Prospect Info: Wings Prospect Discussion

[Pavels Dog]

I can see ASP breaking a lot of hearts around here. At his position, size does genuinely matter. I have, however, decided to reserve judgment on the kid until I see him in NA pro hockey.

It’s unfortunate we have no big d-men in the system.

 

[SantosHalper]

Mazur leaving bodies behind, he may not be thicc enough for everbody but he is strong.
#24 Gavin White 6'1'' & 192 lbs
#26 Michael Karow 6'2'' & 201 lbs

Mazur 172 lbs, he's gonna put people through the boards if he gets extra 10.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

The top 2 scoring defensemen in the NHL are about the same size and ASP is still a growing boy.

So are Boqvist, Lundkvist and Sandin. For the record I like ASP's offensive game better than these three, but I am not about to act like being undersized at the position presents no risks or that the offensive output will always outweigh any defensive struggles.

 

[ricky0034]

So are Boqvist, Lundkvist and Sandin. For the record I like ASP's offensive game better than these three, but I am not about to act like being undersized at the position presents no risks or that the offensive output will always outweigh any defensive struggles.

so are like several dozen other guys of varying degrees of effectiveness

he's not big but he's not exactly outlier level small either

 

[izlez]

Just noticed Buium has 5+17=22 and +21 in 25 games for Denver. Looks like a nice season on paper for him

Keeping up the pace and now at 7g 21a for 28 points in 31 games and +24

Basically scoring at the same rate as Mazur was last year on the same team at the same age... as a 6'4 210 lb defenseman

Really seems like we should be giving this kid more attention.

 

[Henkka]

so are like several dozen other guys of varying degrees of effectiveness

he's not big but he's not exactly outlier level small either

Brian Rafalski.

Swedish one.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Keeping up the pace and now at 7g 21a for 28 points in 31 games and +24

Basically scoring at the same rate as Mazur was last year on the same team at the same age... as a 6'4 210 lb defenseman

Really seems like we should be giving this kid more attention.

I don’t think his offense will translate when going pro. Solid puck moving ability but not high end enough that I think he’s going to be more than a 4 to 6 guy that won’t be a total liability in either end. Maybe a + level Maatta?

 

[HoweFan]

Have the Wings been listed yet in Scott Wheelers rankings of prospects pools? I think I saw # 4 this morning and I can’t remember seeing our name. I can’t remember who was at four for that matter lol

 

[Electric Eric]

Have the Wings been listed yet in Scott Wheelers rankings of prospects pools? I think I saw # 4 this morning and I can’t remember seeing our name. I can’t remember who was at four for that matter lol

Nope, Wings have made it into the top 3 of prospect ranking per the athletic so far.

 

[RRhoads]

Wings, Buffalo and Columbus left?

 

[RedHawkDown]

There’s this weird obsession in hockey that weight is the be all end all of strength. At mazur’s height, 175ish would be a very reasonable weight if he is jacked and not holding a lot of extra fat. He’s probably very strong and just doesn’t have flab.

 

[schuelma24]

Wings, Buffalo and Columbus left?

yup. Personally I think the Wings have the most well rounded pool (show me a better top 2 D/C/G pipeline than Ed/ASP, Kasper/Danielson, Cossa/Augustine), but Wheeler loves himself undersized offensively skilled prospects who kill it in juniors so I'm expecting Buffalo at #1.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

I don’t think his offense will translate when going pro. Solid puck moving ability but not high end enough that I think he’s going to be more than a 4 to 6 guy that won’t be a total liability in either end. Maybe a + level Maatta?

I don't think he will get the PP opportunities he does now in the pro game, but who knows. I am very curious to see him in the pro game. I could see some residual offense from his puck moving game but don't think anyone will call him an offensive defensemen.

 

[jaster]

There’s this weird obsession in hockey that weight is the be all end all of strength. At mazur’s height, 175ish would be a very reasonable weight if he is jacked and not holding a lot of extra fat. He’s probably very strong and just doesn’t have flab.

It’s not the be all end all, but weight still matters. You can be in the bottom percentile, be jacked, and it’s still a problem because you don’t have as much mass to help prevent injuries. Strength is only one piece of it.

 

[RedHawkDown]

It’s not the be all end all, but weight still matters. You can be in the bottom percentile, be jacked, and it’s still a problem because you don’t have as much mass to help prevent injuries. Strength is only one piece of it.

I’d be interested to see if there’s any data that supports this old notion that mass somehow prevents injuries. Mechanically, more weight should make you more vulnerable to injury, at least from falling and going into the boards.

 

[jaster]

I’d be interested to see if there’s any data that supports this old notion that mass somehow prevents injuries. Mechanically, more weight should make you more vulnerable to injury, at least from falling and going into the boards.

It’s not an old notion, it’s actually a newer notion relative to the history of hockey. You won’t find much data, if any, because teams don’t generally put kids in the NHL who are physically not ready, just to watch them get plastered. It’s not an issue in the NHL because teams make sure these kids are physically ready before they get called up.

There are only 5 active players in the NHL who are at least Mazur’s height and under 175 lbs. So he’s in the window, but just barely. He will benefit from more weight. He knows it and he’s working on it.

 

[RedHawkDown]

It’s not an old notion, it’s actually a newer notion relative to the history of hockey. You won’t find much data, if any, because teams don’t generally put kids in the NHL who are physically not ready, just to watch them get plastered. It’s not an issue in the NHL because teams make sure these kids are physically ready before they get called up.

There are only 5 active players in the NHL who are at least Mazur’s height and under 175 lbs. So he’s in the window, but just barely. He will benefit from more weight. He knows it and he’s working on it.

Again, a guy who is 175 and shredded will not get plastered because he will be significantly stronger than guys who are 195 with a lot more body fat. This is a silly notion.

I agree Mazur will put on weight but he has never shown any indication he gets pushed around at his weight and it’s fairly clear that is because he is very strong at his weight. Adding 10lbs of ice cream fat will not make him harder to push around, it’ll make him slower.

 

[jaster]

Again, a guy who is 175 and shredded will not get plastered because he will be significantly stronger than guys who are 195 with a lot more body fat. This is a silly notion.

First, guys weighing 175 in the NHL are virtually never stronger than guys weighing 195 lol. But also, that’s just not how it works every time. You’re assuming that players are fully prepared for every physical engagement they find themselves in. But they are not a lot of the time. Getting caught off guard by a guy with far more mass than you can turn out very poorly, health-wise. If you’re not able to brace for a hit, it matters not at all how much of your 175 lbs is muscle or fat. It’s simply physics.

I agree Mazur will put on weight but he has never shown any indication he gets pushed around at his weight and it’s fairly clear that is because he is very strong at his weight. Adding 10lbs of ice cream fat will not make him harder to push around, it’ll make him slower.

No one is proposing he add 10 lbs of fat lol. And he hasn’t played in the NHL yet. Indications in the AHL mean very little. The NHL is much faster.

I mean look, the Wings want him to add weight and strength, he wants to add weight and strength, and he’s working on adding weight and strength. So I guess take it up with him and the Wings about how unnecessary it all is

 

[Holden Caufield]

I have it on good authority Mazur’s body weight is only 170 lbs. But he has 5 pound balls and thats why he plays like a bull on the ice.

The ‘body weight experts’ fail to factor in that ratio…

 

[newfy]

Again, a guy who is 175 and shredded will not get plastered because he will be significantly stronger than guys who are 195 with a lot more body fat. This is a silly notion.

I agree Mazur will put on weight but he has never shown any indication he gets pushed around at his weight and it’s fairly clear that is because he is very strong at his weight. Adding 10lbs of ice cream fat will not make him harder to push around, it’ll make him slower.

Its the NHL, do you think theres going to be a lot of guys who weigh 195 but have a lot of body fat?

It isnt silly at all. A primary function of muscle is to protect your joints and bones. If you have more muscle when you get hit, the chances of something going in a direction it shouldnt is less because the muscles help stabilise and hold things in place.

 

[RedHawkDown]

Its the NHL, do you think theres going to be a lot of guys who weigh 195 but have a lot of body fat?

It isnt silly at all. A primary function of muscle is to protect your joints and bones. If you have more muscle when you get hit, the chances of something going in a direction it shouldnt is less because the muscles help stabilise and hold things in place.

Well yes if he gets to 195 without gaining much fat he’ll obviously be much stronger.

 

[norrisnick]

Again, a guy who is 175 and shredded will not get plastered because he will be significantly stronger than guys who are 195 with a lot more body fat. This is a silly notion.

I agree Mazur will put on weight but he has never shown any indication he gets pushed around at his weight and it’s fairly clear that is because he is very strong at his weight. Adding 10lbs of ice cream fat will not make him harder to push around, it’ll make him slower.

That's not how physics works. There is a reason linemen and sumo wrestlers get huge. It doesn't help to just be strong. You have to big enough to not easily be shoved around by other strong players.

 

[ricky0034]

if Mazur manages to hit 500 pounds with 0% body fat and also not lose any skating then look out NHL

 

[HoweFan]

Wings, Buffalo and Columbus left?

I was just looking at the Sabres and BJ’s prospects and in my completely biased opinion they can’t hold a candle to us. Cossa and Augustine decided it

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

Again, a guy who is 175 and shredded will not get plastered because he will be significantly stronger than guys who are 195 with a lot more body fat. This is a silly notion.

I agree Mazur will put on weight but he has never shown any indication he gets pushed around at his weight and it’s fairly clear that is because he is very strong at his weight. Adding 10lbs of ice cream fat will not make him harder to push around, it’ll make him slower.

Force = mass * acceleration

A heavier guy hitting a lighter guy at skating speed is more likely to do greater damage than the other way around, no matter how jacked the lighter guy is. Arguing against that is ignoring the science.