Speculation: 2014 Offseason - Roster Building / Trade Speculation Thread V

[Thirty One]

Brooklyn Rangers Fan referenced an article that refutes this. Like you, I had the same impression about Kristo. Apparently, that is not true. He is a RFA at season's end, 80 games or not.

Link?

 

[Off Sides]

Yes, there is.

Allow the guys to walk that are cashing in from imporved numbers while benefiting from the environment they were in and allowing those spots to be filled from within.

The key here is not to be scared ****-less that a young player may go through some growing pains early in the 2014-15 campaign.

Let Boyle, Poo and Stralman walk.

Let Fast, Miller, Lingberg and Allen play

allow for growing pains as the season churns along.

If the guys that are still here are as good as some posters believe them to be, then we should be fine at the end of the season.

we talk about how good they are/could become. Let's put our money where our mouths are. Let the kids play and grow as an organization.

Let us say they do go with these rookies,

Allen plays the left side although he is a righty shot as far as I have read. Where does he fit or are they just going to move him over to play with Moore and hope for the best? Or move Moore over to accommodate Allen? Regardless how does that pair look?

Miller, at center, playing a defensively responsible game? Or on wing where he has not shown much of any progress?

Fast on RW, behind MSL, Nash and Zucc? Or or they going to move someone over like they tried with Gaborik?

Lindberg at center, on the 4th line, without Boyle, who fills that line out to make it any sort of NHL line? Are they bringing back D Moore? If so why have they not signed him yet?

To me that looks more like we are out of options and not so much like a planned roster.

On top of that when was the last time the Rangers went into a season without scraping the cap ceiling? Is this a new philosophy?

Not trying to be a jerk or anything but I do not have anything to go by except what the Rangers have done in previous off-seasons, bringing in Halpern, Frolov, Kotalik and such to replace lost depth seems much more likely. If that's the case, just resigning their own free agents even if they have to pay a little more than they like makes far more sense.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Hehe, back to reading my post, Rusty!

Leddy is 23 and is arguably the "best case scenario" for Skjei to eventually turn into.

I'll take the sure thing at age 23 every single time.

Skjei could end up being another McIlrath. I personally think he becomes a legit NHL player but I see a very similar skill set to Leddy.

Leddy replaces Staal for almost half the cost, and while he's not nearly as good defensively as Staal, he's better offensively and skates like the wind (something that's becoming more apparent that you need to win(mobile defenders- the days of big lumbering Hal Gills is over.)

Both trades make us a better team this season as we as in a better cap situation going forward:

Locking up a legit 1C at 6mil is going to be a STEAL in a few seasons.
And Leddy at 2.7 hitting RFA is a lot better than Staal at 3.9 hitting UFA.

Take a closer look. Nothing about this trade is negative for us, unless you're a fan who overvalues your own players and think we can't possibly recover from losing Brassard's 4-4.5mil for a 2C and Staal's 3.9mil(soon to be 6+mil) for a second-pairing D. And judging from your posts, I really don't think you are.

I don't think that's feasible to be trading a guy and his potential replacement, no matter the package that you get back.

Staal for ROR, sure. Brassard for Leddy and a later draft pick? Sure.

But Skjei shouldn't be anywhere near a trade package if Staal is shipped off. Regardless of the package returning. IMO, ofcourse.

 

[Zuccarello Awesome*]

Leddy does not have Skjei's upside. He's more comparable to John Moore.

That deal would be a disaster. No need to move Skjei in it

Typical overvaluing of your own.

What has Skjei done in his career to warrant more upside than Leddy (who, by the way, is still developing at age 23)?

Clearly you don't watch many Hawks games.

Sheesh. When I haven't seen enough of a player to accurately contribute to the discussion, I just don't post. It's simple.

I'll sit back and watch the proposals with a 3mil Pouliot and Haggerty pencilled into the third line and expected to be Stamkos on the PP because of a YouTube
Video against 16 year olds. Think about that for a second.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Link?

I don't have it. It was quoted either in the last trade thread or the one before it. He responded to one of my posts that pretty much said the same thing you did about Kristo's 80 game clause.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

Typical overvaluing of your own.

What has Skjei done in his career to warrant more upside than Leddy (who, by the way, is still developing at age 23)?

Clearly you don't watch many Hawks games.

Sheesh. When I haven't seen enough of a player to accurately contribute to the discussion, I just don't post. It's simple.

I'll sit back and watch the proposals with a 3mil Pouliot and Haggerty pencilled into the third line and expected to be Stamkos on the PP because of a YouTube
Video against 16 year olds. Think about that for a second.

Nope I don't watch any Hawks games ever I have never seen Leddy play an NHL game!!!!

 

[NYR Viper]

He's a bit of a cherry picker. Meaning he'll swarm around the blue line when the line is pinned defensively, he won't be able to offer much defensive support, but in the event that someone gets control of the puck, he's off to the races.

He's good in transition, which is important in this system.

He's fast, really fast.

He thinks shoot first, which many on this team don't think. It's good to have a balance of guys that look to feed and others that look to shoot.

He has soft hands, he can control hard passes, he sees the ice really well. Offensively, he'd be able to help the team out, quite a bit. Hypothetically, you'd think he'd be good in a possession style of hockey because he's able to keep plays alive with his offensive talent, and you can flip the puck to him behind the defense and he will get it more times than not... but he's careless with the puck. He forces passes and shots that lead to turnovers and odd man rushes. And that severely hurts him in terms of possession hockey.

He doesn't have a heavy shot. But he does have an accurate one.

This. His speed in transition and skill would be a huge upgrade. I think khe has a NHL future honestly.

 

[haveandare]

Let us say they do go with these rookies,

Allen plays the left side although he is a righty shot as far as I have read. Where does he fit or are they just going to move him over to play with Moore and hope for the best? Or move Moore over to accommodate Allen? Regardless how does that pair look?

Miller, at center, playing a defensively responsible game? Or on wing where he has not shown much of any progress?

Fast on RW, behind MSL, Nash and Zucc? Or or they going to move someone over like they tried with Gaborik?

Lindberg at center, on the 4th line, without Boyle, who fills that line out to make it any sort of NHL line? Are they bringing back D Moore? If so why have they not signed him yet?

To me that looks more like we are out of options and not so much like a planned roster.

On top of that when was the last time the Rangers went into a season without scraping the cap ceiling? Is this a new philosophy?

Not trying to be a jerk or anything but I do not have anything to go by except what the Rangers have done in previous off-seasons, bringing in Halpern, Frolov, Kotalik and such to replace lost depth seems much more likely. If that's the case, just resigning their own free agents even if they ahve to pay a little more than they like makes far more sense.

Av says he wants a few rookies on the team next year. 4 may be too many, but there will be rookies on the team.

Some of these questions you're asking are about whether or not someone can read the future. Who can say if Miller will play defensive or not? Who can say what the pairs might look like on opening day when it's the morning of draft day?

The idea, as I understand it, is to put the kids who are most ready in now that the team needs cap space and bodies. How many, who, what positions, etc etc etc are impossible to say for certain at this point.

 

[haveandare]

Typical overvaluing of your own.

What has Skjei done in his career to warrant more upside than Leddy (who, by the way, is still developing at age 23)?

Clearly you don't watch many Hawks games.

Sheesh. When I haven't seen enough of a player to accurately contribute to the discussion, I just don't post. It's simple.

I'll sit back and watch the proposals with a 3mil Pouliot and Haggerty pencilled into the third line and expected to be Stamkos on the PP because of a YouTube
Video against 16 year olds. Think about that for a second.

You don't agree with me, therefore you don't know what you're talking about!

The ol' HF classic.

Almost as time tested as the misrepresentation of others's posts in order to pump yourself up and bring others down, which you close with.

People can disagree with you and still know what they're talking about. I do.

 

[Thirty One]

I don't have it. It was quoted either in the last trade thread or the one before it. He responded to one of my posts that pretty much said the same thing you did about Kristo's 80 game clause.

This post?

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=86881479&postcount=631

Don't see how that refutes it.

 

[JohnC]

Typical overvaluing of your own.

What has Skjei done in his career to warrant more upside than Leddy (who, by the way, is still developing at age 23)?

Clearly you don't watch many Hawks games.

Sheesh. When I haven't seen enough of a player to accurately contribute to the discussion, I just don't post. It's simple.

I'll sit back and watch the proposals with a 3mil Pouliot and Haggerty pencilled into the third line and expected to be Stamkos on the PP because of a YouTube
Video against 16 year olds. Think about that for a second.

Not many 16 year olds in college where I come from

 

[Zuccarello Awesome*]

I don't think that's feasible to be trading a guy and his potential replacement, no matter the package that you get back.

Staal for ROR, sure. Brassard for Leddy and a later draft pick? Sure.

But Skjei shouldn't be anywhere near a trade package if Staal is shipped off. Regardless of the package returning. IMO, ofcourse.

You do realize you arbitrarily ANNOINTED Skjei as "Staal's replacement."

Especially when their games are complete opposites.

Skjei is like Leddy/Moore/Muzzin/etc basically poor mans Duncan Keith's / Ryan McDonagh's.

Nobody touts Skjei as having this top notch upside except Rangers fans. I've watched him play in person, not just YouTube.

IMO, he'll be lucky to turn into Leddy but he does have he skating going for him so it's possible.

But refusing to upgrade your team because you won't part with a prospect who is by all accounts still more than a year away AT LEAST, and may never play a single NHL game is madness.

Thankfully, Sather would never operate like that. This team is in WIN NOW mode. Brady friggin Skjei isn't holding up ANY deal to improve this team.

 

[Zuccarello Awesome*]

Nope I don't watch any Hawks games ever I have never seen Leddy play an NHL game!!!!

Ignoring the question and giving that type of response implies that you really didn't. That's not a very confident response. Still waiting to hear what Skjei has done to warrant having more upside than 23 y/o Nick Leddy who was already in the NHL at the age Skjei is now and nowhere close to sniffing the NHL.

 

[Machinehead]

The Kings were in win-now mode, still put two rookies in their top 6 this year, and won another Stanley Cup.

 

[Thirty One]

Not many 16 year olds in college where I come from

Explain Doogie Hawser, then.

 

[Ail]

Lol @ growing butt hair.

 

[Off Sides]

Av says he wants a few rookies on the team next year. 4 may be too many, but there will be rookies on the team.

Some of these questions you're asking are about whether or not someone can read the future. Who can say if Miller will play defensive or not? Who can say what the pairs might look like on opening day when it's the morning of draft day?

The idea, as I understand it, is to put the kids who are most ready in now that the team needs cap space and bodies. How many, who, what positions, etc etc etc are impossible to say for certain at this point.

The idea as I am perceiving it, based on them signing exactly no one to this point, it is to save cap space for shopping on Tuesday.

I think that is a mistake, if my perception of what they are likely to do, which is based on what they have done in previous off-seasons, is remotely accurate.

 

[Trxjw]

Leddy is a train wreck in his own end. Even worse than Moore.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

1) You are correct there, give credit to where credit is due.
2) How can you be confident/not confident on a subject matter that you admittedly do not follow? You haven't watched most of our prospects, yet you project confidence (or lack thereof) based on... gut feeling?

Is this you in your workplace?

Boss: "Hey, BRB. I'm taking Bob off the potential acquisition of *X company* project. I'd like you to forecast what type of bottom line we might be able to expect if we improved their operations and invested in newer technology"
BRB: "Well, boss, I don't have much knowledge or expertise in *X company's field* and I won't put in the time to familiarize myself with what they do, how they do it, and how they're trending for the future... but i'll give you a completely *unbiased* projection based on opinion and articles that I read from other people that have gone down and reviewed the company. Also, these people may or may not be completely clueless, and their forecasts may be completely outlandish and unrealistic, but i'll take their word for it anyway to construct my forecast."

Perhaps I'd take your opinion more seriously if you didnt blow sunshine up every single prospect's ass.

Some (and probably most) of these guys aren't going to make it. Yet, throughout various posts you've carved out roster spots for Miller, McIlrath, Allen, Fast, Lindberg, Kristo, etc. Perhaps if you admitted some of these guys wont make it in the NHL, you're message wouldn't be so diluted and I'd trust your opinion more.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

This. His speed in transition and skill would be a huge upgrade. I think khe has a NHL future honestly.

He does. He opened eyes in training camp. I don't tout prospects, usually.

I'm a fan of 4 in the last 2 years.

Kreider, first and foremost. But I was able to watch him for several years before he even got his playoff cup of coffee in the 11-12 ECF playoff run and knew what he was capable of.

Miller. My friend at BC was best friends with Kreider. They video chat regularly. She said once JT was on there and that he was an absolute clown. My other friend saw him at a bar in Westchester. Called him a college frat bro. He has talent. He has the body. He needs the maturity. And that will come. He's 21. But he's going to be an important cog for this team moving forward.

Kristo. He has serious offensive talent and instinct. Those are his strengths. I'm not a fan of what they did with him in the AHL. They tried to make him into a 2-way player. You see the goal drop off from his first month down there. He focused on other things. He needs to get smarter with the puck, not try and form his game to suit defensive hockey. Even if he gets to Pouliot level of defense, that's something you should be happy with. He's capable of 50-55 points a year. He has a goal scoring touch.

Allen. The un-flashiest of the bunch. If there is one word i'd use for him... it would be "dependable". Limits mistakes. Mobile. He's solid.

McIlrath has disappointed me, simply because of all the hype he had(has). He has improved over the last two years in the AHL, but it'll take years before he realizes his ceiling (which I will always maintain is a Douglas Murray like player).

Lindberg is good. I think he's a D. Moore clone.

I've never seen Skjei, or Duclair, or Buchnevich, so I can't comment on them.

But the first four I listed... NHL players, with near certainty, IMO.

 

[Machinehead]

It's getting testy in here, I love the offseason!

 

[GAGLine]

Garrison is supposedly available. Staal for Garrison? His cap hit is 4.6 mil for the next 4 years and he can maybe help our PP.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Perhaps I'd take your opinion more seriously if you didnt blow sunshine up every single prospect's ass.

Some (and probably most) of these guys aren't going to make it. Yet, throughout various posts you've carved out roster spots for Miller, McIlrath, Allen, Fast, Lindberg, Kristo, etc. Perhaps if you admitted some of these guys wont make it in the NHL, you're message wouldn't be so diluted and I'd trust your opinion more.

Well, I only blow sunshine out of 4 of their *****. And the rest I have to temper the negativity that is omnipresent on this board by those who have a tendency to talk out of their ass about things they have no idea about.

Miller - Yes
Kreider - Yes
Kristo - Yes, although needs most work and right situation.
Allen - Yes
Lindberg - 4th line expectation
McIlrath - Years before he becomes what everyone wants to see. But "bust"? No.
Fast - he is what he is. Defensively responsible spare forward that could probably benefit from offensive players.

 

[Zuccarello Awesome*]

Not many 16 year olds in college where I come from

Google 'hyperbole'

The point was that there's a YouTube video that every Haggerty-pencil-inner on here has viewed in which he scores goals from the left side (ala Stamkos) against BOYS (ages 17-22).

The point is that he's done nothing to prove he can play with, let alone SCORE against men. Not to mention, 70% of those goals don't go in against NHL goaltenders.

So to pencil him into the lineup and post about him getting PP time and improving our PP are ridiculous, especially when the same people value an unknown C-level prospect over a 23 year old who has proved he can play in the NHL and provide offense from the blue line consistently whose cap-hit is LESS THAN KEVIN KLEIN'S!!

I rest my case!

 

[JohnC]

Explain Doogie Hawser, then.