2018 NHL Entry Draft Thread (Less then 24 Hours Edition)

[yianik]

If we take Tkachuk at 3rd, is it TT, MB, or both ?

 

[Janne Niinimaa]

If we take Tkachuk at 3rd, is it TT, MB, or both ?

Everyone should be fired.

 

[Redux91]

Everyone should be fired.

i think he means more who's final call is it, and it would be bergevin

but i they do do that, then yes, all shoud be fired

 

[Runner77]

Back to the Mark Edwards inteview on 690, previewing the 2018 draft, here are the highlights:

• Like everyone else here, says that Svech is closer to Dahlin than the guys behind him. After Svech, it becomes a little more difficult to rank nos. 3-6.
• Svech had 40 goals in 44 games in the OHL. Says the OHL is a stronger league overall, when you look at the depth of the rosters compared to the Q where Zadina played. He saw Zadina a lot, says he's a pure goal scorer.
• Behind Zadina, you've got program player Wahlstrom who is similar in the fact that he's a real shooter, pure goal scorer as far as the shot.
• Boqvist is a PMD, a little undersized. He's a little bit slight but likes how quick he moves the puck, it's on the tape and back off in a hurry and it's usually really smart decisions.
• Kotkaniemi would be a stretch for Mtl. to take him, he's the big center closest to the top of the draft, had a pretty good tournament in Russia. Saw him for a week in Michigan in the 5-Nations Tournament, put on a show that week. Was a big turning point for his draft season.
• Kotkaniemi vs. Veleno: Kotkaniemi is more skilled, smarter, makes players around him a little better.
• Has Veleno as an early 2nd rounder, doesn't have scoring ability, doesn't have the highest hockey sense, sees him eventually as a winger.
• Jay O'Brien, played high school hockey for the most part this year, in the Boston area. He's a late birthday, played a few games with US National program early in the year, he was dynamite for those 8-9 shifts he played per game. Has him ranked at late first round, could be an early 2nd.
• Says he's looking for Montreal to trade back in. Very high on Beaudin, has him ahead of Veleno. Beaudin is a PMD. Rates him as one of the smartest players in this draft.
• Tkachuk is much like his brother, if had to choose prefers older brother but not by much. He'll be one of those guys battling for that spot between 3-7 slot. Probably a better skater but not as much a PITA to play against like his brother.
• Says when evaluating players, he wants to look at them in the playoffs, not just the regular season, as it's a different game and wants to see if they become invisible in the playoffs or if they'll still excel.
• Dahlin, Svech and Zadina are safe bets, ready to step in as NHLers next season. Wahlstrom would have a chance but not a high chance. Kotkaniemi with his size, there's a chance but wouldn't bet on him. Tkachuk would have a chance. Maybe Evan Bouchard if drafted high since he has size and is a late birthday. Drops off a little after that.
• Best pure scorer after Svech, is between Zadina and Wahlstrom. He and his staff had Zadina ahead all year but don't have a final assessment until meets with staff.
• His take on what Habs should do: he would try to use some of those 2nd rounders to get to Svech because of the drop off after the 2nd pick. Depending who they have on their board when draft reaches the 20-31 pick area, those 4 2nd rounders are nice ammo to move into that area.

https://www.tsn.ca/radio/montreal-6...ntreal-to-trade-back-in-first-round-1.1072479

To avoid random music and idle chatter, cue it up at 3:53.

 

[Runner77]

Mark Edwards mentioning Jay O'Brien got me intrigued. Saw this write-up from his HF thread:

Neutral Zone did their recap of the recent U18 USA Nationals Tourney - Jay O'Brien was the top player, scouting report of him from the tourney.

Jay O’Brien (R, 6’0”, 175lbs, Cape Cod Whalers, Late ’99)- Most NHL teams were on hand throughout the week to watch Jay O’Brien and gauge just how high up the draft boards he belongs. He opted out of going to the USHL after the season, so this was one of the best chances to see him before the draft and there were several scouting directors in attendance along with the regional scouts. O’Brien didn’t disappoint; he led the tournament in points with 11 in 6 games and was dominant offensively throughout. He’s a polished skater who can pull away from opponents in the neutral zone, he has a rocket release and can shoot to score in stride and with defenders in his face. His stickhandling and creativity with the puck is rare and he’s able to make a lot of opponents miss. Nobody in the tournament could match his skill set and he always had the puck on his stick and was a legit scoring threat every time he was on the ice. Dynamic, skilled, sharp shooting forward who will join Providence next season and should make an immediate impact as a top six forward. (6-5-11, 6GP)

Is he an option for the Habs in the 2nd round or is he too long a project, as a high schooler?

 

[Runner77]

For future reference, updated ranking lists that posters have offered in the current version of this thread. Here's the latest list:

So tough to choose after the top 2. The other players all have big positives, but some small negatives too.

Dahlin
Svechnikov

Boqvist
Wahlstrom (don't know what order for these 3 yet)
Zadina

Hughes
Dobson

Tkachuk
Smith
Bouchard
Kotkaniemi

Picking one-dimensional wingers that can't take over a game or make teammates better is not what I would want from a top-10 pick. Call me crazy, but I haven't seen anything exceptional from Wahlstrom outside of finding space and shooting - if he was a center that could half-assed play defence I'd be all over him, but he's neither of this things. Wahlstrom is an exceptionally talented shooter, he's going to be an impact player in the NHL, and I hate agreeing with Grant - but I'd pretty confidently go with Dobson, Boqvist, or Bouchard ahead of him.

Given his ability to control a game, there should be a lot more love for Bouchard. His skating concerns are way overblown on this board and they aren't going to keep him from being an NHL player. His ability to create offence consistently and with low-risk plays is NHL calibre and something that will likely transition well. He's easily one of the most intelligent players in this draft - he doesn't depend on outstanding skating or size to control a game as it's almost all from strong decision making and good reads. He should be right up there with Dobson as a #4 OA consideration IMO.

1) Dahlin
2) Svechnikov
3) Boqvist
4) Bouchard/Dobson
5) Bouchard/Dobson
6) Zadina
7) Wahlstrom

FWIW

With the draft lottery tonight, it seems like a good time to update and expand my rankings.

1	Rasmus Dahlin
2	Andrei Svechnikov
3	Adam Boqvist
4	Oliver Wahlstrom
5	Filip Zadina
6	Noah Dobson
7	Quinn Hughes
8	Jesperi Kotkaniemi
9	Evan Bouchard
10	Ty Smith
11	Brady Tkachuk
12	Vitali Kravtsov
13	Joel Farabee
14	Grigori Denisenko
15	Isac Lundestrom
16	Martin Kaut
17	Barrett Hayton
18	Joseph Veleno
19	Akil Thomas
20	Bulat Shafigullin
21	Jake Wise
22	Jonatan Berggren
23	Rasmus Sandin
24	Jared McIsaac
25	Ryan Merkley
26	Bode Wilde
27	Dominik Bokk
28	Ty Dellandrea
29	Rasmus Kupari
30	Serron Noel
31	Nils Lundkvist
32	Jacob Olofsson
33	Jonny Tychonick
34	David Gustafsson
35	Filip Hallander
36	Ruslan Ishkakov
37	Cam Hillis
38	Jett Woo
39	Jack Drury
40	Alexander Alexeyev
41	Calen Addison
42	Nicolas Beaudin
43	Danila Zhuravylov
44	Ryan McLeod
45	Liam Foudy
46	Ivan Morozov
47	Johnny Gruden
48	Alexander Khovanov
49	Cole Fonstad
50	Kevin Bahl
51	K'Andre Miller
52	Kirill Marchenko

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

I'm a bit higher on Wilde than I maybe should be, especially when I prefer to look for hockey IQ above all else, but you can't ignore the tools, and I think he can be coached to be at least pretty good defensively at the NHL level.

My new list:

1 - Dahlin
2 - Svechnikov
3 - Zadina
4 - Hughes
5 - Boqvist
6 - Kotkaniemi
7 - Wahlstrom
8 - Dobson
9 - Bouchard
10 - Kravtsov
11- Tkachuk
12 - Farabee
13 - Smith
14 - Sandin
15 - Kupari

Dahlin
Tier
Svechnikov
Tier
Wahlstrom & Boqvist
Tier
Zadina & Hughes & Dobson

Still a work in progress as the ability to raise your game in the next two games in the U-18, CHL play-offs and Memorial Cup will factor in.

1. Rasmus Dahlin D SHL
2. Andrei Svechnikov RW/LW OHL
3. Adam Boqvist D SHL
4. Oliver Wahlstrom C/RW
5. Noah Dobson D QMJHL
6. Filip Zadina LW QMJHL
7. Quinton Hughes D NCAA
8. Jesper Kotkaniemi C FEL
9. Ty Smith D WHL
10. Evan Bouchard D OHL
11. Vitali Kravtsov RW KHL
12. Brady Tkachuk LW NCAA
13. Isaac Lundestrom C SHL
14. Filip Hallander LW Allsvenskan
15. Jonathan Berggren C/RW SHL
16. Joel Farabee LW USHL
17. Akil Thomas C OHL
18. Jacob Olofsson C Allsvenskan
19. Rasmus Sandin D OHL
20. Alexander Alexeyev D WHL
21. Bulat Shaffigullin F KHL
22. Nils Lundkvist D SHL
23. Rasmus Kupari C FEL
24. Barrett Hayton C OHL
25. Ruslan Iskhakov F MHL
26. Ty Dellandrea C OHL
27. Blake McLaughlin C USHL
28. Bode Wilde D USHL
29. Joe Veleno C QMJHL
30. Grigori Denisenko LW KHL
31. Ivan Morozov C MHL
32. Martin Kaut RW Cze
33. Liam Foudy C OHL
34. Danila Zhuravlyov D MHL
35. Ryan Merkley D OHL
36. Jared McIsaac D QMJHL
37. Cameron Hillis C OHL
38. Dominik Bokk RW SEL
39. Philipp Kurashev C QMJHL
40. Johnny Tychonick D BCHL
41. Jett Woo D WHL
42. Jesse Ylonen RW FEL
43. Alexander Khovanov C QMJHL
44. Cole Fonstad C WHL
45. Semyon Der-Arguchintsev C OHL
46. Jake Wise C USHL
47. Calen Addison D WHL
48. Jacob Ragnarsson D Allsvenskan
49. Jacob Bernard-Docker D BCHL
50. Niklas Nordgren RW FEL

Now that the season is over for almost everyone.

1. Rasmus Dahlin
2. Andrei Svechnikov

3. Filip Zadina
4. Oliver Wahlstrom
5. Adam Boqvist
6. Quinn Hughes
7. Jesperi Kotkaniemi
8. Noah Dobson

9. Ty Smith
10. Brady Tkachuk
11. Evan Bouchard
12. Vitaly Kravtsov
13. Jonatan Berggren
14. Joel Farabee
15. Isac Lundestrom
16. Filip Hallander
17. Martin Kaut
18. Nils Lundkvist
19. Alexander Alexeyev
20. Grigori Denisenko

21. Joseph Veleno
22. Rasmus Kupari
23. Ty Dellandrea
24. Jonathan Tychonick
25. Jesse Ylonen
26. Akil Thomas
27. Barrett Hayton
28. Jacob Olofsson
29. Dominik Bokk
30. Rasmus Sandin
31. Liam Foudy

* 3 to 5 is a coin toss. Top 8 players are pretty much set for D-day - though a big finals by Dobson could bump him up. Same for 9-20, with a few players maybe switching here and there as I keep getting more tape in.

Update:

1. Dahlin
2. Svechnikov
3. Zadina
4. Wahlstrom
5. Boqvist
6. Kotkaniemi
7. Dobson
8. Hughes
9. Bouchard
10. Tkachuk
11. Kravtsov
12. Smith
13. Farabee
14. Berggren
15. Kaut
16. Lundeström
17. Kupari
18. Alexeyev
19. Veleno
20. Denisenko
21. Lundkvist
22. Dellandrea
23. Hållander
24. Tychonick
25. Ylönen
26. Gustafsson
27. Hayton
28. Sandin
29. Bokk
30. Olofsson
31. K'AntPlay Miller

K'Antplay showed enough in the later games of the tournament, and at the 5 nations that I'm willing to roll the dice on him. He's actually a very interesting prospect. Big winners for this tournament, IMO, were Berggren, Gustafsson, and Kotkaniemi. Barry and Goose are big time players.

Here is my top 31. This is not how I think the draft will go down, but it's who I like.

I am doing something a little different where I'll put a "grade" just to illustrate the discrepency I see between prospects. It's not scientific like how @ProspectsFanatic did it with his software. This is strictly based on my intrinsic ratings (observations, my interpretation of statistics, general "feel" of the prospect).

1. Rasmus Dahlin (100)
2. Andrei Svechnikov (98)

3. Adam Boqvist (94)
4. Oliver Wahlstrom (92)
5. Filip Zadina (91)
6. Quinn Hughes (90)

7. Noah Dobson (88)
8. Jesperi Kotkaniemi (87)
9. Ty Smith (87)
10. Brady Tkachuk (86)

11. Evan Bouchard (85)
12. Vitaly Kravtsov (84)
13. Filip Hallander (83)
14. Jonatan Berggren (82)
15. Isac Lundestrom (81)
16. Joel Farabee (80)

17. Ty Dellandrea (79)
18. Jonathan Tychonick (77)
19. Rasmus Kupari (77)
20. Martin Kaut (77)
21. Nils Lundkvist (76)
22. Dominik Bokk (75)
23. Alexander Alexeyev (75)
24. Rasmus Sandin (70)

25. Grigori Denisenko (68)
26. Joseph Veleno (68)
27. Jacob Olofsson (67)
28. Barrett Hayton (66)
29. Jesse Ylonen (65)
30. Bode Wilde (64)
31. Liam Foudy (63)

 

[Montreal Impact FC]

zadina has tremendous skills a crazy shot specially heavy wrister and can create space despite his lack of mobility... which makes me believe if he can improve his skating who knows what he could achieve. Svechnikov migjt have explosion but Zadina seems to be a very cerebral player on the making.

tough draft I wont lie and surely would prefer Svechnikov but I still be a bit worried about Zadina having more untapped potential.. they are different.

 

[Montreal Impact FC]

Zadina could also be Pavel Brendl. It's a way to look at things that offers no value.

brendl was known to be a special case he just didnt give a damn.. if i recall right he had so many bad habits. Zadina? the guys is the opposite in terms on dedication and work ethic

 

[Mrb1p]

I have no real idea about O'brien, he's one of the only player i havent seen.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

The Wahlstrom over Zadina notion is the most mindboggling...

 

[Mrb1p]

zadina has tremendous skills a crazy shot specially heavy wrister and can create space despite his lack of mobility... which makes me believe if he can improve his skating who knows what he could achieve. Svechnikov migjt have explosion but Zadina seems to be a very cerebral player on the making.

tough draft I wont lie and surely would prefer Svechnikov but I still be a bit worried about Zadina having more untapped potential.. they are different.

Another one...

 

[Mrb1p]

The Wahlstrom over Zadina notion is the most mindboggling...

No, the Zadina being close to Svechnikov is.

 

[Runner77]

Looking into O'Brien further, seems that he's had a growth spurt, when comparing the write-up in my prior post vs. The Draft Analyst.

The Draft Analyst has him ranked 21st in its list of top 25 centers available to the 2018 draft:

21. Jay O’Brien (Thayer Academy, HS-MA | 5’10, 185): Matching speed with a ferocious appetite for success usually nets good results, so it didn’t come as a surprise that O’Brien recently was named the top high school player in New England. He’s a tough competitor who doesn’t quit on a play regardless of the score or how much time remains on the clock. He’s headed to Providence College in the fall.

And as the Analyst puts it: There’s no way to sugarcoat it – the 2018 NHL draft is one of the thinnest for centers in quite some time. In fact, you have to go back to the 2000 draft to find the last time a pivot was not one of the first 10 players chosen.

Of course, TDA's comments need to be taken with a grain of salt as they exclude Kotkaniemi from the list as they consider him to be a winger.

Back to O'Brien -- is he really 2nd round material? Even those who provided extended lists in this thread, did not include O'Brien in their rankings.

 

[Andrei79]

brendl was known to be a special case he just didnt give a damn.. if i recall right he had so many bad habits. Zadina? the guys is the opposite in terms on dedication and work ethic

Yeah, that was kind of the whole point of that post. Take two players that have nothing to do with each other and try to extrapolate bust potential. It's worthless.

 

[Goldenhands]

Zadina wont play at the WC, didnt make the team.

 

[WinterLion]

As an aside, do any of you buy those draft books and magazines that most appear in June? Aren't they kind of redundant, given the wealth of info that posters here come up with?

I know many of you guys hate him, but I have always liked Kyle Woodlief and "The Red Line Report". Kyle is based in Lake Placid and works with a bunch of scouts. His opinions are often a bit far fetched as he falls in love with certain players and not others, but it's a fun read and it's clear he has seen the players a lot.

The problem I have with many of the others is that they don't have the guts to stray from the common opinion... so they are all very close. Then the draft happens and you see that it actually wasn't so set in stone.

There are some great takes on hfboards of course. I especially like hearing from the European guys because they often have way different biases...

 

[Runner77]

I know many of you guys hate him, but I have always liked Kyle Woodlief and "The Red Line Report". Kyle is based in Lake Placid and works with a bunch of scouts. His opinions are often a bit far fetched as he falls in love with certain players and not others, but it's a fun read and it's clear he has seen the players a lot.

The problem I have with many of the others is that they don't have the guts to stray from the common opinion... so they are all very close. Then the draft happens and you see that it actually wasn't so set in stone.

There are some great takes on hfboards of course. I especially like hearing from the European guys because they often have way different biases...

Back when I used to buy draft reports, my favorite was The Red Line. Woodlief has a unique writing style and as you suggested, he's not afraid to take up a position that strays from the norm. He's very informative and witty and provides several interesting ways to gauge a player's value. I just find it expensive for the amount of content, it tends to be rather brief when compared to competitors. Of course, it's all about quality over quantity, however, there are far fewer player profiles in his offering.

 

[WinterLion]

Back when I used to buy draft reports, my favorite was The Red Line. Woodlief has a unique writing style and as you suggested, he's not afraid to take up a position that strays from the norm. He's very informative and witty and provides several interesting ways to gauge a player's value. I just find it expensive for the amount of content, it tends to be rather brief when compared to competitors. Of course, it's all about quality over quantity, however, there are far fewer player profiles in his offering.

Yeah it's expensive... and hilarious! I haven't seen his report on USAtoday anymore... I used to like his articles. Do you know if he still does those?

 

[Weber Fan]

Do we have a list from Woodlief?

 

[WinterLion]

Zadina wont play at the WC, didnt make the team.

BUST!!

 

[Runner77]

Yeah it's expensive... and hilarious! I haven't seen his report on USAtoday anymore... I used to like his articles. Do you know if he still does those?

I've read somewhere that he hasn't done any reports this year but haven't checked. I used to really like his one-page reports in USA Today. I don't know what happened.

One thing I've also enjoyed were his on-air recaps in June, where he lays out his draft list and provides comments on his choices. You can tell just by the way he expresses himself how it reflects his writing style. He'll rattle off any profile without the benefit of notes, using a very entertaining style and incise langue and has done as much last year when he conducted an interview with TSN 690 as he was driving to the airport. Even while driving, he didn't skip a beat.

Compare that to a habitual mangler who is universally despised on this site, who can't put two sentences together, who is monotone, hems and haws and is mostly about generalities and platitudes. Nothing could have been more stark in terms of contrast, than the day that McCagg was on 690, followed one hour later by Woodlief -- and where both were asked similar questions. I kid you not, it was like day and night.

 

[WinterLion]

I've read somewhere that he hasn't done any reports this year but haven't checked. I used to enjoy his one-page reports in USA Today. I don't know what happened.

One thing I've also enjoyed were his on-air recaps in June, where he lays out his draft list and provides comments on his choices. You can tell just by the way he expresses himself how it reflects his writing style. He'll rattle off any profile without the benefit of notes and has done as much last year when he received a call from TSN 690 as he was driving to the airport. He conducted the interview while driving and didn't skip a beat.

Compare that to a habitual mangler who is universally despised on this site, who can't put two sentences together, who is monotone, hems and haws and is mostly about generalities and platitudes. Nothing could have been more stark in terms of contrast, than the day that McCagg was on 690, followed one hour later by Woodlief -- and where both were asked similar questions. I kid you not, it was like day and night.

Yeah I believe it. If you find anything this year please share!!

I used to like having McCagg on here, but then he thought he was a God and that everyone should bow to his glory... One thing I've learned is that you are going to be wrong. Scouting 18 year olds is a very imperfect science.

 

[Runner77]

Kyle Woodlief's last twitter message had to do with a recent interview he was giving to NHL Network:



I've searched the NHL Network's website, twitter account and YT and it didn't come up.

 

[le_sean]

If we take Tkachuk at 3rd, is it TT, MB, or both ?

TT and his cronies for sure. I really believe Marc just let’s him do what he does. You can’t say that Galchenyuk, Scherbak, Sergachev are what Bergevin envision as his ideal players. You can say “yeah but McCarron” but really, that pick was 25th so they figured they’d try something that didn’t work out.

Plus we need to realize there was a reaction to completely getting destroyed physically by the Sens in the playoffs. This year it was everything, but offence and goal scoring stood out. I don’t think you’re seeing Tkachuk going to Montreal.

 

[The Great Weal]

I was hoping for more from Sandin in the playoffs. I would definitely still take him with our 2nd though.