2022/23 Roster Thread XIII: Where the 13th Floor Has Been Located

[Hollywood Cannon]

You can bet your ass Torts is trying to become part of that FO one day. He's not going to piss off the old guard that directly aligns with his overall hockey beliefs.



I still fail to see where some young guy from Canada is getting inside Flyer knowledge, because he kind of just repeats what I hear elsewhere. Will say he's at least easier to talk to than Myrtetus, who just gets ultra defensive about the team at any time.

He doesn't. Just like all of the Flyers twitter wannabees they throw likely shit at the wall and people eat it up as if they're somebody.

 

[Striiker]

So in reality he's not holding them accountable at all because he has no power to do anything.

He doesn't get to choose if the team is rebuilding. That's Fletcher's decision. Fletcher is clearly not rebuilding. Also, Tortorella is famously full of shit with the media. His own actions indicate he's not trying to push a rebuild.

He’s also choosing to use Ristolainen over Zamula. Clearly he still values that awful trashcan more than a superior kid.

 

[deadhead]

I doubt becoming part of the FO is in Torts' plans, he has no connections with the organization and has never shown interest in a FO position.

He'll be 67 when the contract runs out, he actually has a life outside of hockey.
I think he likes the challenge of rebuilding the team, and knows going deep into the playoffs with this team would probably cement his election to the HOF.

He's not going to directly confront the POB, rather, by speaking the truth, he'll put them on the hot seat.

 

[Beef Invictus]

I doubt becoming part of the FO is in Torts' plans, he has no connections with the organization and has never shown interest in a FO position.

He'll be 67 when the contract runs out, he actually has a life outside of hockey.
I think he likes the challenge of rebuilding the team, and knows going deep into the playoffs with this team would probably cement his election to the HOF.

He's not going to directly confront the POB, rather, by speaking the truth, he'll put them on the hot seat.

Tortorella has never played Machiavellian games with his bosses. Nor is he actually doing anything differently. He wants to get rid of as many prospects as he can and he has a boss who agrees.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

He is here because he's getting paid sixteen million dollars. He doesn't give a shit about any of those other things. He will "quit" before the end of his contract like he has done before.

 

[Captain Dave Poulin]

Tortorella has never played Machiavellian games with his bosses. Nor is he actually doing anything differently. He wants to get rid of as many prospects as he can and he has a boss who agrees.

Jorts is a c***.

 

[Beef Invictus]

He is here because he's getting paid sixteen million dollars. He doesn't give a shit about any of those other things. He will "quit" before the end of his contract like he has done before.

Nothing says "determined to see the HOF" quite like quitting on CBJ his last year after they talked him into staying.

 

[deadhead]

Nothing says "determined to see the HOF" quite like quitting on CBJ his last year after they talked him into staying.

You mean after his GM decimated the team?
When they traded Dubois for Laine, that was the last straw, Laine is exactly the kind of player Torts hates.

 

[Kelmitchell2]

We could’ve had stankoven, jiricek, caufield…

Instead we have toumalla, Gauthier, york

Could have had Robertson or debrincat but we have Ratcliffe

You mean after his GM decimated the team?
When they traded Dubois for Laine, that was the last straw, Laine is exactly the kind of player Torts hates.

Yeah a player with skill, aren't those just the worse, and damn that zegras to hell, he's going to ruin hockey with those skillful hockey moves

 

[Beef Invictus]

You mean after his GM decimated the team?
When they traded Dubois for Laine, that was the last straw, Laine is exactly the kind of player Torts hates.

The GM was attempting to build a skilled roster and Tortorella didn't want that. He disagreed with it. He wanted to quit, not participate in the rebuilt. After agreeing to stay, he completely mailed it in. Even CBJ fans who generally like him admit he did a shit job.


So it's truly comical to think he's coming here explicitly to do the stuff he wanted to quit over last time around, to the point where for the first time in his career he'll deviously strongarm his boss into doing the thing Torts didn't actually want to do to stop said boss from doing the thing Tortorella wants.

 

[deadhead]

The GM was attempting to build a skilled roster and Tortorella didn't want that. He disagreed with it. He wanted to quit, not participate in the rebuilt. After agreeing to stay, he completely mailed it in. Even CBJ fans who generally like him admit he did a shit job.


So it's truly comical to think he's coming here explicitly to do the stuff he wanted to quit over last time around, to the point where for the first time in his career he'll deviously strongarm his boss into doing the thing Torts didn't actually want to do to stop said boss from doing the thing Tortorella wants.

You mean the GM who built a team worse than the Flyers? A team that hasn't sniffed the playoffs since Torts left?

 

[JojoTheWhale]

The important bit that doesn't get discussed enough is that the 24th, 25th, 26th, and 27th most recent playoff losses of the dynasty Lightning were handed to them by none other than John Tortorella. He won't put up with any guff.

 

[flyerslducks]

Top 5 incoming. Hawks and flyers climbed the loser standing and will continue to do so.

But who comes out of the top 5? Ottawa, Vancouver, and ducks all in the bottom with rightful bottom 5 chicago+Arizona. I expect one or both of Ottawa/Vancouver to come out maybe. Really everyone in that bottom 5 has more talent than us (maybe on par with Chicago once they sell toews/kaner)

 

[Beef Invictus]

You mean the GM who built a team worse than the Flyers? A team that hasn't sniffed the playoffs since Torts left?

Worse than the Flyers? Outside of Hart they've been just about identical. What a swing and a miss, on an attempt to change the subject because you have no actual response.

 

[deadhead]

81 points last year, 15 points this year despite adding JG and Gudbranson.
Six top scorers JG (29), Jenner (29), Chinakov (21), Kuraly (30), Johnson (20), Nyquist (33).
With Werenski out, they're not going to get much better.

A perfect example of starting a rebuild, then trying to short-cut the process. Where have we seen that strategy before?

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

Sure looks better than the Flyers to me.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Funny how Jake's defense went into the toilet after his first year with AV (and we'll ignore his ECHL level shooting).
Jake was horrible this season before he went on IR, and still has one year left at $8.25M.
Hayes at least has some future at LW, he's just not a top 6 center anymore.

Hayes is worse defensively than Voracek was. Worst forward on the team, actually. Voracek was never the worst. Nor did his defense go in the toilet. That's just one of the many things you like to make up.

 

[deadhead]

Voracek wasn't a center. Let's see how Hayes looks at wing before we make definitive statements.
Center is a lot more demanding than wing.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

Center is a lot more demanding than wing.

Let's say that the Flyers agree with this statement.

What does it say about them that the only 2 Centers they've taken in 4 drafts were a guy they project to move there from Wing and a 7th rounder with 14 scoreless games above the level of Rhode Island High School play?

 

[Craft Beer Lover]

I have seen no evidence that the Flyer development is any worse than the majority of NHL teams.

If they truly had bad development, players would be going elsewhere and shining after a couple seasons of "recovery."
TK, Sanheim have developed nicely, Farabee's struggles are probably more physical (major surgery).
Provorov seems less a development issue than a player's ego (hard to coach).
And try to name a young player who succeeded elsewhere after struggling here.

Now you could claim that for Buffalo, where a number of players have left and improved, but is that development or just suppression due to playing on a bad team? Though given how poor Risto is at fundamental defense, I'd suspect development, but the proof would be if Shaw can turn him into a respectable defenseman.

The fact that a player doesn't live up to expectations doesn't necessarily point to development, it may be the player's talent was overestimated - it's when that player goes elsewhere and improves you start wondering.

Can’t stop laughing. How has Sanheim developed NICELY? Good grief, he is so overrated on these boards. If Provorov is traded, he is your #1 defenseman, meaning that he will play 25+ minutes, including penalty kills in crucial situations.

His scouts NEVER wanted Makar. That has already been proven to be a LIE by Clarke. They were discussing Patrick vs. Heiskanen by all reputable accounts.

Oh, so they screwed up by selecting the stiff Nolan Patrick, instead of the stud defenseman Heiskanen?? How does that look better for the organ-I-zation? How has the overrated Sanheim “developed nicely?” Does he kill penalties? Do you trust him in a one goal game with a minute left? He is a defensive liability.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Voracek wasn't a center. Let's see how Hayes looks at wing before we make definitive statements.
Center is a lot more demanding than wing.

Here are players ranked from bad to good for xGA/60 last game:

The shift from Center to LW moved him all the way from "worst forward" to...."worst forward."

 

[deadhead]

Let's say that the Flyers agree with this statement.

What does it say about them that the only 2 Centers they've taken in 4 drafts were a guy they project to move there from Wing and a 7th rounder with 14 scoreless games above the level of Rhode Island High School play?

Gauthier was moved to wing to accommodate another center on the USDP, but BC recruited him to play center, so projecting him at center isn't a stretch.

Desnoyers is a center and seems to be holding up at that spot in LHV.

Cates is the odd duck, a LW in college who is holding up very well at center, but it's early, we'll see how the experiement progresses - but the opposite of Laughton, a center who looks more comfortable at LW.

Laczynski was a center in college.

Given that Frost hasn't shown 2C skill, a playmaking center is going to be a priority going forward.

Think at one time they had Couts, Patrick, Frost, Laughton, JOB, Bunnaman, Vorobyev, lined up, unfortunately the best laid plans of mice and GMs . . .

Can’t stop laughing. How has Sanheim developed NICELY? Good grief, he is so overrated on these boards. If Provorov is traded, he is your #1 defenseman, meaning that he will play 25+ minutes, including penalty kills in crucial situations.

Oh, so they screwed up by selecting the stiff Nolan Patrick, instead of the stud defenseman Heiskanen?? How does that look better for the organ-I-zation? How has the overrated Sanheim “developed nicely?” Does he kill penalties? Do you trust him in a one goal game with a minute left? He is a defensive liability.

2:01 on the PK this season. 2:08 last season.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Gauthier was moved to wing to accommodate another center on the USDP, but BC recruited him to play center, so projecting him at center isn't a stretch.

Desnoyers is a center and seems to be holding up at that spot in LHV.

Cates is the odd duck, a LW in college who is holding up very well at center, but it's early, we'll see how the experiement progresses - but the opposite of Laughton, a center who looks more comfortable at LW.

Laczynski was a center in college.

Given that Frost hasn't shown 2C skill, a playmaking center is going to be a priority going forward.

Think at one time they had Couts, Patrick, Frost, Laughton, JOB, Bunnaman, Vorobyev, lined up, unfortunately the best laid plans of mice and GMs . . .


2:01 on the PK this season. 2:08 last season.

Aside from the times that he does.

It's funny how the Fletcher apologists are so desperate to quit on Frost as fast as possible, because that's what defense of Fletcher requires. Sort of like how it was once necessary to falsely insist TK hadn't shown and top six skill when Hakstol had him on the 4th line.

 

[deadhead]

Here are players ranked from bad to good for xGA/60 last game:

View attachment 611824

The shift from Center to LW moved him all the way from "worst forward" to...."worst forward."

Last 9 games pr 60 minutes:
Sedlak 1.37
Laczynski 1.96
N Cates 2.28
TK 2.44
Deslauriers 2.44
Frost 2.60
MacEwen 2.76
Laughton 2.81
Tippett 3.03
Farabee 3.17
Hayes 3.43

Seeler 1.99
Braun 1.99
Risto 2.25
Sanheim 2.33
Provorov 3.51
TDA 3.52

 

[JojoTheWhale]

Gauthier was moved to wing to accommodate another center on the USDP, but BC recruited him to play center, so projecting him at center isn't a stretch.

Desnoyers is a center and seems to be holding up at that spot in LHV.

Cates is the odd duck, a LW in college who is holding up very well at center, but it's early, we'll see how the experiement progresses - but the opposite of Laughton, a center who looks more comfortable at LW.

Laczynski was a center in college.

Given that Frost hasn't shown 2C skill, a playmaking center is going to be a priority going forward.

Think at one time they had Couts, Patrick, Frost, Laughton, JOB, Bunnaman, Vorobyev, lined up, unfortunately the best laid plans of mice and GMs . . .


2:01 on the PK this season. 2:08 last season.

I don't care if it's a stretch. It's added risk. The whole point is that they place extra emphasis on the position and then don't prioritize it in the draft.

Desnoyers was another projection. He was primarily a LW.

Not one of the other 9 players you listed was in the last 4 drafts.