Speculation: With the third pick in the 2024 NHL draft the Anaheim Ducks select...(Draft is June 28th @ 4pm PT. ESPN. ESPN+)

[Gliff]

In fairness, I saw plenty of people on Twitter bitching that Verbeek made a mistake trading Jamie, but that's the Twitter fanbase.

If I bought people on twitter free pizza 75% would complain

Cmon. I dont mean to be that guy but it's twitter. The same place that wanted PV fired after drafting Leo.

 

[91Fedorov]

.

Bold take! But I'm with you, and to hell with anyone here that disagrees!

 

[Ducks DVM]

Did they? I remember the consensus being pretty positive. Maybe just me.

I didn’t complain about trading Drysdale. I complained about adding a high 2nd to Drysdale.

 

[Smirnov2Chistov]

Yes, I am assuming PV will be here for several years. He is improving the team to a degree GMBM never even approached. He's drafting well, putting his stamp on the team. And he says he wants this team to compete for the playoffs next year. Why would we stop that?

This is subjective - on both of your points. I haven't been impressed with Verbeeks drafting so far but who knows what the future holds.

Are you implying that Murray didn't draft well? (I'm trying to not have a Verbeek v. Murray debate again lol)

 

[Ducks DVM]

Agreed. But he inherited a truly terrible hockey team and has improved it, and he has taken impressive, un-Murray-like risks along the way (like trading Drysdale for Cutter). I think we'll see the fruits of that next season and beyond.

---

I think it’s more accurate to say that he inherited a below average team, made it truly terrible with the players he traded away (not getting into the trades themselves, but he is the one that decided to make it terrible), kept it terrible with the “defense” he then put together in the first offseason, made a great (Gudas) and a jury is still out (Killorn) free agent signing the second off-season, has Carlsson, Mintyukov, a bunch of question marks and Luneau if he’s ever healthy again to show for the draft, some very questionable trade targets to go along with what appears to be some promising prospects and a home run in Cutter, and a ton of draft picks this summer. He’a also created unnecessary drama with how he’s handled Zegras, and hired a coach that coaches to his stated vision, not to the actual players that the GM has collected.

The team is still terrible. We just have a good number of pieces with huge potential.

I’m not saying that Verbeek is terrible. I’m just pointing out that he was not given a terrible team but rather intentionally decided to go down the burn it to the foundation path, and has made what appear to be rookie GM errors since. Time will tell.

 

[Mr Rogers]

---

I think it’s more accurate to say that he inherited a below average team, made it truly terrible with the players he traded away (not getting into the trades themselves, but he is the one that decided to make it terrible), kept it terrible with the “defense” he then put together in the first offseason, made a great (Gudas) and a jury is still out (Killorn) free agent signing the second off-season, has Carlsson, Mintyukov, a bunch of question marks and Luneau if he’s ever healthy again to show for the draft, some very questionable trade targets to go along with what appears to be some promising prospects and a home run in Cutter, and a ton of draft picks this summer. He’a also created unnecessary drama with how he’s handled Zegras, and hired a coach that coaches to his stated vision, not to the actual players that the coach has collected.

The team is still terrible. We just have a good number of pieces with huge potential.

I’m not saying that Verbeek is terrible. I’m just pointing out that he was not given a terrible team but rather intentionally decided to go down the burn it to the foundation path, and has made what appear to be rookie GM errors since. Time will tell.

Agree that the jury is still out. However, I am glad that he fully committed to true, full-throated rebuild - something Murray may not have ever chosen to do. But yeah, the team has to start improving. Also similar to Murray, I haven't on the whole loved a lot of his forward draft picks although I guess there are 1 or 2 interesting ones (Sidorov)

 

[Hey234]

---

I think it’s more accurate to say that he inherited a below average team, made it truly terrible with the players he traded away (not getting into the trades themselves, but he is the one that decided to make it terrible), kept it terrible with the “defense” he then put together in the first offseason, made a great (Gudas) and a jury is still out (Killorn) free agent signing the second off-season, has Carlsson, Mintyukov, a bunch of question marks and Luneau if he’s ever healthy again to show for the draft, some very questionable trade targets to go along with what appears to be some promising prospects and a home run in Cutter, and a ton of draft picks this summer. He’a also created unnecessary drama with how he’s handled Zegras, and hired a coach that coaches to his stated vision, not to the actual players that the coach has collected.

The team is still terrible. We just have a good number of pieces with huge potential.

I’m not saying that Verbeek is terrible. I’m just pointing out that he was not given a terrible team but rather intentionally decided to go down the burn it to the foundation path, and has made what appear to be rookie GM errors since. Time will tell.

I agree with your overall point that he intentionally made the team worse to build it back. However, I also feel like some of these criticisms are too early.

For example, I don't necessarily agree with the coaching issues yet. One thing that changed my perspective was the coach in San Diego. I really enjoyed Matt McIlvane's interview with Alexis Downie not too long ago. One of the things he mentioned many times was how hard of a transition it was for the NHL and Gulls players because of the different focuses and habits Cronin was/is trying to build. He said that his team struggled as well to build those habits and when the players like Zellweger finally got them, they started to excel. His interview and, some other player interviews at the end of the season, makes me think that a lot of the issues we're seeing with systems or mistakes are a results of needing time to transition habits and train. Essentially, a player's issue needing time more than a coaching issue.

 

[Ducks DVM]

I agree with your overall point that he intentionally made the team worse to build it back. However, I also feel like some of these criticisms are too early.

For example, I don't necessarily agree with the coaching issues yet. One thing that changed my perspective was the coach in San Diego. I really enjoyed Matt McIlvane's interview with Alexis Downie not too long ago. One of the things he mentioned many times was how hard of a transition it was for the NHL and Gulls players because of the different focuses and habits Cronin was/is trying to build. He said that his team struggled as well to build those habits and when the players like Zellweger finally got them, they started to excel. His interview and, some other player interviews at the end of the season, makes me think that a lot of the issues we're seeing with systems or mistakes are a results of needing time to transition habits and train. Essentially, a player's issue needing time more than a coaching issue.

What I mean by the coaching comment is putting out a line of Zegras Carlsson Terry then telling them they have to play dump and chase. It’s literally never going to work, and hamstrings the actual abilities of those players while simultaneously increasing the chances that they’re going to get injured. Making Zellweger dump the puck backwards to Killorn and/or Strome for a PP entry. That sort of thing.

 

[Smirnov2Chistov]

Agree that the jury is still out. However, I am glad that he fully committed to true, full-throated rebuild - something Murray may not have ever chosen to do. But yeah, the team has to start improving. Also similar to Murray, I haven't on the whole loved a lot of his forward draft picks although I guess there are 1 or 2 interesting ones (Sidorov)

I mean, I wasn’t a real big fan of their drafting plan this past year. Outside of the potential home runs in Carlsson and Clara, many of the draft picks we had this past year weren’t sexy picks. Maybe Terrance and Sidorov can amount to something, but there’s a lot of ‘supporting prospects’ that leave a lot to be desired

 

[Smirnov2Chistov]

For example, I don't necessarily agree with the coaching issues yet. One thing that changed my perspective was the coach in San Diego. I really enjoyed Matt McIlvane's interview with Alexis Downie not too long ago. One of the things he mentioned many times was how hard of a transition it was for the NHL and Gulls players because of the different focuses and habits Cronin was/is trying to build. He said that his team struggled as well to build those habits and when the players like Zellweger finally got them, they started to excel. His interview and, some other player interviews at the end of the season, makes me think that a lot of the issues we're seeing with systems or mistakes are a results of needing time to transition habits and train. Essentially, a player's issue needing time more than a coaching issue.

unfortunately just don’t buy this.

Does ‘building player habits’ include being outshot most nights, or showing lethargic play on 85% of nights?

There are spurts of promise, I can’t deny that - but both clubs have a losing culture/environment.

 

[2faded]

Agree that the jury is still out. However, I am glad that he fully committed to true, full-throated rebuild - something Murray may not have ever chosen to do. But yeah, the team has to start improving. Also similar to Murray, I haven't on the whole loved a lot of his forward draft picks although I guess there are 1 or 2 interesting ones (Sidorov)

Murray's forever retool was never going to result in a cup contending team. Verbeek saw it and made the right choice to reset and actually rebuild. Almost hit on Bedard. Missed but still ended up with a 1C that will be key to cup chances.

 

[70sSanO]

..,and he has taken impressive, un-Murray-like risks along the way (like trading Drysdale for Cutter). I think we'll see the fruits of that next season and beyond.

Quite ironic as one man’s selling is another man’s buying.

John

 

[HanSolo]

If I bought people on twitter free pizza 75% would complain

Cmon. I dont mean to be that guy but it's twitter. The same place that wanted PV fired after drafting Leo.

Just playing devil's advocate. The only place worse for hockey takes is Facebook comment threads.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

If it was so easy to score that many points in a 9 game stretch in the KHL as a 17 year old defenseman, than we must be assuming he’s the 20th or so player to do it right? I don’t care if he’s scored them over 1 game or 40 or 60, he’s done what no other prospects his age did offensively in the second/ third best league there is.

If that's the case, then let me remind you of Sam Steel and his hat tricks. A flash and that's all it is. What about the rest of the season? Was it a fluke or is it reproduceable.

Silayev
Game Set	Games	G	A	Pts	PPG		+/-
Total	63​	3​	8​	11​	0.17​		-9​
1 to 9	9​	1​	5​	6​	0.67​		1​
10 to 63	54​	2​	3​	5​	0.09​		-10​

For the other 54 games, Silayev's scoring was under 0.10 ppg. Was it a fluke or is it reproduceable?

In the previous season (D-1), he scored 8 points in 41 MHL games. That's a scoring rate of 0.195 ppg. That's two seasons worth of producing under 0.20 ppg rate. At least he's got that reproducibility down.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

I'm actually getting worried Chicago could pick Silayev lol, when he hits his prime, no one is gonna mess with Bedard if they are on the same team. Having 1C Bedard and 1D Silayev would be setting them up for a long time for success assuming Silayev hits his ceiling.

If that happens they got to pick Demidov for sure if he's there at #3. I don't think Lind/Dick/Buium/Lev are enough to avoid picking a KHL player this time around and its not like they got the issues like Mitchkov wanting to go to specific teams. Last year both Carlsson and Fantilli were legit #1 overall talents (was just their luck a that Bedard a crosby level talent was in same draft class) going #2 and #3 that passing on Mitchkov was a no brainer.

Edit: no to trading Zegras while his value is low. Drysdale was different because Philly was pretty desperate to get something for Cutter and being able to get Cutter for injury prone Dman they wouldn't ever get a better deal than that. I think Zegras still fits perfectly on the team he either has to earn a Center spot back or he becomes a playmaking winger longterm like a poor mans Marner.

Chicago currently has a top-pairing LD that 6'6 and 216 lbs in 22 year old Alex Vlasic. He played his first full season in the NHL last year. He's a shutdown D. They have another shutdown LD coming up in 6'4 Del Mastro, except his offense has developed over the years. The known offensive D-men they have are 6'3 LD Korchinski (7th OA in 2022 draft) and 6'4 RD Rinzel (22nd OA in 2022 draft).

If Chicago goes D in the draft, then it'll probably be RD Lev.

 

[ScarTroy]

If that's the case, then let me remind you of Sam Steel and his hat tricks. A flash and that's all it is. What about the rest of the season? Was it a fluke or is it reproduceable.

Silayev
Game Set	Games	G	A	Pts	PPG		+/-
Total	63​	3​	8​	11​	0.17​		-9​
1 to 9	9​	1​	5​	6​	0.67​		1​
10 to 63	54​	2​	3​	5​	0.09​		-10​

For the other 54 games, Silayev's scoring was under 0.10 ppg. Was it a fluke or is it reproduceable?

In the previous season (D-1), he scored 8 points in 41 MHL games. That's a scoring rate of 0.195 ppg. That's two seasons worth of producing under 0.20 ppg rate. At least he's got that reproducibility down.

Like I said I don’t care if it’s a “flash” when he’s the only one who has been able to do it. It shows he has the ability to produce at that rate. For being a guy that’s very big on giving young players more time to marinate in college because their growing body needs time to rest, you sure do change your tune when a 17 year old is playing in a pro league and falls off their pace due to the exact fatigue you so often voice your concerns over.

 

[Hey234]

IMO, given what should be available, Silayev seems too high risk. The Ducks need a slam dunk top 2 defenseman minimum and ideally a #1. Levshunov seems like the obvious choice from my uninformed corner.

 

[Static]

David st. Louis recommended center AJ Spellacy as a lottery ticket late second rounder and his scouting reports sound fun.

Picked hockey over D1 football, still learning the game, huge work rate and athletic ability. Really hope we take swings like that instead of the high floor guys we took last year.

 

[cheesymc]

David st. Louis recommended center AJ Spellacy as a lottery ticket late second rounder and his scouting reports sound fun.

Picked hockey over D1 football, still learning the game, huge work rate and athletic ability. Really hope we take swings like that instead of the high floor guys we took last year.

He is someone I was hoping dropped to our 4rth round pick. He sounds like he has limited upside with his hockey sense and puck skills, but I like his skating and grit.... just not for a 2nd round pick.

I'm hoping we get at least 2 physical forwards in a Lindstrom, Surin, Wetsch, Spellacy, or Ruohonen. There are a few others too.

 

[FiveTacos]

IMO, given what should be available, Silayev seems too high risk. The Ducks need a slam dunk top 2 defenseman minimum and ideally a #1.

Unfortunately there is no slam dunk top 2 dman available. If there were one, he'd be a slam dunk 2nd overall pick in a draft like this.

And from what I understand, Silayev is actually low risk in terms of his floor ... given his tools and his play at a higher level than most of his draft peers, it seems he's a high likelihood to at least be a good defender at the NHL level.

 

[BringBackTheIceman]

*Medicals permitting* I’ve come around on Lindstrom at 3. Honestly wouldn’t be surprised if he went 2 if Chicago was comfortable with his health

 

[Hockey Duckie]

Unfortunately there is no slam dunk top 2 dman available. If there were one, he'd be a slam dunk 2nd overall pick in a draft like this.

And from what I understand, Silayev is actually low risk in terms of his floor ... given his tools and his play at a higher level than most of his draft peers, it seems he's a high likelihood to at least be a good defender at the NHL level.

I'm thinking lots are coming around on Lev as he's projected to go #2 OA more and more on many mock drafts.

Here's a blurb on Lev from Pronman's recent article:

Owen Power went first overall in 2021 after being a great two-way defenseman in college and showing a highly projectable game to the pros. Levshunov had arguably an even better draft season than Power in the same conference, although Power is considerably taller. Levshunov ticks all the boxes in this draft unlike any of the other options. He’s 6-foot-2. He’s a strong skater. He’s very skilled, and thinks the game at a high level. He likes to attack but he defended fine in college, showing physicality and killing penalties for a top team.

Pronman: Ranking the top defensemen available in the 2024 NHL Draft

The 2024 NHL Draft is likely going to be the draft of the defensemen. There could be as many as five or six defensemen picked in the top 10.

www.nytimes.com

Between Lev and Silayev, one of them has a higher chance of being a 2-way D. Lev is an OFD learning to play defense, which he has shown tremendous improvement in the past two seasons. Silayev is a shutdown D who hasn't shown much production on the offensive side, but reportedly has a good transition game.

Lev is a rookie in the NCAA, where the age range is from 17 to 26. One of Lev's teammate played as a 22-year old sophomore, Joey Lawson, whom the Ducks invited to this year's Dev camp. That's a bit more difficult level of competition than the CHL, whose age range is 16 to 20.

 

[eaterfan]

Between Lev and Silayev, one of them has a higher chance of being a 2-way D. Lev is an OFD learning to play defense, which he has shown tremendous improvement in the past two seasons. Silayev is a shutdown D who hasn't shown much production on the offensive side, but reportedly has a good transition game.

Lev is a rookie in the NCAA, where the age range is from 17 to 26. One of Lev's teammate played as a 22-year old sophomore, Joey Lawson, whom the Ducks invited to this year's Dev camp. That's a bit more difficult level of competition than the CHL, whose age range is 16 to 20.

Isn't Silayev in the KHL? I'd say the KHL is probably harder than the NCAA.

 

[Static]

None of these dmen sound all that great. I think I'd rather go for a forward, to be honest. Just sign a top RH dman instead.

 

[Static]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1798439562680963243