Confirmed with Link: Wings out of the bidding for Lecavalier, according to Khan (post #743)

[Michael Brand Eggs]

yeah at first I thought it was pretty unlikely but the more I read about the situation the more I change my mind on that

I still probably wouldn't call the Wings the "favorite" to land him but certainly a very legitimate shot

Brad May on Sportsnet is claiming that a (now former) teammate of Lecavalier's has told him that Vinny will NOT sign in Canada.

Who knows how much that's worth. May does seem to have some connections, though.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Brad May said on sportsnet that Vinny's teammates in Tampa Don't believe he will sign with a Canadian franchise.

Take that for what it is, but if he takes Toronto and Montreal off the table, what option do we become?

 

[FlashyG]

Brad May said on sportsnet that Vinny's teammates in Tampa Don't believe he will sign with a Canadian franchise.

Take that for what it is, but if he takes Toronto and Montreal off the table, what option do we become?

There has been so many things said by him (or things he's claimed to have said) that its hard to gauge where we stand.

Here are some of the things I've read about him saying today

-he's open to any of the 29 teams available to him.
-specifically spoke about only Montreal and Detroit though.
-wants a long term deal, preferably one that will take him to retirement.
-doesn't want to go somewhere that is a bottom feeder or in a rebuild.
-doesn't think he'll ever play in Tampa again.

I've also heard people say about him that

-He'd prefer to stay in the east
-and now that he won't sign in Canada.

If you believe the rumors our odds are probably pretty good, but my guess is that it will come down to how much we're willing to pay him and for how long. Chances are some teams are going to offer him some pretty good deals so I'd say the chances of landing him are probably around the same as they were for Parise and likely a little worse than they were with Suter.

 

[RedWingsNow*]

So.. people aren't concerned about a 5 year deal to a guy who would be 36 to start year 4. The same year Datsyuk would be 38? Zetterberg would be 36. Franzen 36.

 

[FlashyG]

So.. people aren't concerned about a 5 year deal to a guy who would be 36 to start year 4. The same year Datsyuk would be 38? Zetterberg would be 36. Franzen 36.

Not all that much in Lecavalier's case.

It won't be a 35+ contract so if he chose to retire it would cost the team nothing.

I'd probably leave a buyout open for next year though, that way if Franzen has a down year or if Tatar or Nyquist makes a big progression we can potentially buy out Franzen's long deal.

 

[WingsOverAvs]

Not all that much in Lecavalier's case.

It won't be a 35+ contract so if he chose to retire it would cost the team nothing.

I'd probably leave a buyout open for next year though, that way if Franzen has a down year or if Tatar or Nyquist makes a big progression we can potentially buy out Franzen's long deal.

I REALLY wish people would get off the "BUYOUT FRANZEN" bandwagon. He's a 20g/50pt producer and we have him locked up at 1m under "market price"

 

[RedWingsNow*]

Not all that much in Lecavalier's case.

It won't be a 35+ contract so if he chose to retire it would cost the team nothing.

I'd probably leave a buyout open for next year though, that way if Franzen has a down year or if Tatar or Nyquist makes a big progression we can potentially buy out Franzen's long deal.

I'm not worried about him retiring.

I'm worried that we're going to have $25M tied up in 4 players 36 and older.

Very few elite centers in the NHL remain elite very long beyond 35. And Johan Franzen is already showing signs of decline

 

[FlashyG]

I REALLY wish people would get off the "BUYOUT FRANZEN" bandwagon. He's a 20g/50pt producer and we have him locked up at 1m under "market price"

I've defended Franzen more than most around here, I think he's probably the most unfairly criticized player on the team and I personally think he's one of the best bang for your buck players in the entire league

He is however on a very long contract and if he starts to show signs of regressing this upcoming season we won't get a better chance to get out from under that deal.

I think a lot would need to happen for buying him out to be a good idea, but I wouldn't rule it out completely especially if Tatar or Nyquist have a breakout year.

 

[ComradeChris]

I'd rather sign UFA free agent Happy Gilmore.

 

[FlashyG]

I'm not worried about him retiring.

I'm worried that we're going to have $25M tied up in 4 players 36 and older.

Very few elite centers in the NHL remain elite very long beyond 35. And Johan Franzen is already showing signs of decline

Unless we're giving Lecavalier 7.5 million a season I think your 25 million figure is a little high.

As I said in my original response we could still have the option of buying Franzen out next season should his production drop or if the teams age is a real concern.

I would prefer to limit a Vinny signing to 4 years but if it takes an extra year to get him I can certainly live with that. He's by far the best option available at C, and you can never have too much depth down the middle.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

I REALLY wish people would get off the "BUYOUT FRANZEN" bandwagon. He's a 20g/50pt producer and we have him locked up at 1m under "market price"

I am a huge Franzen supporter, but one of our buyouts should be held in reserve for next off-season in case they entertain this option. I don't think they will use it on him, but we better have it just in case that becomes something we need to realistically consider.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

So.. people aren't concerned about a 5 year deal to a guy who would be 36 to start year 4. The same year Datsyuk would be 38? Zetterberg would be 36. Franzen 36.

Concerning, absolutely. Deal breaker, probably not. Vinny, Z and Pavel aren't guys I have huge concerns about here.

I am also of the opinion it would force a little bit of the youth movement. I know people will call that wishful thinking, but this would force hard decisions again. I prefer this to patch work, these are star caliber players or at least in Franzen's case as of now on a good cap hit relative to what he produces.

 

[WingsOverAvs]

Unless we're giving Lecavalier 7.5 million a season I think your 25 million figure is a little high.

As I said in my original response we could still have the option of buying Franzen out next season should his production drop or if the teams age is a real concern.

I would prefer to limit a Vinny signing to 4 years but if it takes an extra year to get him I can certainly live with that. He's by far the best option available at C, and you can never have too much depth down the middle.

I'd prefer DET use both buyouts this year if certain chips fall, one of which being a pipe dream, but a glorious one it would be....Holland submitting a *GASP* offer sheet.

 

[Petes2424]

So.. people aren't concerned about a 5 year deal to a guy who would be 36 to start year 4. The same year Datsyuk would be 38? Zetterberg would be 36. Franzen 36.

If there's a Cup in those years, who cares. I actually think he'll take a 4x4 type deal. I would be scared off anything over $5 million though. To me, it's a slam dunk move both for the Wings and Lecavalier.

 

[Petes2424]

I've defended Franzen more than most around here, I think he's probably the most unfairly criticized player on the team and I personally think he's one of the best bang for your buck players in the entire league

He is however on a very long contract and if he starts to show signs of regressing this upcoming season we won't get a better chance to get out from under that deal.

I think a lot would need to happen for buying him out to be a good idea, but I wouldn't rule it out completely especially if Tatar or Nyquist have a breakout year.

He'd look absolutely great on a line with Lecavalier and Tatar though. Franzen and Vinny demand space on the ice and a guy with Tatar's skill and speed? That could be a horribly hard line to play against.

 

[ThankYouBasedGod]

Lecavalier is signing with the Florida Panthers.

 

[pdd]

I would have to think that if DET brings in Vinny (and I hope they do. Perfect fit on DET's 2nd line) its going to have to be for the money he was willing to give Filppula, or at least very close. Holland will still want to go out and get a Penner like player to add some size.

In regard to Yzerman's prowess as a GM, he's still trying to clean up the mess Lawson left so lets reserve judgememnt for now. Saw this earlier today:

Jeff Marek ‏@JeffMarek 5m
Lawton had him (Vinny) going to the Habs for Price, Pacioretty, a 1st and either Subban or McDonaugh

Lawson wouldnt pull the trigger

L-a-w-t-o-n. Brian Lawton, a.k.a "Notch". The guy who was drafted 1st overall in 1983, the same year Yzerman was drafted.

Hmm....

That ruins the speculation that was happening on the Calgary board the other day.

And he'd be a perfect fit there too. Big, skilled center who would have skilled linemates to play with.

Columbus, Detroit, Florida, Montreal, New Jersey, NYI, Ottawa, Toronto, Washington are all potential Eastern destinations.

Dropping teams that were unlikely or borderline playoff teams, we get:

Detroit, Montreal, Washington

Washington potentially keeps Ribeiro; which leaves Detroit and Montreal as "guaranteed" playoff destinations if that happens. Lecavalier has in the past expressed a desire to remain on a US-based team, but he has also been linked to Montreal for years as he is from Quebec and there have been multiple failed trades which he did approve (as mentioned above).

So it's a toss-up. Probably Montreal as they are more desperate for centers, and would offer more, plus a star Quebecois center who is somewhat reminiscent of Jean Beliveau might sell tickets.

Brad May said on sportsnet that Vinny's teammates in Tampa Don't believe he will sign with a Canadian franchise.

Take that for what it is, but if he takes Toronto and Montreal off the table, what option do we become?

As I stated previously, option #1.

There has been so many things said by him (or things he's claimed to have said) that its hard to gauge where we stand.

Here are some of the things I've read about him saying today

-he's open to any of the 29 teams available to him.
-specifically spoke about only Montreal and Detroit though.
-wants a long term deal, preferably one that will take him to retirement.
-doesn't want to go somewhere that is a bottom feeder or in a rebuild.
-doesn't think he'll ever play in Tampa again.

I've also heard people say about him that

-He'd prefer to stay in the east
-and now that he won't sign in Canada.

The bolded is something he has said in the past. He has stated since the buyout that "his door is open to anybody"

Sporting News article

 

[SportsballChic]

I'd rather sign UFA free agent Happy Gilmore.

"but WHAT a SHOT.........."

 

[FlashyG]

I'd prefer DET use both buyouts this year if certain chips fall, one of which being a pipe dream, but a glorious one it would be....Holland submitting a *GASP* offer sheet.

You don't really submit offer sheets, you agree to one with a RFA. Holland tried that with Weber last year but Weber chose Philly over Detroit.

You also have to complete your buyouts before you're able to even attempt signing someone to an offer sheet.

Regardless though, Offer sheets are essentially useless unless they are for average players because they are always matched when it comes to the kind of talent we have a need for.

Using both buyouts this year wouldn't be the end of the world, but we might regret it next year.

 

[WingsOverAvs]

You don't really submit offer sheets, you agree to one with a RFA. Holland tried that with Weber last year but Weber chose Philly over Detroit.

You also have to complete your buyouts before you're able to even attempt signing someone to an offer sheet.

Regardless though, Offer sheets are essentially useless unless they are for average players because they are always matched when it comes to the kind of talent we have a need for.

Using both buyouts this year wouldn't be the end of the world, but we might regret it next year.

You're submitting a contract offer to a player. Lets not argue over what the definition of "IS" is. Completing the buyouts beforehand isnt an issue imo. Sammy is the obvious first choice. After that any one of a few players would work just fine and it wouldnt really impact DET much if any. The player I have my eye on is Chris Stewart. I dont know if STL is going to be willing to pay him what he could command as a FA. Theyve never been a team to spend and they're likely going to be looking for a bonafide starting netminder (the tandem didnt work so well last year) in the near future and they owe Pietrangelo a hefty deal. If not an offer sheet, perhaps they'd be willing to exchange RFA rights with DET (who would sweeten the deal). DET needs a winger like Stewart (or Horton, Penner, Bickell, etc). And he has more offensive upside than any of the other options.

Who knows, just something ive been pondering.

Henrik Zetterberg ($6.083m)/Pavel Datsyuk ($6.700m)/Justin Abdelkader ($1.800m)
Johan Franzen ($3.955m)/Vinny Lecavalier ($5.000m)/Chris Stewart ($4.500m)
Gustav Nyquist ($1.500m)/Darren Helm ($2.125m)/Damien Brunner ($2.750m)
Drew Miller ($1.350m)/Joakim Andersson ($1.000m)/Tomas Tatar ($0.840m)

Niklas Kronwall ($4.750m)/Jonathan Ericsson ($3.250m)
Jakub Kindl ($2.000m)/Danny DeKeyser ($1.350m)
Kyle Quincey ($3.775m)/Brendan Smith ($1.500m)
Brian Lashoff ($0.725m)

Jimmy Howard ($5.292m)
Jonas Gustavsson ($1.500m)

CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $3,565,455

 

[Cyborg Yzerberg]

I'm 100% all for this. Bring Vinny to Hockeytown.

 

[pdd]

I REALLY wish people would get off the "BUYOUT FRANZEN" bandwagon. He's a 20g/50pt producer and we have him locked up at 1m under "market price"

I'm more on the "trade Franzen" bandwagon.

If we sign Lecavalier, that gives us a solid 2C and puts Dats/Z together (or Z/Vinny, or Dats/Vinny). Factoring in the emergence of Nyquist and Tatar, plus the fact that Jurco, Jarnkrok, and Pulkkinen are also banging on the door; that doesn't leave room for Franzen who potentially could be our fourth or fifth best winger in as little as a year or two.

Franzen hasn't been a huge force in the playoffs in years, and he's declining in regular season performance. But he could likely still be a centerpiece in a deal to get us back a top-pairing defenseman. Enstrom is definitely a good target, among others. Or perhaps the Wings sign Vinny and Scuderi, buy out Sammy, and maybe we can get Franzen+Quincey/Cola to bring back Loui Eriksson from Dallas.

 

[FlashyG]

You're submitting a contract offer to a player. Lets not argue over what the definition of "IS" is. Completing the buyouts beforehand isnt an issue imo. Sammy is the obvious first choice. After that any one of a few players would work just fine and it wouldnt really impact DET much if any. The player I have my eye on is Chris Stewart. I dont know if STL is going to be willing to pay him what he could command as a FA. Theyve never been a team to spend and they're likely going to be looking for a bonafide starting netminder (the tandem didnt work so well last year) in the near future. If not an offer sheet, perhaps they'd be willing to exchange RFA's with DET sweetening the deal. Who knows, just something ive been pondering.

I was pointing out the difference because you implied that its something Holland never does.

We have no idea how many he's attempted to sign because you only hear about one if its agreed on between the player and the team. Also while Stewart is one of the RFA's I think you could actually get via an offersheet, to sign him to something St. Louis wouldn't match you're likely giving up a first, second and third round pick in a deep draft where we have a better pick than we've had in decades.

Personally I think Lecavalier is better in every way to Stewart, other than age.

He's bigger, hits more, is a more consistent scorer, better passer, better skater, has won a cup and wouldn't cost us draft picks to acquire

 

[needzmoarcleary]

I'm more on the "trade Franzen" bandwagon.

If we sign Lecavalier, that gives us a solid 2C and puts Dats/Z together (or Z/Vinny, or Dats/Vinny). Factoring in the emergence of Nyquist and Tatar, plus the fact that Jurco, Jarnkrok, and Pulkkinen are also banging on the door; that doesn't leave room for Franzen who potentially could be our fourth or fifth best winger in as little as a year or two.

Franzen hasn't been a huge force in the playoffs in years, and he's declining in regular season performance. But he could likely still be a centerpiece in a deal to get us back a top-pairing defenseman. Enstrom is definitely a good target, among others. Or perhaps the Wings sign Vinny and Scuderi, buy out Sammy, and maybe we can get Franzen+Quincey/Cola to bring back Loui Eriksson from Dallas.

As a huge Loui Eriksson fan as I am I highly doubt they part with him. I believe that the Dallas board stated numerous times he isn't going anywhere if I recall.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Lecavalier is signing with the Florida Panthers.

Awe Vinny said he wont play for a bottom feeder, So i seriously doubt it. Vinny wants to win a cup and that will never happen in Florida.