Speculation: 2021-22 LA Kings News, Rumors, Roster Thread Part VI

[kings11]

Kempe-Kopitar-Brown
Iafallo-Danault-Ardvisson
Andersson-Kupari-Moore
Lemieux-Lizotte-Kaliyev
Grundstrom-Athanasiou-Frk
Turcotte-Byfield-JAD
Tkachev-Madden-Thomas
Lee-Helenius-Chromiak
Simontaival-Pinelli

Doughty-Anderson
Moverare-Roy
Durzi-Bjornfot
Wolanin-Maatta
Clarke-Kirsanov
Faber-Nousiainen
Grans-Doyle
Spence
Strand


Quick
Petersen
Parik
Ingham

that’s where we currently are with the ability to literally trade for anyone or sign any upcoming UFA

 

[Peter James Bond II]

If the Kings had Lucas Raymond and Moritz Seider:

The Kings would have Lucas Raymond on the second line....in Ontario, learning the system. The first line in Ontario is for veterans, that set the example. If Raymond does well, he can get a tall cup of coffee in March. Moritz Seider would be in Ontario too, 2nd pairing and 2nd PP unit. If 3 King defensemen go down or in covid protocol, he would get to come up to taxi squad and be around the Kings team and practice with them. Change my mind...errrr, change the Kings' hierarchy minds.

If Detroit had Quinton Byfield and Alex Turcotte:

Byfield would be on the second line and be playing with Tyler Bertuzzi and have 7 goals and 13 assists. He would be on the 1st PP. He would be excelling in every facet.
Alex Turcotte would be holding down 3C and have 4 goals and 8 assists. He would be on the second PP and PK. He would already be a fan favorite.

 

[Herby]

If the Kings had Lucas Raymond and Moritz Seider:

The Kings would have Lucas Raymond on the second line....in Ontario, learning the system. The first line in Ontario is for veterans, that set the example. If Raymond does well, he can get a tall cup of coffee in March. Moritz Seider would be in Ontario too, 2nd pairing and 2nd PP unit. If 3 King defensemen go down or in covid protocol, he would get to come up to taxi squad and be around the Kings team and practice with them. Change my mind...errrr, change the Kings' hierarchy minds.

If Detroit had Quinton Byfield and Alex Turcotte:

Byfield would be on the second line and be playing with Tyler Bertuzzi and have 7 goals and 13 assists. He would be on the 1st PP. He would be excelling in every facet.
Alex Turcotte would be holding down 3C and have 4 goals and 8 assists. He would be on the second PP and PK. He would already be a fan favorite.

This is said so many times on this board, like its gospel, but still can anyone cite any examples of the Kings slow playing young players and being proven wrong about it? Been slow played here and gone on to be good somewhere else? or be slowplayed here and then show they were really worthy of more once they got a shot?

Alex Turcotte has 3 goals and 10 points in 18 games this season for the Ontario Reign and 0-0 in 3 games for the Kings, but he would have 4 and 12 for the Detroit Red Wings? I am assuming you are projecting that he would have somehow played every game, which is quite the reach based on history.

QB has 1 point in 6 games in the AHL, but if he were in Detroit he would be scoring at a close to a 50 point pace?

And the Detroit guys, you think the Kings who have had Kaliyev up for the entire year would not have given NHL shots to Seider or Raymond?

Is it possible that maybe, just maybe their guys progressed quicker than our guys have?

 

[Kudelski37]

If the Kings had Lucas Raymond and Moritz Seider:

The Kings would have Lucas Raymond on the second line....in Ontario, learning the system. The first line in Ontario is for veterans, that set the example. If Raymond does well, he can get a tall cup of coffee in March. Moritz Seider would be in Ontario too, 2nd pairing and 2nd PP unit. If 3 King defensemen go down or in covid protocol, he would get to come up to taxi squad and be around the Kings team and practice with them. Change my mind...errrr, change the Kings' hierarchy minds.

If Detroit had Quinton Byfield and Alex Turcotte:

Byfield would be on the second line and be playing with Tyler Bertuzzi and have 7 goals and 13 assists. He would be on the 1st PP. He would be excelling in every facet.
Alex Turcotte would be holding down 3C and have 4 goals and 8 assists. He would be on the second PP and PK. He would already be a fan favorite.

Is this a swipe at Kings coaches/management or medical staff?

 

[Peter James Bond II]

Is this a swipe at Kings coaches/management or medical staff?

No Bob, even you were a third line player that got to play games on Gretzky's line. It's more of a compliment to Yzerman, his staff and how they can develop players like Dylan Larkin and Todd Bertuzzi.

 

[All The Kings Men]

So is the problem with scouting? Or did you need to see a list of top-six forwards in the NHL drafted out of the first round? Off the top of my head, there's Jesper Bratt, Jamie Benn, Nikita Kucherov, Yanni Gourde, Ryan O'Reilly, Ondrej Palat, Patrice Bergeron.

I feel like every so often I propose an alternative explanation and every time I do it gets completely ignored...

 

[Kudelski37]

No Bob, even you were a third line player that got to play games on Gretzky's line. It's more of a compliment to Yzerman, his staff and how they can develop players like Dylan Larkin and Todd Bertuzzi.

Even Yzerman can't keep players from getting covid and injuries.

 

[BigKing]

This is said so many times on this board, like its gospel, but still can anyone cite any examples of the Kings slow playing young players and being proven wrong about it? Been slow played here and gone on to be good somewhere else? or be slowplayed here and then show they were really worthy of more once they got a shot?

Alex Turcotte has 3 goals and 10 points in 18 games this season for the Ontario Reign and 0-0 in 3 games for the Kings, but he would have 4 and 12 for the Detroit Red Wings? I am assuming you are projecting that he would have somehow played every game, which is quite the reach based on history.

QB has 1 point in 6 games in the AHL, but if he were in Detroit he would be scoring at a close to a 50 point pace?

And the Detroit guys, you think the Kings who have had Kaliyev up for the entire year would not have given NHL shots to Seider or Raymond?

Is it possible that maybe, just maybe their guys progressed quicker than our guys have?

The prospects are the only thing we've had to get excited about and a good portion of them must pan out and/or get dealt for proven talent or else this whole tank job is for naught. I'm not tossing the entire prospect pool in the garbage but it is 100% fair to say that the bloom is off the rose at this point for several of these guys and nobody should be given grief if they say so. The excuses are there but it doesn't change the fact that the results are what they are. Long way to go to declare booms/busts and whatnot but some on here have real short memories when it comes to having a top ranked prospect pool and what that actually means but, shit, players drafted after Turcotte and Byfield could be better players now and possibly in the future and that is okay.

I feel like it gets ignored every time I say it but Lombardi had a Top 5 pool for 3-4 years with Doughty only counting towards the ranking once. Thing was anchored by Thomas Hickey, Bernier, Purcell, Teubert, Moller etc. Draft position informs these rankings so much but the actual results the further away you get from the draft matter more than say Lias Andersson being a 7th overall pick. We are going to see busts relative to their draft position but, hopefully, we will see some booms as well. Byfield MUST be elite or this thing is f***ed. Lombardi's pool turned out good players but we'd still be without a Cup if he takes Bogosian or anyone else with the Doughty pick.

Players develop at different paces so I'm not saying that all is lost; however, none of the Kings prospects have hit NHL ice and immediately looked like a problem for the rest of the league like Kopitar and Doughty did. That is elite, HHOF caliber stuff so it is special: I get it. Just saying though that it took two of those type of players plus an army of other talent to win those Cups. Call me negative but I am pretty concerned that these types of players are not currently in the pool. It isn't wrong to expect more production out of Turcotte or for him to stay healthy. Byfield has excuses as well but that's the problem: he got drafted and then basically sat on his ass until the WJC and then has barely played this season. This is prime development time and it keeps getting delayed. It's not his fault but that doesn't matter: what matter is it is happening. There is a lot of taking for granted that these guys will all just be studs but Vilardi missing all that development time is a problem. Turcotte in a shaky Wisconsin situation and then an injury-marred, shortened AHL campaign isn't cool. Byfield pretty much not playing until late December? Not good, Bob!

I don't know. I'm just so prepared to be let down since I've been let down by so many Kings prospects dating back to, I don't know, Pavel Rosa? Storr? Aki? When things don't go as expected early on and you are three or four seasons removed from the draft year, well, it is 100% reasonable to be worried: especially if the prospect in question was supposed to be one of the very best of his draft class.

 

[King'sPawn]

I feel like every so often I propose an alternative explanation and every time I do it gets completely ignored...

I'm sorry you feel that way. I honestly don't recall what you've said specifically, but not because it's unimportant.

 

[Telos]

This is said so many times on this board, like its gospel, but still can anyone cite any examples of the Kings slow playing young players and being proven wrong about it? Been slow played here and gone on to be good somewhere else? or be slowplayed here and then show they were really worthy of more once they got a shot?

Alex Turcotte has 3 goals and 10 points in 18 games this season for the Ontario Reign and 0-0 in 3 games for the Kings, but he would have 4 and 12 for the Detroit Red Wings? I am assuming you are projecting that he would have somehow played every game, which is quite the reach based on history.

QB has 1 point in 6 games in the AHL, but if he were in Detroit he would be scoring at a close to a 50 point pace?

And the Detroit guys, you think the Kings who have had Kaliyev up for the entire year would not have given NHL shots to Seider or Raymond?

Is it possible that maybe, just maybe their guys progressed quicker than our guys have?

Maybe, I get what you're saying, but how many other teams have this much difficulty developing a top 6/top 4 player? Obviously, there is definitely a bias in that sure other teams do have difficulty and it mainly feels like we are the only ones because we watch every game and every prospect highlight, but I don't think there is enough bias to say that there isn't something to the Kings development system and stalling some of these very highly touted blue-chip guys routinely.

Chalking it up that everyone was just a bust or lackluster definitely isn't a satisfying answer and seems to be an oversimplification. While elite talent doesn't fall from trees, it seems like a really long time since LA had a young talent just burning it up and belonging on the top line/top pairing while other teams around the league seem to be putting their prospects in those positions and finding some success here or there more than the Kings.

I think the main gripe around the fanbase isn't that our prospects just somehow collectively progressed slower than the rest of the league and we just unluckily picked every long-shot project on the board, but the Kings development system seems out of touch with the positioning and utilization of these guys during the early stages of their career. There are very few teams around the league that aren't playing their blue-chip or first-round prospects on the top 6, top 4, top 2 special team situations. Obviously, there are two competing philosophies there between those that believe good players will be good wherever whenever and those that are convinced that some players are just boom or bust players that need to be in certain situations that benefit their skillset - a perfect example would be someone like Laine. You just know that if the Kings drafted him they'd stick on the bottom 6 next to Kupari or Lizotte and 6-7 seasons later he'd be either not in the NHL or on another team with a career-high of like 14 goals...

 

[Mcsorley47]

The prospects are the only thing we've had to get excited about and a good portion of them must pan out and/or get dealt for proven talent or else this whole tank job is for naught. I'm not tossing the entire prospect pool in the garbage but it is 100% fair to say that the bloom is off the rose at this point for several of these guys and nobody should be given grief if they say so. The excuses are there but it doesn't change the fact that the results are what they are. Long way to go to declare booms/busts and whatnot but some on here have real short memories when it comes to having a top ranked prospect pool and what that actually means but, shit, players drafted after Turcotte and Byfield could be better players now and possibly in the future and that is okay.

I feel like it gets ignored every time I say it but Lombardi had a Top 5 pool for 3-4 years with Doughty only counting towards the ranking once. Thing was anchored by Thomas Hickey, Bernier, Purcell, Teubert, Moller etc. Draft position informs these rankings so much but the actual results the further away you get from the draft matter more than say Lias Andersson being a 7th overall pick. We are going to see busts relative to their draft position but, hopefully, we will see some booms as well. Byfield MUST be elite or this thing is f***ed. Lombardi's pool turned out good players but we'd still be without a Cup if he takes Bogosian or anyone else with the Doughty pick.

Players develop at different paces so I'm not saying that all is lost; however, none of the Kings prospects have hit NHL ice and immediately looked like a problem for the rest of the league like Kopitar and Doughty did. That is elite, HHOF caliber stuff so it is special: I get it. Just saying though that it took two of those type of players plus an army of other talent to win those Cups. Call me negative but I am pretty concerned that these types of players are not currently in the pool. It isn't wrong to expect more production out of Turcotte or for him to stay healthy. Byfield has excuses as well but that's the problem: he got drafted and then basically sat on his ass until the WJC and then has barely played this season. This is prime development time and it keeps getting delayed. It's not his fault but that doesn't matter: what matter is it is happening. There is a lot of taking for granted that these guys will all just be studs but Vilardi missing all that development time is a problem. Turcotte in a shaky Wisconsin situation and then an injury-marred, shortened AHL campaign isn't cool. Byfield pretty much not playing until late December? Not good, Bob!

I don't know. I'm just so prepared to be let down since I've been let down by so many Kings prospects dating back to, I don't know, Pavel Rosa? Storr? Aki? When things don't go as expected early on and you are three or four seasons removed from the draft year, well, it is 100% reasonable to be worried: especially if the prospect in question was supposed to be one of the very best of his draft class.

I think Byfield and Clarke will be elite. If this happens and Turk becomes a poor mans Mike Richards, I’d be happy as f$#&.

I think we really need those two players to hit and if they do, we’re back.

Clarke is going to be a stud! He’s feisty and hates to lose. Kind of like Mr. 8.

 

[Ghetty Green]

Moverare > Mikey

Mikey needs to be a trade chip.

 

[crassbonanza]

Alex Turcotte has 3 goals and 10 points in 18 games this season for the Ontario Reign and 0-0 in 3 games for the Kings, but he would have 4 and 12 for the Detroit Red Wings? I am assuming you are projecting that he would have somehow played every game, which is quite the reach based on history.

QB has 1 point in 6 games in the AHL, but if he were in Detroit he would be scoring at a close to a 50 point pace?

Honestly reading that puts the concern in perspective. Whether it is scouting or development, we have two lottery picks struggling in the AHL currently, blue chippers who can't even dominate with the Reign. People are already penciling Byfield into the 1st line center position, but 1 point in 6 games is rough. I know there is development time, but you have guys like Raymond, Stutzle, Mercer, Lundell and Jarvis from his draft putting up more than a half point per game in the NHL this season. To be fair, Lafreniere has not been great either, but he still has 11 points in 35 games this year. From Turcs draft year you have a lot of playerss making impacts in the NHL; Zegras, Seider, Hughes, Cozens, Dach, Hoglander, Kakko, Newhook, Byram, Tomasino and even Kaliyev have all scored more than 10 points in the NHL this year. Clarke being left off of the WJC for whatever reason is just another issue. It all may work out and I would love this comment to be dug up 5 years from now, but our blue chippers have not had a trajectory that inspires confidence.

 

[Schmooley]

Honestly reading that puts the concern in perspective. Whether it is scouting or development, we have two lottery picks struggling in the AHL currently, blue chippers who can't even dominate with the Reign. People are already penciling Byfield into the 1st line center position, but 1 point in 6 games is rough. I know there is development time, but you have guys like Raymond, Stutzle, Mercer, Lundell and Jarvis from his draft putting up more than a half point per game in the NHL this season. To be fair, Lafreniere has not been great either, but he still has 11 points in 35 games this year. From Turcs draft year you have a lot of playerss making impacts in the NHL; Zegras, Seider, Hughes, Cozens, Dach, Hoglander, Kakko, Newhook, Byram, Tomasino and even Kaliyev have all scored more than 10 points in the NHL this year. Clarke being left off of the WJC for whatever reason is just another issue. It all may work out and I would love this comment to be dug up 5 years from now, but our blue chippers have not had a trajectory that inspires confidence.

Byfield is going to be the #1c after Kopitar. You dont think hes gonna be good?

 

[kingsfan28]

If the Kings had Lucas Raymond and Moritz Seider:

The Kings would have Lucas Raymond on the second line....in Ontario, learning the system. The first line in Ontario is for veterans, that set the example. If Raymond does well, he can get a tall cup of coffee in March. Moritz Seider would be in Ontario too, 2nd pairing and 2nd PP unit. If 3 King defensemen go down or in covid protocol, he would get to come up to taxi squad and be around the Kings team and practice with them. Change my mind...errrr, change the Kings' hierarchy minds.

If Detroit had Quinton Byfield and Alex Turcotte:

Byfield would be on the second line and be playing with Tyler Bertuzzi and have 7 goals and 13 assists. He would be on the 1st PP. He would be excelling in every facet.
Alex Turcotte would be holding down 3C and have 4 goals and 8 assists. He would be on the second PP and PK. He would already be a fan favorite.

Oh god, not this crap again! [Insert Detroit instead of anaheim]

I'll make it easy...Had Byfield/Turcotte not got hurt he'd be playing 3rd line center and we may be talking about him like we are about Zegras or Raymond. Instead we have Kupari [a highly touted prospect] and his whopping 3g -3a in 31 games, who has shown no signs of being a regular scorer in the NHL or anything else.

 

[crassbonanza]

Byfield is going to be the #1c after Kopitar. You dont think hes gonna be good?

I guess good is relative. I think Byfield will be a good NHLer no doubt, but I am concerned about whether he will be a 1c, nevermind an elite 1c. Kopi put up 61 points in his D+1 season, Kopi was always on the verge of elite so I think he is a good comparison, especially because we expect Byfield to replace him. I remember Kopitar making a fool of Pronger wide for his first NHL goal and I knew he would be a star. I have yet to see anything similar from Byfield, there are a number of factors from injuries to lockdowns, but you have to admit there is some concern about his elite potential. Again, I want my comment to be dug up at one point to show how wrong I was, but Byfield and Turc have had concerning development profiles in my opinion.

 

[crassbonanza]

Had Byfield/Turcotte not got hurt he'd be playing 3rd line center and we may be talking about him like we are about Zegras or Raymond.

Raymond currently has 29 points in 34 games, which is tied with Kopitar. Zegras has 25 points in 30 games, which is 5 points better than any player on the Kings other than Kopi. Our prospects would be putting up those points on the Kings as a 3rd line center?

Nobody would be bitching about development if we had saw star potential like the two you mentioned, but instead we are seeing a combined 11 points in 24 games in the AHL from our blue chippers.

 

[Statto]

Let’s not worry about QB just yet he’s coming of a relatively bad broken ankle which was giving him discomfort his first few games back and then had a bought of Covid. He looked good in preseason and hasn’t yet got going on his comeback, effectively in another preseason. I don’t think there is any way anyone can say he’s struggling or doing well because he quite simply has been in the situation to demonstrate that one way or the other. Given it’s the ankle he broke it could easily be something that he feels for a little while yet depending on how much ligament involvement there was. He’s now has a few games back since Covid (no idea on how affected he was) so I’d personally give it this weekend also and from there on out I’ll start judging it. I’m betting he’s in LA by the end of February, if not sooner.

 

[Schmooley]

I guess good is relative. I think Byfield will be a good NHLer no doubt, but I am concerned about whether he will be a 1c, nevermind an elite 1c. Kopi put up 61 points in his D+1 season, Kopi was always on the verge of elite so I think he is a good comparison, especially because we expect Byfield to replace him. I remember Kopitar making a fool of Pronger wide for his first NHL goal and I knew he would be a star. I have yet to see anything similar from Byfield, there are a number of factors from injuries to lockdowns, but you have to admit there is some concern about his elite potential. Again, I want my comment to be dug up at one point to show how wrong I was, but Byfield and Turc have had concerning development profiles in my opinion.

I can see being concerned but its early. Byfield is further away than Kopitar was at the time but theres no reason why he shouldnt get to that level. He doesnt have the finesse of Kopitar but may make up for it in other ways.

 

[kilowatt]

Kopi had six points in his first three games as a King and he was younger than Byfield is now. Rookie Kopitar was so f***ing good and he made his debut at 19 years and 43 days. Absurd.

Los Angeles Kings at Anaheim Ducks Box Score — October 6, 2006 | Hockey-Reference.com

Here's the box score from his first game. Raitis Ivanans fought Todd Fedoruk, Kopitar's second goal of the game was assisted by Kevin Dallman and Dan Cloutier, and Sean O'Donnell assisted on a Ryan Getzlaf goal.

Oh, and Kopi played 22:16, a minute more than Blake himself (and Ivanans played 2:34!)

 

[LAKings88]

Byfield has had a difficult couple of years. His potential is still huge tho.

 

[johnjm22]

From Turcs draft year you have a lot of playerss making impacts in the NHL; Zegras, Seider, Hughes, Cozens, Dach, Hoglander, Kakko, Newhook, Byram, Tomasino and even Kaliyev have all scored more than 10 points in the NHL this year.

And Boldy has been fantastic also. He made his NHL debut the other night and of course he scored a goal.

He's another player that would get taken ahead of Turcotte if you were redoing that draft.

 

[KingsFan7824]

If the Kings had Lucas Raymond and Moritz Seider:

The Kings would have Lucas Raymond on the second line....in Ontario, learning the system. The first line in Ontario is for veterans, that set the example. If Raymond does well, he can get a tall cup of coffee in March. Moritz Seider would be in Ontario too, 2nd pairing and 2nd PP unit. If 3 King defensemen go down or in covid protocol, he would get to come up to taxi squad and be around the Kings team and practice with them. Change my mind...errrr, change the Kings' hierarchy minds.

If Detroit had Quinton Byfield and Alex Turcotte:

Byfield would be on the second line and be playing with Tyler Bertuzzi and have 7 goals and 13 assists. He would be on the 1st PP. He would be excelling in every facet.
Alex Turcotte would be holding down 3C and have 4 goals and 8 assists. He would be on the second PP and PK. He would already be a fan favorite.

Pay no attention to Anderson and Bjornfot on defense, who were going to be on the team regardless of who else was hurt.

But that can't really count as a current example, because it already happened.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

And Boldy has been fantastic also. He made his NHL debut the other night and of course he scored a goal.

He's another player that would get taken ahead of Turcotte if you were redoing that draft.

Can't tell if you are sarcastic or not, I'm going with not......

Yea, Boldy has been a goddamn animal this year, he is clearly the #1 reason why Minnesota is having a great year, 119 goals scored, and he's been involved in .008% of them, that's a goddamn miracle, how the f*** did he not go #1 ?

Am I doing this shit right?

 

[johnjm22]

Can't tell if you are sarcastic or not, I'm going with not......

Yea, Boldy has been a goddamn animal this year, he is clearly the #1 reason why Minnesota is having a great year, 119 goals scored, and he's been involved in .008% of them, that's a goddamn miracle, how the f*** did he not go #1 ?

Am I doing this shit right?

What are you talking about? He's played 1 game in the Minnesota. I can't tell if your post is sarcastic or not.

Boldy has been fantastic since being drafted.