Speculation: 2021-21 LA Kings News/Rumors/Roster discussion

[KingsFan7824]

...or you need to creatively circumvent the Cap...
...or you need the league to coddle you and not make you build your team the way everyone else has had to / does...

I think the league, made up of the owners, thought they could use Vegas to dump some bad contracts there. That's why Vegas had to use whatever % of the cap they had to use in the expansion draft. They couldn't take just the cheapest guys. They had to have some substantial contracts in there too.

To their credit, Vegas not only did that, but then they also took advantage of some teams, and then on top of that used some cap space to improve the team. Had the team started out poorly in 17-18, maybe the last 4 years for them are different, but they shot right out of the gate, and weaponized their lack of awful contracts. They probably have a few now, but the players still seem hungry. They have a good thing going.

 

[Herby]

Never understood why people get mad when stuff is discussed, especially in a dead time of the year for the Kings.

That is the great thing about a messageboard, if you don't want to read something people are discussing just scroll down until you find something to your liking.

 

[Herby]

Biggest problem - multiple coaches and GMs and the offense is still among the worst in the league. Nearly 20 years it's been complete trash. Last season was nearly unwatchable, especially during the final 20 games. Kopitar should have 1250+ points by now.

Because the Kings do not value speed and skill as much as they value grit, size and two-way play, remember the "flavor of the month" or whatever it was Lombardi said about the Penguins? And that mind-set has continued with the "changing of the regimes" which still kept the same people in positions of power both at the professional level and with the scouting staff who hold the same views.

There is simply no other conclusion to come to based on how this team has drafted for the past 15 years. It should surprise no one with how bad this offense has been forever. The Kings have not drafted anything resembling a star forward in 16 years, that is just insane.

 

[Papa Mocha 15]

I still miss a high octane offense. Herby is right in that case. I'm not expecting big changes in how we draft or coach until we get get a GM that plans to change the style that LA is going to play. Not just small tweaks which is what I feel we have at the moment. Need new management. Appreciate Luckys contributions but I don't see LA moving along for awhile.

 

[funky]

I loved Dean. He lead us to the promise land twice, but I was okay letting him go because of the recent decisions he had made.

In comes Blake, I like him as a player, hated that he wanted a trade but we ended up with Deadmarsh whom for about a season and a half was my new favorite. And we added a Ziggy so Blake was forget about.

Blake held the team together a bit long but does it really matter. He had to see what they actually had. We have to remember it takes two teams to trade and other that Kopitar and Drew most our guys looked like crap compared to the salaries they had.

now his team has retained our two best players and has one of the best prospect pool in The league. It is to early to judge how this turns out but we are headed in the right direction

I don’t care if the first few years are criticized because everyone is allowed their opinion. Dean had Cloutier Blake had Kovy.

I am just very excited to see where the next two years takes us as it will be the true test of our organization and their ability to rebound. In my mind it looks great so far. Let’s see if ownership has the stones to take this to the next level

 

[kilowatt]

Totally off topic, but I'd love to trade for Cam York. I wonder if we could swing a trade with Philly in which we take JVR and get York in the deal.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

The Kings are in a rebuild because of Lombardi. Good run, but we are paying for it now.

Speaking of rebuilds, Kings were rumored to be looking at players with 2-3 years on their contracts. Wonder if grabbing an Eriksson 1 year, Lucic 2 year, Neal 2 years could add some extra assets. Might as well utilize the extra cap. Sutter won't want to part with Lucic though.

For sure. Yet, everyone knew that would be the case.

GMs live long enough to become the villain. None stick around forever. Look at the Hawks 3 Cups--only 2 of them were with Bowman, and they're in the same boat now. Bruins, Sweeny looks like he's done the right things, but their only Cup is with Chiarelli. TBL, Yzerman has moved on. Etc--in other words, DL getting canned isn't necessarily due to his 'mistakes,' it's the lifecycle of pro sports.

I know more than a few of us would have been comfortable with DL staying on for a rebuild if he could acknowledge it was time. Hell, if nothing else, he'd be killing it from a culture standpoint.

I still miss a high octane offense. Herby is right in that case. I'm not expecting big changes in how we draft or coach until we get get a GM that plans to change the style that LA is going to play. Not just small tweaks which is what I feel we have at the moment. Need new management. Appreciate Luckys contributions but I don't see LA moving along for awhile.

Haha. No kidding. We're right smack in the middle of "draft speedy skilled players" but also "play the 1-3-1." what the f*** actually are we doing?

 

[BigKing]

I loved Dean. He lead us to the promise land twice, but I was okay letting him go because of the recent decisions he had made.

In comes Blake, I like him as a player, hated that he wanted a trade but we ended up with Deadmarsh whom for about a season and a half was my new favorite. And we added a Ziggy so Blake was forget about.

Blake held the team together a bit long but does it really matter. He had to see what they actually had. We have to remember it takes two teams to trade and other that Kopitar and Drew most our guys looked like crap compared to the salaries they had.

now his team has retained our two best players and has one of the best prospect pool in The league. It is to early to judge how this turns out but we are headed in the right direction

I don’t care if the first few years are criticized because everyone is allowed their opinion. Dean had Cloutier Blake had Kovy.

I am just very excited to see where the next two years takes us as it will be the true test of our organization and their ability to rebound. In my mind it looks great so far. Let’s see if ownership has the stones to take this to the next level

He was the AGM so he already should have known what they had. He thought they were a contender. That's the whole point. He missed the mark in a massive way. Tons of guys had trade value in the Summer of 17.

 

[DryIslandBartender]

Because the Kings do not value speed and skill as much as they value grit, size and two-way play, remember the "flavor of the month" or whatever it was Lombardi said about the Penguins? And that mind-set has continued with the "changing of the regimes" which still kept the same people in positions of power both at the professional level and with the scouting staff who hold the same views.

There is simply no other conclusion to come to based on how this team has drafted for the past 15 years. It should surprise no one with how bad this offense has been forever. The Kings have not drafted anything resembling a star forward in 16 years, that is just insane.

DL wasn’t wrong about the flavor of the month comment. Even Bluc and the players in their first introductory press conference said they need speed, but never got speed and acquired slow players like Phaneuf/Kovalchuk.

Speed is nothing new in the NHL and was blown out of proportion years ago.

Look at the remaining teams in the playoffs, speed isn’t the determining factor in where they ended up to this point.

 

[Herby]

For sure. Yet, everyone knew that would be the case.

GMs live long enough to become the villain. None stick around forever. Look at the Hawks 3 Cups--only 2 of them were with Bowman, and they're in the same boat now. Bruins, Sweeny looks like he's done the right things, but their only Cup is with Chiarelli. TBL, Yzerman has moved on. Etc--in other words, DL getting canned isn't necessarily due to his 'mistakes,' it's the lifecycle of pro sports.

I know more than a few of us would have been comfortable with DL staying on for a rebuild if he could acknowledge it was time. Hell, if nothing else, he'd be killing it from a culture standpoint.

Coaches, executives and non-star players all have expiration dates. Dean Lombardi and Darryl Sutter's expiration dates came and they were correctly moved on from.

Plus, I am not sure about the culture stuff anymore. As someone else pointed out the culture was declining as much as the product on the ice. Stoll (and who knows who else) busted for coke in Vegas, not buying-out Richards despite being the worst player on the team, the Voynov debacle and embarrassing actions taken by the organization, the Richards border debacle and embarrassing actions taken by the organization, the Sutter lockerroom lockout, Brown being stripped of his C for no reason. Those are not examples of a strong culture.

It was time to move on, only mistake was who they hired.

 

[Herby]

DL wasn’t wrong about the flavor of the month comment. Even Bluc and the players in their first introductory press conference said they need speed, but never got speed and acquired slow players like Phaneuf/Kovalchuk.

Speed is nothing new in the NHL and was blown out of proportion years ago.

Look at the remaining teams in the playoffs, speed isn’t the determining factor in where they ended up to this point.

I disagree, he didn't realize that the game was opening up and the grit and size stuff at the very least had to be complimented by skill. Trading for Lucic and then trying tio double down by signing him to a 7 year deal just proved how out of touch he was.

Again, the Kings have not drafted what would be considered a good 1st line player in 15 years, and it is not bad luck, they have just chosen not focus on those types of players if they also didn't have something like grit, size or two-way play and its cost them the chance to draft some highly skilled players.

 

[johnjm22]

So Owen Power says he's probably going back to the NCAA after the draft.

Buffalo in an interesting position. They're desperate to improve the team right now to placate their core players and fanbase. They also need forwards morose than defensemen.

It's very rare the 1st OA pick gets traded. It hasn't happened since 2003, but I think the chances of it happening this year are much higher than usual.

 

[Herby]

So Owen Power says he's probably going back to the NCAA after the draft.

Buffalo in an interesting position. They're desperate to improve the team right now to placate their core players and fanbase. They're also more interested in forwards than defensemen.

It's very rare the 1st OA pick gets traded. It hasn't happen since 2003, but I think the chances of it happening this year are much higher than usual.

I realize the #1OA has been in the NHL every year since 2006 but Power was simply not dominant enough at the NCAA level last year to warrant a jump, Buffalo might pressure him and he might cave but it won't be the best path for his development. I know people get sick of me saying it, but look it up, NCAA players who return for a sophomore season have significantly better NHL careers than those that don't. There was a good quote from Caufield in one of the local papers where he said he wanted to go pro but was talked out of it by people he trusted and that it was the best decision he ever made. Power seems like a smart kid, having a dominant season (hopefully) in the NCAA and then joining Buffalo for a cup of coffee at the end of the season will be better for his development than either being rushed to the NHL or riding busses in the AHL as a teenager.

I think Buffalo is in it for the long haul here and isn't worried about him being signed or in the NHL next season, they are going to be terrible regardless.

 

[KingsHockey24]

With Eichel on his way out and Buffalo probably needing a replacement would you guys do something like Power for Byfield?

Gets us our much needed young top pairing LHD with lots of size.

 

[Herby]

With Eichel on his way out and Buffalo probably needing a replacement would you guys do something like Power for Byfield?

Gets us our much needed young top pairing LHD with lots of size.

No.

Byfield is a better prospect, period.

Plus, the Kings are in no position to trade their only elite forward prospect for a defenseman. Every rebuild needs a 1C, even more than a 1D. Byfield is the only player in the Kings system with 1C upside.

 

[Schrute farms]

With Eichel on his way out and Buffalo probably needing a replacement would you guys do something like Power for Byfield?

Gets us our much needed young top pairing LHD with lots of size.

No F-ing way would I even consider that.

 

[KingsHockey24]

No.

Byfield is a better prospect, period.

Plus, the Kings are in no position to trade their only elite forward prospect for a defenseman. Every rebuild needs a 1C, even more than a 1D. Byfield is the only player in the Kings system with 1C upside.

What if instead of Byfield it was Turcotte + Kupari/Madden

 

[Trash Panda]

With Eichel on his way out and Buffalo probably needing a replacement would you guys do something like Power for Byfield?

Gets us our much needed young top pairing LHD with lots of size.

Absolutely not.

As soon as Q gets used to his body, the guy is going to be an absolute moose at the NHL level. He will develop slower than most people want, but that’s just fine when you’re almost assuredly going to end up with a quality top line center with size.

 

[Herby]

What if instead of Byfield it was Turcotte + Kupari/Madden

Buffalo would not do that, they would get better offers, neither guy has the star upside that Power has. The Kings are probably not in a position to realistically trade for the #1 pick this year even if Buffalo were to hypothetically trade it. They'd either be giving up to much or to little. There is a huge gap in the Kings prospect pool between #1 and the rest, and Power would fall somewhere between that gap. Plus if Buffalo is doing it because they want immediate NHL help that Power won't provide if he stays in school there is no guarantee that Turcotte and Kupari provide that this season.

I'd be absolutely shocked if Power staying in school and debuting in March or April 2022 instead of October 2021 would warrant Buffalo not taking him #1, he seems pretty consensus at this point.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Byfield would be the 1st overall pick in this years draft if he was born a few days later.

Some people really are just enamored with shinier, new toys.

 

[Fishhead]

Because the Kings do not value speed and skill as much as they value grit, size and two-way play, remember the "flavor of the month" or whatever it was Lombardi said about the Penguins? And that mind-set has continued with the "changing of the regimes" which still kept the same people in positions of power both at the professional level and with the scouting staff who hold the same views.

There is simply no other conclusion to come to based on how this team has drafted for the past 15 years. It should surprise no one with how bad this offense has been forever. The Kings have not drafted anything resembling a star forward in 16 years, that is just insane.

I would say this was the case, but not so sure now. Nearly all the higher picks over the last few years were skill guys, and not big, gritty guys. There was a shift around 2016, here are our picks in the top 3 rounds:

Clague
Vilardi
JAD
Villalta
Shafigullin
Thomas
Kupari
Turcotte
Bjornfot
Kaliyev
Fagemo
Parik
Byfield
Grans
Faber
Simontaival
Laferriere

I don't think many of those guys were taken for size or grit. Two way play, of course you always look for that, but I wouldn't say it was emphasized. Even Lombardi took Clague in 2016, but who else on there would be a typical Kings grit/size/character pick? I think Thomas for sure. Maybe JAD, but maybe they thought he would be undersized. I think Vilardi would have been taken regardless of who was in charge because he was a faller. Turcotte? Maybe, he had a lot of those qualities DL cherished, but with Seider and Cozens right there, I don't think that's a slam dunk.

There are 17 skaters there and only 7 are over 6 feet tall. Going back to the Doughty draft to 2015, there were 22 skaters picked in the top 3 rounds, and 16 were over 6 feet. Not a huge size difference, but there is definitely a shift there. Still, it remains to be seen if they would go after a smaller guy like Savoie or Cooley if they are in their range.

 

[DryIslandBartender]

I disagree, he didn't realize that the game was opening up and the grit and size stuff at the very least had to be complimented by skill. Trading for Lucic and then trying tio double down by signing him to a 7 year deal just proved how out of touch he was.

Again, the Kings have not drafted what would be considered a good 1st line player in 15 years, and it is not bad luck, they have just chosen not focus on those types of players if they also didn't have something like grit, size or two-way play and its cost them the chance to draft some highly skilled players.

The Kings weren’t looking to tear down the roster or change what makes them successful. Goaltending, strong D, and power scheme to overrun the opposition. It is a successful formula for the playoffs as we all saw. Plus we just saw Colorado, a high octane offense get overrun by the Knights. A player like Mark Stone, who isn’t a fast skater by any means, was very effective.

In regards to Lucic, in his lone season with the Kings was he was a 20 goal scorer with 35 assists on the wing. Contrast that with the previous season where the Kings were rolling with Pearson (16 points), Clifford (15 points), Dwight King (26 points) on the left side. I don’t need to tell you that Lucic was a massive upgrade to those guys and filled a huge hole on the roster.

Price was steep in trading Jones, Colin Miller, and a first (Zboril) but Lombardi was in a tough spot with forwards. Stoll and Williams left the Kings, so their leadership was gone.

 

[funky]

What if instead of Byfield it was Turcotte + Kupari/Madden

If I am putting Turcotte and Kupari in a package it would be with another piece for Werenski.

 

[Herby]

I would say this was the case, but not so sure now. Nearly all the higher picks over the last few years were skill guys, and not big, gritty guys. There was a shift around 2016, here are our picks in the top 3 rounds:

Clague
Vilardi
JAD
Villalta
Shafigullin
Thomas
Kupari
Turcotte
Bjornfot
Kaliyev
Fagemo
Parik
Byfield
Grans
Faber
Simontaival
Laferriere

I don't think many of those guys were taken for size or grit. Two way play, of course you always look for that, but I wouldn't say it was emphasized. Even Lombardi took Clague in 2016, but who else on there would be a typical Kings grit/size/character pick? I think Thomas for sure. Maybe JAD, but maybe they thought he would be undersized. I think Vilardi would have been taken regardless of who was in charge because he was a faller. Turcotte? Maybe, he had a lot of those qualities DL cherished, but with Seider and Cozens right there, I don't think that's a slam dunk.

There are 17 skaters there and only 7 are over 6 feet tall. Going back to the Doughty draft to 2015, there were 22 skaters picked in the top 3 rounds, and 16 were over 6 feet. Not a huge size difference, but there is definitely a shift there. Still, it remains to be seen if they would go after a smaller guy like Savoie or Cooley if they are in their range.

They still went with size, two-way play and grit over higher skill in the first round in 2017, 2019 and 2020. We will see how 2020 plays out, my guess is both players turn into superstars so we can toss that one out. But the other ones, it's tough to ignore what some of the players the Kings had a chance to draft have done at the NHL level.

They gambled bigtime by not drafting Arty with #23 in 2019, ultimately you have to give Blake credit for knowing the situation and taking the calculated risk, but had they missed out on Kaliyev it would have been a disaster. I think an organization that more highly valued that type of player would have taken him there and then looked for the future #3 d-man with the next pick, happy it worked out but I still think it shows, (along with their picks in 17 and 19) that there are other things they value more.

If I am putting Turcotte and Kupari in a package it would be with another piece for Werenski.

Feels like Columbus could get more, depending on what your other piece is. Werenski is a stud, one of the best goal-scoring d-man in the league and still only 23 and still an RFA. The return would be pretty massive.

 

[funky]

I think we should also keep in mind what our kids did together in Ontario this year. The team was filled with a bunch of first year pros that got crushed the first ten games and then showed they are a future force the rest of the year. That shows a ton of character. I think we have very solid character in our recent drafts. We have guys like Anderson in the NHL that oozes leadership. I am excited for the future.