Writer and actors on STRIKE. Most main stream TV and Movies come to a stand still

[Jumptheshark]

I sometimes work for an actor who owns a hotel here in the UK and while he is semi retired--he has talked about how his royalties have gone down by 65% over the last 10 years or so, do to how the streaming rights work as opposed to the old style. while not famous, he was one of those "I know that guy"

 

[SniperHF]

No wonder the quality of writing has gone down as the years have gone by. It was simply unsustainable.

I watch almost no tv anymore and I used to watch a lot. The 2005-2014 rangeish was so much superior.
The explosion of content helps passive viewers who just want to put something passable on. But even the premium series now are inferior to those of old. Fewer episodes per season, longer times between seasons

Somehow really high quality shows a decade and a half ago could put out 13 episode seasons every year. Now it's around 8 if you're lucky, and usually not every year.

Hopefully this industry pops like the video game crash in the 80's and it resets things for another golden age, but I'm not holding my breath. Too much money in streaming still even with dwindling returns.

 

[BostonBob]

And now I got the following e-mail from ACTRA:

Dear Members,

At midnight SAG-AFTRA will begin strike action against the Alliance of Motion Picture and Television Producers (AMTPT) after a disappointing month at the bargaining table, achieving only “insulting” proposals.

Many of you may have questions.

Please click here to read FAQ on the SAG-AFTRA Strike and what it means for you.

Click here to read ACTRA’s Solidarity Statement.

Click here to read ACTRA’s News Release about the SAG-AFTRA Strike.

In Solidarity,

Eleanor Noble
ACTRA National President

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Not exactly a great sign indicating a short strike when the ACTRA National President calls the latest offers " insulting ". I've got a bad feeling that this entire year will be a wash for me. Looks like I might have to go back to being a gigilo - now where did I put those a**less chaps ????

 

[Jumptheshark]

SAG strike: Avatar and Gladiator sequels look set to be hit as actors walk out

Films and TV shows in production are affected as some 160,000 performers stop work in LA.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[John Price]

 

[Behn Wilson]

I like how Jay Leno took a pay cut on The Tonight Show when they were going to layoff a bunch of his staff over budget cuts to savve their jobs. A truly classy move by Jay.

I sure dont see that out of any of these top end actors getting 10 digit salaries then complaining others are not getting paid enough. Too much of the budget going to them. Cant have it both ways.

 

[Hierso]

I can understand where the actors & writers are comming from but to me it seems that either the books are being cooked hard or that streaming isn't that great for the studios. Hopefully it's the international markets time to shine, i'm so tired of superheroes..

 

[kook10]

I can understand where the actors & writers are comming from but to me it seems that either the books are being cooked hard or that streaming isn't that great for the studios. Hopefully it's the international markets time to shine, i'm so tired of superheroes..

That's kind of the rub - how do you draw a direct connection between subscription revenue and viewership? They don't necessarily correlate. Hit shows may or may not move the subscription needle. How many people signed up just for Tiger King or Squid game? How can you know? There isn't a good model for rewarding success anymore.

The concept of second run is starting to come back but isn't entirely clear yet too. There is no DVD market and syndication is dying or dead. Ad supported VOD is relative small and new (but growing). That's one reason why some shows are starting go away after a certain amount of time. They're looking to license them overseas and now there are signs that some streamers will license shows to other streamers for second runs. That will be more easily identifiable (as will Ad-Supported VOD).

 

[Tasty Biscuits]

How many people signed up just for Tiger King or Squid game? How can you know?

I feel like that info is absolutely attainable though. Your own account tracks what you watch, so no reason they wouldn't be able to filter a data search that's like "accounts that watched Squid Game (and how many eps even) and less than 5 other shows and signed up between X and Y dates. I'm sure services have some massive database algorithm what-have-you that allows them to parse through info any way they seem fit.

 

[kook10]

I feel like that info is absolutely attainable though. Your own account tracks what you watch, so no reason they wouldn't be able to filter a data search that's like "accounts that watched Squid Game (and how many eps even) and less than 5 other shows and signed up between X and Y dates. I'm sure services have some massive database algorithm what-have-you that allows them to parse through info any way they seem fit.

For the sake of argument let's say that's true (for added subs), how would you split money for massive hits where nobody added subscriptions? One show's success would be at the expense of other shows.

Even in your example the added sub would have 6 shows of data - would you split that added revenue equally amongst those six shows and not to popular shows with no added subscribers?

 

[Tasty Biscuits]

For the sake of argument let's say that's true (for added subs), how would you split money for massive hits where nobody added subscriptions? One show's success would be at the expense of other shows.

Even in your example the added sub would have 6 shows of data - would you split that added revenue equally amongst those six shows and not to popular shows with no added subscribers?

Oh indeed the revenue split is a whole other can of worms in and of itself. I absolutely think they have that kind of data, but yes, figuring out how to actually apply that to revenue distribution and/or sharing in a fair and sensible way would seem to be an......intricate problem, to say the least.

 

[Big McLargehuge]

I moved to LA 11 years ago to be a part of this industry and just about every reason I left it has been laid bare these past few months. Even the nepo-babies I know are making far less for far more work than their parents did.

All of the risk has been pushed onto the workers and all of the reward is exclusively reaped by the execs and investors. Burn this shit to the ground.

 

[kook10]

Oh indeed the revenue split is a whole other can of worms in and of itself. I absolutely think they have that kind of data, but yes, figuring out how to actually apply that to revenue distribution and/or sharing in a fair and sensible way would seem to be an......intricate problem, to say the least.

And still your your example draws an inference of causation from correlation. It might be simply somebody joined when something premiered by chance. ...and then the audit mess... ugh

I moved to LA 11 years ago to be a part of this industry and just about every reason I left it has been laid bare these past few months. Even the nepo-babies I know are making far less for far more work than their parents did.

All of the risk has been pushed onto the workers and all of the reward is exclusively reaped by the execs and investors. Burn this shit to the ground.

A big part of the equation that gets overlooked is the race to bottom for cheap production and incentives. It makes for more sporadic production all over even with more production overall. There is no guarantee you can live in one place and stay fully employed. I would not advise anyone to get into the industry.

[as an aside the "far more work" piece is a double edged sword. there are a good few people who have complained about the new DGA rules for shortening the days. People (rightfully) complain about the safety of long long days, but there are almost as many IATSE folks that complain that their checks are smaller when they work less OT and the gold time disappears. Studios have clamped down on "back door" compensation too since their parents' generation. That is - in place of higher wages, people used to negotiate inflated gear rentals to get to their total compensation. now SOX policies require competitive bids, conflict of interest disclosures, etc]

 

[Big McLargehuge]

A big part of the equation that gets overlooked is the race to bottom for cheap production and incentives. It makes for more sporadic production all over even with more production overall. There is no guarantee you can live in one place and stay fully employed. I would not advise anyone to get into the industry.

Agreed. Especially do not if you have health problems, as I do. I couldn't be abused as a glorified intern 'assistant' and thus never got my foot in the door. The staff writing job people like me thrive in are just gone now. You want your biggest reason shows just aren't hitting the same way they did a decade ago? It's stuff like that being excised to save costs. Even massive hits have a fraction the writing staff of the smallest rooms of old. Fewer people doing more work means shorter seasons, longer times between seasons, more mistakes, fewer ideas, etc., etc.

I came here to be a George Meyer-type (the 'glue' of The Simpsons writing room during the prime years) only to find out that execs hate George Meyer-types because they can't easily assign a $ valuation on someone who only gets their name attached to 1 script a year, but has their fingerprints on every script because of the writers room and rewrites. Getting rid of the guy 'only' writing 1 episode a year was the easiest cut to make en route to gutting the entire concept of the writers room. God forbid a collaborative creative medium involve creative collaboration.

 

[MMC]

 

[Neil Racki]

I support the writers and other creatives. I loathe the execs who have turned an art form into a soulless subscription-addled morass.

I support the artists ... but "soulless subscription-addled morass"?

Theres so much awesome content out there through all the streaming services .. big projects, little projects, indie projects, big budget action movie projects. I cant keep up.

Im watching low budget indie movies all the time that would have never been made if not for streaming services buying content like trust fund coke heads

 

[Jumptheshark]

until they get changed the Hollywood accounting mayhem--the big companies will always find away to keep money away from certain people

remember

The Empire strikes back, Coming to America. My Big Fat Greek Wedding and many others, never made money with how Hollywood does their books.

My Big Fat Greek Wedding was made on a budget of $5mill when it was made and grossed $368 mill world wide--but the books said it lost 100mill

 

[Mario_is_BACK!!]

 

[Seedtype]

I'm wondering if forcing the streaming services to be more transparent with how much subscribers watch shows and movies is a worthwhile idea? Like a Nielsen for streaming?

Seems like it's something studios can hide behind when that view data isn't published publicly.

 

[Osprey]

If that $280M were distributed evenly to the 160,000 SAG-AFTRA members, they'd each get only $1,750 more and the vast majority of them would still be making under $25,000. If the $11B in profits after the stock buybacks were distributed to them, they'd each get a nice check for $68,750, but then they'd be out of jobs because that money wasn't re-invested into new projects for them to work on.

 

[RandV]

If that $280M were distributed evenly to the 160,000 SAG-AFTRA members, they'd each get only $1,750 more and the vast majority of them would still be making under $25,000. If the $11B in profits after the stock buybacks were distributed to them, they'd each get a nice check for $68,750, but then they'd be out of jobs because that money wasn't re-invested into new projects for them to work on.

I'm mostly a layman when it comes to financial stuff but stock buybacks aren't an investment in new industry work. From what I understand the primary function is it increases the stock value as you're increasing demand which is good for share holders, but mostly it's more money for execs who will own/receive stock themselves and are paid incentives for increase stock value.

 

[RandV]

until they get changed the Hollywood accounting mayhem--the big companies will always find away to keep money away from certain people

remember

The Empire strikes back, Coming to America. My Big Fat Greek Wedding and many others, never made money with how Hollywood does their books.

My Big Fat Greek Wedding was made on a budget of $5mill when it was made and grossed $368 mill world wide--but the books said it lost 100mill

I'd say the strike now is more about the small screen than the big screen. In Hollywood the big budget productions have always had their accounting magic for the execs but for everyone else the pay is more of a set rate not tied to the success. If you're a leading actor in a successful movie I would think it's more like you are rewarded with a pay increase on your next movie.

The old cable TV model on the other hand you can't really hide success in the same way and there's all sorts of incentives for success for everyone involved, something that's been lost in the switch to streaming.

 

[Osprey]

I'm mostly a layman when it comes to financial stuff but stock buybacks aren't an investment in new industry work. From what I understand the primary function is it increases the stock value as you're increasing demand which is good for share holders, but mostly it's more money for execs who will own/receive stock themselves and are paid incentives for increase stock value.

I didn't say that they are. I said that profits after them could be.

 

[Jumptheshark]

I'd say the strike now is more about the small screen than the big screen. In Hollywood the big budget productions have always had their accounting magic for the execs but for everyone else the pay is more of a set rate not tied to the success. If you're a leading actor in a successful movie I would think it's more like you are rewarded with a pay increase on your next movie.

The old cable TV model on the other hand you can't really hide success in the same way and there's all sorts of incentives for success for everyone involved, something that's been lost in the switch to streaming.y

yes and now. Streaming in the big issue and the battle ground and this is where hollywood accounting is taken place. Netflix agreed a while ago to start paying royalties to on screen persons but they are using the spotify paradigm in how much they pay(atleast here in the UK and Europe)

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Selfishness.

Glad my House of the Dragon isnt getting delayed though.