Speculation: 2014 Offseason - Roster Building / Trade Speculation Thread IV

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

yoo every ranger fan knows how valuable richards was in the locker room this post season...would you deal JT Miller for Richards and a prospect, which ever team he goes too? Sather did say we are a cup contending team, richards at a reasonable amount would be great for our squad

Good lord.

 

[Cassano]

I don't need to repost the massive amount of statistics that have been evoked demonstrating how much Stralman is markedly better than Klein. The fact of the matter is Klein would not be a good replacement for Stralman. He's played less minutes against easier competition. He's been sheltered, and he STILL doesn't do as good as Stralman does.

That's the problem. You can post all the statistics defending your claim, but it'll be brushed off aside as 'LOL STRALMAN HOMER'.

And then the eye test... My favorite lol.

 

[SupersonicMonkey*]

We hear it all the time how the team will never recover from losing Dubinsky, AA, Prust (loved that one), Callahan, Jagr, Korpikoski blah blah blah.

Stralman will be replaced. He's not part of the core.

It took a long time to replace those players. Or, do you not recall 12-13 and the lack of depth?

Stralman will be replaced by who? When?

Yes he is a part of the core.

 

[AlternateSideParking]

No, I want Anton Stralman back.

The drop-off from Stralman to Klein at 2RC will be much bigger than the dropoff from Klein to whatever plug we put in at 3RC.

We all want him back. Just like Hawks fans wanted Brower and Bolland back.

With Staal impending, you could very well have 25 million committed long term to the defense with NTCs and NMCs.

Dangerous dangerous waters to tread.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

That's the problem. You can post all the statistics defending your claim, but it'll be brushed off aside as 'LOL STRALMAN HOMER'.

And then the eye test... My favorite lol.

The eye test is funny because it just further proves that Stralman is superior.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Do you like Kreider? Because Evander Kane is a better version of Kreider.

Yes, you're right. He scored a whopping 3 whole points more than Kreider did in the same amount of GP.

 

[DelZottoHitTheNetJK]

Look, there is doubt Stralman is better... I never said Klein was better than stralman... Clearly, the stats say otherwise, but it's how much better everyone thinks he is... I'm not saying Klein is a world breaker, but he's still a very, very good defenseman.

When you factor in $, Klein is the better option, especially when we need more offense from the defense corps

This. Stralman is the better defenseman save for Klein being more apt to join the rush. When it comes to performance/$ though, Klein will likely be more bang for your buck unless Stralman takes a discount. I'd rather have Klein @2.9M than Stralman @ 4.5M, if that's what he winds up getting

 

[offdacrossbar]

yoo every ranger fan knows how valuable richards was in the locker room this post season...would you deal JT Miller for Richards and a prospect, which ever team he goes too? Sather did say we are a cup contending team, richards at a reasonable amount would be great for our squad

um....uh......er.........i.........um...............uhhhhhhhh.....

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

Stralman is a good player. Better than expected. A nice surprise, like extra fries at the bottom of the bag under the napkins.

This made me lol.

Those are always the best fries, though.

 

[Cassano]

The eye test is funny because it just further proves that Stralman is superior.

Yeah, I didn't quite see the 'crease-clearing' capabilities that Klein was lauded for.

Especially in the Martinez OT goal.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Stralman is a nice player, but he is one of the more overrated guys I've seen around here.

 

[AlternateSideParking]

I dont think so at all. He's probably equivalent to an excellent #2 starter on a good team. A player who must be re-signed.

How so? That means he'd be borderline Cy Young.

Is Stralman borderline Norris?

Nooooooobody here is mentioning that maybe, just maybe, Stralman had his best NHL season because he had an expiring contract.

We'll see.

 

[silverfish]

I don't need to repost the massive amount of statistics that have been evoked demonstrating how much Stralman is markedly better than Klein. The fact of the matter is Klein would not be a good replacement for Stralman. He's played less minutes against easier competition. He's been sheltered, and he STILL doesn't do as good as Stralman does.

Weird...

Playoffs:

Klein: +7
Stralman: +4

Klein: 4 points
Stralman: 5 points

Quality of Competition:
Klein: 27.4%
Stralman: 29.3%

Quality of Teammates:
Klein: 25.5%
Stralman: 27.3%

Corsi:
Klein: +5.9% relative to the rest of the team
Stralman: +2.5% relative to the rest of the team

Deployment:
Klein: 21.8% defensive zone
Stralman: 38.3% defensive zone

Look, ma! Stats! Not just blatant thrown out opinions!

Stralman had the better teammates, faced barely better competition, and was deployed a ton more in the defensive zone. Stralman played with Staal. Klein played with Moore and Diaz.

Klein can hang. And if it's Stralman @$5m per, or Klein @2.9m per, I take Klein every. day.

 

[Cassano]

How so? That means he'd be borderline Cy Young.

Is Stralman borderline Norris?

Nooooooobody here is mentioning that maybe, just maybe, Stralman had his best NHL season because he had an expiring contract.

We'll see.

I'd say he's similar to Kuroda.

 

[Fletch]

I don't need to repost the massive amount of statistics that have been evoked demonstrating how much Stralman is markedly better than Klein. The fact of the matter is Klein would not be a good replacement for Stralman. He's played less minutes against easier competition. He's been sheltered, and he STILL doesn't do as good as Stralman does.

Klein isn't a good replacement for Stralman unless the difference in salary were significant whereby other things can be done. Klein is a $2.9MM, third on the defense chart depth defenseman. If Staal is traded, now you have a hole next to Stralman and Moore is not the answer, and I think Staal-Klein is better than Stralman-Moore; of course, Staal-Stralman is much better. It's all got to fit in an overall formula that I'm not smart enough to put forth. Yea, Klein is less than Stralman, but if Klein replaced Stralman and there was a bunch of other things happening, then one needs to evaluate the entire picture. Like I said, the formula is too large to calculate for me.

 

[AlternateSideParking]

I don't really see it. Kane has never overly impressed me. He's got great tools, but I think Kreider has a better attitude and head on his shoulders. Kane is more talented than Kreider, but I don't think he's ever going to put it all together.

Jeff Carter had an attitude problem too, and he was traded twice because of it.

Kane is only 23. Size, speed and power can't be taught.

Maturing comes naturally.

 

[TheTakedown]

This. Stralman is the better defenseman save for Klein being more apt to join the rush. When it comes to performance/$ though, Klein will likely be more bang for your buck unless Stralman takes a discount. I'd rather have Klein @2.9M than Stralman @ 4.5M, if that's what he winds up getting

And that's the purpose of the stats I'm posting. I'm saying that Klein is a solid REPLACEMENT, especially when considering cost (40% less than Stralman's value right now).

When you couple that with the fact that we have one defenseman that can play offensively, and that our defense without that defenseman is 30th in the league with points, there is no doubt you need to know who to keep at what cost and what to replace with a different type of player. I'm not saying Stralman is just some replaceable player. He most likely isn't... which is why he needs to be replaced with a different TYPE of player.

That is my point.

The other issue is that if we want to deal with what happens AFTER this coming season, Staal needs to be dealt with RIGHT NOW in THIS offseason. His value is humongously high, and he's on a downtrend

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Yeah, I didn't quite see the 'crease-clearing' capabilities that Klein was lauded for.

Especially in the Martinez OT goal.

That goal was Zuccarello's fault more than anything, but its in the past.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

There is something to be said about why Nashville 1) moved Klein out of the top 4 and 2) traded him for reclamation project Michael Del Zotto.

I'm surprised that some people think that he can adequately replace Stralman, despite that fact that Klein was moved out of the top 4 in a completely defensively inferior team before he came to the Rangers.

Could he be a stop gap for a few games? Sure. But lets not get carried away here.

The 2nd pairing would be average, but would fall short of being relied on in the pressure situations AV put them on this year.

 

[NYR Viper]

Retweeted by Mark Spector
OilersNow ‏@OilersNow 2m
"Size is a factor. It's no secret we play in a big conference, and we need size to compete." Oilers GM Craig MacTavish.

I almost guarantee Boyle signs with Edmonton.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

Jeff Carter had an attitude problem too, and he was traded twice because of it.

Kane is only 23. Size, speed and power can't be taught.

Maturing comes naturally.

Regardless of my opinion on Kane, I just don't think that moving Staal for a winger would be the best course of action. I, myself, am pretty comfortable with our group of wingers. We could use a righty sniper, but I think we need to address the center situation more than anything. We need a guy behind Stepan who provide some speed/size. Hopefully Miller can be that player, but if move Staal, I'd want a player like that in return.

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

There is something to be said about why Nashville 1) moved Klein out of the top 4 and 2) traded him for reclamation project Michael Del Zotto.

I'm surprised that some people think that he can adequately replace Stralman, despite that fact that Klein was moved out of the top 4 in a completely defensively inferior team before he came to the Rangers.

Could he be a stop gap for a few games? Sure. But lets not get carried away here.

The 2nd pairing would be average, but would fall short of being relied on in the pressure situations AV put them on this year.

There is something to be said. Nashville made a bad trade.

And if you think Nashville has been "defensively inferior" over the last several years, you should check again.

 

[SupersonicMonkey*]

That's the problem. You can post all the statistics defending your claim, but it'll be brushed off aside as 'LOL STRALMAN HOMER'.

And then the eye test... My favorite lol.

But here is the thing, Stralman wins the stats argument AND the eye test to anyone who paid attention while watching (in other words, doesn't drink and impare themselves while watching).

Over the last three seasons Stralman has been the most consistent defenseman behind McDonagh and Girardi. Not Staal. Stralman. The stats, the injury history, and the "eye test" confirm.

We are arguing over what is going to be a few hundred thousand dollars and a couple of extra years to keep the better player at this point in time. But because Staal was a former 1st round pick of the Rangers and used to fill the spot McDonagh currently fills, shrouds people from the truth, which is he hasn't been the same since the mutiple head injuries. His feet and his hands don't keep up enough to warrant the 6+ million per year on a long-term contract he will demand.

Stralman is currently and by all indications will continue to be moving forward, the better player, and he will be paid less than Staal starting next summer.

Furthermore, the cap will likely rise again next summer and a contract like 4.5 x 6 for Stralman will be a bargain.

Who is replacing Stralman? McIlrath (eventually)? Another slow-footed defender to pair with overpaid and slow-footed Staal? That pair would look like pylons against teams with average speed.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

There is something to be said about why Nashville 1) moved Klein out of the top 4 and 2) traded him for reclamation project Michael Del Zotto.

I'm surprised that some people think that he can adequately replace Stralman, despite that fact that Klein was moved out of the top 4 in a completely defensively inferior team before he came to the Rangers.

Could he be a stop gap for a few games? Sure. But lets not get carried away here.

The 2nd pairing would be average, but would fall short of being relied on in the pressure situations AV put them on this year.

Well, Nashville's blueline isn't exactly "completely inferior" to ours. They are truly stacked at that position when you take into account their NHLers and prospects. They have Weber/Jones/Ellis down the right side alone. Which made Klein expendable for a lefty D.

 

[AlternateSideParking]

Yes, you're right. He scored a whopping 3 whole points more than Kreider did in the same amount of GP.

Exactly.

More points.

Better.

I deal in absolutes.