Speculation: 2023-24-25 Sharks Roster Discussion

[gaucholoco3]

I suspect Bords will end up in a deal like Merkley was. Swayman isn't worth that sort of price for the Sharks right now. We don't have the depth to make acquiring Pettersson right now worth it either. The team needs to be patient and build through the draft for a couple more years minimum.

You can’t just expect to fill 20 spots with draft picks. It’s able accumulating assets and then using those assets to build the best team possible.

If Pettersson is available then you pay the price to get him.

 

[Hodge]

Yeah if Swayman or Pettersson is available you do everything you can to acquire them. They’re elite cornerstone players.

 

[Celly4Celebrini]

Yeah if Swayman or Pettersson is available you do everything you can to acquire them. They’re elite cornerstone players.

they dont really fit the window. were much further away than i thought. i didnt think i had unrealistic expectations, but i definitely didnt see a 1 gpg average through 9 on the bingo card.

the worst thing would be to buy them, have their value plummet and have them want out/become disinterested in playing here cause we suck.

IMO we need to at least be semi competitive before adding external pieces, which is still 2 years away

 

[gaucholoco3]

they dont really fit the window. were much further away than i thought. i didnt think i had unrealistic expectations, but i definitely didnt see a 1 gpg average through 9 on the bingo card.

the worst thing would be to buy them, have their value plummet and have them want out/become disinterested in playing here cause we suck.

IMO we need to at least be semi competitive before adding external pieces, which is still 2 years away

The window opens when the team decides to start competing. Not getting a cornerstone Goaltender or Franchise 1C just because they are available a year early is just dumb. If either of those players are available you say yes.

 

[jarr92]

The window opens when the team decides to start competing. Not getting a cornerstone Goaltender or Franchise 1C just because they are available a year early is just dumb. If either of those players are available you say yes.

Pettersson I can agree with, but how elite would Swayman look behind the Sharks defense?

 

[LadyStanley]

Sharks looking more and more like a top-tier trainwreck

There's bad and then there's what the 2023-24 San Jose Sharks have been in the early going of the NHL season.

sports.yahoo.com

Pessimism

 

[LadyStanley]

DFO podcast asked the question: are Sharks so bad they are damaging prospect development? Yes was the answer

 

[Hobocop]

DFO podcast asked the question: are Sharks so bad they are damaging prospect development? Yes was the answer

Even if that were true, I'm not really sure what could be done about that at this point. The only prospect that's still up is Eklund, and he's where he needs to be.

Couture coming back will help this team look a little less pathetic. We're still easily going to be the worst team in the league, but I don't expect us to stay averaging one goal a game all season.

 

[Hodge]

DFO podcast asked the question: are Sharks so bad they are damaging prospect development? Yes was the answer

No they aren't. Frank just has a stick up his ass over the Labanc stuff.

 

[Groo]

Sharks fans are doing what they do best - hyping up prospects.

Sharks are doing what they do best - ensuring they don't develop prospects.

Hyping up prospects is the lifeblood of this site. Sharks fans are hardly unique in this

 

[sharski]

It's crazy that Vlasic was drafted by us and has played almost 1250 games only with us and I just wish every day that he wasn't a Shark anymore. Players like that are usually big time fan favourites. The moment he signed his crippling deal, he mailed it in so hard.

Literally the happiest I've ever seen Vlasic throughout all these years

 

[coooldude]

Sharks looking more and more like a top-tier trainwreck

There's bad and then there's what the 2023-24 San Jose Sharks have been in the early going of the NHL season.

sports.yahoo.com

Pessimism

Key quote (last sentence):
The Sharks are more likely to be a doormat enjoyed by opposing fanbases all season than a group of legendary losers remembered for years to come.

tl;dr our expected goals are higher than we've seen, our goaltending is slightly better than league average, and if you project out those things for the rest of the season, author argues we're likely to be worst but not historically bad. Time will tell!

 

[Pinkfloyd]

You can’t just expect to fill 20 spots with draft picks. It’s able accumulating assets and then using those assets to build the best team possible.

If Pettersson is available then you pay the price to get him.

I don't. There's no chance in hell the Sharks would be good enough with Pettersson to do any meaningful competing with him. We couldn't compete with Karlsson. Pettersson can't carry a significantly more talented Vancouver team to the playoffs most years either.

Yeah if Swayman or Pettersson is available you do everything you can to acquire them. They’re elite cornerstone players.

Not when getting them doesn't yield the desired result. All getting both of those two would do is waste future assets on items that won't compensate for our awful blue line and lack of depth up front. Things that will be awfully difficult to address when those two will eat up a lot of available cap space and we have some bad cap we'd have no real way to get rid of. It's just being impatient. We need some elite young players to make it worth chasing that sort of talent.

 

[coooldude]

I don't. There's no chance in hell the Sharks would be good enough with Pettersson to do any meaningful competing with him. We couldn't compete with Karlsson. Pettersson can't carry a significantly more talented Vancouver team to the playoffs most years either.

Not when getting them doesn't yield the desired result. All getting both of those two would do is waste future assets on items that won't compensate for our awful blue line and lack of depth up front. Things that will be awfully difficult to address when those two will eat up a lot of available cap space and we have some bad cap we'd have no real way to get rid of. It's just being impatient. We need some elite young players to make it worth chasing that sort of talent.

Agreed, you start targeting those kinds of players when you already have some of your future in place. You start making trades like Meier to NJD. we aren't ready for that yet. 3 more years to clear the contracts and draft well.

 

[Sendhelplease]

Yeah if Swayman or Pettersson is available you do everything you can to acquire them. They’re elite cornerstone players.

Petterson yes, Swayman no...

 

[spintops]

Couture (especially) and Hertl have stated they want to stay and win here. Do you guys think that changes this year with just how bad we are? I know it's about more then hockey for these guys but if we are sitting at 0-15 I wonder if they change their minds.

 

[weastern bias]

Key quote (last sentence):
The Sharks are more likely to be a doormat enjoyed by opposing fanbases all season than a group of legendary losers remembered for years to come.

tl;dr our expected goals are higher than we've seen, our goaltending is slightly better than league average, and if you project out those things for the rest of the season, author argues we're likely to be worst but not historically bad. Time will tell!

A regression towards our xG per game over our actual goals per game would still have us as a historically bad team

As that article points out our xG for is currently at 2.09 per game, that would only be good enough for the 66th worst of all time rather than the 2nd, still historic for a league that is over 100 years old

The idea that our offense can regress to the mean and restore us to respectability ignores that our goaltending is massively outperforming their xGA, which is just as likely to regress

Our team goaltending has saved 2.52 goals above expected at even strength in 9 games, or an extra goal against every 5 games, it doesn't make any more sense to expect our goaltending to keep playing so well behind this defense than it does for us to expect our offense to start capitalizing in opportunities when we don't have any elite play drivers on the roster

We're dead last in shots on goal per game with 24.6, .1 behind STL, and we're dead last in shots on goal allowed per game with 38.3, 1.8 shots more than MTL, our xG opportunities don't translate to shots on goal but our shots against also aren't translating to an expected amount of goals against, if our metrics regress to the mean we'd roughly meet in the middle right where we are now as one of the worst teams of all time

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Agreed, you start targeting those kinds of players when you already have some of your future in place. You start making trades like Meier to NJD. we aren't ready for that yet. 3 more years to clear the contracts and draft well.

Three years will let us shed the dead weight for the most part. Obviously nothing but helpful but the rebuild will take as long as it needs to in order to either become a deep team of good players or have an elite few to build around. It's taking more and more talent in order to compete and I hope for the team's sake that its management is not short-sighted about what it is they have to do to get competitive realistically.

You take steals where you can get it if it doesn't get in the way of building through the draft. We're not going to rebuild this team through trades and free agency.

 

[Alaskanice]

Couture (especially) and Hertl have stated they want to stay and win here. Do you guys think that changes this year with just how bad we are? I know it's about more then hockey for these guys but if we are sitting at 0-15 I wonder if they change their minds.

I don’t think it changes anything. I’d like to think they have some integrity. Hockey players, in the world of professional sports, tend to be more genuine when they say such things.

 

[Jargon]

If we somehow could get Petterson of course you get him. He speeds up the rebuild — and next year there’s a bit more hope for more help. Guschin likely makes the team, so does Muhk and Thrun. Bystedt might start in the AHL but hopefully he can find a way up to the big club and Eklund will have an extra year.

You then go out and try and make more trades/signings for players that matter and not the carcasses of old guys that are barely in the league. They won’t be a playoff team but they could start looking better. Ideally we get Celebrini this year and then he, Smith and Musty can come in together the year after next and then we’re talking.

The main issue is still D and other than picking BPA with our 1st, I feel like every other pick has to be a swing at a defenseman.

 

[Anomie2029]

Eklund seems to be developing quite well?

Maybe it's time to hold Bordeleau accountable for failing to improve any aspect of his game in the last two years. He fluked into a completely unearned opportunity to start the season thanks to Couture's injury and failed to do anything with it. He was terrible at the end of last season.

Bordeleau is still young and shouldn't be written off entirely but unless you're in his immediate family I don't understand how you can consider him NHL ready at this point.

To be honest with you, I think Eklund should have been further along in his development. I also don’t think anchoring him with a stone-handed winger is helping him develop.

As for Bordeleau, I had him to be in the AHL. I didn’t like his game last year. He has looked a lot better this season. Should he be in the NHL? No. Should he be in the NHL over a Carpenter? Probably. I just don’t think the Cuda is a better development spot than the Sharks at the moment (which is why my original point is that the Sharks are messing up development).

The reality is that with young offensive players, they can’t be scratched every time they make a poor play or have a poor game whilst gifting players like Hoffman games where they are showing constant poor play. If we want strong offensive players, we have to accept during their development they will make mistakes to learn what they can and can’t get away with. Doing otherwise will result in them never becoming NHLers or becoming 3rd/4th liners with no offensive upside.

 

[TheBeard]

If we draft first overall then I’m all for making a huge splash in free agency. If not then I’m waiting next year.

 

[Jargon]

If we draft first overall then I’m all for making a huge splash in free agency. If not then I’m waiting next year.

Is the thought that Celebrini might be ready for the NHL right off the bat?

 

[Skeksis25]

Even if people like Swayman or Peterssen are available, are we really going to be able to come up with the most enticing package? I would imagine multiple teams would jump at the chance to get players like that. I find it hard to believe that a team like NJ who seem like a solid G away from being real contenders would allow us to outbid them for Swayman with all the riches they have. Peterssen, I would think would have even more suitors. What's the best that we could realistically offer for these guys that would tempt their current teams?

 

[WSS11]

Good God. People are talking about blowing up the farm and blowing picks for players who would be past their prime by the time we’re ready to compete. Absolutely terrible idea.