Speculation: 2022-2023 General Lightning Discussion - Part 2

[Bartleby]

It wasn't a good hit that Cernak laid out but how many f***ing times is Okposo going to stare at his ankles and get run over in this league?

The "she was asking for it" defense. Two games is fair.

 

[Point21]

Would something around Domi (50%) and Lafferty for a package around Foote, Vladdy, a prospect like Fortier, and a couple picks be worth it? would leave us with 1.4m in cap to make another move for a dman like TVR and it overkills our bottom 6 core and gets Bellemare out of the lineup

 

[JTBF81]

Would something around Domi (50%) and Lafferty for a package around Foote, Vladdy, a prospect like Fortier, and a couple picks be worth it? would leave us with 1.4m in cap to make another move for a dman like TVR and it overkills our bottom 6 core and gets Bellemare out of the lineup

Depending on the picks and the prospect, it could be interesting. I would guess the '24 2nd would be included, and probabaly a 3rd either this year or next, but whether Tampa would have to include the '25 1st could be a dealbreaker. McCabe would also be interesting, but to get him with no retention,Tampa would have to move all 3 of Names, Foote, and Myers. With retention on McCabe, it might be too costly for Tampa. If they got Lafferty and Domi@50%, they'd have 1.445 left for an additional move in your example, so with retention, all kinds of dmen could be available depending on what else Tampa was willing to move. Mayfield, TVR, Jensen, Seeler, maybe Walman etc.

 

[CupsOverCash]

Bring Mcd back!

 

[LTIR Trickery]

The "she was asking for it" defense. Two games is fair.

It is, honestly thought it would be more. Okposo has really taken some shots.

 

[These Are The Days]

Agreed. We always tend to depend on one line + PP for scoring in the playoffs. It's gone on for too long for it to be a coincidence rather than just part of the system. I would rather add a two-way guy who can chip in a timely goal or two, but is more here to give us some stability.

Bah humbug. Screw a bunch of PP+1 scoring line logic. This is exactly why Boston hasn't been able to win another Cup or beat us in a series. Just because we nearly pulled it off with that formula last year doesn't mean anything now. I didn't actually expect that it could somehow get even harder for us than it did last year and I'll be damned if we aren't gonna have Remade Leafs+President Boston+Remade NYR on our schedule and God knows what's waiting for us in the Finals

Rolling 1 line is gonna wind up in us getting our asses kicked because we're gonna have to play defense 80% of the game while the ONE LINE that actually dictates play just sits there waiting for it's next shift. We literally lost the Cup to Chicago because of this problem and to the Pens and Capitals. Last year we got injured as can be and our scoring puttered out again


Sell EVERYTHING for one last Cup and get Kane and Gavrikov. If you wanna shut shit down throw Cirelli on the ice with Killer. It's a guaranteed "Nothing's gonna happen" while our scoring lines drive the other team mad and the school bus only needs to figure out 10 minutes a night

You don't beat Boston by turning into Boston. They finally figured out how to roll more than PP+1 scoring line for the first time in like 10 years and they're probably gonna set all the damn records now. You HAVE TO fight fire with fire.


All the boring ass "death by structure" we love to do can wait when until we're up 2 goals. But at this rate 2 goals is all this team is gonna manage when our opponent is throwing EVERYTHING it has at us

 

[Felonious Python]

Would something around Domi (50%) and Lafferty for a package around Foote, Vladdy, a prospect like Fortier, and a couple picks be worth it? would leave us with 1.4m in cap to make another move for a dman like TVR and it overkills our bottom 6 core and gets Bellemare out of the lineup

I don't really think Domi is a fit for us. His reputation is that he's lacking on the defensive side of the game.

The Strengths and Weaknesses of Max Domi's Game

Max Domi figures to be a solid fit for the Columbus Blue Jackets, and Alison Lukan breaks down what he brings.

www.1stohiobattery.com

 

[The Gongshow]

I don't really think Domi is a fit for us. His reputation is that he's lacking on the defensive side of the game.

The Strengths and Weaknesses of Max Domi's Game

Max Domi figures to be a solid fit for the Columbus Blue Jackets, and Alison Lukan breaks down what he brings.

www.1stohiobattery.com

Domi is a hard pass. He's barely a 3rd line player and his reputation isn't worth the headache or draft pick(s).

 

[Pierre Larouche]

Probably quite a bit from non playoff teams based on size alone and skill as a 19 year old in the top Finnish league. He is probably the one prospect i would keep off the table, even over Howard. Huuhtanen screams middle 6 PWF that can put up 20 goals and 40-50 points a year maybe more with PP time

I read Howard isn’t doing much at Minnesota-Duluth, but haven’t seen him play. Any thoughts?

 

[Zwui21]

JBB has usually gone after the 2 way F type, stressing defense 1st but with some scoring ability. Scoring is not the issue, and going out and spending a bunch on some top 6 scoring winger rental isn't the answer. The team has not regressed in terms of offense(unlike what some on here keep saying), but the defense has dropped off compared to the last 3 seasons. Just as a small example, 3 of the last 4 losses, the team scored 3, 4, and 5 goals. I think there's likely enough for 2 or 3 smaller moves, provided Names and one of Foote or Myers are traded. Even if it's just Names, there would be just over 3.2 million available for either two bottom 6 F or one and a dman.

I don't agree. Scoring isn't the issue until it is, we cannot go on a deep playoff run relying on 1 line to score goals + the PP (which isn't reliable enough).
If we wanna go for another run, a quality add on the F department is needed, as well as switching back Paul to top 6 n Cirelli on the 3rd line on a shutdown role.
Add someone that can play and create goals with Stammer 5v5 and our team immediately gets scary good. If not possible add 2 good bottom six players to replace Vladdy and PEB.

If we had the chance I wouldn't say no to a Dman, but I see that department as fully dependant on whether Hedman and Sergy can pull their heads out their asses come playoff time or not.

The window is open now and will be for the next couple of years, gotta try and take advantage of it.

 

[JTBF81]

I don't agree. Scoring isn't the issue until it is, we cannot go on a deep playoff run relying on 1 line to score goals + the PP (which isn't reliable enough).
If we wanna go for another run, a quality add on the F department is needed, as well as switching back Paul to top 6 n Cirelli on the 3rd line on a shutdown role.
Add someone that can play and create goals with Stammer 5v5 and our team immediately gets scary good. If not possible add 2 good bottom six players to replace Vladdy and PEB.

If we had the chance I wouldn't say no to a Dman, but I see that department as fully dependant on whether Hedman and Sergy can pull their heads out their asses come playoff time or not.

The window is open now and will be for the next couple of years, gotta try and take advantage of it.

The team is averaging over 3.5 GF/G, the highest average since the '18-'19 team. They have the personnel and the ability to have goal scoring from more than one line, if they find the right mix. They don't have the assets for a Kane, who from most speculation wants NYR or nothing, nor Meier, who S.J. is apparently wanting a king's ransom for. Tampa acquired their top 6 scoring winger last year with Hagel anyway, and without a '23 or '24 1st, Tampa doesn't have the high end picks soon enough nor the.blue chip prospects to pull off a big fish. They have had a top 5 offense for most of the season as well, while their defense has dropped to middle of the pack from a usual top 5-10 position.



The ability is there to grab 1-2 middle/bottom 6 forwards, some with term, some ufa's. There are also at least half a dozen dmen that could be of help and could fit, if JBB can move out a couple cap hits(Names+Myers ideally, but Names+Foote also probably works). Although dmen do usually take longer to adjust, having that additional depth on the blueline is always helpful, especially given that there always seems to be somebody banged up in that group. I agree that if Hedman doesn't elevate the defensive side of his game it likely won't matter what 4/5 or 5/6 type dman they might get.



I don't agree with burning through much of what they have left for a ufa they can't keep, at least not this season. If they can land a scoring winger with term that they can afford perhaps things are different(not sure how many of those are available). Tampa's window isn't closed after this run, so I'd use lesser assets and picks to boost the bottom 6 and maybe the defense in an attempt to, as JBB said, "make them tougher to play against."

 

[Point21]

I read Howard isn’t doing much at Minnesota-Duluth, but haven’t seen him play. Any thoughts?

He has been struggling a bit this year and im sure a lot has to do with transitioning to the college level. I've heard his play style doesn't fit there. Next year will be a bigger projection of where we could see his development going. He oozes potential as a top 6 winger. just needs to put it all together at the college level first

 

[DFC]

Would something around Domi (50%) and Lafferty for a package around Foote, Vladdy, a prospect like Fortier, and a couple picks be worth it? would leave us with 1.4m in cap to make another move for a dman like TVR and it overkills our bottom 6 core and gets Bellemare out of the lineup

I've always thought Domi wouldn't fit here. Maybe I'm wrong.

Bah humbug. Screw a bunch of PP+1 scoring line logic. This is exactly why Boston hasn't been able to win another Cup or beat us in a series. Just because we nearly pulled it off with that formula last year doesn't mean anything now. I didn't actually expect that it could somehow get even harder for us than it did last year and I'll be damned if we aren't gonna have Remade Leafs+President Boston+Remade NYR on our schedule and God knows what's waiting for us in the Finals

Rolling 1 line is gonna wind up in us getting our asses kicked because we're gonna have to play defense 80% of the game while the ONE LINE that actually dictates play just sits there waiting for it's next shift. We literally lost the Cup to Chicago because of this problem and to the Pens and Capitals. Last year we got injured as can be and our scoring puttered out again


Sell EVERYTHING for one last Cup and get Kane and Gavrikov. If you wanna shut shit down throw Cirelli on the ice with Killer. It's a guaranteed "Nothing's gonna happen" while our scoring lines drive the other team mad and the school bus only needs to figure out 10 minutes a night

You don't beat Boston by turning into Boston. They finally figured out how to roll more than PP+1 scoring line for the first time in like 10 years and they're probably gonna set all the damn records now. You HAVE TO fight fire with fire.


All the boring ass "death by structure" we love to do can wait when until we're up 2 goals. But at this rate 2 goals is all this team is gonna manage when our opponent is throwing EVERYTHING it has at us

We used that formula to win two cups. "More scoring" just isnt the answer, because it wont change the way we play come playoff time.

It's not that we only have one good line. It's that we have one line that tends to score a lot. The others chip in, but you have to go all the way back to Filppula to remember a second line that scored a lot.

 

[These Are The Days]

I've always thought Domi wouldn't fit here. Maybe I'm wrong.

We used that formula to win two cups. "More scoring" just isnt the answer, because it wont change the way we play come playoff time.

It's not that we only have one good line. It's that we have one line that tends to score a lot. The others chip in, but you have to go all the way back to Filppula to remember a second line that scored a lot.

Yet come playoff time the Filppula line did jack. I'm not looking for more offense, I'm looking for consistency. We're turning into Boston and I know how that story ends. We're gonna need a goal and Coop is just gonna stack Point, Stamkos and Kucherov like they're the perfection line because no one else in the lineup is getting it done. We're not winning 4 series like this. We have like 2 dozen combinations that could probably work to shut teams down and only 1 that can score a goal when asked.

I don't like it man

 

[Point21]

 

[DFC]

Yet come playoff time the Filppula line did jack. I'm not looking for more offense, I'm looking for consistency. We're turning into Boston and I know how that story ends. We're gonna need a goal and Coop is just gonna stack Point, Stamkos and Kucherov like they're the perfection line because no one else in the lineup is getting it done. We're not winning 4 series like this. We have like 2 dozen combinations that could probably work to shut teams down and only 1 that can score a goal when asked.

I don't like it man

My point is it's not actually a roster problem. The same thing happens no matter who is on the roster. So if you really want to change it, you're gonna have to talk to Cooper, and tell him the strategy he used to win two cups isn't gonna be good enough this year.

The thing is, there are weaknesses on the team. It's just that scoring isnt one of them. When the playoffs start, we rely on superb attention to detail, no matter who is on the roster. But there are guys in the bottom six who just might not be good enough to play their role, and there's at least one defenseman who cant keep up well enough to pay that attention to detail.

I would rather address those legitimate holes than try to turn into the 2022 Panthers.

 

[Lightning1995]

My point is it's not actually a roster problem. The same thing happens no matter who is on the roster. So if you really want to change it, you're gonna have to talk to Cooper, and tell him the strategy he used to win two cups isn't gonna be good enough this year.

The thing is, there are weaknesses on the team. It's just that scoring isnt one of them. When the playoffs start, we rely on superb attention to detail, no matter who is on the roster. But there are guys in the bottom six who just might not be good enough to play their role, and there's at least one defenseman who cant keep up well enough to pay that attention to detail.

I would rather address those legitimate holes than try to turn into the 2022 Panthers.

What Dman are you referring to?

 

[DFC]

What Dman are you referring to?

Mainly Foote, although I think our defense in general could be improved. Foote just needs more sheltering, IMO, and there are times when we can't shelter him at all, which leads to him being scratched (or exposed). I feel like he is a likely candidate for any deal we make though, to go the other way, and his name has been reported as being "out there."

 

[Lightning1995]

Mainly Foote, although I think our defense in general could be improved. Foote just needs more sheltering, IMO, and there are times when we can't shelter him at all, which leads to him being scratched (or exposed). I feel like he is a likely candidate for any deal we make though, to go the other way, and his name has been reported as being "out there."

Agree on Foote but he’s not in the top 6. That said we all know a deep run takes more than 6, so I get your point.

 

[DFC]

Agree on Foote but he’s not in the top 6. That said we all know a deep run takes more than 6, so I get your point.

Yeah, it's more like, I don't want to be one injury away from playing Foote over his head. Because, while he can hold his own against grinders etc, the second he gets caught against a real threat, you notice it right away.

I'd like a third pairing D to put a degree of separation between us and that situation.

I just think there are things we can realistically do and then there are pipe dreams. Even without the cap situation, we don't have the assets to out-bid the competition. In the Kane situation, we're talking about Kane telling Chicago he wants to go play in NY. I'm sure if that falls through, he will have a back-up list. But at the point the list extends to several teams, the price goes up, and I don't see how we win a bidding war, given we have to pay a third team to take salary.

 

[Point21]

I think if we go defense, it needs to be someone that will take a top 4 spot over Perbix and Bogo. I much rather get someone that will make our defense better rather than go get someone thats gonna be fighting for a bottom pairing spot with Bogo and Perbix.

Hedman - ?/Cernak
Sergy - ?/Cernak
Cole - Perbix/Bogo

That way Hedman or Sergy has a little more leeway to be more offensive minded with Cernak being back. Yeah we can throw Perbix or Bogo with Hedman but at the same time do we really want Cernak with Cole as a shutdown pair

 

[DFC]

I think if we go defense, it needs to be someone that will take a top 4 spot over Perbix and Bogo. I much rather get someone that will make our defense better rather than go get someone thats gonna be fighting for a bottom pairing spot with Bogo and Perbix.

Hedman - ?/Cernak
Sergy - ?/Cernak
Cole - Perbix/Bogo

That way Hedman or Sergy has a little more leeway to be more offensive minded with Cernak being back. Yeah we can throw Perbix or Bogo with Hedman but at the same time do we really want Cernak with Cole as a shutdown pair

I would love that, but I think it's gonna be outside of our price range. It puts us back in the "we need a top-4 RHD" cycle we go through every year. I think that would be ideal though. I just don't see how we have the assets to pull it off.

Wouldn't surprise me if we circle back on Schenn, if his price really has dropped to a 3rd.

 

[Point21]

I would love that, but I think it's gonna be outside of our price range. It puts us back in the "we need a top-4 RHD" cycle we go through every year. I think that would be ideal though. I just don't see how we have the assets to pull it off.

Wouldn't surprise me if we circle back on Schenn, if his price really has dropped to a 3rd.

i wouldnt mind Schenn but i dont think hes what we need. LA has a couple of potential RHD that could be available, Durzi is a name that comes to mind as he has some offense in his game and hes only 1.7m for this year and next. i know the "Tampa way" is no short dmen but adding some speed to the back end would help alot

 

[Felonious Python]

Braydon Coburn color commentating some games in Wesley Chapel.

 

[Felonious Python]