2022/23 Roster Thread III: Run It Back!

[Starat327]

Nike. Just don’t do it.

 

[mja]

“Goofy”? “Pathetic”?

In 19/20,

DeAngelo had 53 points in 68 games
Gaudreau had 58 points in 70 games

And all I suggested was a bet they’d be within 20 points of each other.

Come on, man. Gaudreau just outscored him by 64 points. Even if you want to pro-rate DeAngelo's production over the full year, it's still a 50 point gap. Sure, given the right set of circumstances, almost anything can happen, but what's even the point of this except mindless optimism?

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Come on, man. Gaudreau just outscored him by 64 points. Even if you want to pro-rate DeAngelo's production over the full year, it's still a 50 point gap. Sure, given the right set of circumstances, almost anything can happen, but what's even the point of this except mindless optimism?

You’re calling my bet that TDA & Gaudreau will be within 20 points of each other “goofy” & “pathetic” when just two seasons ago they were within 5 points of each other.

 

[mja]

You’re calling my bet that TDA & Gaudreau will be within 20 points of each other “goofy” & “pathetic” when just two seasons ago they were within 5 points of each other.

The goofy and pathetic part isn't so much the bet, but rather your apparent need to point to anything, no matter how improbable or ultimately meaningless, to continue to delude yourself that we're in a good spot.

 

[Beef Invictus]

In that case we were right to dump Ghost?

But that's ex post, at the time he had three subpar seasons, both knees scoped.
So if Hayes is 100% and gets 50+ points, we shoud then keep him b/c his past doesn't matter?

Has Hayes gotten better at defense and has he stopped reducing the offensive output of his linemates, on top of actually being able to stay healthy?

 

[Evergreen]

Has anybody here been following the investigation surrounding the 2018 WJC sexual assault? Hart’s agent came out with a very vague statement about Hart’s involvement that suggests he was present. I have no idea whether Hart was actually involved physically, but at the very least you’ve got to think this whole thing might be weighing over him. Hopefully it doesn’t affect Hart’s mental state going into a big season for him.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

Has anybody here been following the investigation surrounding the 2018 WJC sexual assault? Hart’s agent came out with a very vague statement about Hart’s involvement that suggests he was present. I have no idea whether Hart was actually involved physically, but at the very least you’ve got to think this whole thing might be weighing over him. Hopefully it doesn’t affect Hart’s mental state going into a big season for him.

The statement that they released didn't suggest that he was present in any way at least with how I read it. Did that same statement leave some room for legal weaseling? Very much so but it didn't suggest that he was present.

 

[Fight4yourRight]

Has anybody here been following the investigation surrounding the 2018 WJC sexual assault? Hart’s agent came out with a very vague statement about Hart’s involvement that suggests he was present. I have no idea whether Hart was actually involved physically, but at the very least you’ve got to think this whole thing might be weighing over him. Hopefully it doesn’t affect Hart’s mental state going into a big season for him.

Who gives a shit? I feel for the girl only. For the players who weren’t involved, they have a clear mind. If a player’s mental state is indeed a mess because of this investigation, it is not a good sign.

 

[Evergreen]

Who gives a shit? I feel for the girl only. For the players who weren’t involved, they have a clear mind. If a player’s mental state is indeed a mess because of this investigation, it is not a good sign.

I absolutely agree with you. I’m just bringing this up because I haven’t seen a lot of discussion about the situation as it relates to Hart but I could see this whole thing blowing up quite soon.

 

[Evergreen]

The statement that they released didn't suggest that he was present in any way at least with how I read it. Did that same statement leave some room for legal weaseling? Very much so but it didn't suggest that he was present.

If he weren’t there you’d think that would be made very clear in the statement so as to remove all doubt regarding his involvement. Other players who weren’t present made that very clear in their statements. Just saying Hart was “not engaged in wrongdoing” at best leaves plenty of room for doubt and interpretation. Especially when that claim appears to rest upon further claim that these individuals were “cleared of wrongdoing” by the police. But that’s not what police do.

In any case, I hope Carter was not involved in this. I’m very sorry for the poor girl and I hope that those who were involved face appropriate repercussions.

 

[deadhead]

Has Hayes gotten better at defense and has he stopped reducing the offensive output of his linemates, on top of actually being able to stay healthy?

Let's see what happens this season.

Hayes healthy and playing for Torts is unknown territory.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

If he weren’t there you’d think that would be made very clear in the statement so as to remove all doubt regarding his involvement. Other players who weren’t present made that very clear in their statements. Just saying Hart was “not engaged in wrongdoing” at best leaves plenty of room for doubt and interpretation. Especially when that claim appears to rest upon further claim that these individuals were “cleared of wrongdoing” by the police. But that’s not what police do.

In any case, I hope Carter was not involved in this. I’m very sorry for the poor girl and I hope that those who were involved face appropriate repercussions.

Those are two completely different things though. The statement never suggested that he was there. It just wasn't as firm as it should/could have been to remove all doubt which is a fairly reasonable stance and is one that i've been talking about myself in other threads.

It was a statement crafted by a lawyer in which they're essentially saying that the six players that they represent committed no wrong doing based off of the the "investigation" which showed that no wrongdoing had occurred. That's weak because the investigation itself is one of the main things that is being criticized during this situation.

 

[Evergreen]

Those are two completely different things though. The statement never suggested that he was there. It just wasn't as firm as it should/could have been to remove all doubt which is a fairly reasonable stance and is one that i've been talking about myself in other threads.

It was a statement crafted by a lawyer in which they're essentially saying that the six players that they represent committed no wrong doing based off of the the "investigation" which showed that no wrongdoing had occurred. That's weak because the investigation itself is one of the main things that is being criticized during this situation.

I don’t agree that those are two separate things. By not explicitly stating that Hart wasn’t there, when that would be the best way to defend his innocence, the statement strongly implies that he was there.

Regardless it’s a stupid thing to argue about. I agree with your second point about relying on the outcome of the initial investigation to establish your innocence is weak when the investigation itself was severely flawed.

 

[Hanover Fist]

Has anybody seen any updates on Sean’s recovery?

 

[Curufinwe]

Yeah, I can imagine Fletcher going to Holmgren in 2019 and telling him since Patrick is damaged goods, I'm writing off the season b/c there's no center worth paying, and AV will just have to be patient.

In your imaginary world Fletcher had to sign Hayes because of Holmgren, but then three years later Homer allowed Fletcher to let the biggest free agent on the market, a 40 goal/115 point forward, go to Columbus even though he was begging to be a Flyer.

On that other hand, staying healthy is valuable in and of itself. Inability to do so should be factored in.

You might say that the most important ability is availability.

 

[Curufinwe]

In that case we were right to dump Ghost?

Ghost played 82 games last season.

Risto played 66. Ellis played 4.

 

[PhillyWings]

Let's see what happens this season.

Hayes healthy and playing for Torts is unknown territory.

Can't teach an old dog new tricks.

 

[deadhead]

In your imaginary world Fletcher had to sign Hayes because of Holmgren, but then three years later Homer allowed Fletcher to let the biggest free agent on the market, a 40 goal/115 point forward, go to Columbus even though he was begging to be a Flyer.

In 2018 Holmgren made it clear that Fletcher was hired with a "bias for action," his words.

This summer, we'll find out what was going on behind the scenes at some point, but it's clear that JG wasn't Fletcher's priority, and maybe not the FO - maybe there's an internal civil war, maybe they finally realized they weren't competing for the Cup the next couple years and didn't want a $10M contract for a 29 year old player (Couts at 30 only makes $7.5M).

Timing is everything, obviously something changed between the TDL when they resigned Risto when they were prepared to trade him and the summer. TDA was a short-term move that wouldn't block a rebuild/reload and might accelerate it. But it did block a JG signing.

The interesting thing is Torts was supposed to signal a lack of patience, yet none of the teams that hired him (maybe Van and that didn't end well) engaged in an "aggressive retool." His MO is more to push his new team, evaluate his players, have the GM make a move or two, then win with whom he has on hand.

 

[DancingPanther]

Has anybody here been following the investigation surrounding the 2018 WJC sexual assault? Hart’s agent came out with a very vague statement about Hart’s involvement that suggests he was present. I have no idea whether Hart was actually involved physically, but at the very least you’ve got to think this whole thing might be weighing over him. Hopefully it doesn’t affect Hart’s mental state going into a big season for him.

Wait what? There's an investigation?

 

[deadhead]

Can't teach an old dog new tricks.

Sure you can, I have. Or at least reinforce their better behaviors.

 

[bobbythebrain]

Wait what? There's an investigation?

Apparently there is video and text showing it was consensual. Probably not gonna go too far

 

[Beef Invictus]

In 2018 Holmgren made it clear that Fletcher was hired with a "bias for action," his words.

This summer, we'll find out what was going on behind the scenes at some point, but it's clear that JG wasn't Fletcher's priority, and maybe not the FO - maybe there's an internal civil war, maybe they finally realized they weren't competing for the Cup the next couple years and didn't want a $10M contract for a 29 year old player (Couts at 30 only makes $7.5M).

Timing is everything, obviously something changed between the TDL when they resigned Risto when they were prepared to trade him and the summer. TDA was a short-term move that wouldn't block a rebuild/reload and might accelerate it. But it did block a JG signing.

The interesting thing is Torts was supposed to signal a lack of patience, yet none of the teams that hired him (maybe Van and that didn't end well) engaged in an "aggressive retool." His MO is more to push his new team, evaluate his players, have the GM make a move or two, then win with whom he has on hand.

There is no civil war. There may be grumbling and malcontent, but Fletcher holds all power. Every decision is his. He isn't forced into anything.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

Apparently there is video and text showing it was consensual. Probably not gonna go too far

Yeah, that's not how it works. It's not remotely that simple.

 

[Starat327]

Yeah, that's not how it works. It's not remotely that simple.

@Hollywood Cannon is making me say all the things I'm about to say.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

@Hollywood Cannon is making me say all the things I'm about to say.

Take a word of advice from @JojoTheWhale type it out and then delete it.