Rumor: 2023-2024 Trade Rumors and Free Agency: Offseason Edition

[Balthazar]

This article won't help us trade Girard

 

[Avs9296]

This article won't help us trade Girard

In the end, there are different ways to win a cup. Avs did it with a relatively "soft" defense that was a possession and transition monster.

In the end they have to be GOOD. They can be big or small but if they are shit then it won't matter. Ideally you need a mix of course.

 

[Balthazar]

In the end, there are different ways to win a cup. Avs did it with a relatively "soft" defense that was a possession and transition monster.

Read the article, plenty of Avs talk.

 

[Mighty Makar]

Keep Toews and trade Girard.

 

[Avs9296]

Read the article, plenty of Avs talk.

I can't its behind a paywall

 

[Balthazar]

I can't its behind a paywall

 

[LOFIN]

Sure, but they'll never, ever, win the cup. Silly me for thinking that it should be every NHL team's goal.

If what you suggest is that they (or some other teams) should just embrace the tank for years, not all teams can afford to do that. They couldn't do that after they signed Gaudreau anyway. Why did they sign him then? Because Columbus is not a free agent destination, and when a star player actually wants to come there, you sign him.

 

[redacted]

It is a bit of a myth the Avs are small and soft. Makar is small, but he's certainly not soft. G is small and soft. Byram, Toews, Manson, EJ, JMFJ, and Dermy are all 6'1" or taller. None of them are soft. A few of them (Manson, EJ, JMFJ, and Dermy) are known to be physical players. Hunt played a lot this year out of necessity and he fits the small/soft... but he's not who the Avs would ideally have.

 

[dmac7719]

Read the article, plenty of Avs talk.

Really, you thought there was plenty of Avs talked. He only mentioned Manson because it fit his bigger is better narrative, nevermind that Manson was like the 4ht-5th best dman of the run.

Where's the section that bigger isn't always better when the smaller players are just so much better than everyone else, ala the Avs best dmen

 

[Balthazar]

Where's the section that bigger isn't always better

Here:

 

[Bender]

If Peeke comes on the market now, Avs should sniff around. Cheap, RD, solid skater, not overly physical but has some in him, more of a 5 but can play up. He'd be really nice insurance for the inevitable Manson injury (and honestly probably pass him on the depth chart anyway).

Probably not with Makar and Manson on the right side already unless Manson is done for next season as well.

If Peeke is more of a 5 as you say, coming in at $2.75M for the next 3 years isn't exactly cheap and probably not how they should manage their cap for their bottom pairing d-men, imo.

 

[redacted]

Here:

And the Wild are clearly a team that doesn't mind small defensemen.

Probably not with Makar and Manson on the right side already unless Manson is done for next season as well.

If Peeke is more of a 5 as you say, coming in at $2.75M for the next 3 years isn't exactly cheap and probably not how they should manage their cap for their bottom pairing d-men, imo.

It wouldn't be penciled in to start, but I'd be shocked if Peeke would end the season below Manson on the depth chart.

2.75m is an improvement compared to the $11m last year!

 

[Cake Malar]

At least one more of these moves are in the pipeline. Probably announced in the next 48 hours... could be as soon as today. I expect it will get similar ire.

Please let it be JTC

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

That Athletic article is a bit hilarious… I don’t even know why they’re trying to include the Avs in that.

You don’t need size on the backend, you need great hockey players and guys who are competitive.

 

[redacted]

That Athletic article is a bit hilarious… I don’t even know why they’re trying to include the Avs in that.

You don’t need size on the backend, you need great hockey players and guys who are competitive.

Like I said in my post above... it is a bit of a myth the Avs are small. The Cup lineup only had Makar below 6'. That whole run only had G and Makar. Beyond them we're all 6'1+"... EJ, Manson, and JMFJ all have some known snarl. Byram, Toews, and Makar are not soft. I'd say the Avs fit the idea of size matters... they are bigger than Florida and pretty similar to Vegas (Makar is the guy who drags the Avs down).

 

[Balthazar]

That Athletic article is a bit hilarious… I don’t even know why they’re trying to include the Avs in that.

You don’t need size on the backend, you need great hockey players and guys who are competitive.

Girard is a good competitive hockey player.

 

[S E P H]

Your hate boner is showing

To me, Provorov is a good deal. Only 2 years (not locked into a bad contract) and they can sell him at the 25 deadline for roughly what they paid. This deal they have a bad contract on the books for 8 years. That’s much worse

@Balthazar is sort of right though. Jarmo can draft with his eyes closed, but he's signed Severson to that contract, signed Gudbranson to whatever you call his deal, has Elvis at 5.4 million, has Laine at 8.7 million (not someone you want to build a team around), somehow paid Roslovic 4 million, has no quality centres, and now has plans to hire Babcock as the head coach. I defended him more than others on here, but it seems that his worst moves are when he has his eyes set on the prize and will get it at all costs. He could've potentially waited and gotten a better player than signed him to that deal, hell I would rather have Provorov at that contract than Damian.

I like Severson, I wanted Avs to draft him over Mitch Heard and he is a valuable defenceman. But not "6.125 million" for "8 years" level of crazy pills good.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

Like I said in my post above... it is a bit of a myth the Avs are small. The Cup lineup only had Makar below 6'. That whole run only had G and Makar. Beyond them we're all 6'1+"... EJ, Manson, and JMFJ all have some known snarl. Byram, Toews, and Makar are not soft. I'd say the Avs fit the idea of size matters... they are bigger than Florida and pretty similar to Vegas (Makar is the guy who drags the Avs down).

Yeah, I agree. I just don’t think there’s a blanket rule. There would be some NHL teams that would look at not just Girard, but Byram and Toews and say they don’t fit their size profile.

Like, Edmonton for instance… they’re size queens on defence. They want every defender to be 6’3-6’5. I wouldn’t say it’s worked out for them.

I wouldn’t want 3 Sam Girard’s, but you can get a lot of utility out of one of them. Just like I wouldn’t want 3 Josh Manson’s, but I can find use for one of them.

Ultimately, I think you need players who are great on both sides of the puck and a lead horse.

 

[redacted]

@Balthazar is sort of right though. Jarmo can draft with his eyes closed, but he's signed Severson to that contract, signed Gudbranson to whatever you call his deal, has Elvis at 5.4 million, has Laine at 8.7 million (not someone you want to build a team around), somehow paid Roslovic 4 million, has no quality centres, and now has plans to hire Babcock as the head coach. I defended him more than others on here, but it seems that his worst moves are when he has his eyes set on the prize and will get it at all costs. He could've potentially waited and gotten a better player than signed him to that deal, hell I would rather have Provorov at that contract than Damian.

I like Severson, I wanted Avs to draft him over Mitch Heard and he is a valuable defenceman. But not "6.125 million" for "8 years" level of crazy pills good.

I'm not saying Jarmo has only made good moves... I'm simply saying there are reasons he's making the moves he is. This Severson deal is real bad, I've commented that... and I said prior whoever signed him would regret it. He's a talented offensive guy, but horrendous defensively. Yet he is a guy who they can run on a middle pairing and help them quite a bit.

The Laine situation is a pretty clear data point as to how this is operating. The team has to stay decent for the organization to survive. They couldn't afford to send PLD for just futures, they needed a guy to help them now and have potential. Laine fits that. I'd never build around him because I hate the way he plays, but I get the appeal of the type of player he is when he is on.

Roslovic is a RFA comparable situation. It was that or arbitration... this is why teams hate arbitration.

Gudbranson is another real stinker of a deal and a bad one. There are rumblings it was a factor on the Gaudreau deal, but I don't think that excuses it.

Merzlikins is an interesting one... when he signed, he was definitely on the upswing and looked every bit the guy he has the talent to be. He's just mentally fallen apart since then. There might be reasons behind it, but certainly the result right now is very bad. We will see if he rebounds next year with a new staff and him taking the time to get his head straight.

I'm not going to say Jarmo is perfect or even close. You do have to take into consideration the organization though. Columbus will never be Chicago where they can dump everything, suck, and still have one of the top 2 or 3 budget in the league. They'll always be a budget team, that has to have enough attendance to keep the budget up. It isn't an ideal situation for team building, but it is their situation.

 

[redacted]

Yeah, I agree. I just don’t think there’s a blanket rule. There would be some NHL teams that would look at not just Girard, but Byram and Toews and say they don’t fit their size profile.

Like, Edmonton for instance… they’re size queens on defence. They want every defender to be 6’3-6’5. I wouldn’t say it’s worked out for them.

I wouldn’t want 3 Sam Girard’s, but you can get a lot of utility out of one of them. Just like I wouldn’t want 3 Josh Manson’s, but I can find use for one of them.

Ultimately, I think you need players who are great on both sides of the puck and a lead horse.

Most hockey guys that I converse with basically have the cutoff at 6'. If you're below 6' you better be a damn good player in some realm... and when you're building, you don't really want more than one of those guys. So while there are some out there that are 6'3+" only... they are really about as rare as the IDGAF Wild who will skate 3 guys under 6'.

In the end, I'd say the Avs do add more to the size conversation than they take away from it. If the Wild won the Cup, they'd change the narrative.

 

[Avs9296]

It is a bit of a myth the Avs are small and soft. Makar is small, but he's certainly not soft. G is small and soft. Byram, Toews, Manson, EJ, JMFJ, and Dermy are all 6'1" or taller. None of them are soft. A few of them (Manson, EJ, JMFJ, and Dermy) are known to be physical players. Hunt played a lot this year out of necessity and he fits the small/soft... but he's not who the Avs would ideally have.

None of Makar, Toews, Girard or Byram really lean on guys in the corners or cross check the shit out of guys in front of our own net. Makar will throw a big hit once in a while but he's hardly clearing creases and making people pay the price in front.

Those 4 guys rely on quickness and reading of the game to stop cycles and transition the puck out of the zone. They're not soft per se, but they are not what I'd consider physical defensemen at all.


Also now everyone is in love with Manson?! According to half this board the guy sucks and is a liability. Whatever fits the narrative at the time I guess.

 

[redacted]

None of Makar, Toews, Girard or Byram really lean on guys in the corners or cross check the shit out of guys in front of our own net. Makar will throw a big hit once in a while but he's hardly clearing creases and making people pay the price in front.

Those 4 guys rely on quickness and reading of the game to stop cycles and transition the puck out of the zone. They're not soft per se, but they are not what I'd consider physical defensemen at all.


Also now everyone is in love with Manson?! According to half this board the guy sucks and is a liability. Whatever fits the narrative at the time I guess.

Byram leans and cross checks guys... he'll battle too. Not always well, but nobody would really think that Byram is soft by any stretch. He's as feisty as anybody. He's more akin to JMFJ from a physical standpoint than he is to G. Toews isn't outright physical but he will battle. The Avs are not a soft D core. That is really a myth.

Where is anybody in love with Manson in this conversation? This conversation is all around size and physicality not quality of play.

 

[The Abusement Park]

None of Makar, Toews, Girard or Byram really lean on guys in the corners or cross check the shit out of guys in front of our own net. Makar will throw a big hit once in a while but he's hardly clearing creases and making people pay the price in front.

Those 4 guys rely on quickness and reading of the game to stop cycles and transition the puck out of the zone. They're not soft per se, but they are not what I'd consider physical defensemen at all.


Also now everyone is in love with Manson?! According to half this board the guy sucks and is a liability. Whatever fits the narrative at the time I guess.

Where’s that coming from?

 

[Avs9296]

Byram leans and cross checks guys... he'll battle too. Not always well, but nobody would really think that Byram is soft by any stretch. He's as feisty as anybody. He's more akin to JMFJ from a physical standpoint than he is to G. Toews isn't outright physical but he will battle. The Avs are not a soft D core. That is really a myth.

Where is anybody in love with Manson in this conversation? This conversation is all around size and physicality not quality of play.

Byram leans and that's fine, but he often gets tossed aside rather easily. He's a bit too light weight to be considered a physical dman.

Anyways like I said, the Avs d core may not be soft, but they certainly are less physical then the average NHL team. The top 4 of Toews/Makar/G/Byram don't rely on physicality and certainly don't strike fear into the opposition. There's nothing wrong with that, because they'll hurt you in a multitude of other ways, but the Avs won a cup without having a super big and physical d core.

Where’s that coming from?

Mostly from the Article actually. Not the posters in here.

 

[Balthazar]

The top 4 of Toews/Makar/G/Byram don't rely on physicality and certainly don't strike fear into the opposition. There's nothing wrong with that, because they'll hurt you in a multitude of other ways, but the Avs won a cup without having a super big and physical d core.

They literally traded for Manson to "help Girard". That's from Sakic himself. So yea there was something wrong with a smaller top 4.