2022/23 Roster Thread III: Run It Back!

[DancingPanther]

Niccy Knucks

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

 

[Beef Invictus]

Trading for TDA is certainly valuing offense over defense!

That's part of their annual quest to find the mythical partner who fixes Provorov more than anything else.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

Charlie did talk about how the Flyers have too many voices within their front office structure & it becomes problematic because none of them including Fletcher have any idea of what they’re doing. He said that’s essentially why it’s so all over the place & lacks any consistency.

He later talked about Comcast & said he often gets killed for it by a segment of the fan base but he said Comcast isn’t an issue. It’s the people they employ & some of them were inherited by Comcast not exactly picked by them. He said Comcast spends more money on the hockey budget than most of the league. The issue is the people making those decisions with that budget don’t know what they’re doing. He said it’s a careful what you ask for type of situation to him because a smaller owner might not offer that type of budget. He said he doesn’t really get the sense Comcast wants to sell the team anyway & if for whatever reason they did they would likely clean house with the organization first before they would consider selling in his opinion.

He said he thinks they’re probably going to be bad these next two seasons. He thinks if that happens Comcast will step in & clean out the front office structure. He said at the end of last year there was probably like 5-6K actual people in attendance for those games. He expects it to be worse this year with all the STH cancellations if they continue to suck. He said that will probably get Comcast’s attention & it won’t be just changing out Fletcher.

He did say the Flyers legitimately think this roster can make the playoffs. They legitimately think signings like Deslauires are positive additions. He said their plan is essentially to do a half rebuild/half competitive thing again like they did with Hextall. He said that’s why they won’t trade first rounders but they’re will trade mid rounders for help now. But he mentioned Hextall had a prime Giroux, Voracek, & Couturier which they don’t have now. So it’s probably going to bottom out anyway. As most of these players they are bringing in through the outside are secondary players at best & are costing a lot in assets/contract to do so.

He said the team in his opinion is probably going to be bad next year & the one after it no matter what. But he said if you accepted that & brought in someone competent to run your front office he said in three years you could turn this around & start seeing plausible potential. He said if you basically take a backseat these next few years to accumulate capspace & assets then to him the contract outlook doesn’t look too bad under that lens. I think he was alluding to Coututier, Hayes, & Ristolainen. He said earlier in the podcast he thinks Ellis is done.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Charlie did talk about how the Flyers have too many voices within their front office structure & it becomes problematic because none of them including Fletcher have any idea of what they’re doing. He said that’s essentially why it’s so all over the place & lacks any consistency.

He later talked about Comcast & said he often gets killed for it by a segment of the fan base but he said Comcast isn’t an issue. It’s the people they employ & some of them were inherited by Comcast not exactly picked by them. He said Comcast spends more money on the hockey budget than most of the league. The issue is the people making those decisions with that budget don’t know what they’re doing. He said it’s a careful what you ask for type of situation to him because a smaller owner might not offer that type of budget.

He said he thinks they’re probably going to be bad these next two seasons. He thinks if that happens Comcast will step in & clean out the front office structure. He said at the end of last year there was probably like 5-6K actual people in attendance for those games. He expects it to be worse this year with all the STH cancellations if they continue to suck. He said that will probably get Comcast’s attention & it won’t be just changing out Fletcher.

He did say the Flyers legitimately think this roster can make the playoffs. They legitimately think signings like Deslauires are positive additions. He said their plan is essentially to do a half rebuild/half competitive thing again like they did with Hextall. He said that’s why they won’t trade first rounders but they’re will trade mid rounders for help now. But he mentioned Hextall had a prime Giroux, Voracek, & Couturier which they don’t have now. So it’s probably going to bottom out anyway. As most of these players they are bringing in through the outside are secondary players at best & are costing a lot in assets/contract to do so.

He said the team in his opinion is probably going to be next year & the one after it no matter what. But he said if you accepted that & brought in someone competent to run your front office he said in three years you could turn this around & start seeing plausible potential. He said if you basically take a backseat these next few years to accumulate capspace & assets then to him the contract outlook doesn’t look too bad under that lens. I think he was alluding to Coututier, Hayes, & Ristolainen. He said earlier in the podcast he thinks Ellis is done.

This comes back to my proposed game of matching the draft pick or signing to the person who asked for it. This off-season has thus far gone like every major figure was given one free decision to make by Fletcher. What player belongs to which figure?? We can drink while we do this.

 

[Pet Charles]

He averaged 19:05 last season for the Flyers.

Great. I’d love to see York playing top-4 minutes in 2022-23. The person I responded to had them penciled in on the third pairing, where he won’t get 19 minutes a night.

York does well in all situations. If the option is playing Ristolainen or York with Provorov, give me York every day of the week. Ristolainen playing 20+ minutes a night is like showing up to a track meet in your dress shoes.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

It's true. Hextall inherited prime Giroux, Voracek, Couturier, and Simmonds.

The current regime has prime...... who? Konecny? Hart? Provorov? Sanheim?

Some of Hextall's picks need to step up in a big way, and Fletcher's picks better be ready in short order or he's cooked.

 

[Beef Invictus]

It's true. Hextall inherited prime Giroux, Voracek, Couturier, and Simmonds.

The current regime has prime...... who? Konecny? Hart? Provorov? Sanheim?

Some of Hextall's picks need to step up in a big way, and Fletcher's picks better be ready in short order or he's cooked.

Fletcher probably shouldn't have developed them into dirt.

 

[Tripod]

That's Jordan Hall, he's not a journalist, he's a shill.

Though it's a good sign that Deslauriers realizes fighting is not his ticket to PT:

Deslauriers mentioned that he has expanded his game.

"I've been working hard every summer just for that," he said. "The league is getting faster, I've been doing a lot of power skating. I know my age and everything. This league is getting younger and faster. So I know what I have to bring."

And Ben Simmons shoots 3's in the offseason.

Talk is cheap

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

The Comcast/Flyers talking point is funny because it neglects that basically the whole sports landscape these days are essentially dominated by big business. Corporations own teams all over the place.

Even in hockey the highest valued teams including the Flyers are essentially all owned by Corporations. Snider himself made the deal to sell majority to Comcast to stay ahead of the financial curve. This team wouldn’t be a top six valued franchise in the league if Comcast never bought majority stake off Snider.

 

[usahockey22flyers]

Especially when you are going to have a particularly young team, as the Flyers will, I think there's value in having a Deslauriers. Opponents are less likely to try to take liberties with and intimidate the kids if they know they've got to deal with Deslauriers. And the kids can play with more confidence.

They do play in a division that has some particularly intimidating customers (Reeves, Wilson, Martin, etc.)

If they NEED to have this guy, can’t it be MacEwen? Why do we need both

 

[Pet Charles]

If they NEED to have this guy, can’t it be MacEwen? Why do we need both

I feel like you’d get the best answer to this mystical question if you asked the Tootsie Pop owl. The reason is that you’d be no wiser and out your lollipop, where the lollipop represents cap space and roster flexibility.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

If they NEED to have this guy, can’t it be MacEwen? Why do we need both

I appreciate MacEwen, guy is as game as they come. But he's not even close to Deslauriers when it comes to that aspect.

 

[Starat327]

We've gone over this before, but I didn't even want Gaudreau at this juncture, and I didn't want to trade a premium future asset to dump off JVR, so Chuck did some things right but it was out of incompetence, and then he turned around and did a bunch of stuff wrong as well, like signing a 4th liner for double an ELC with a 4 year term.

Our defense is wretched. Provorov is lost. Sanheim's headed out the door. Risto is Robert Hagg levels of bad. DeAngelo is what you think Ghost was. This organization thinks Seeler is a player because of a single fight. Attard's being coached to focus on the opposite of his strengths. Cam York's all we really have to look forward to and he isn't even guaranteed a spot!

We're endlessly negative because we have all been able to correctly see that the goddamned plane was crashing into the goddamned mountain for the last 3-4 years. We haven't been terrible because we're not tough enough to play against. We've been terrible because we lack skill, we lack speed, we lack an understanding of today's game, we lack an understanding of how to build a competitive roster in today's NHL, and we keep doubling and tripling down on a failed organizational philosophy. All we want is competent management. Give me that, and I'll start to get excited again.

Would you say he is pre-Tahoe Hagg or Post Tahoe Hagg? Cause those are two very different things.

 

[Curufinwe]

The Comcast/Flyers talking point is funny because it neglects that basically the whole sports landscape these days are essentially dominated by big business. Corporations own teams all over the place.

Even in hockey the highest valued teams including the Flyers are essentially all owned by Corporations. Snider himself made the deal to sell majority to Comcast to stay ahead of the financial curve. This team wouldn’t be a top six valued franchise in the league if Comcast never bought majority stake off Snider.

Yeah, the “sell-the-team people” are clueless.

 

[Beef Invictus]

I appreciate MacEwen, guy is as game as they come. But he's not even close to Deslauriers when it comes to that aspect.

"That aspect" will lose them more games than it wins them. By a wide margin.

 

[flyersnorth]

Nic "Le Killer" Deslauriers

Psycho killer.

Qu’est-ce que c’est?

Unh unh unh unnnnnh unh unh unh unnnnh unh unh.

 

[flyersnorth]

Charlie did talk about how the Flyers have too many voices within their front office structure & it becomes problematic because none of them including Fletcher have any idea of what they’re doing. He said that’s essentially why it’s so all over the place & lacks any consistency.

He later talked about Comcast & said he often gets killed for it by a segment of the fan base but he said Comcast isn’t an issue. It’s the people they employ & some of them were inherited by Comcast not exactly picked by them. He said Comcast spends more money on the hockey budget than most of the league. The issue is the people making those decisions with that budget don’t know what they’re doing. He said it’s a careful what you ask for type of situation to him because a smaller owner might not offer that type of budget. He said he doesn’t really get the sense Comcast wants to sell the team anyway & if for whatever reason they did they would likely clean house with the organization first before they would consider selling in his opinion.

He said he thinks they’re probably going to be bad these next two seasons. He thinks if that happens Comcast will step in & clean out the front office structure. He said at the end of last year there was probably like 5-6K actual people in attendance for those games. He expects it to be worse this year with all the STH cancellations if they continue to suck. He said that will probably get Comcast’s attention & it won’t be just changing out Fletcher.

He did say the Flyers legitimately think this roster can make the playoffs. They legitimately think signings like Deslauires are positive additions. He said their plan is essentially to do a half rebuild/half competitive thing again like they did with Hextall. He said that’s why they won’t trade first rounders but they’re will trade mid rounders for help now. But he mentioned Hextall had a prime Giroux, Voracek, & Couturier which they don’t have now. So it’s probably going to bottom out anyway. As most of these players they are bringing in through the outside are secondary players at best & are costing a lot in assets/contract to do so.

He said the team in his opinion is probably going to be bad next year & the one after it no matter what. But he said if you accepted that & brought in someone competent to run your front office he said in three years you could turn this around & start seeing plausible potential. He said if you basically take a backseat these next few years to accumulate capspace & assets then to him the contract outlook doesn’t look too bad under that lens. I think he was alluding to Coututier, Hayes, & Ristolainen. He said earlier in the podcast he thinks Ellis is done.

The other interesting bit was when Charlie said the Flyers could have signed Gaudreau without doing anything. They have the headroom now, and could have done like Vegas and Tampa , and worry about it later.

He said with Farabee definitely and Ellis most likely on LTIR to start the season, they would have had an opportunity to get their guy now and move pieces out after. Yes, you lose leverage, but they get their guy.

 

[Tripod]

Especially when you are going to have a particularly young team, as the Flyers will, I think there's value in having a Deslauriers. Opponents are less likely to try to take liberties with and intimidate the kids if they know they've got to deal with Deslauriers. And the kids can play with more confidence.

They do play in a division that has some particularly intimidating customers (Reeves, Wilson, Martin, etc.)

Young?

6 of our forwards on opening day will be in their 30's.
6/7 of the Dmen are 25 or older and that doesn't include Ellis.

 

[freakydallas13]

Yeah, the "sell the team" crowd is out there tilting at windmills. It's the same reason I didn't contribute to the billboard fund: they are complaining about the wrong problem. Selling the team is only on the radar for me because they refuse to clean out the Crony-archy. If they did that I would have no problem with them continuing to own the team.

I guess a new owner could be inclined to gut the advisors, but it isn't a gaurantee and selling the team for the sake of taking it away from Comcast accomplishes very little.

At least per Charlie it seems like flushing Clarke et all is on the radar now. Gotta hope the team takes actions at this point that lead towards that end all goal. Making the playoffs this year would be a disaster for the future outlook though, because Comcast would look at all the advisor advice and say to themselves "They're right, full steam ahead with their plan".

 

[deadhead]

Young?

6 of our forwards on opening day will be in their 30's.
6/7 of the Dmen are 25 or older and that doesn't include Ellis.

Well, who do you expect to be on the 2023-24 roster.
Things can change very quickly.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Well, who do you expect to be on the 2023-24 roster.
Things can change very quickly.

If Fletcher is still involved somehow, the 23-24 roster will still be a bunch of decrepit veterans and league rejects. If you think it'll be the prospects moving up, you haven't been paying attention to Fletcher's words or actions

 

[FlyerNutter]

Yeah, the "sell the team" crowd is out there tilting at windmills. It's the same reason I didn't contribute to the billboard fund: they are complaining about the wrong problem. Selling the team is only on the radar for me because they refuse to clean out the Crony-archy. If they did that I would have no problem with them continuing to own the team.

I guess a new owner could be inclined to gut the advisors, but it isn't a gaurantee and selling the team for the sake of taking it away from Comcast accomplishes very little.

At least per Charlie it seems like flushing Clarke et all is on the radar now. Gotta hope the team takes actions at this point that lead towards that end all goal. Making the playoffs this year would be a disaster for the future outlook though, because Comcast would look at all the advisor advice and say to themselves "They're right, full steam ahead with their plan".

I don’t think anyone expects Comcast to sell.

What I do expect is that if enough negative noise is made - that someone there will notice what a POS job Dave Scott is doing overseeing this franchise.

I firmly believe that’s what it will take. Ownership is definitely a current problem, because there is clearly nobody competent to oversee Fletcher.

Proof? He’s still employed as of this second. Countless other organizations have shown recently to have higher standards.

 

[LegionOfDoom91]

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

Coming from a guy who didn’t want to talk about the past with this organization in his PC… probably best he sits this one out.