2022/23 Roster Thread XII: The Twelfth Night, a comedy play

[flyerslducks]

I honestly would rather buy out risto than see him play another 5 years. We suck anyway and the cap is going up every year. f*** it dude lol

 

[deadhead]

Let's look at Torts in TB, which is more like the current Flyer situation, a really bad team.
Took over in 2000-01, halfway through the season, so he couldn't make many changes.
F: Lecavalier (20), Johnson (26), Modin (26), Richards (20), Holzinger (28), Johnson (24),
Ekman (24), St Louis (25), Warriner (27), Primeau (24), Kharintov (24), Keefe (20)

D: Kubina (23), Mara (21), Cullimore (28), Sarich (22), Zyzuzin (23)

a year later
F: Richards (21), Modin (27), St Louis (26), Prospal (26), Clymer (23), Lecavalier (21),
Andreychuck (38), Ylonen (29), Olvestad (21), Taylor (32), Keefe (21), Alexeev (20)
[Prospal T Ryan Johnson & 6th rd pick, Adnreychuck FA, Ylonen T 6th rd pick & Andre Roy]

D: Kubina (24), Boyle (25), Neckar (26), Cullimore (29), Pratt (26), Sarich (23), Ledyard (40)
[Boyle, T 5th rd pick, Neckar T for Mara, Johnson, Pratt T 6th rd pic]

make the playoffs in 2002-03, by PO TOI:

F: Lecavalier, St Louis, Richards, Andreychuck, Prospal, Modin,
Fedotenko, T Taylor, Clymer, Dingman, Alexeev, Roy/Svitov
[Fedotenko and (2) 2nd rd picks for #4 which became Pitkanen]

D: Boyle, Kubina, Cullimore, Sarich/Pratt, Neckar, Luckowich

Point is they didn't blow up the team, a lot of young players got to play, failed and were replaced.
The keepers played bigger roles, a number of role players were added cheaply.
A defensive core was identified and given bigger minutes.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

Irrelevant on all counts. The salary cap didn’t exist. The Flyers don’t have a Lecavalier, St. Louis, Richards, or Boyle.

What happened in in the early 2000’s is irrelevant in today’s day in age and Tortorella wasn’t the GM and he’s not the GM now.

 

[flyerslducks]

So is cam Atkinson done for the year or is he going to be done for his career a la Ellis? So much wasted cap space.

17+ to Ellis, Atkinson, risto for absolutely nothing.
Another 7 for Hayes to be a slow center
1.75 for deslauriers to do nothing

 

[Rebels57]

Got it, zero use discussing this with you. Rebuilding teams keep their prospects that need NHL time in the AHL (while playing trash in the NHL) and trade picks for short term roster upgrades.

No point in arguing with someone when this is their definition of a rebuild.

You still will argue with him though

 

[Flyerfan4life]

So is cam Atkinson done for the year or is he going to be done for his career a la Ellis? So much wasted cap space.

17+ to Ellis, Atkinson, risto for absolutely nothing.
Another 7 for Hayes to be a slow center
1.75 for deslauriers to do nothing

cue Chuckles smirking gif here..

 

[Fight4yourRight]

Jost is surely no worse than Bellows. Let the shit waiver pick up carousel continue!

 

[FLYguy3911]

They are maxed out on contracts.

 

[deadhead]

Who drafted Jost?

 

[Nizzle]

Irrelevant on all counts. The salary cap didn’t exist. The Flyers don’t have a Lecavalier, St. Louis, Richards, or Boyle.

What happened in in the early 2000’s is irrelevant in today’s day in age and Tortorella wasn’t the GM and he’s not the GM now.

Love the argument that team with young forward core of Lecavalier, St. Louis and Richards is somehow close to current situation of the Flyers.

 

[BiggE]

There is something that I've been thinking about more - and more.

To move Konecny. Signed at 5.5 for 2 more seasons after this one, ready to turn 26. We are currently in his prime years. Arguably the best contract on the current team.

Said team, is irrelevant for the next few years as is - and are we really going to pay a guy that will be approaching 30 for his past performance?

For a team that actually should rebuild properly, I'd sell high on TK this season, and its not because I dont like the player. Make the smart move here, and realize how far out you actually are. For one damn time.

They should absolutely be moving Konecny, and Provorov and Laughton because none of them are gonna be here when and if this team ever gets good again. But our idiot GM, the guy who acquires and re-signs garbage like Risto for 5 years and a goon for 4 will never make those kind of smart moves. The entire hockey side of the franchise is run by relics and imbeciles. Honestly, unless Daniel Snyder was to buy the team, I really can’t imagine how it could be any worse.

I’d rather the franchise would just fold than to go on like this, locked in perpetual mediocrity. It’s sickening.

 

[deadhead]

Love the argument that team with young forward core of Lecavalier, St. Louis and Richards is somehow close to current situation of the Flyers.

St Louis was a UDFA who put up 56 3-18 21 in Calgary, then signed off the street by TB.
78g 18-22 40 his first year with Torts, injured the following year, 53g 16-19 35, then 82g 33-37 70.

Richards was #64 in the draft, rookie year under Torts, who played him 16:14 at 20 years old, next season 19:48.

So it wasn't like he was "given" these two, they blossomed under him.

 

[Cody Webster]

More and more delusional by the day. Didn't think it was possible

 

[deadhead]

They should absolutely be moving Konecny, and Provorov and Laughton because none of them are gonna be here when and if this team ever gets good again. But our idiot GM, the guy who acquires and re-signs garbage like Risto for 5 years and a goon for 4 will never make those kind of smart moves. The entire hockey side of the franchise is run by relics and imbeciles. Honestly, unless Daniel Snyder was to buy the team, I really can’t imagine how it could be any worse.

I’d rather the franchise would just fold than to go on like this, locked in perpetual mediocrity. It’s sickening.

There is no way I trade TK, he's 25, entering his peak years and is becoming an elite scorer and play driver.

Laughton yes, with the emergence of Cates, and Desnoyers and Wisdom on the way, he's expendable at 28.

Provorov yes, I think he needs a change of scenery, it just isn't working and he could get a good haul, I'd be looking at a young center or RHD, and a draft pick or two.

With TDA you stick with him for another year, and at worst flip him at the TDL for a 2nd.

Hayes you hold onto until you know what's up wit Couts, and whether Gauthier and Cates can play center at the NHL level.

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

I've long maintained that Frost was the next Barzal, but the presence of JVR was holding him back. Egg on my face with this one, guys.

So they're totally gonna claim Jost, right?

They can’t

 

[Nizzle]

St Louis was a UDFA who put up 56 3-18 21 in Calgary, then signed off the street by TB.
78g 18-22 40 his first year with Torts, injured the following year, 53g 16-19 35, then 82g 33-37 70.

Richards was #64 in the draft, rookie year under Torts, who played him 16:14 at 20 years old, next season 19:48.

So it wasn't like he was "given" these two, they blossomed under him.

You forgot Lecavalier.

 

[deadhead]

You forgot Lecavalier.

No. We have Gauthier and will probably pick high this draft as well.
You build with both high picks and players you develop on your team.
If you just rely on high draft picks, it takes a long time and as Buffalo shows, sometimes never.

 

[Magua]

MacEwen is our Martin St. Louis.

 

[Fight4yourRight]

MacEwen is our Martin St. Louis.

 

[Nizzle]

No. We have Gauthier and will probably pick high this draft as well.
You build with both high picks and players you develop on your team.
If you just rely on high draft picks, it takes a long time and as Buffalo shows, sometimes never.

EDIT: What do you mean ”No.”
He was the only player you did not mention in your post, so if you did not forget him, did you leave him out on purpose?

 

[flyerslducks]

They should absolutely be moving Konecny, and Provorov and Laughton because none of them are gonna be here when and if this team ever gets good again. But our idiot GM, the guy who acquires and re-signs garbage like Risto for 5 years and a goon for 4 will never make those kind of smart moves. The entire hockey side of the franchise is run by relics and imbeciles. Honestly, unless Daniel Snyder was to buy the team, I really can’t imagine how it could be any worse.

I’d rather the franchise would just fold than to go on like this, locked in perpetual mediocrity. It’s sickening.

Hell, I would retain 50% of Laughton deal to get a package similar to what hawks got for hagel and more if possible. 1.5 for Laughton is insane value and can help contenders like crazy. Provorov i agree cus I think the return would be nice.

As for tk, I’m on the fenc… as flyernutter stated, it would be nice to get more assets in return. On the other hand, I don’t think it would hurt to keep him in the top 6. If we get these top end talent in these next two drsft, having a guy like tk on their lines would help. He’s the one guy I wouldn’t mind resigning when his contract is done. Now if the return is insane, then you obviously consider it.

Even tda…retain 50% of his this year even to get rid of him so we can get more 23 picks lol

Hayes you hold onto until you know what's up wit Couts, and whether Gauthier and Cates can play center at the NHL level.

Well we are for sure holding onto our slug of a skater, 7million dollar man, Kevin hayes. Gl finding anyone willing to take that contract lol

 

[Beef Invictus]

Who drafted Jost?

Someone far more capable and competent than Fletcher.

 

[deadhead]

”I didn’t forget, I just didn’t mention him and now I’m comparing the most hyped rookie of his draft to Gauthier.”

Vinnie had a nice career, but he wasn't special in TB. Good but not McKinnon or Pointer or Crosby good.
His two big seasons were 2006-2008, at 26-27 years old.

2000-01: 16-18 34 at ES
2001-02: 15-8 23
2002-03: 20-32 52
2003-04: 25-25 50 - he was 27th in overall scoring that season, St Louis was (1), Stillman (8) [obtained with a 2nd rd pick], Richards (10).

 

[Nizzle]

Vinnie had a nice career, but he wasn't special in TB. Good but not McKinnon or Pointer or Crosby good.
His two big seasons were 2006-2008, at 26-27 years old.

2000-01: 16-18 34 at ES
2001-02: 15-8 23
2002-03: 20-32 52
2003-04: 25-25 50 - he was 27th in overall scoring that season, St Louis was (1), Stillman (8) [obtained with a 2nd rd pick], Richards (10).

That has nothing to do with what I asked.
Edit: oh sorry, you commented the un-edited version.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

Now we’re poo pooing Vincent Lecavalier while hoisting up Cutter Gauthier.

Cool, cool.