rarer than "better at wing." The question is if you have the center depth to pass on deploying the player there (or attempting to develop them as a C). There's enough scarcity in top 9 centers around the league that guys like Kevin Hayes get seven f***ing million dollars some summers.

I saw someone doing this with Frost lately. "He'd be better at wing." Yeah, no shit. But you need centers. So he should be a center unless you have 4 players who do it better.

 

[Curufinwe]

Remind me, what was Laughton's production in the NHL when he was 20?

6 points in 31 games - 5 ESP and 1 PPP. Colaiacovo had 8 in 33.

NHL Stats

The official source for NHL Stats including skaters, goalies, teams stats and more.

www.nhl.com

Interestingly, Laughton did not score another point on the PP until 21-22, and then had 9 last season.

 

[Curufinwe]

Walker was 3rd pair in LA, if he's faster due to a year away from ACL surgery, he might get 1st pair minutes by default

A 3rd pairing dman who averaged 13:39 at ES last season will go to the 1st pairing on his new team if he's slightly faster.

Doubt Stall will play more than Braun did last season, Braun was probably a better player.

Staal averaged 15:35 at ES and played 82 games for a playoff team, and averaged 18:50 at ES in their 21 playoff games.

Braun averaged 13:32 at ES and only played 51 games for the 7th worst team in the league.

 

[Beef Invictus]

6 points in 31 games - 5 ESP and 1 PPP. Colaiacovo had 8 in 33.

NHL Stats

The official source for NHL Stats including skaters, goalies, teams stats and more.

www.nhl.com

Interestingly, Laughton did not score another point on the PP until 21-22, and then had 9 last season.

Very comparable to to Farabee

 

[captainpaxil]

I'm a hockey traditionalist so I see the center position akin to the QB or point guard position where distribution is a primary asset. Hockey IQ is a big part of that and Laughton has a decent amount but he's definitely more of a shooter than a passer. Frost is a more traditional center candidate

 

[deadhead]

I'm a hockey traditionalist so I see the center position akin to the QB or point guard position where distribution is a primary asset. Hockey IQ is a big part of that and Laughton has a decent amount but he's definitely more of a shooter than a passer. Frost is a more traditional center candidate

Depends on your mix of players, if you have wings like Tippett or TK, you need a playmaker at center.
If Brink emerges, he can carry a defense first center who's a good shooter, the way G raised Couts game.
Foerster is still ??? Better playmaker than expected, but good enough to run a line?

Balance of skills, the ideal center is fast, physical, high IQ on defense, can carry the puck in transition and make clean entries into the O-zone, has great vision in the O-zone and is an accurate passer with great anticipation and has a killer wrist shot. Of course, I've just described a hypothetical GOAT.

In the real world, you have to trade off between these qualities.

Center is like CF in baseball, you see if a player can handle it b/c it's harder to find good centers than wings (or good CFs than corner OFs).

 

[renberg]

The Flyers can’t afford to move Frost off of center. They don’t have enough quality players at the position as it is now. Sorry but Cates is not a quality center. He’s a wing playing center because no one else on the present roster can do it better than him. That’s not a good credential for the job. #1 center is SC; #2 is Frost; #3 is Cates by default and could end up being Potulny with the way Torts looks at things or if Briere snags someone in a trade.

 

[Beef Invictus]

The Flyers can’t afford to move Frost off of center. They don’t have enough quality players at the position as it is now. Sorry but Cates is not a quality center. He’s a wing playing center because no one else on the present roster can do it better than him. That’s not a good credential for the job. #1 center is SC; #2 is Frost; #3 is Cates by default and could end up being Potulny with the way Torts looks at things or if Briere snags someone in a trade.

Frost should be the 2C but Tortorella is more likely to plop Cates there. It's nutty.

 

[Flyerfan4life]

Frost should be the 2C but Tortorella is more likely to plop Cates there. It's nutty.

Frost is more likely to be sent packing then ever sniffing 2C.

signed Torts!