2022/23 Roster Thread XX: Heading into the Homestretch

[Beef Invictus]

I don't think it's about "trawling the bottom."
Rather if it's a 3-5 year process, when they're competitive again, they don't want to be the Flyers of the last decade, with a group of stars in their late 20s, with only a couple peak seasons left, and a group of prospects in their late teens and early 20s, 2-3 years away from entering their peak seasons.

2025-26: Couts (33), Laughton (31), Risto (31), Provorov (28-29), Sanheim (29), TK (28), Allison (28), Hart (27)
bold would need to be extended

Cates (26), Frost (26), Tippett (26), Farabee (25), Brink (24), Foerster (23-24), Desnoyers (23-24), Gauthier (21-22)
Attard (26), Ginning (25-26), Zamula (25), York (24-25), Andrae (23), Sampson (22)
Ersson (26), Kosolov (23-24), Fedotov (29)

Gonna be a lot longer than 3-5 years. You're really underestimating the damage your hero did. They're 3-5 years behind the ball to start, they have so few picks and prospects.

 

[Flyerfan4life]

We'll have to wait to see how the lottery balls fall but hypothetically let's operate off of the idea that Anaheim is first. I can't think of any way that they'd move off of Bedard. Chicago at 2 is not going to give up local boy Fantilli. The first possible move would then be for Carlsson or Mitchkov with Columbus. IDK if either of these players would be worth a package to get them such as the one that the Flyers gave up for Lindros. Perhaps they're generational players; maybe they're not. Then there's the entire question of Mitchkov ever being able to come to NA in order to play.
I'm all for Briere being aggressive in order to better the club but I don't want to see him doing something stupid either.

100% if we trade for mitchkov he will never come over..

#beaf***ingFlyer

 

[Flyer lurker]

Provorov and Sanheim are my top trade chips. I don't buy that Sanheim is untradeable.

Also Hart, depending on return of course.

Hayes no brainer
Provorov 75% gone
Hart I am not hanging up
Praying ada goes for a 5th but not counting on it.
Praying this org is not stupid enough to trade Farabee
Laughton 29 years old 3m career high in points, would love to hear the offers

 

[FLYguy3911]

This talk about trading up, before the lottery, is so weird. There are places to be aggressive during a rebuild, but blindly planning a trade up in your first draft when you are short on picks to begin with doesn't seem like the move. Packaging two firsts in a hypothetical player trade even less so. Do they even know how rarely top 5 picks are traded? If anything they should be looking to move back, but that's not a decision that should be made until they are on the clock.

Also weird these desires are coming out before the President is hired. Makes you wonder if the hire is all but a formality.

 

[deadhead]

We'll have to wait to see how the lottery balls fall but hypothetically let's operate off of the idea that Anaheim is first. I can't think of any way that they'd move off of Bedard. Chicago at 2 is not going to give up local boy Fantilli. The first possible move would then be for Carlsson or Mitchkov with Columbus. IDK if either of these players would be worth a package to get them such as the one that the Flyers gave up for Lindros. Perhaps they're generational players; maybe they're not. Then there's the entire question of Mitchkov ever being able to come to NA in order to play.
I'm all for Briere being aggressive in order to better the club but I don't want to see him doing something stupid either.

I think this is more about letting the league know he's open for business.

He'll get a lot of low ball offers initially, seeing if he'll bite, then teams will get serious.

But trading up is hard, and trades with PO teams are built around late round 1sts (top ten protection is standard these days), and "B" prospects (A prospects can contribute immediately so PO teams rarely trade them).

So don't expect miracles, we don't have a Eichel or Duchene or Stone to trade.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

Gonna be a lot longer than 3-5 years. You're really underestimating the damage your hero did. They're 3-5 years behind the ball to start, they have so few picks and prospects.

My hope is it’s 3-5 years at the bottom. The next 2-3 years they should finally start coming up for air and showing promise for the future. So I’m hoping they are competitive and a contender 8-10 years from today. What I’m scared of is if the rebuild fails. At least at that point we wouldn’t be in purgatory. This last decade has been unbearable and it will take a lot of patience from everyone involved

 

[renberg]

Hayes no brainer
Provorov 75% gone
Hart I am not hanging up
Praying ada goes for a 5th but not counting on it.
Praying this org is not stupid enough to trade Farabee
Laughton 29 years old 3m career high in points, would love to hear the offers

It could be Hayes and Provorov to CBJ for Gudbrandson just to get Hayes out of town. Any semi sensible offer should be good enough to get TDA off of the roster. He’s done here.

I think this is more about letting the league know he's open for business.

He'll get a lot of low ball offers initially, seeing if he'll bite, then teams will get serious.

But trading up is hard, and trades with PO teams are built around late round 1sts (top ten protection is standard these days), and "B" prospects (A prospects can contribute immediately so PO teams rarely trade them).

So don't expect miracles, we don't have a Eichel or Duchene or Stone to trade.

Unless Briere can put a reasonable deal together for Carlsson, I don’t see the Flyers being able to move up. Trading for the rights to Mitchkov makes sense from a hockey perspective but is way too risky. Perhaps Briere can move some roster players for first rounders after the Flyers choice? Also they should be careful with moving next year’s first from Florida. That pick has a chance to have real value.

 

[BigToe]

This talk about trading up, before the lottery, is so weird. There are places to be aggressive during a rebuild, but blindly planning a trade up in your first draft when you are short on picks to begin with doesn't seem like the move. Packaging two firsts in a hypothetical player trade even less so. Do they even know how rarely top 5 picks are traded? If anything they should be looking to move back, but that's not a decision that should be made until they are on the clock.

Also weird these desires are coming out before the President is hired. Makes you wonder if the hire is all but a formality.

It makes zero sense. Don’t think we should trade down this year either.

 

[FLYguy3911]

It makes zero sense. Don’t think we should trade down this year either.

Trading back moreso as a general philosophy early in a rebuild, not a hard or fast rule for this draft because I agree this draft seems to tier off right around where they would be picking. They need lots of lotto tickets if they don't luck out in the lottery.

 

[FlyerNutter]

I’m not one of the draft guys here but trading down is insane to me knowing who runs this team.

It leaves more chance for mistakes where as I think with a higher pick you go with consensus. The Flyers are far too stupid when it comes to scouting to avoid consensus, even if the Patrick pick looms.

I do believe this team floats in this nonsense 7-10 area for a couple more years. If there is a chance to sell current assets which are really irrelevant to the future success of the team, I’m down.

Enough of this obsession to win by placing hopes on lineups made up of secondary talent. It’s been years of that shit.

 

[FLYguy3911]

I’m not one of the draft guys here but trading down is insane to me knowing who runs this team.

It leaves more chance for mistakes where as I think with a higher pick you go with consensus. The Flyers are far too stupid when it comes to scouting to avoid consensus, even if the Patrick pick looms.

I do believe this team floats in this nonsense 7-10 area for a couple more years. If there is a chance to sell current assets which are really irrelevant to the future success of the team, I’m down.

Enough of this obsession to win by placing hopes on lineups made up of secondary talent. It’s been years of that shit.

Not sure if you are advocating trading up into the top 5 or what, but if your organization can't evaluate talent and it lives by antiquated philosophies nothing will matter in the end anyway.

Being overconfident in your ability to project 17 and 18 year old players is where teams get in trouble. Go no further than 2017 in what was thought to be a two player draft where no one had interest in moving that pick...3 bonafide stars went in the next three picks.

Again, I'm not pounding the table to trade back without seeing the board, but trading back (slightly) at this point in a rebuild and stacking the odds seems like a more logical path than trading for a pick that will be priced so far above market value.

 

[usahockey22flyers]

Anyone have a mock roster for next year? Feel free to put X instead of a name if you think they will fill it externally

 

[bennysflyers16]

Holy those exit interviews. Torts is a that doesn’t communicate at all.
Hayes and Provy 100% gone

TDA came across better than Torts lol

 

[usahockey22flyers]

Holy those exit interviews. Torts is a that doesn’t communicate at all.
Hayes and Provy 100% gone

TDA came across better than Torts lol

This is my biggest gripe with him - I'm fine with him being tough, but how do you not explain your rationale? He won't last long

 

[bennysflyers16]

This is my biggest gripe with him - I'm fine with him being tough, but how do you not explain your rationale? He won't last long

The Sanheim and Frost benching they say wasn’t explained. And shocking how they all claim he doesn’t talk to them. This prick was all about my players know where they stand all the time.

Very clear most don’t believe in his system as well

 

[usahockey22flyers]

TK - Coots - Tipp
Farabee - Frost - Cam
Laughton - Cates - Foerster
Deslauriers - x - Allison

Sanheim - Risto
Seeler - York
Zamula - TDA

Hart
Ersson

I theoretically traded Hayes/Provy. I think Torts was rolling Sanheim/Risto, so I kept that as is.

Might be missing someone. Any comments?

Thinking out loud: The RW log jam is real - couldn't fit Brink there, can he play LW? I wonder if they try and fit Desnoyers in at LW in the bottom 6.

 

[Beef Invictus]

The Sanheim and Frost benching they say wasn’t explained. And shocking how they all claim he doesn’t talk to them. This prick was all about my players know where they stand all the time.

Very clear most don’t believe in his system as well

I must reiterate for the third time today that Tortorella proudly trumpeted that he wouldn't be talking to them or coaching them directly.

 

[Curufinwe]

TK - Coots - Tipp
Farabee - Frost - Cam
Laughton - Cates - Foerster
Deslauriers - x - Allison

Sanheim - Risto
Seeler - York
Zamula - TDA

Hart
Ersson

I theoretically traded Hayes/Provy. I think Torts was rolling Sanheim/Risto, so I kept that as is.

Might be missing someone. Any comments?

Thinking out loud: The RW log jam is real - couldn't fit Brink there, can he play LW? I wonder if they try and fit Desnoyers in at LW in the bottom 6.

I think Angelo is gone, even if it’s a buyout.

 

[FlyerNutter]

Not sure if you are advocating trading up into the top 5 or what, but if your organization can't evaluate talent and it lives by antiquated philosophies nothing will matter in the end anyway.

Being overconfident in your ability to project 17 and 18 year old players is where teams get in trouble. Go no further than 2017 in what was thought to be a two player draft where no one had interest in moving that pick...3 bonafide stars went in the next three picks.

Again, I'm not pounding the table to trade back without seeing the board, but trading back (slightly) at this point in a rebuild and stacking the odds seems like a more logical path than trading for a pick that will be priced so far above market value.

I don’t trust them to evaluate with a larger pool of potential players. Being in a top 4 for example, we know kind of where they are going to go.

I trust external scouts a hell of a lot more than the Flyers crew.

I think there are organizations that can operate with a trade down approach - but not the Flyers. There is a reason this team can’t find more than one superstar in 20 years. They need the high picks imo.

The scouting talent isn’t there.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

I am fine with buying out TDA if they can’t move him.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Can’t have a goalie stealing games if they are serious about trawling the bottom. See what a young team like Ottawa who is looking for a goaltender would give up.

I don't want to trade these guys for the purpose of "trawling the bottom."

I'm just looking to move assets from certain positions who have significant cap implications and use them to improve a different position and/or improve their draft outlook (be it moving up or adding another high pick).

Even without Provorov and Sanheim, the Flyers will have York, Zamula, Seeler, Ginning, and Andrae all available for LD next season.

I've seen enough of Provorov and Sanheim where I don't think their marginal utility over those players is enough to justify the cap hits.

But proven top 4 defensemen have value. So use them to address other needs.

Hart I'm undecided on. I'm really not sure I want to commit to the monster contract he's probably going to require after next season. Goaltending, I believe, is a position of depth with Ersson, Kolosov, and perhaps Fedotov in the system. So if I'm the Flyers, I'm going to see what Hart's trade value is, and if I get a strong offer I pull the trigger.

Plus, obviously JVR is off the books, and they are going to trade Hayes and perhaps DeAngelo, and even if you have to eat some salary on those two, they should be able to put themselves in a pretty good cap situation going forward.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Fletcher does love leaving a trail of buyouts for bad contracts, often a year or two in. It's one of his signature moves

 

[Flyerfan4life]

I must reiterate for the third time today that Tortorella proudly trumpeted that he wouldn't be talking to them or coaching them directly.

im telling ya... this Org. is the perfect storm for Torts..

both sides are enablers of full Dino mindset..

its like the spiderman pointing at himself meme..

 

[Kelmitchell2]

I am fine with buying out TDA if they can’t move him.

Oh not me, he's a good tank commander, he could have real value for us next season

 

[Chicken N Raffls]