Windsor Spitfires 2023-24 Offseason Thread (Part 3)

[frontsfan67]

His game just isn’t translatable to the NHL, unfortunately. If he had continued to show the defensive promise he had in his first year, he would be selected for sure. But when given more responsibility he floundered.

Not every player is cut out to be an NHLer - He’ll still be a fantastic OHL player the next 2/3 years.

The team went from first in the west to bottom of the west in 1 season. 50 point difference. You don’t think that comes into play? Who was the second best? Woodall a rookie defenceman?


I don’t think he’s a first pairing d man at the nhl level but I could see him on the second or third pairing as a puck moving d man. isn’t a blue chipper but I could see someone selecting him rounds 5-7 100%

If not selected this year probably asks for a trade to some other team that lacks a puck moving d man like Kingston. Windsor may not be a good fit but he showed a lot of promise his rookie year.

 

[Cherrydon]

The team went from first in the west to bottom of the west in 1 season. 50 point difference. You don’t think that comes into play? Who was the second best? Woodall a rookie defenceman?


I don’t think he’s a first pairing d man at the nhl level but I could see him on the second or third pairing as a puck moving d man. isn’t a blue chipper but I could see someone selecting him rounds 5-7 100%

If not selected this year probably asks for a trade to some other team that lacks a puck moving d man like Kingston. Windsor may not be a good fit but he showed a lot of promise his rookie year.

If Greentree, Spellacy, Davis and rookie Woodall all developed welll on the last same team last year, what was his problem? His first season compared to last season was a total lack of any effort other than when offensive opportunities presented themselves. Scouts covered the Spits all year extensively watching primarily Greentree but at the end of the day, Cristoforo dropped like a rock in the draft rankings. Sure he was forced into a #1 pairing but so were 13 other NHL draft ranked D like Parekh, Dickinson, Danforth, Mews, Fischer etc.

 

[frontsfan67]

If Greentree, Spellacy, Davis and rookie Woodall all developed welll on the last same team last year, what was his problem? His first season compared to last season was a total lack of any effort other than when offensive opportunities presented themselves. Scouts covered the Spits all year extensively watching primarily Greentree but at the end of the day, Cristoforo dropped like a rock in the draft rankings. Sure he was forced into a #1 pairing but so were 13 other NHL draft ranked D like Parekh, Dickinson, Danforth, Mews, Fischer etc.

As I said he’s not a blue chipper or going to be a star like the other guys. But that is the kind of stuff that can 100% be worked on. If he works on that and his defence I don’t think you fans will be coming for the kids head.

Probably not the easiest to deal with as an 18 year old from another city coming to play in Windsor, the fans that he had last season have all turned on him and are pitchforking around blaming him. As I said I predict if that doesn’t change he asks for a trade.

 

[Cherrydon]

As I said he’s not a blue chipper or going to be a star like the other guys. But that is the kind of stuff that can 100% be worked on. If he works on that and his defence I don’t think you fans will be coming for the kids head.

The discussion was simply will he be drafted or not and why. I have nothing against him and gladly hopes he does improve defensively while maintaining his offensive skills. Yes. You can teach positional play and schemes. You cannot teach the internal desire dermed soft around here.. You either have it or not. Hopefully he turns the corner as likely we have him 3 more years unless dealt for a fresh look.

 

[OHL4Life]

If Greentree, Spellacy, Davis and rookie Woodall all developed welll on the last same team last year, what was his problem? His first season compared to last season was a total lack of any effort other than when offensive opportunities presented themselves. Scouts covered the Spits all year extensively watching primarily Greentree but at the end of the day, Cristoforo dropped like a rock in the draft rankings. Sure he was forced into a #1 pairing but so were 13 other NHL draft ranked D like Parekh, Dickinson, Danforth, Mews, Fischer etc.

he went to being a guy who could be used strategically vs a guy who had to be used everywhere due to lack of depth. If they he’d 2/3 older guys ahead of him to play harder minutes it would have been better for him, but ces la vie

 

[frontsfan67]

The discussion was simply will he be drafted or not and why. I have nothing against him and gladly hopes he does improve defensively while maintaining his offensive skills. Yes. You can teach positional play and schemes. You cannot teach the internal desire dermed soft around here.. You either have it or not. Hopefully he turns the corner as likely we have him 3 more years unless dealt for a fresh look.

You can teach that though that’s the thing. Jason Robertson was one of the softest players I’ve ever seen the first 3 seasons with Kingston. Extremely talented but was soft as baby shit. 4th season came around and he’s crashing and banging guys, going into corners etc. completely changed. Still not dropping the gloves but not shying away from corners that’s for sure.

Lots can happen in a few years, and lots can be learned and taught in a few years. He may not ever be as good as some of the other d men from the draft. But I believe he does get drafted. Probably not high as his stock has plummeted, but we see steals in the later rounds every year and I think he could be one of them if he works on the effort and defence.

 

[OHL4Life]

Rule is dress only 3 16 yr olds per game. If you acquire someone else's 1st round only 16 yr old after the Christmas break trade window you can then dress 3 of yours plus the trade acquisition.

It’s 4. And then 5 after the trade deadline. Pete’s played 5/6 at times after the deadline last year

Pete’s had 4 of their own 07s in this one and 2 they traded for in this game as an example

Ontario Hockey League

The OHL consists of 20 member teams, including 17 in the province of Ontario as well as three in the United States, with two in the state of Michigan and one in the state of Pennsylvania.

chl.ca

 

[Cherrydon]

It’s 4. And then 5 after the trade deadline. Pete’s played 5/6 at times after the deadline last year

Pete’s had 4 of their own 07s in this one and 2 they traded for in this game as an example

Ontario Hockey League

The OHL consists of 20 member teams, including 17 in the province of Ontario as well as three in the United States, with two in the state of Michigan and one in the state of Pennsylvania.

chl.ca

Read my later message where I agreed it is 4 and more after they turn 17 or call up from the affiliates especially once affiliate team is done for the year. The discussion is how they are positioned to start the year where limits matter especially with 2 US born 16 year olds

 

[OHL4Life]

Read my later message where I agreed it is 4 and more after they turn 17 or call up from the affiliates especially once affiliate team is done for the year. The discussion is how they are positioned to start the year where limits matter especially with 2 US born 16 year olds

it’s 4 from puck drop, burthdate has no bearing, it’s birth year. next year you have 4 08s and can affiliate as many as you want on a B card up to 10 games. when the player on a b card hits 10, they can’t play again until their team are eliminated, then they are free to join the OHL team for the remainder of the season.

it’s not that hard, hicks needs time, Brocklehurst definitely needs time. Windbiel needs to play infront of a better d group

 

[Cherrydon]

it’s 4 from puck drop, burthdate has no bearing, it’s birth year. next year you have 4 08s and can affiliate as many as you want on a B card up to 10 games. when the player on a b card hits 10, they can’t play again until their team are eliminated, then they are free to join the OHL team for the remainder of the season.

it’s not that hard, hicks needs time, Brocklehurst definitely needs time. Windbiel needs to play infront of a better d group

From what I read, Hockey Canada governs over the CHL. No team can affiliate more than 5 players total regardless of age. Meaning a 18 yr old already signed but is assigned to an affiliate counts against your 5 total. Junior B teams can only play 2- 16 yr olds. Yes you can affiliate 2 Junior B 2 CJHL and 1 Junior C if meets local player/no major midget team.

 

[OHL4Life]

From what I read, Hockey Canada governs over the CHL. No team can affiliate more than 5 players total regardless of age. Meaning a 18 yr old already signed but is assigned to an affiliate counts against your 5 total. Junior B teams can only play 2- 16 yr olds. Yes you can affiliate 2 Junior B 2 CJHL and 1 Junior C if meets local player/no major midget team.

your allowed as many b cards as possible. It’s from the moth of Ted baker, who ran the leagues rules at the time

Windsor would have had 7 last year on a b card at least with morgan, gaymes, manzo, froggett, tonin, lavigne, hjelhot plus Odell would have been on a b card unt he was traded

 

[Cherrydon]

your allowed as many b cards as possible. It’s from the moth of Ted baker, who ran the leagues rules at the time

Windsor would have had 7 last year on a b card at least with morgan, gaymes, manzo, froggett, tonin, lavigne, hjelhot plus Odell would have been on a b card unt he was traded

My point was not how many "B" cards a team have, technically limited by protected list, but nonetheless my point is the number of signed standard contracts with the OHL club. The Spits have 6 signed. 4 to roster 2 to be sent to Junior B Lasalle Vipers. Any unsigned drafted protected player can sign a contract with whoever they choose (other than another OHL club) and affiliate with a team in a higher league. Ex. Carson Woodall signed with the Vipers July 2022 and then signed with the Spits Feb 2023 to a standard contract. Late February the protected players list must be reduced to 35 and the ladst date you can sign a player in that season

 

[OHL4Life]

My point was not how many "B" cards a team have, technically limited by protected list, but nonetheless my point is the number of signed standard contracts with the OHL club. The Spits have 6 signed. 4 to roster 2 to be sent to Junior B Lasalle Vipers. Any unsigned drafted protected player can sign a contract with whoever they choose (other than another OHL club) and affiliate with a team in a higher league. Ex. Carson Woodall signed with the Vipers July 2022 and then signed with the Spits Feb 2023 to a standard contract. Late February the protected players list must be reduced to 35 and the ladst date you can sign a player in that season

it never happens but in theory based on the OHL rules you can sign every single player to a contract . from ted bakers lips. take that as the truth or a lie at this point it doesn’t really matter.

the reserve list doesn’t even need to be down to 35, it just needs to be down to the amount of draft picks you have to ensure your within 50 on draft day, so if your down to 10 pics, you can still have 40 on the reserve list. you also submit an affiliate list of players you want eligible after that date in case you sign them late. but even that isn’t exact, as 1/2 teams every year drop a player in the middle of the draft.

The trade deadline is the date you have to bump up any player to an a card before they are locked into the card for the remainder of the season

 

[Cherrydon]

it never happens but in theory based on the OHL rules you can sign every single player to a contract . from ted bakers lips. take that as the truth or a lie at this point it doesn’t really matter.

the reserve list doesn’t even need to be down to 35, it just needs to be down to the amount of draft picks you have to ensure your within 50 on draft day, so if your down to 10 pics, you can still have 40 on the reserve list. you also submit an affiliate list of players you want eligible after that date in case you sign them late. but even that isn’t exact, as 1/2 teams every year drop a player in the middle of the draft.

The trade deadline is the date you have to bump up any player to an a card before they are locked into the card for the remainder of the season

Absolutely agree except 1 thing, Hockey Canada governs the Junior B/U18 team matrix and those teams are limited to rostering affiliated players. If a ohl drafted player signs with a junior b team, that is one thing, but signing a standard player contract with a OHL team is another. The trade deadline is not the last date a team cam sign can add to their roster, it is in mid- February.

See above.

 

[Savard18]

Winner for the Most Educational Thread of the week goes to Windsor 2023-2024 Off-Season! Congratulations and nice work boys.

 

[OHL4Life]

Winner for the Most Educational Thread of the week goes to Windsor 2023-2024 Off-Season! Congratulations and nice work boys.

it’s an improvement, as little as a year ago this won trash fire of the year. we may still get there lol

 

[HockeyPops]

@Cherrydon where does this 5 affiliate rule come from? I know minor hockey teams that have had 12+ affiliates. Is this just a junior hockey rule from hockey canada?

 

[Cherrydon]

Ok. After much digging they changed the 5 player affiliation limit for 16 year olds to U15 in 2022. Teams can have a affiliation players list up to 19 affiliates. Junior B limit-12 players plus 2 goalies and 5 specialty affiliate players (15 year olds with 5 game limit) But Junior B can only have 2 16-yr olds. An affiliate player cannot displace a another 16 yr old already registered on that team. There is a possibility a Junior B could add a 3rd or 4th 16 yr old. The league matrix is 2 16 yr olds per team times the number of teams in the league. GOJHL has 23 teams so 46 total 16 yr olds. If another team doesn't sign 2- 16 yr olds by a certain date, another team can apply to the league for a 3rd. That rarely happens. Junior C can under special circumstances sign 1-16 yr old but that player cannot be play as affiliate in a higher league that season. Clear as mud lol.

 

[Cherrydon]

Interesting is the GOJHL rules and USA hockey are readily available with little effort. chl/ohl on the other hand, like looking for a needle in the haystack. USA hockey affiliate players similar rules to us. 10 games as well but they have a rule where an affiliated player can only play 6 games prior to March 1st and same as us, unlimited after that players season has concluded. USA hockey has limits of 18 affiliated players Tier 1 and 12 players Tier 2. Very similar to our Junior B

 

[OHLTG]

Is there a reason this stuff isn't readily available online for people to access? Even the basics?

 

[Cherrydon]

Is there a reason this stuff isn't readily available online for people to access? Even the basics?

Hockey Canada is an umbrella for most league's in Canada with a couple of exceptions. Their policies I have on a 200 page document but leagues can also impose reduced limitations individually such as 19 affiliated players max but Junior B reduces that to 12 plus 2 goalies and if possible 5 -15 yr olds under special circumstances. It is not just the OHL. The lack of complete printed roster rules made public is just as bad for the WHL and the Q. Maybe with Branch retired the new commissioner with be more transparent. How about just publicly post all the trade windows and dates as such as well as inal roster addition dates, protected list reductions after trade window etc. I learned one thing, B cards is a loose term with apparently no limits when the player signs with a lesser league and affiliates in writing to a major A club. The team they sign with must givr permission to be able to be called up as am affiliate player.

 

[OHLTG]

The lack of complete printed roster rules made public is just as bad for the WHL and the Q. Maybe with Branch retired the new commissioner with be more transparent. How about just publicly post all the trade windows and dates as such as well as inal roster addition dates, protected list reductions after trade window etc. I learned one thing, B cards is a loose term with apparently no limits when the player signs with a lesser league and affiliates in writing to a major A club. The team they sign with must givr permission to be able to be called up as am affiliate player.

There's a list of things that people have been asking about for several seasons now, including the ones you mentioned. Trade windows/freezes, final roster dates, how many players of (insert age here) you can carry and what dates, how cards work (A v. B v. totals), etc. None of that is overly secretive so I don't see why they can't post the basics on the OHL site in a FAQ section. It would go a long way towards transparency.

 

[Cherrydon]

There's a list of things that people have been asking about for several seasons now, including the ones you mentioned. Trade windows/freezes, final roster dates, how many players of (insert age here) you can carry and what dates, how cards work (A v. B v. totals), etc. None of that is overly secretive so I don't see why they can't post the basics on the OHL site in a FAQ section. It would go a long way towards transparency.

You are absolutely correct

 

[OHL4Life]

There's a list of things that people have been asking about for several seasons now, including the ones you mentioned. Trade windows/freezes, final roster dates, how many players of (insert age here) you can carry and what dates, how cards work (A v. B v. totals), etc. None of that is overly secretive so I don't see why they can't post the basics on the OHL site in a FAQ section. It would go a long way towards transparency.

transparency in what way, a lack of transparency suggests they are hiding something. What are they hiding?

Should they publish it, sure, I just don’t think a common fan cares.

 

[RayzorIsDull]

transparency in what way, a lack of transparency suggests they are hiding something. What are they hiding?

Should they publish it, sure, I just don’t think a common fan cares.

Right I find it somewhat interesting but what is the common fan going to do with this information?