Speculation: 2014 Offseason - Roster Building / Trade Speculation Thread V

[Championship*]

I guess nobody liked my Leddy idea on page 2?

Staal+ for ROR
Brassard + Skjei for Leddy and Morin

Zuccarello O'Reilly Nash
Kreider Stepan St. Louis
Hagelin Miller Morin/Kristo
Carcillo Moore Carter

McDonagh Girardi
Leddy Stralman
Moore Klein

Lundqvist
Talbot



I see that as a much better lineup than most of these that are inferior to last year's model.


Make use of your assets. Sell high.

Chicago needs a 2C. Brassard would fit perfectly there.
Leddy is what we hope Skjei one day becomes.

Staal has played his best hockey. Move him before we lose him for nothing because he won't be worth re-signing at what his market value will be.

I'm sure people saw it, but just chose to ignore it because if how bad of an idea it was

 

[Machinehead]

Why? It takes players different amounts of time to develop. Hagelin graduated from college in 4 years. Played half a season in the AHL and then made the NHL. If Kristo makes the NHL next season, that's only 1/2-1 full season later. Not a big deal.

In rare cases it's not a big deal. In today's league where an ELC is priceless diamond, if a guy hasn't even been given a shot 6 years after getting drafted, he's probably not good enough.

Hagelin was a late bloomer, yes, but he had just turned 23 when he made the Rangers. He'll be 26 over the summer about to enter his 4th season. They're not really comparable.

There's a fine line between a late bloomer and a bust. Kristo, at best, is walking the line.

 

[haveandare]

Yes, there is.

Allow the guys to walk that are cashing in from imporved numbers while benefiting from the environment they were in and allowing those spots to be filled from within.

The key here is not to be scared ****-less that a young player may go through some growing pains early in the 2014-15 campaign.

Let Boyle, Poo and Stralman walk.

Let Fast, Miller, Lingberg and Allen play

allow for growing pains as the season churns along.

If the guys that are still here are as good as some posters believe them to be, then we should be fine at the end of the season.

we talk about how good they are/could become. Let's put our money where our mouths are. Let the kids play and grow as an organization.

I agree with this. I'd try to keep Stralman if possible, but if it's not in the cards, let him go.

It's not like it'd turn the team to Buffalo or something. They have an established core of great players, including the best goalie in the world to help keep mistakes from turning into goals against. They need cap space now, and in the future. They need players to fill gaps. Brings the kids up and solve both problems.

 

[Thirty One]

I have my doubts about Kristo, but I do like the prospects of adding his RH shot to the powerplay.

 

[NYR Viper]

In rare cases it's not a big deal. In today's league where an ELC is priceless diamond, if a guy hasn't even been given a shot 6 years after getting drafted, he's probably not good enough.

Hagelin was a late bloomer, yes, but he had just turned 23 when he made the Rangers. He'll be 26 over the summer about to enter his 4th season. They're not really comparable.

There's a fine line between a late bloomer and a bust. Kristo, at best, is walking the line.

I'd give him 1 more year. I'm not saying he is very young but I wouldn't call him a bust either. He had 25 goals in 63 games in his first year in the AHL. The kid can flat out score and he likes the puck on his stick. Does he have some deficiencies to his game? Yes, defense. But he is a wing.

Pouliot was not a good defensive player either. Neither does Kreider for the most part. Right handed, skilled forward who likes the puck on his stick.

 

[NYR Viper]

I have my doubts about Kristo, but I do like the prospects of adding his RH shot to the powerplay.

This. And I like the fact that he likes to have the puck on his stick. In a puck possession system, that is invaluable.

 

[TheTakedown]

I'd give him 1 more year. I'm not saying he is very young but I wouldn't call him a bust either. He had 25 goals in 63 games in his first year in the AHL. The kid can flat out score and he likes the puck on his stick. Does he have some deficiencies to his game? Yes, defense. But he is a wing.

Pouliot was not a good defensive player either. Neither does Kreider for the most part. Right handed, skilled forward who likes the puck on his stick.

Viper, is it true that AV has had his eye on Kristo this year as well?

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Danny Kristo is 24 and hasn't even sniffed NHL ice. If he's a serious option, this team is worse off than I thought.

Hagelin made his Rangers debut at age 23. I don't see a problem with Kristo. He might be a solid 3rd liner and maybe, if we're lucky, he will still improve, just like Hagelin has been doing.

 

[NYR Viper]

Viper, is it true that AV has had his eye on Kristo this year as well?

He has mentioned him. He liked him in camp, along with Fast, Lindberg and Miller. He liked how Kristo was not a passenger on his line but was seemingly trying to create. Sometimes it takes those players a little while to understand when to create and when not to. And sometimes that means dealing with some growing pains at the NHL level.

In all honesty, if Pouliot leaves, having one of Fast, Miller or Kristo on that line may be a good thing.

 

[Machinehead]

I'd give him 1 more year. I'm not saying he is very young but I wouldn't call him a bust either. He had 25 goals in 63 games in his first year in the AHL. The kid can flat out score and he likes the puck on his stick. Does he have some deficiencies to his game? Yes, defense. But he is a wing.

Pouliot was not a good defensive player either. Neither does Kreider for the most part. Right handed, skilled forward who likes the puck on his stick.

I just feel like there's a reason he's still down there.

Then again, there was a reason Pouliot was on a different team every year, and we figured that out well enough.

 

[NYR Viper]

As a sidenote, Jesper Fast is also a right handed shot. He and Kristo would be solid additions to the PP. Both have the skill and vision to be dangerous.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

If Kristo-Brassard-Zuccarello wind up being a line, you sure as hell can't **** with the defense.

Anyway, Im not confident any of the prospects are ready to make a meaningful impact the start the season and my opinions will follow that thinking until proven otherwise.

1) You are correct there, give credit to where credit is due.
2) How can you be confident/not confident on a subject matter that you admittedly do not follow? You haven't watched most of our prospects, yet you project confidence (or lack thereof) based on... gut feeling?

Is this you in your workplace?

Boss: "Hey, BRB. I'm taking Bob off the potential acquisition of *X company* project. I'd like you to forecast what type of bottom line we might be able to expect if we improved their operations and invested in newer technology"
BRB: "Well, boss, I don't have much knowledge or expertise in *X company's field* and I won't put in the time to familiarize myself with what they do, how they do it, and how they're trending for the future... but i'll give you a completely *unbiased* projection based on opinion and articles that I read from other people that have gone down and reviewed the company. Also, these people may or may not be completely clueless, and their forecasts may be completely outlandish and unrealistic, but i'll take their word for it anyway to construct my forecast."

 

[Thirty One]

This. And I like the fact that he likes to have the puck on his stick. In a puck possession system, that is invaluable.

I see him as the guy who capitalizes on the offensive zone time, not the one who creates it. I'm not sure if that's what you were saying too, but thought I'd mention it.

 

[NYR Viper]

I just feel like there's a reason he's still down there.

Then again, there was a reason Pouliot was on a different team every year, and we figured that out well enough.

It's his defensive game. He needs to be on an offensive line. Really, Miller was the only player that was brought up during the season and that was mainly because a center was down and his versatility of playing ether wing or center.

Fast has a more polished all-around game

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

I have my doubts about Kristo, but I do like the prospects of adding his RH shot to the powerplay.

If that's your end goal, then Haggerty should be the right handed winger that you should be salivating over.

Bigger body. Harder shot. He can screen the goalie while the puck rotates around, or he can be slotted where Stepan usually is and actually rip slap shots.

Kristo doesn't have the type of shot that Haggerty does.

 

[Ian]

MZA and Brassard were good enough together that adding someone unproven like Kristo to their line could still work out well.

Pouliot was never a tremendous defensive force, so even if Kristo is extremly rough around the edges when it comes to defenseive play, it could work.

The problem I could see happening though is that Kristo is primarily a perimeter player, while Pouliot made a lot happen for that line around the hashmarks.

Maybe someone who watched the Wolfpack could correct me on this, but the few games I saw where Kristo played, I didn't see him get involved in much of that dirty work.

 

[Zuccarello Awesome*]

Not only did you trade Staal, but you traded Skjei... his eventual replacement.

Back to the drawing board for you, -77-.

Hehe, back to reading my post, Rusty!

Leddy is 23 and is arguably the "best case scenario" for Skjei to eventually turn into.

I'll take the sure thing at age 23 every single time.

Skjei could end up being another McIlrath. I personally think he becomes a legit NHL player but I see a very similar skill set to Leddy.

Leddy replaces Staal for almost half the cost, and while he's not nearly as good defensively as Staal, he's better offensively and skates like the wind (something that's becoming more apparent that you need to win(mobile defenders- the days of big lumbering Hal Gills is over.)

Both trades make us a better team this season as we as in a better cap situation going forward:

Locking up a legit 1C at 6mil is going to be a STEAL in a few seasons.
And Leddy at 2.7 hitting RFA is a lot better than Staal at 3.9 hitting UFA.

Take a closer look. Nothing about this trade is negative for us, unless you're a fan who overvalues your own players and think we can't possibly recover from losing Brassard's 4-4.5mil for a 2C and Staal's 3.9mil(soon to be 6+mil) for a second-pairing D. And judging from your posts, I really don't think you are.

 

[NYR Viper]

I see him as the guy who capitalizes on the offensive zone time, not the one who creates it. I'm not sure if that's what you were saying too, but thought I'd mention it.

I think he is okay at carrying the puck through the neutral zone from what I have seen. It's getting out of the defensive zone and in zone coverage that he is still learning.

Skill-wise though he knows how to create offense. No doubt about it

 

[Thirty One]

Also if Kristo doesn't play in 80 NHL games this season, he would be eligible for unrestricted free agency next summer.

 

[Machinehead]

If that's your end goal, then Haggerty should be the right handed winger that you should be salivating over.

Bigger body. Harder shot. He can screen the goalie while the puck rotates around, or he can be slotted where Stepan usually is and actually rip slap shots.

Kristo doesn't have the type of shot that Haggerty does.

Ah yes, Haggerty is how I like my prospects; younger than me

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

Leddy does not have Skjei's upside. He's more comparable to John Moore.

That deal would be a disaster. No need to move Skjei in it

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

I see him as the guy who capitalizes on the offensive zone time, not the one who creates it. I'm not sure if that's what you were saying too, but thought I'd mention it.

He's a bit of a cherry picker. Meaning he'll swarm around the blue line when the line is pinned defensively, he won't be able to offer much defensive support, but in the event that someone gets control of the puck, he's off to the races.

He's good in transition, which is important in this system.

He's fast, really fast.

He thinks shoot first, which many on this team don't think. It's good to have a balance of guys that look to feed and others that look to shoot.

He has soft hands, he can control hard passes, he sees the ice really well. Offensively, he'd be able to help the team out, quite a bit. Hypothetically, you'd think he'd be good in a possession style of hockey because he's able to keep plays alive with his offensive talent, and you can flip the puck to him behind the defense and he will get it more times than not... but he's careless with the puck. He forces passes and shots that lead to turnovers and odd man rushes. And that severely hurts him in terms of possession hockey.

He doesn't have a heavy shot. But he does have an accurate one.

 

[Zuccarello Awesome*]

Jeremy Morin is another RH shoot-first player, except he's actually NHL-ready unlike Haggerty who just grew hair on his butt. Penciling Haggerty into a lineup is the funniest thing to me.

MachineHead is right about one thing though: Haggerty is a PROSPECT.

Morin is NHL ready. Proven.
Kristo might be.
Haggerty most likely is not even close.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Also if Kristo doesn't play in 80 NHL games this season, he would be eligible for unrestricted free agency next summer.

Brooklyn Rangers Fan referenced an article that refutes this. Like you, I had the same impression about Kristo. Apparently, that is not true. He is a RFA at season's end, 80 games or not.

 

[GAGLine]

Nyquist just played his first full season at age 24.
Zucc played his first full season at age 26.
MSL played his first full season at age 25.
Tim Thomas didn't play an NHL game until he was 31.

Just because a player is a certain age doesn't mean they don't still have the ability to become a good player.