GDT: 2018 Free Agency: Jay Beagle 4 x 3M, Antoine Roussel 4 x 3.25M, both w/ limited NTCs

[racerjoe]

He never started out on the fourth line or wing kind sir.
And credits the Sedins(veterans) on how to become a pro.

Umm is most certainly started at 4C

 

[CanaFan]

He never started out on the fourth line or wing kind sir.
And credits the Sedins(veterans) on how to become a pro.

His first games were 4th line, then he moved up to third when Richardson got hurt.

Not wing obviously, I assumed you could figure that part out yourself.

 

[canucksfan]

A salary cap means nothing to a rebuilding team, but is critical to a contending team. A rebuilding team does not have to worry about the salary cap as high value free agents will NOT be signing with them. As such it can afford to carry players that can help the young budding stars develop into star players and not bust. By the time the young stars are ready to carry the team, and more assets are needed through free agency, these vets are off the books. This is not a difficult concept to understand for most.

Taking on useless and overpriced contracts limits what the team can do. They can't take on potential buyouts from other teams for picks or prospects. Furthermore, the roster spots are being taken from potential younger players.

While the Canucks aren't a destination for most players that could change soon as the younger players start making contributions. Instead they have put some money into players like Loui, Gagner, Beagle, Sutter and Roussel.

 

[CanaFan]

Umm is most certainly started at 4C

Guess “hawky” knowledge isn’t the same thing as hockey knowledge.

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

I don't disagree with making sure players are ready before they enter the league. I don't even disagree with taking on players like this under the right circumstances, and even overpaying them.

What I have a problem with is putting two players who are 4th liners into our lineup with a gifted spot and a long term deal. The idea is to insulate young players so they are not rushed into the league and playing over their head. It is not to completely block their path to the NHL. Oh and by the way our glut of waiver fodder is surely red meat to other GMs where we have totally shown our cards, and instead of a trade being available, they can just wait til we start waiving people.

If we are banking on any of our top talent to ever play on the fourth line we are in trouble.
These guys should never see the fourth line other then the likes of a Lind or a Gadjovic who are three years away anyways.

 

[passive voice]

Almost none of those players have played an 82 game season you just stated by the way.

Del Zotto, 82, 2017-2018. Horvat, 82, 2015-16. Sutter, 82, 2011-12. Eriksson, 82, 2011-12. Edler, 82, 2011-12. Gagner, 81, 2016-17. Jake just did 75! Tanev's always injured but it's not like he doesn't understand the grind. What are you talking about.

 

[CanaFan]

If we are banking on any of our top talent to ever play on the fourth line we are in trouble.
These guys should never see the fourth line other then the likes of a Lind or a Gadjovic who are three years away anyways.

You don’t need to think so simply. If Roussel plays the 4th line then it means Leipsic plays the 3rd line instead of 4th. And if Leipsic plays 3rd line then Gaudette or Dahlen can’t. So now they either need to be able to handle top 6 roles right away - which is a big step up for them - or they have to go to Utica. Like Horvat, it doesn’t hurt to start lower and work your way up when you’re ready. These moves certainly remove that flexibility.

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

The players you physically wrote down. Leipsic etc. All waiver fodder players that have zero value. They are 24 and still can’t crack a regular roster so they need to be replaced.

 

[CherryToke]

We've added more winning culture coattail riders. What are they gonna do, tell stories about the actual leaders on the winning cultures they came from and tell the kids to be like them?

 

[Jay Cee]

The players you physically wrote down. Leipsic etc. All waiver fodder players that have zero value. They are 24 and still can’t crack a regular roster so they need to be replaced.

You realize we just traded a few months ago for value for Leipsic right? Lol. And as for your comment about 4th liners- there are only so many spots on a team for players and some guys have to go through waivers to go to the minors. If you sign two guys to big contracts that is automatic they are making the team regardless of how well they play. That's not the culture you want.

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

You don’t need to think so simply. If Roussel plays the 4th line then it means Leipsic plays the 3rd line instead of 4th. And if Leipsic plays 3rd line then Gaudette or Dahlen can’t. So now they either need to be able to handle top 6 roles right away - which is a big step up for them - or they have to go to Utica. Like Horvat, it doesn’t hurt to start lower and work your way up when you’re ready. These moves certainly remove that flexibility.

Leipsic is not going to be on the team clearly. He also isn’t better then any of the guys we just signed. That is the point of depth he now is in Utica to start the year just like he couldn’t crack Toronto or Vegas’s roster prior to coming here.
They built up their depth and deemed him expandable. Same with Gaunce and Pouliot with Leipsic and even borderline Virtanen even though he deserves one more season to work off his last 20 games.
5 years from now most of these guys will be in Europe

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

You realize we just traded a few months ago for value for Leipsic right? Lol. And as for your comment about 4th liners- there are only so many spots on a team for players and some guys have to go through waivers to go to the minors. If you sign two guys to big contracts that is automatic they are making the team regardless of how well they play. That's not the culture you want.

We traded the Swedish free agent defenseman who never even played a game for him and that’s value? I’m pretty sure he’s a free agent as well right now.

 

[CanaFan]

Leipsic is not going to be on the team clearly. He also isn’t better then any of the guys we just signed. That is the point of depth he now is in Utica to start the year just like he couldn’t crack Toronto or Vegas’s roster prior to coming here.
They built up their depth and deemed him expandable. Same with Gaunce and Pouliot with Leipsic and even borderline Virtanen even though he deserves one more season to work off his last 20 games.
5 years from now most of these guys will be in Europe

You don’t think Leipsic will be on the team?

I think Benning and Green disagree.

 

[rimshot]

Taking on useless and overpriced contracts limits what the team can do. They can't take on potential buyouts from other teams for picks or prospects. Furthermore, the roster spots are being taken from potential younger players.

While the Canucks aren't a destination for most players that could change soon as the younger players start making contributions. Instead they have put some money into players like Loui, Gagner, Beagle, Sutter and Roussel.

Since we are talking about Beagle and Rousell according to the topic heading I would like to know how they could possibly stop the Nucks from taking on another bad contract they are such a small% of the cap and they are nowhere close to the cap in any event and wont be for years. How they are blocking any younger players...please name the defensive specialists at Utica they are blocking. If you want Pettersson or Horvat to play as defensive specialists I dont know what to tell you. These guys are also currency that rebuilding teams use at the trade deadline to acquire more picks. For example the Leafs traded Daniel Winnick twice for multiple second round picks. Theoretically, the Nucks could give Beagle 25 minutes a game at #1 C but if that happens they have a coaching problem not so much a GM problem though they do have a GM problem.

 

[y2kcanucks]

Well thank you for trying to politically enlighten us hockey fans that have strayed into this political discussion board. Although nearly everyone has come here to discuss hockey,you have found it necessary to provide us with some much needed political education and direction. I am sure we all thank you for your efforts in this regard.

Reading comprehension? I don't think I named any political faction, but sure you can make things up like that. Go ahead.

 

[y2kcanucks]

I can just picture how sad and confused Jim is why people don't like his free agent signings.

And the confusion he'll have when no other team wants to trade draft picks or good young prospects for his free agent signings.

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

You don’t think Leipsic will be on the team?

I think Benning and Green disagree.

Not over a Dahlen or Pettersson or Gaudette.
He is not a top six forward and at 5’9 can’t provide the type of game necessary to survive in a bottom six roll.
He might be able to next year but will be surpassed the following year by bigger, better and younger talent.

 

[rimshot]

Reading comprehension? I don't think I named any political faction, but sure you can make things up like that. Go ahead.

Ahhh.. I see, that was a post concerned with hockey not politics.

 

[CanaFan]

Not over a Dahlen or Pettersson or Gaudette.
He is not a top six forward and at 5’9 can’t provide the type of game necessary to survive in a bottom six roll.
He might be able to next year but will be surpassed the following year by bigger, better and younger talent.

While I actually agree with you in terms of Leipsics value, he is definitely in the plans for Benning and Green. His spot is not available for Gaudette.

 

[Jay Cee]

We traded the Swedish free agent defenseman who never even played a game for him and that’s value? I’m pretty sure he’s a free agent as well right now.

So your argument is that we had to sign these mediocre 4th line players because the other 4th line players we acquired before suck even worse?

 

[krutovsdonut]

The players you physically wrote down. Leipsic etc. All waiver fodder players that have zero value. They are 24 and still can’t crack a regular roster so they need to be replaced.

beagle was a regular health scratch until he was 28
roussel didn't play an nhl game until he was 25
schaller became a regular at 25.

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

While I actually agree with you in terms of Leipsics value, he is definitely in the plans for Benning and Green. His spot is not available for Gaudette.

If he was a Center I’d agree but being a winger not a chance.

 

[Cupless44]

Exactly why we have a top three prospect’s pool in the whole league.
See what I did there?
We will have one of the best teams in the league in 5 years. That is how a rebuild works.

No Toronto and Winnipeg are the way rebuilds should work.

And our prospect pool was last rated 7th. It is not top 3 even though we have been a bottom feeder for years now. More draft picks might help that, which is what "rebuilding teams" normally do

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

So your argument is that we had to sign these mediocre 4th line players because the other 4th line players we acquired before suck even worse?

Correct. We now have depth.
If you notice no longer here is Chaput, Megna and Dowd. LaBate and Grenier are gone because we have now evolved as a team.
I’d be the first to drive them to the airport as well.

 

[Cupless44]

Yeah they should have signed more vets to create a better culture like we are.
Finally someone who agrees with me.

The culture that Eriksson, Gagner, Del Zotto brought last year to another bottom 5 finish?