Will he stay or go? Let's talk some Mr. Huberdeau.

[I am not exposed]

If we re-sigh Huberdeau at $7.1, as pantherbot is saying, I will be delighted. I would expect it be more tbh.

 

[Gentle Man]

I already acknowledged that Huber will likely be more productive than a Landeskog in my first post, but you also have to consider the theoretical drop-off in play between ages 36 and 38 can be pretty steep. The farther out you go on the curve, it's like a cliff at some point. So it matters a lot for these longer-term contract discussions and unfortunately for Huby, the way his contracts have been timed, he'll be at that 30 year mark that is not great for his negotiating position. Just think back to the days when UFAs didn't hit the market until they were 31...all those signings were a disaster. As I've said above, sports science is better now and Huber's game should age well, but as anyone over 30 knows, things just aren't the same.

The 3rd wheel argument against Landeskog can also be applied to Huberdeau. He either benefits from playing with an elite center in Barkov or gets weaker opposition on the 2nd line.

With regards to Hall, the argument about his inconsistent play can go both ways. He clearly showed a high level of play before getting bounced around, and now has finally found a good spot with Boston. So yes he gets a discount for the recent inconsistency, but he has proven to play at an elite level with a higher ceiling that has not been shown by Huber. Not sure how you can look at Hall and Huber and say Huber should get 30% more than Hall.

Even so, if you're correct at $8-9M market value for Huber, and as others have suggested Barkov could have gotten $12M on open market. Apply the 17% discount to the $8-9M, and you arrive at $7.1M.

Thats not what being a 3rd wheel means though.

Huberdeau is clearly carrying his own line. He did last season and is doing it this season. Weaker opposition is nothing something as cut and dry. Yes, teams will match up harder against Barkov, but Huberdeau will line up against tough match ups himself. Landeskog has not shown the propensity to carry a high production rate on his own.

Higher ceiling than Huberdeau? His career (hart trophy season) high was 93 points on New Jersey where yes, everything went through him as they simply didnt have a choice either. Huby had a career high of 92. Last year he was on a 91 point pace away from Barkov as his center. Remember he started and played most of last season with Wennberg.

Contracts are generally signed on what you've recently done and not what you are going to do. And generally, you pay for the first few years of the contract and hope that the drop off at the latter stages arent horrible. I like the 1 million for every 10 points of production rule.

If Huberdeau continues to trend at 80-90 points as he currently is this season....8-9 is a fair price.

 

[I am not exposed]

Another point is who do we prioritise? Huberdeau or Weegar? I know who Jean Luc Discard would say. But how about everyone else!

 

[KW]

The changes in salary cap expectations makes a huge difference going forward. Look at Barkov, he got $10M x 8 and is arguably way more important and a better player than Huby. Why would Huby, at an older age, get $9M when Barkov got $10M? That' makes no sense.

Yeah I was also looking for a voting option at either lower salary or shorter duration or a bit of both. I think he’ll stay but won’t be $8-9 x 8 but more like $7.5 x 7 or $8 x 6.

 

[Gentle Man]

Another point is who do we prioritise? Huberdeau or Weegar? I know who Jean Luc Discard would say. But how about everyone else!

Simply pray for the cap to rise

 

[ucanthanzalthetruth]

Voted somewhere else. Don't see how the cap can work.

 

[Cats2TheCup]

I used to be certain he was leaving. Then last year things changed. Seems Florida is family to him at this point, and they'll pay him what he wants anyway, so why leave now? Top of the league. The Montreal argument is dead. His whole family hates the Montreal Canadians now. They're die hard Panthers fans. He stays. His Instagram is just him repping Panthers gear and the Florida lifestyle. His sister sings anthems here. His brothers play here. He fuggin stays.

 

[Dread Clawz]

Love Huberdeau, don't get me wrong here, but Barkov is the much better complete player and worth more. He's a center, he scores almost near the same pace as Huber, but against higher competition, takes more defensive zone starts, plays pk and pp, he's our captain, I could go on. Then in addition to that, 3 years younger when the contract starts which is a huge difference. So yeah, if Barkov gets $10M, I don't think Huber should be anywhere near that.

Yeah, Barkov is undoubtedly the much more complete player and plays tougher minutes. Huby is probably more offensively talented though, even if it's just a slight edge. So I think 1M less is fair. Maybe he takes 9, maybe 8.75. But 7M? No. He would scoff at that and rightfully so. Being at 9 puts him right in the average of Nylander(7) and Marner(10.9), which I think is very reasonable.

 

[Dread Clawz]

Another point is who do we prioritise? Huberdeau or Weegar? I know who Jean Luc Discard would say. But how about everyone else!

Huby ainec

 

[Fern111]

Huby is my favorite Panther and he's an integral part of this team and it's leadership group. I think you pay him whatever the hell he wants as long as it's below Barkov.

I have no doubt Zito will make the cap work.

 

[GermanPanther]

I think the Main Reason he stay, is the Way this Teams goes and that the Organisation really work on the open Holes.
Under Tallon we dont really closed holes, we let them stay and put some net and leafs over it, only for the nice View.

The other Main Reason, is his new Linemate you can tell me what you want, Benett and Huberdeau have an excellent chemistry maybe a friendship going, this Line works.
I mean we talked about this for more then 2 and a half Year, that Huberdeau had never real Linemates he can play with. Now last and this Season he get Bennett and the 2 work well together and both Players get there Game going. 12 in 10 and 7 in 8 , that speaks alone both Players if there would still play together my stand together there with a Point per Game.

And i love Line chemistry, beside good positioning in defensive play is this really important. And hard to build and find, the System must fit and the Player must find together.

Only real big negative Point. As personal View that Market, there is no doubt and really often mention from Canadian Media or Original 6 Broadcast.
How much Media attention he and Barkov and other could get on a different Market.

The Money he will get by his re-signing will be the same he get on a bigger Market, there is no doubt about it since he is a Franchise Player.

So overall, for my personal View i would say, the Organisation did a lot to let him stay and really hope for a Cup.

@TheImpatientPanther
Can we place and extra voting option into to choose. 7-8 yr 10 Million.
Huberdeau will get the Barkov Contract, both Player Franchise Player and Key Player, both should get the same Money. This both Players did, do and will do a lot for this Franchise.

 

[letsgrowcactus]

Another point is who do we prioritise? Huberdeau or Weegar? I know who Jean Luc Discard would say. But how about everyone else!

Does Weegar even want to re-sign?
Losing either of them will suck. We also need to decide if we keep both and lose one to FA, or if we trade one in the offseason to get back some assets. I think we probably keep both, but the option is there.

 

[Vilam]

The only thing that could screw up Huby staying is fallout from this Q nonsense. Hope we solve it satisfactorily and go deep in the playoffs this year.

 

[Dread Clawz]

Does Weegar even want to re-sign?
Losing either of them will suck. We also need to decide if we keep both and lose one to FA, or if we trade one in the offseason to get back some assets. I think we probably keep both, but the option is there.

I think Weegar wants to stay, but if he wants a deal comparable to Ek's, I don't think Zito is interested. I doubt we trade him because we are in win now mode, but if he goes into next season without an extension, the writing may be on the wall.

 

[pantherbot]

Thats not what being a 3rd wheel means though.

Huberdeau is clearly carrying his own line. He did last season and is doing it this season. Weaker opposition is nothing something as cut and dry. Yes, teams will match up harder against Barkov, but Huberdeau will line up against tough match ups himself. Landeskog has not shown the propensity to carry a high production rate on his own.

Higher ceiling than Huberdeau? His career (hart trophy season) high was 93 points on New Jersey where yes, everything went through him as they simply didnt have a choice either. Huby had a career high of 92. Last year he was on a 91 point pace away from Barkov as his center. Remember he started and played most of last season with Wennberg.

Contracts are generally signed on what you've recently done and not what you are going to do. And generally, you pay for the first few years of the contract and hope that the drop off at the latter stages arent horrible. I like the 1 million for every 10 points of production rule.

If Huberdeau continues to trend at 80-90 points as he currently is this season....8-9 is a fair price.

I just mean that saying Landeskog is a 3rd wheel can be a comparable argument to saying Huberdeau plays against lower competition and gets more offensive starts. Interestingly, I just looked up an article about Landeskog vs. Huberdeau written by a pro NHL scout. (Jonathan Huberdeau Vs. Gabriel Landeskog: Who's more valuable?) It's a bit dated and I think doesn't give Huber the proper respect for things like competitiveness, but I think it's more or less fair. Assume the scout is off on Huberdeau, and you can argue $7-8M if you want.

Yes higher ceiling than Huberdeau. Hall carried that team by himself, it's about more than just points. I'm not equating the two and like Huber better, but Hall has also proven he can carry a team (not saying he can do that now, but neither can Huber).

Last season, Huber was doing well on the 2nd line away from Barkov, but it wasn't until we picked up Bennett that he really turned it on and we can see now he's not the same player as when he plays with Bennett. Also while he played away from Barkov on the 2nd line, he played with Barkov on the power play. Huber ranked 25th in even strength points among forwards, but 4th in power play points.

I think contracts take into account both current and future performance, that's why you see players like Landeskog get $7M. I think he can be an 80-90 point player through early 30's, but then drop to maybe a 60 point player afterwards.

 

[pantherbot]

Yeah, Barkov is undoubtedly the much more complete player and plays tougher minutes. Huby is probably more offensively talented though, even if it's just a slight edge. So I think 1M less is fair. Maybe he takes 9, maybe 8.75. But 7M? No. He would scoff at that and rightfully so. Being at 9 puts him right in the average of Nylander(7) and Marner(10.9), which I think is very reasonable.

Neither Nylander or Marner are good comparables though. Both are younger, so you're paying for prime years and contracts were sign during a different salary cap situation.

 

[pantherbot]

Yeah I was also looking for a voting option at either lower salary or shorter duration or a bit of both. I think he’ll stay but won’t be $8-9 x 8 but more like $7.5 x 7 or $8 x 6.

yeah I think that's fair. If salary cap situation improves a bit, I could see $7.5M x 7 or 8 years, maybe if we're stretching it $8M. But anything beyond that is not a good idea.

 

[TheImpatientPanther]

.

@TheImpatientPanther
Can we place and extra voting option into to choose. 7-8 yr 10 Million.
Huberdeau will get the Barkov Contract, both Player Franchise Player and Key Player, both should get the same Money. This both Players did, do and will do a lot for this Franchise.

Option was added at bottom.
I should have put up to $10 million but just unsure if he would get the same as Barkov, even if Bob did.
Plus I don't think Bob will be here after 2023-24 anyhow.
We shall see though.

 

[Gentle Man]

I just mean that saying Landeskog is a 3rd wheel can be a comparable argument to saying Huberdeau plays against lower competition and gets more offensive starts. Interestingly, I just looked up an article about Landeskog vs. Huberdeau written by a pro NHL scout. (Jonathan Huberdeau Vs. Gabriel Landeskog: Who's more valuable?) It's a bit dated and I think doesn't give Huber the proper respect for things like competitiveness, but I think it's more or less fair. Assume the scout is off on Huberdeau, and you can argue $7-8M if you want.

Yes higher ceiling than Huberdeau. Hall carried that team by himself, it's about more than just points. I'm not equating the two and like Huber better, but Hall has also proven he can carry a team (not saying he can do that now, but neither can Huber).

Last season, Huber was doing well on the 2nd line away from Barkov, but it wasn't until we picked up Bennett that he really turned it on and we can see now he's not the same player as when he plays with Bennett. Also while he played away from Barkov on the 2nd line, he played with Barkov on the power play. Huber ranked 25th in even strength points among forwards, but 4th in power play points.

I think contracts take into account both current and future performance, that's why you see players like Landeskog get $7M. I think he can be an 80-90 point player through early 30's, but then drop to maybe a 60 point player afterwards.

We'll agree to disagree. Huberdeau will be signing his contract probably being the 3rd best LW in the league unless Marchand drops off in which he becomes second.

Hall only had one 90 point season.

And landeskog's production and lack thereof without his mates are out there to see

 

[zeroG]

I just mean that saying Landeskog is a 3rd wheel can be a comparable argument to saying Huberdeau plays against lower competition and gets more offensive starts. Interestingly, I just looked up an article about Landeskog vs. Huberdeau written by a pro NHL scout. (Jonathan Huberdeau Vs. Gabriel Landeskog: Who's more valuable?) It's a bit dated and I think doesn't give Huber the proper respect for things like competitiveness, but I think it's more or less fair. Assume the scout is off on Huberdeau, and you can argue $7-8M if you want.

Yes higher ceiling than Huberdeau. Hall carried that team by himself, it's about more than just points. I'm not equating the two and like Huber better, but Hall has also proven he can carry a team (not saying he can do that now, but neither can Huber).

Last season, Huber was doing well on the 2nd line away from Barkov, but it wasn't until we picked up Bennett that he really turned it on and we can see now he's not the same player as when he plays with Bennett. Also while he played away from Barkov on the 2nd line, he played with Barkov on the power play. Huber ranked 25th in even strength points among forwards, but 4th in power play points.

I think contracts take into account both current and future performance, that's why you see players like Landeskog get $7M. I think he can be an 80-90 point player through early 30's, but then drop to maybe a 60 point player afterwards.

huh. seems to me like huby's been playing with more of a chip on his shoulder the past couple of years. maybe this type of talk is why.

 

[Little Bobby Boo]

Most likely Weegar, both contracts end in 2023.

Weegar is one of the few guys we can't lose. He is elite and can carry a top pair.

 

[5 Hole]

I have no doubt Huby stays here. He’s a franchise guy just like Barky & Ek. We’ve come too far with these guys to not lock them up and they really seem to want to play here.
I think 7mil is master level Zito, 8mil is decent and 9mil is still fair to both parties.
Oh, and Weegar has to stay.

 

[TheImpatientPanther]

Could see OTT throwing big money at him to lock down a Chabot - Weegar pairing.
He's definitely getting $5.5 to 6 million on the low if he paces another 40+pt season.
Rielly deal may be somewhat comparable.

Think we were all worried to go long term on this current deal because of his health/injuries but damn, one more year would have been awesome, even if it was closer to $4 mil per.
Weegar is my favorite player in the sense of his path and journey to the NHL.

Here's a question for ya?
If you could only keep one,Weegar or Forsling?
Seems Forsling would age well into his 30s.
but both will want that $5-6 mil minimum.

Does Weegar even want to re-sign?
Losing either of them will suck. We also need to decide if we keep both and lose one to FA, or if we trade one in the offseason to get back some assets. I think we probably keep both, but the option is there.

I think Weegar wants to stay, but if he wants a deal comparable to Ek's, I don't think Zito is interested. I doubt we trade him because we are in win now mode, but if he goes into next season without an extension, the writing may be on the wall.

 

[Dread Clawz]

Weegar is one of the few guys we can't lose. He is elite and can carry a top pair.

There's a lot of guys we can't lose. We've amassed a lot of talent here and we' re not gonna be able to keep all of it. The bottom line is if Weegar keeps up his play, are you comfortable paying him and Ek a combined 14-15 M?

 

[Dread Clawz]

Could see OTT throwing big money at him to lock down a Chabot - Weegar pairing.
He's definitely getting $5.5 to 6 million on the low if he paces another 40+pt season.
Rielly deal may be somewhat comparable.

Think we were all worried to go long term on this current deal because of his health/injuries but damn, one more year would have been awesome, even if it was closer to $4 mil per.

Weegar is my favorite player in the sense of his path and journey to the NHL.
Such a long and well deserved career for a 7th rounder

Here's a question for ya?
Weegar or Forsling?
Seems Forsling would age well into his 30s.
but both will want that $5-6 mil minimum.

If Forsling can cement his status as a 2/3 D this season, I would have to say Forsling. Weegar is terrific too, it' s just a preference.

You bring up a good point, I think a lot of people on the 'keep Weegar at all costs' train forget that Fors is due a big raise in 2024 as well.